Rapist may have contracted HIV from victim

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Well you need to at least consider state of mind right?

I mean if I go berserk to the point I hurt someone, I may (As unlikely as it may be) have chosen to hurt them, but I wasn't necessarily what you would call perfectly sane at the time of the incident.

There is a reason for the insanity plea after all.

Sadistic neo-Nazi torturors/murderers and sadistic child/teen molesters aren't insane. They are just people who should die alone in a hole experiencing things worse than what they practised.

[Gauthier]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

[Big Jim P]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Not often enough.

[Aequalitia]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

I think s/he meant otherwise... that they are never someone that we should really think about, and have consideration. e_e

[Big Jim P]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

I think you misunderstood Gauthiers post.

[Gauthier]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

Or maybe I understand that usually rapists tend to only suffer legal punishments assuming they get caught in the first place.

[Lordieth]

This story doesn't make me happy at all. It's just tragic in every way, really.

[Aequalitia]

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

I think s/he meant otherwise... that they are never someone that we should really think about, and have consideration. e_e

Ohhh, just misunderstanding of me then, sorry Gauthier.

[Greed and Death]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

Strange thing about that.
Japan's net debt per GDP is 134.325% and Spain's net debt per gdp is 72%.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... ublic_debt

[Shaggai]

Again, how often is a rapist scarred by a victim just as much if not more than a victim is scarred by a rapist?

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

Compassion, sympathy, and empathy are three different things. I feel no sympathy for the rapist. I feel empathy because the rapist is a human and is suffering. Compassion... well, perhaps I feel compassion. It's more complicated than the oher two.

Well you need to at least consider state of mind right?

I mean if I go berserk to the point I hurt someone, I may (As unlikely as it may be) have chosen to hurt them, but I wasn't necessarily what you would call perfectly sane at the time of the incident.

There is a reason for the insanity plea after all.

Sadistic neo-Nazi torturors/murderers and sadistic child/teen molesters aren't insane. They are just people who should die alone in a hole experiencing things worse than what they practised.

No.

No.

No. That is not justice. It isn't even vengeance. It's the sort of thing that makes "eye for an eye" seem like a good idea.

From your posts it seems you have been on the wrong end of both. If you have not, I apologize. If you have, I'm sorry. Such things should never happen to anyone.

And that's the thing. "Anyone" means anyone. Nobody, no matter who they are, deserves such things to happen to them. Because if we say "oh, but it's okay when it happens to those people", we open the door to saying "oh, but those other people deserve it. And those people over there, too. And those people we don't like, they deserve it too."

See, disproportionate retribution is a natural instinct. Stop them from doing it again by doing even worse than they did. And having those impulses is nothing to be ashamed of. But we are human. We can rise above them and say "I'll only do to him what he did to me. No worse." The impulse for vengeance is satisfied, and you aren't making everything actively worse in a spiral of retribution. And it seems fair.

But we can rise even above that. "An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind," and we can put our desires for retribution under our desires to stop whatever harm might be done. We can fight for justice, not vengeance; fight to make people not do horrifying things, even if they escape punishment we feel they deserve. If I could end all torture forever, but would have to let all torturers go unpunished, I would do it. If I could stop homophobia but would have to let all the Russian Neo-Nazis be absolved of all crimes, I would do it. Even the worst of the worst should be let roam free, if that will mean they turn to good.

The Religious Society of Friends has a belief that "There is that of God (or goodness) in everyone." Everyone has the potential to do good, or to turn to good. Of course they do. They are human, and humans can put reason before vengeance, desire to do good before impulses to harm, and above all can change. Sometimes they refuse. Sometimes, perhaps, other influences can make it exceedingly difficult to change.

But even if it cannot be done, there is no need to punish those who present a clear and unchangeable danger to society. They should be isolated, yes, and if that is a punishment then so be it. But we, as humans, have a moral imperative to reduce the amount of suffering in the world, to the best of our ability, and if we can prevent those we cannot rehabilitate from causing suffering, why would we make them suffer beyond what is necessary?

We must be human. We must be humane. We must do what is right, even to those who don't, for if we will not do what is right then who will? If we inflict even greater suffering than they did, are we not worse than them? Should we punish ourselves with even more horrific suffering? It is our duty to be the absolute best we can be. We must not shirk it.

[Torcularis Septentrionalis]

Douchecanoe deserves HIV.

[Gauthier]

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

Strange thing about that.
Japan's net debt per GDP is 134.325% and Spain's net debt per gdp is 72%.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... ublic_debt

And this has to do with rape, how?

[The Victorian Empire]

Wow, amazing about how people are happy about a person obtaining a deadly disease. What have we become?

The guy raped someone, he got what he deserved, so don't act all high and mighty and pity someone who brought pain onto someone else. Revenge is a bitch, a cold bitch, but a bitch none the less.

[Keronians]

Karma can be such a bitch.

[Shaggai]

Douchecanoe deserves HIV.

Will HIV make his victim suddenly well? Will it erase what he did?

You're feeling sympathy for a person who may have contracted HIV from raping someone? Raping has consequences to its actions, and sometimes those consequences go above the courtroom, in this case, getting HIV (if the tests results are positive)

The bigger question is, why celebrate anyone getting HIV and likely having to receive medication for the rest of his life, regardless if this person is a suspect or victim? Does our sympathy for humankind against harm end at the line of conviction?

If that principle is applied consistently, there isn't much of a reason for a justice system. We'd might as well just confer punishment on the thought rather than proof of guilt.

[Shaggai]

Wow, amazing about how people are happy about a person obtaining a deadly disease. What have we become?

The guy raped someone, he got what he deserved, so don't act all high and mighty and pity someone who brought pain onto someone else. Revenge is a bitch, a cold bitch, but a bitch none the less.

Do you support mandatory HIV injections for veryone convicted of rape?

[Gauthier]

Douchecanoe deserves HIV.

Will HIV make his victim suddenly well? Will it erase what he did?

Not often rapists get more than a prison sentence assuming they actually get caught and tried. And if you have a brilliant judge like G. Todd Baugh presiding, even that's just a slap on the wrist.

[Hetalian Indie Rio de Janeiro]

No, Shaggai, I was only really victimized by homophobia. Not rape.

[The Victorian Empire]

The guy raped someone, he got what he deserved, so don't act all high and mighty and pity someone who brought pain onto someone else. Revenge is a bitch, a cold bitch, but a bitch none the less.

Do you support mandatory HIV injections for veryone convicted of rape?

Of course not, but I'm not going to pity a rapist.

[Aequalitia]

Sounds you would never understand how rape can ruin someone mentally and maybe even physical. I got only compassion for the victim, not for the rapist.

Compassion, sympathy, and empathy are three different things. I feel no sympathy for the rapist. I feel empathy because the rapist is a human and is suffering. Compassion... well, perhaps I feel compassion. It's more complicated than the oher two.

A rapist don't have the right in me eyes to have empathy, and totally not even compassion. That right got the victims, and not the rapist self.

[Shaggai]

No, Shaggai, I was only really victimized by homophobia. Not rape.

Good. I wish you had never been victimized at all, but I'm glad it wasn't worse.

Will HIV make his victim suddenly well? Will it erase what he did?

Not often rapists get more than a prison sentence assuming they actually get caught and tried. And if you have a brilliant judge like G. Todd Baugh presiding, even that's just a slap on the wrist.

Idiot judges are a different matter. Doesn't make this any better.

Do you support mandatory HIV injections for veryone convicted of rape?

Of course not, but I'm not going to pity a rapist.

I have very little sympathy for this man. He still doesn't deserve HIV. If rapists deserved HIV, mandatory injections for convicted rapists would be okay, but they don't.

[Gauthier]

I have very little sympathy for this man. He still doesn't deserve HIV. If rapists deserved HIV, mandatory injections for convicted rapists would be okay, but they don't.

This is less a "KARMA IZ BITCH" and more along the lines of "Darwin Award Winner", like the drunk who broke into a polar bear den and tried to molest it.

[Torcularis Septentrionalis]

Douchecanoe deserves HIV.

Will HIV make his victim suddenly well? Will it erase what he did?

You want me to take pity on a man who probably ruined a woman's life?
Have you ever been raped?
Let me explain it to you.
You have no power, you can do nothing. You are in pain, sobbing, begging for them to stop. Instead, they force themselves inside of you, dry. You can feel your hymen breaking very painfully and you just cry harder. You have no idea what to do because you don't know if they will kill you or hurt you or something else. When it's over, you feel worthless. It was your fault. No one would ever believe you, they would just think you're a whore. You're still in pain, but now you also have to bear the mental pain as well. You feel ruined and useless. Your first time was supposed to be special, but instead it was ripped from you.

I tried to kill myself after I was forcibly impregnated as a seventeen year old. The pain I endured then resulted in my ending up in hospital after hospital just to calm the voices in my head telling me to kill myself.

And you want me to pity a man that did this to another woman.

[Shaggai]

Will HIV make his victim suddenly well? Will it erase what he did?

You want me to take pity on a man who probably ruined a woman's life?
Have you ever been raped?
Let me explain it to you.
You have no power, you can do nothing. You are in pain, sobbing, begging for them to stop. Instead, they force themselves inside of you, dry. You can feel your hymen breaking very painfully and you just cry harder. You have no idea what to do because you don't know if they will kill you or hurt you or something else. When it's over, you feel worthless. It was your fault. No one would ever believe you, they would just think you're a whore. You're still in pain, but now you also have to bear the mental pain as well. You feel ruined and useless. Your first time was supposed to be special, but instead it was ripped from you.

I tried to kill myself after I was forcibly impregnated as a seventeen year old. The pain I endured then resulted in my ending up in hospital after hospital just to calm the voices in my head telling me to kill myself.

And you want me to pity a man that did this to another woman.

I don't care if you pity him. You can have absolutely no pity. That's fine. Whether or not he deserves pity is another discussion. But he doesn't deserve HIV. He deserves whatever he is sentenced to. Maybe more, if the judge isn't very good.

The victim deserves all of the sympathy she can possibly get. She already has a disease that will most likely kill her in a horrifying way. Then this happened to her. She deserves love, and compasson, and all the good things she gets. She in no way deserves any of the bad things that have happened to her.

But the man still doesn't deserve HIV. Pitying him and saying "he deserves it" are two extremely different things. He will be sentenced, and he deserves all of his sentence. But would you support injecting all convicted rapists with HIV? The prison sentence he will undoubtedly receive will isolae him from society and in the future hopefully he will not do this again. But as I hae said, we have a duty to reduce suffering. We should not increase it.

Give him exactly as much pity as he should get. But he doesn't deserve HIV. This is a tragic story all around.