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by United commonwealth of ayrshire » Thu Sep 05, 2013 3:29 am
by Zapato » Thu Sep 05, 2013 4:15 am
Srboslavija wrote:West Faristan2 wrote:
Yeah, don't criticize , you might 'disappoint' some random guy on an internet forum! Seriously, how is opposing anti-gay laws having a 'cold war mentality'? Do you think any criticism of Russia is having a 'cold war mentality'? Should we be forbidden from criticizing Russia lest we offend your oh-so-delicate feelings?
How rude.
Problem is not about opposing, I'm talking about the way in which individuals are opposing.
Maybe I was expecting too much from LGBT people to refrain from acting like bigots?
by West Faristan2 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:27 am
Srboslavija wrote:West Faristan2 wrote:
Yeah, don't criticize , you might 'disappoint' some random guy on an internet forum! Seriously, how is opposing anti-gay laws having a 'cold war mentality'? Do you think any criticism of Russia is having a 'cold war mentality'? Should we be forbidden from criticizing Russia lest we offend your oh-so-delicate feelings?
How rude.
Problem is not about opposing, I'm talking about the way in which individuals are opposing.
Maybe I was expecting too much from LGBT people to refrain from acting like bigots?
by Liriena » Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:41 am
United commonwealth of ayrshire wrote:I think what we have to remember is that here in Britain we only allowed homosexuals TOTAL equality only earlier this year, and that of course some priests still refuse to marry them and a large amount of people still feel either prejudiced or disgusted by homosexuality.
Russia are just a bit behind us, they'll catch up in their own time. I don't think it's such an issue that we should boycott the world's most famous winter sports event over it.
Why not boycott the southern US states that still class homosexuality as illegal. And there are many of them. There are also plenty of countries who would actually KILL people for being homosexual! These countries include Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Yemen, Iran, Mauritania, Somaliland and parts of Nigeria. This is a more pressing problem. Boycott these countries, and most importantly, do NOT support the Saudi Arabian interests in Syria!
I am: A pansexual, pantheist, green socialist An aspiring writer and journalist | Political compass stuff: Economic Left/Right: -8.13 Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -8.92 For: Grassroots democracy, workers' self-management, humanitarianism, pacifism, pluralism, environmentalism, interculturalism, indigenous rights, minority rights, LGBT+ rights, feminism, optimism Against: Nationalism, authoritarianism, fascism, conservatism, populism, violence, ethnocentrism, racism, sexism, religious bigotry, anti-LGBT+ bigotry, death penalty, neoliberalism, tribalism, cynicism ⚧Copy and paste this in your sig if you passed biology and know gender and sex aren't the same thing.⚧ |
by Shofercia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:15 pm
Zapato wrote:Srboslavija wrote:
How rude.
Problem is not about opposing, I'm talking about the way in which individuals are opposing.
Maybe I was expecting too much from LGBT people to refrain from acting like bigots?
Yeah, the important part is that LGBT people are not rude when they oppose what Russia is doing. The best way to go about it is to make reasonable arguments about equality (illegal in Russia), inform the public about the facts (illegal in Russia), create an awareness campaign (illegal in Russia), demonstrate how gay parents are able to take care of children in a normal and healthy manner (illegal in Russia), and then beg the authorities to please respect the rights they already have and to not errode them further.
Don't be rude, guys. Just politely beg for your basic human rights, and perhaps the request will be taken into consideration at some unknown point in time.
by San-Silvacian » Thu Sep 05, 2013 12:37 pm
Shofercia wrote:Zapato wrote:Yeah, the important part is that LGBT people are not rude when they oppose what Russia is doing. The best way to go about it is to make reasonable arguments about equality (illegal in Russia), inform the public about the facts (illegal in Russia), create an awareness campaign (illegal in Russia), demonstrate how gay parents are able to take care of children in a normal and healthy manner (illegal in Russia), and then beg the authorities to please respect the rights they already have and to not errode them further.
Don't be rude, guys. Just politely beg for your basic human rights, and perhaps the request will be taken into consideration at some unknown point in time.
But hey, go ahead and make fun of Srboslavija for repeating what MLK Jr said. After all, what does he know, he only led the most successful Civil Rights Movement in World History...
by West Faristan2 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:52 pm
Shofercia wrote:Zapato wrote:Yeah, the important part is that LGBT people are not rude when they oppose what Russia is doing. The best way to go about it is to make reasonable arguments about equality (illegal in Russia), inform the public about the facts (illegal in Russia), create an awareness campaign (illegal in Russia), demonstrate how gay parents are able to take care of children in a normal and healthy manner (illegal in Russia), and then beg the authorities to please respect the rights they already have and to not errode them further.
Don't be rude, guys. Just politely beg for your basic human rights, and perhaps the request will be taken into consideration at some unknown point in time.
But hey, go ahead and make fun of Srboslavija for repeating what MLK Jr said. After all, what does he know, he only led the most successful Civil Rights Movement in World History...
by West Faristan2 » Thu Sep 05, 2013 1:52 pm
Shofercia wrote:Zapato wrote:Yeah, the important part is that LGBT people are not rude when they oppose what Russia is doing. The best way to go about it is to make reasonable arguments about equality (illegal in Russia), inform the public about the facts (illegal in Russia), create an awareness campaign (illegal in Russia), demonstrate how gay parents are able to take care of children in a normal and healthy manner (illegal in Russia), and then beg the authorities to please respect the rights they already have and to not errode them further.
Don't be rude, guys. Just politely beg for your basic human rights, and perhaps the request will be taken into consideration at some unknown point in time.
But hey, go ahead and make fun of Srboslavija for repeating what MLK Jr said. After all, what does he know, he only led the most successful Civil Rights Movement in World History...
by Urmanian » Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:53 pm
Regnum Dominae wrote:Putin: I do not discriminate against gay people, I give them prizes!
http://www.salon.com/2013/09/04/putin_i ... em_prizes/
Vladimir Putin Says Gay People Are Not Discriminated Against In Russia
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/09 ... 64036.html
No, Putin, we are not that stupid.
by Regnum Dominae » Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:56 pm
Urmanian wrote:
by Quebec and Atlantic Canada » Thu Sep 05, 2013 5:57 pm
Urmanian wrote:I can kind of understand Shofercia's point (even though it often comes off to me as simply apologetic) but when I see stuff like this I become less and less convinced that one can fix gay rights in Russia by begging on their fours with "respect and understanding of Russian culture" as he suggests.
by Shofercia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 6:40 pm
Quebec and Atlantic Canada wrote:Urmanian wrote:I can kind of understand Shofercia's point (even though it often comes off to me as simply apologetic) but when I see stuff like this I become less and less convinced that one can fix gay rights in Russia by begging on their fours with "respect and understanding of Russian culture" as he suggests.
You really won't understand half of what he's saying re: Russian policies and why he's saying it until you realize he's a Putinist stenographer.
by Shofercia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 6:44 pm
Urmanian wrote:Regnum Dominae wrote:Putin: I do not discriminate against gay people, I give them prizes!
http://www.salon.com/2013/09/04/putin_i ... em_prizes/
Vladimir Putin Says Gay People Are Not Discriminated Against In Russia
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/09 ... 64036.html
No, Putin, we are not that stupid.
The day after Putin claimed LGBT citizens to be fully equal in rights with other Russian citizens, an United Russia parliamentary has proposed a bill that could be used to deny gay parents custody over their children.
"According to state-owned media outlet Russia Today, Zhuravlev's explanatory note on the proposed amendment says the "non-traditional sexual orientation of one or both parents would become sufficient reason to deprive both of them of their parental rights."
I can kind of understand Shofercia's point (even though it often comes off to me as simply apologetic) but when I see stuff like this I become less and less convinced that one can fix gay rights in Russia by begging on their fours with "respect and understanding of Russian culture" as he suggests.
West Faristan2 wrote:
And that whistling sound you hear is the point sailing majestically over Shoffie's stupid little head.
by Transnapastain » Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:48 pm
West Faristan2 wrote:
Snip
And that whistling sound you hear is the point sailing majestically over Shoffie's stupid little head.
by Scholencia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:45 pm
Urmanian wrote:Regnum Dominae wrote:Putin: I do not discriminate against gay people, I give them prizes!
http://www.salon.com/2013/09/04/putin_i ... em_prizes/
Vladimir Putin Says Gay People Are Not Discriminated Against In Russia
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2013/09 ... 64036.html
No, Putin, we are not that stupid.
The day after Putin claimed LGBT citizens to be fully equal in rights with other Russian citizens, an United Russia parliamentary has proposed a bill that could be used to deny gay parents custody over their children.
"According to state-owned media outlet Russia Today, Zhuravlev's explanatory note on the proposed amendment says the "non-traditional sexual orientation of one or both parents would become sufficient reason to deprive both of them of their parental rights."
I can kind of understand Shofercia's point (even though it often comes off to me as simply apologetic) but when I see stuff like this I become less and less convinced that one can fix gay rights in Russia by begging on their fours with "respect and understanding of Russian culture" as he suggests.
by Regnum Dominae » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:46 pm
Scholencia wrote:Urmanian wrote:The day after Putin claimed LGBT citizens to be fully equal in rights with other Russian citizens, an United Russia parliamentary has proposed a bill that could be used to deny gay parents custody over their children.
"According to state-owned media outlet Russia Today, Zhuravlev's explanatory note on the proposed amendment says the "non-traditional sexual orientation of one or both parents would become sufficient reason to deprive both of them of their parental rights."
I can kind of understand Shofercia's point (even though it often comes off to me as simply apologetic) but when I see stuff like this I become less and less convinced that one can fix gay rights in Russia by begging on their fours with "respect and understanding of Russian culture" as he suggests.
Russia is based on christian values and principles, so there is nothing wrong is dont allow gay marriges; it only worth that gays are not percecuted there which they are not.
by Scholencia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:49 pm
by Regnum Dominae » Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:51 pm
Scholencia wrote:I mean that gays are ok in Russia since nobody is persecute them for being gay (of course gay marriages are not human rights).
Regnum Dominae wrote:Russia's actions are legitimately horrifying at this point.The Russian government's new law condemning so-called gay propaganda has now encouraged people to report their LGBT neighbors to local authorities.
A notice allegedly from the government says any person who suspects that a neighbor or tenant disseminates "homosexual propaganda" should contact the police immediately, Gay Star News and O-Blog-Dee-O-Blog-Da report.
"Increase your vigilance when you talk to your neighbors, when you are checking your mail and in elevators," the notice says, according to a translation. "You can easily become a target of homosexual propaganda. There is one step from being homosexual and to start propaganda of homosexualism and molesting decent people."
[...]
http://www.advocate.com/news/world-news ... ples-homes
Also, homosexuality is really un-slavic.
by Scholencia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:03 pm
by Regnum Dominae » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:06 pm
Scholencia wrote:banning gay propaganda =/= discriminating gays
There are a lot gay bares in Moscow, and the police or the authorities are not even attacking people that in these bars.
No true Scotsman? Why is so hard to understand that homosexuality is very un-slavic. It is something that is imposed on slavic countries by western imperialists.
by Shofercia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:06 pm
Scholencia wrote:I mean that gays are ok in Russia since nobody is persecute them for being gay (of course gay marriages are not human rights).
by Scholencia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:13 pm
Shofercia wrote:Scholencia wrote:I mean that gays are ok in Russia since nobody is persecute them for being gay (of course gay marriages are not human rights).
That's the problem with this law, is that it allows the Government to prosecute Gays. If this law said absolutely nothing about Gay Prosecution, it wouldn't have drawn such a massive outcry.
by The Tiger Kingdom » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:14 pm
Scholencia wrote:Shofercia wrote:
That's the problem with this law, is that it allows the Government to prosecute Gays. If this law said absolutely nothing about Gay Prosecution, it wouldn't have drawn such a massive outcry.
Let us be honest, where there any gays 50years ago in Eastern Europe? No, there was not. The suddenly flock of homos in Eastern Europe is the result of liberal propaganda. My point is that homosexuality is very un-slavic.
by Shofercia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:18 pm
Scholencia wrote:Shofercia wrote:
That's the problem with this law, is that it allows the Government to prosecute Gays. If this law said absolutely nothing about Gay Prosecution, it wouldn't have drawn such a massive outcry.
Let us be honest, where there any gays 50years ago in Eastern Europe? No, there was not. The suddenly flock of homos in Eastern Europe is the result of liberal propaganda. My point is that homosexuality is very un-slavic.
by Scholencia » Thu Sep 05, 2013 9:19 pm
Regnum Dominae wrote:Scholencia wrote:banning gay propaganda =/= discriminating gays
So spying on gay neighbors to the police is not discrimination about gays?
But... but.. governments and people are sping people also for various reasons, you know that is you would complain if a neighbour reported you to the police for consuming marihuana or drugs. Now, according to you, you would complain why people are reporting junkies to the police.
So, you have obvious evidence that gays are tolerated yet it is still discrimination? But, in that case christian are discriminated by western media.
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