The Black Hawks: The Most Feared Military Organization in NS

[Klaus Devestatorie]

As we discussed on IRC already, the key word in the sentence is was. I've reached out to SkyDip and CSP to let them know that Milograd has no access to the nation, but since you knew that before making this most recent post I can only guess that your own "convenient" interests are interfering with open or honest discourse with Euro and TNI.

I'm all for open and honest discourse. It was you who decided to be dishonest by omitting Milograd's involvement when you clearly knew it would be a problem. No matter how long he was involved, The Black Hawks decided not to disclose his involvement -- until he let it slip on IRC today -- precisely because you knew it would be controversial and because it might cost you supporting troops whom professional raiders privately disdain but publicly pay lip service to in order to secure their pilers.

I have no doubt you got a kick out of seeing Europeia and TNI endorsing a lead nation that had been under Milograd's control, and I hope for the sake of their sovereignty and their dignity that it's the last chuckle you get at their expense. You need them, but they don't need you, and I hope to see them choose to work more with regions who will have enough respect for them to be honest with them and less with regions like, well, yours.

You make it sound like the ideological disconnect between orgs and imperialists hasn't been a well known fact amongst the leadership of both for roughly 6 years.

[Cormac Stark]

The UDL trying to dictate policy to other regions is nothing new, but if this is the track that Spiritus will also be taking then I expect it will not be long until Spiritus gains the same reputation.

I have no interest in dictating policy to other regions. Europeia's and The New Inquisition's military decisions are their own to make; I think it's pretty clear what course I, as an individual with an opinion, hope they'll choose, but that's their choice to make. Unlike some, I trust their ability to make sound decisions when provided with all the information and have concealed nothing.

[Mallorea and Riva]

The UDL trying to dictate policy to other regions is nothing new, but if this is the track that Spiritus will also be taking then I expect it will not be long until Spiritus gains the same reputation.

I have no interest in dictating policy to other regions. Europeia's and The New Inquisition's military decisions are their own to make; I think it's pretty clear what course I, as an individual with an opinion, hope they'll choose, but that's their choice to make. Unlike some, I trust their ability to make sound decisions when provided with all the information and have concealed nothing.

Dude you concealed the person controlling the nation I didn't conceal anything, if Euro or TNI would like to know if puppets used to belong to Milograd then I will certainly let them know in the future.

Klaus: There are enough mutual interests that we make it work in the end. Having people like Cormac to work against always seems to bring about a united front.

[Milograd]

He's new to the game, Avakael, cut him some slack.

[Cromarty]

Any raider stupid enough to break rank over his babbling should be stripped of the title.

Call it raider unity or whatever you want, it doesn't matter.

At the end of the day, defender efforts at having the raider world mirror them in internal dysfunction will continue to fail because you see, unlike you, they don't get their panties in a bunch over a load of political bullshit. No self-respecting updater is going to buy into your garbage, and you clearly don't get the culture if you think any legit raiders are going to equate TSP with Japan.

Take it to the update, Cormac. Take it to the update.

As TNI, LKE and Euro keep saying, they aren't raiders.

[Cromarty]

He's new to the game, Avakael, cut him some slack.

This is marginally amusing, considering your own relative newness.

[Milograd]

He's new to the game, Avakael, cut him some slack.

This is marginally amusing, considering your own relative newness.

Right, because I definitely joined in 2011.

[Common-Sense Politics]

For the record, I never suspected Mall or TBH leadership was trying to pull one over on us. Mall and Jakker have always been very straight up with me in our limited business together. We don't agree on much of anything but I respect both of them because they consistently reciprocate that respect.

[Cromarty]

This is marginally amusing, considering your own relative newness.

Right, because I definitely joined in 2011.

Oh dear Milo.

Have you forgotten who you're talking to? I remember the original Carta.

[Milograd]

Right, because I definitely joined in 2011.

Oh dear Milo.

Have you forgotten who you're talking to? I remember the original Carta.

And I remember St George of England, and you and I both know you've been around longer than that.

[Vortiaganica]

Oh dear Milo.

Have you forgotten who you're talking to? I remember the original Carta.

And I remember St George of England, and you and I both know you've been around longer than that.

Why is this even a thing you're talking about right now in this thread?

If I didn't know better I'd say you're both getting a little heated but this is really just trivial commentary.

Don't make me get mah scythe.

[Tramiar]

For the record, I never suspected Mall or TBH leadership was trying to pull one over on us. Mall and Jakker have always been very straight up with me in our limited business together. We don't agree on much of anything but I respect both of them because they consistently reciprocate that respect.

Aren't you listening to Cormac? Obviously we get much more amusement out of... well, im not really sure. Making you endorse nations that used to belong to Carta? (Cormac, what exactly are we finding amusing about that? And when did we start having problems with Euro or TNI that we'd want to purposefully decieve them about something? Please tell me, cause you obviously know much more about TBH than me or its other leaders, and I'd like to get the story right.)

[Common-Sense Politics]

It just seems to me that on top of foolishly trying to get people to break rank with TBH, Cormac is mischaracterizing the extent of Euro/TNI-LKE's involvement in the TSP anti-coup effort.

But hey, whatever. It shouldn't matter if Milo is the point or not, this is a whole other ball game, and raiders don't rip at each other in their own arena for what happened elsewhere.

That kind of hyper-moralism, insane backstabbing behavior is best kept on the other side of the fence.

I think it might be you who is mischaracterizing Europeia's involvement in the effort to restore law and order in TSP. Not only was it our top military priority for the duration of the incident, we were the first to come to the Coalition's defense diplomatically. We refused Milograd's entry to our community and will continue to do so. We were happy to defer to their command structure, following their lead in whatever capacity we could at the time. I think our contribution was substantial and appreciated, as was validated by TSP's eventual victory announcement. I would have loved to have given oodles of WAs every night but that just wasn't an option for us.

EDIT: And after double checking we ran zero operations outside of TSP, update or reinforcement, during that time.

[Belschaft]

It just seems to me that on top of foolishly trying to get people to break rank with TBH, Cormac is mischaracterizing the extent of Euro/TNI-LKE's involvement in the TSP anti-coup effort.

But hey, whatever. It shouldn't matter if Milo is the point or not, this is a whole other ball game, and raiders don't rip at each other in their own arena for what happened elsewhere.

That kind of hyper-moralism, insane backstabbing behavior is best kept on the other side of the fence.

I think it might be you who is mischaracterizing Europeia's involvement in the effort to restore law and order in TSP. Not only was it our top military priority for the duration of the incident, we were the first to come to the Coalition's defense diplomatically. We refused Milograd's entry to our community and will continue to do so. We were happy to defer to their command structure, following their lead in whatever capacity we could at the time. I think our contribution was substantial and appreciated, as was validated by TSP's eventual victory announcement. I would have loved to have given oodles of WAs every night but that just wasn't an option for us.

EDIT: And after double checking we ran zero operations outside of TSP, update or reinforcement, during that time.

If I remember correctly a representative of Euro's Navy had direct access to TSP's second highest decision making group during the coup. Euro's contribution was vital and highly appreciated.

This is marginally amusing, considering your own relative newness.

Right, because I definitely joined in 2011.

I dunno, if you didn't join in 2011 but had actually been around for much longer under a different name that would mean you were lying about almost everything for two years, which would kinda make you a sociopath, wouldn't it?

[Milograd]

I dunno, if you didn't join in 2011 but had actually been around for much longer under a different name that would mean you were lying about almost everything for two years, which would kinda make you a sociopath, wouldn't it?

"Sociopath" is an awfully strong word to use to describe someone for how they play a game.

[Belschaft]

I dunno, if you didn't join in 2011 but had actually been around for much longer under a different name that would mean you were lying about almost everything for two years, which would kinda make you a sociopath, wouldn't it?

"Sociopath" is an awfully strong word to use to describe someone for how they play a game.

I'd say it is the perfect word to describe you should, as you seem to be indicating in this thread, Carta/Milograd merely be a concocted persona, considering the various IRL details you've claimed as such.

[Mallorea and Riva]

Whether or not Milograd is a sociopath does not belong in TBH's news thread. I doubt it belongs in any thread really.

[B Wolf]

I think it might be you who is mischaracterizing Europeia's involvement in the effort to restore law and order in TSP. Not only was it our top military priority for the duration of the incident, we were the first to come to the Coalition's defense diplomatically. We refused Milograd's entry to our community and will continue to do so. We were happy to defer to their command structure, following their lead in whatever capacity we could at the time. I think our contribution was substantial and appreciated, as was validated by TSP's eventual victory announcement. I would have loved to have given oodles of WAs every night but that just wasn't an option for us.

EDIT: And after double checking we ran zero operations outside of TSP, update or reinforcement, during that time.

Well, okay then. I just guess that given the overall low performance of the resistance, I didn't notice any significant contribution that was overt. But your point about deferring to their command is noted, and clearly you honoured your alliance and were steadfast and substantial in your support, as you could and additionally behind the scenes.

Don't be mad at me Mr. President

[Common-Sense Politics]

Not mad. Just wanted to correct a misconception.

[Jakker]

Silly Cormac trying to get people to be mad at each other. Don't you have anything better to do?

Euro's assistance in this current operation is much appreciated and we sincerely respect all of Euro's leadership. Personally for me, CSP's witty one liners are what do it for me.

[SkyDip]

Silly Cormac trying to get people to be mad at each other. Don't you have anything better to do?

Euro's assistance in this current operation is much appreciated and we sincerely respect all of Euro's leadership. Personally for me, CSP's witty one liners are what do it for me.

And here I thought I was the favorite child.

[Charles Cerebella]

Sorry to be late to the party, I've been away a few days and am only now catching up.

First, to clarify our involvement in helping liberate TSP. The New Inquisition was the third region to post their diplomatic support in favour of the legitimate TSP government, and the UIAF was involved in every liberation attempt that we were informed was going on and stood ready to aid on a number of occasions with 7+ troops when liberations did not happen due to a failure for others to provide sufficient troops.

We were involved in support of a TBH separate occupation during this period, which is merely an efficient use of the UIAF's significant reinforcement numbers given the fact that Milo/Durk's banning made any non-updater nations in the region not viable as a tactic. We further took part or led in a number of other update operations. TSP updates a little gone 5 o'clock am and pm GMT. Leaving five minutes before and after to switch WA nations, that leaves a good hour and twenty minutes of update when other operations can take place. UIAF updaters are well practised in conducting multiple missions during updates, as shown by our recent capture of 18 regions during a major. As such, during the coup our other activities never prevented the UIAF giving its maximum possible resources to the efforts to liberate the region and we always stood ready to aid whenever asked, more than can be said for many others.

Now as to the matter of the Japan occupation. Given the nation is no longer controlled by Milograd, we have no objection to continuing to support the mission as long as it may continue. Should we end up working with Milograd in future through regions he is part of, for example with Lazarus, a treaty ally of both TNI and the LKE, then should the Government of The South Pacific inform us that they are unhappy with us working with Lazarus or TBH or whoever because of that then we will of course seek to honour their request and look for ways that we can work with those regions consistently with our relationship with TSP. But we have no intention as it stands of changing our policies due to the pressure of someone who is not part of the The South Pacific government and who does not speak officially for them but instead is trying to poison the friendly and long-standing relationship between us and The Black Hawks.

[Cromarty]

Hmmm, 'poison' is an interesting choice of words there. Quite frankly I would say all Cormac was doing was informing groups that may have problems supporting a raid led by someone who couped their treatied ally that that raid may be being led by that person. Certainly Milograd's words implied he was leading the operation, so the fact that TNIAF and Euro were supporting the raid would've been... interesting to say the least.

Obviously we know that this isn't the case now, so TNIAF and Euro can stay in... Japan is it? (I've really stopped paying attention lol) without... ummm... consternation?

[Cormac Stark]

Just as a note, it truly was not my intention to poison anyone's relations with anyone. I received some information and raised some questions regarding that information, questions which have now been answered. I was not questioning either Europeia's or The New Inquisition's commitment to The South Pacific, both because it's not my place to do so but also because I personally witnessed that commitment during the liberation of TSP and it's not even a question in my mind. While I would certainly like to see Europeia and The New Inquisition not involved in the occupation of Japan, the deployment of their forces is their choice and I respect it -- I just also wanted them to be aware of information of which I had become aware.

I appreciate the responses from both Europeia and The New Inquisition and their attention to this matter.

[Cerian Quilor]

Hmmm, 'poison' is an interesting choice of words there. Quite frankly I would say all Cormac was doing was informing groups that may have problems supporting a raid led by someone who couped their treatied ally that that raid may be being led by that person. Certainly Milograd's words implied he was leading the operation, so the fact that TNIAF and Euro were supporting the raid would've been... interesting to say the least.

Obviously we know that this isn't the case now, so TNIAF and Euro can stay in... Japan is it? (I've really stopped paying attention lol) without... ummm... consternation?

TNIAF no longer really exists (at the moment, anyway), Cromarty. Get with the program. Its UIAF now.