The United Defenders League

[Ambroscus Koth]

Woah, I dig this gameplay test. Surprised at how many other people were farther right than I was, seeing as I explicitly stated it was great idea for people to barge into regions for no reason and hold it indefinitely, and how defending is wrong and unneeded

[Unibot II]

Woah, I dig this gameplay test. Surprised at how many other people were farther right than I was, seeing as I explicitly stated it was great idea for people to barge into regions for no reason and hold it indefinitely, and how defending is wrong and unneeded

Yes, but then there is .. JAL.

What, 3000+ career ejections?

[Ambroscus Koth]

Yeah, I don't mind being outshone by JAL

[Thousandsuns]

interesting experience when doing detag

I hope you had fun detagging, bud.

Update is in a few hours. So if you want to do it again, we'll have stuff to do. ^^

yeah... coming through

[Unibot II]

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In an unprecedented move, Halcones declared no defender should try to restore Iraq, demonstrating the hatred that runs deep in the Black Riders squadron for Islam and the Middle East. Today, a joint FRA-UDL Active Restoration Mission of Iraq was initiated and conducted successfully with Lt. Ravania triggering and Sir Unibot, Lt. Zwangzug, Merryman Arkinesia and Luna Dancing on the ready for the imminent strike.

Defender forces moved in a two-second window of opportunity which amounted to no soldier being ejected or banned by the active invader delegate.

Islamophobia in NationStates will not be tolerated by The United Defenders League and we thank our fellow defender organization for their commitment to this mission to free Iraq.

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[Mallorea and Riva]

In an unprecedented move, Halcones declared no defender should try to restore Iraq, demonstrating the hatred that runs deep in the Black Riders squadron for Islam and the Middle East.

Wouldn't try detagging this one, fendas.

- Halcones.

Care to elaborate there? You're making a very broad claim. Is it the position of the United Defender's League that TBR as an organization target Muslim and Middle Eastern regions predominantly?

[Drop Your Pants]

Defender forces moved in a two-second window of opportunity which amounted to no soldier being ejected or banned by the active invader delegate.

Although 3 of us were late and the FRA took lead by mistake.

Islamophobia in NationStates will not be tolerated by The United Defenders League and we thank our fellow defender organization for their commitment to this mission to free Iraq.

It was fun to defend but we didn't do it because you claim TBR are Islamophobia's. I can't speak for the others but i only did it because i was online


There's a whole topic on the subject Mall
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=200558

[General Halcones]

Yes congratulations on Iraq. You really didn't need to send that many in for just a detag though - I was going to lose delegacy that update anyway. I would actually consider what you did as an invasion - you were not liberating since the raiders had already left, and it was hardly a detag with that number of troops. Is it the case, that UDL has a preference to protect Islamic regions over others?

I am also surprised that you feel the need to gloat about it - amazing - out of the 22 we took that update, you have only yet detagged one. Please note, you did attempt another, but I prevented it.

Why is that you have snipped out that quote, Uni? It's best to always keep things in context, don't be like the press.

[Mallorea and Riva]

There's a whole topic on the subject Mall
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=200558

That topic is about whether TBR actually have such a policy, I'm asking Unibot not about his opinion, but about the official position of the United Defenders League.

[Sayfs Region]

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(Image)

In an unprecedented move, Halcones declared no defender should try to restore Iraq, demonstrating the hatred that runs deep in the Black Riders squadron for Islam and the Middle East. Today, a joint FRA-UDL Active Restoration Mission of Iraq was initiated and conducted successfully with Lt. Ravania triggering and Sir Unibot, Lt. Zwangzug, Merryman Arkinesia and Luna Dancing on the ready for the imminent strike.

Defender forces moved in a two-second window of opportunity which amounted to no soldier being ejected or banned by the active invader delegate.

Islamophobia in NationStates will not be tolerated by The United Defenders League and we thank our fellow defender organization for their commitment to this mission to free Iraq.

(Image)

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Are the black riders squadran a satanic region then?

[Of the Free Socialist Territories]

FreeSoc's TL;DR: ALL TBR MEMBERS HATE ALL MUSLIMS

Nice to see some balanced coverage of the actions of the UDL and the Black Riders this week.

Also, since when has "don't detag this" been proof of Islamophobia?

[Drop Your Pants]

Where did Uni say that exact quote? And since this is the UDL thread of course its biased to UDL.

[Of the Free Socialist Territories]

Where did Uni say that exact quote? And since this is the UDL thread of course its biased to UDL.

Bias shouldn't get in the way of fact.

demonstrating the hatred that runs deep in the Black Riders squadron for Islam and the Middle East.

It's pretty heavily implied.

[Mahaj]

This thread is not intended to be a list of all the true facts about the world.

Nevertheless, we do believe that the things said in our official posts (since we cannot sanction the content not in official posts) have accuracy to them.

[Crushing Our Enemies]

Can we just cut out the Islamophobia accusations? All the evidence is on the table: people can draw their own conclusions. Continuing to talk about it in the absence of any new evidence is just getting tiresome.

[Kog SFBA]

Can we just cut out the Islamophobia accusations? All the evidence is on the table: people can draw their own conclusions. Continuing to talk about it in the absence of any new evidence is just getting tiresome.

I can say that personally, I do not believe that TBR is islamophobic or targets regions specifically because of any connection to Islam.

[Drop Your Pants]

It's pretty heavily implied.

But Uni never actually said all TBR members hate all muslims

[Lyanna Stark]

Can we just cut out the Islamophobia accusations? All the evidence is on the table: people can draw their own conclusions. Continuing to talk about it in the absence of any new evidence is just getting tiresome.

I can say that personally, I do not believe that TBR is islamophobic or targets regions specifically because of any connection to Islam.

Same. Nor that everyone in TBR is Islamophobic or anything like that.

The fact that this argument is being made by the UDL that TBR and all those involved in TBR are (or were) Islamophobic without any real proof actually shown a reason to doubt the truth of claims that UDL makes in the future. :/

I like the UDL, but I like proven factual arguments more. >.>

Come out with actual proof or retract the claim; I warn you, inaccurate uses of statistics don't count as proof.

[Cormac Stark]

The fact that this argument is being made by the UDL that TBR and all those involved in TBR are (or were) Islamophobic without any real proof actually shown a reason to doubt the truth of claims that UDL makes in the future. :/

I don't think anyone has even said that, so I'm not sure how distorting what people have actually said -- that TBR has an organizational bias against Islam, not that everyone in TBR does -- is productive. For me, the evidence for this bias has been not so much the number of Islamic regions they raid (particularly since tag raiding is often arbitrary) but the frequency in which they occupy Islamic regions long-term lately and the intensity of their griefing of those regions in comparison to other non-Islamic regions.

I don't actually have statistics on any of that, but I'm sure everyone recalls the intense griefing of Region of reunited muslim states followed very shortly after by the similarly heavy -- though not as long -- griefing of Iraq.

EDIT: I still haven't seen an explanation for why Halcones singled out Iraq, of the dozens of regions TBR raided during that particular update, as the region that defenders shouldn't detag either.

[A Million Voices]

For me, the evidence for this bias has been not so much the number of Islamic regions they raid (particularly since tag raiding is often arbitrary) but the frequency in which they occupy Islamic regions long-term lately and the intensity of their griefing of those regions in comparison to other non-Islamic regions.

I don't actually have statistics on any of that, but I'm sure everyone recalls the intense griefing of Region of reunited muslim states followed very shortly after by the similarly heavy -- though not as long -- griefing of Iraq.

The occupation of RORM was 5 months ago and the last full occupation of Iraq was 3 weeks ago. Am I forgetting some regions? I don't think I am, but even if I forgot one, we are hardly occupying these regions in droves. Two holds does not an "organizational bias" make.

In fact, if you even admit you have no statistics on this, you shouldn't assert it. The claim that "oh everyone remembers how bad it was" has the substance of a soap bubble. Of course natives got kicked and their posts surpressed. But doesn't this happen with our other holds? I said it in my other thread and I will say it again: Allowing ourselves to get bogged down in the minutiae of a single raid is a distraction, and does nothing to establish a pattern of targeting islamic regions.

EDIT: I still haven't seen an explanation for why Halcones singled out Iraq, of the dozens of regions TBR raided during that particular update, as the region that defenders shouldn't detag either.

He explained it pretty clearly on our announcement thread.

...You'll notice very few Islamic regions in the mix - Iraq was taken yet again, rendering the defender's recent detag operation pointless. Iraq was targeted not because it is Middle-Eastern or Islamic, but because the defenders care so passionately about it. Target selection largely depends on the defenders' feelings, not our own.

[Cormac Stark]

EDIT: I still haven't seen an explanation for why Halcones singled out Iraq, of the dozens of regions TBR raided during that particular update, as the region that defenders shouldn't detag either.

He explained it pretty clearly on our announcement thread.

...You'll notice very few Islamic regions in the mix - Iraq was taken yet again, rendering the defender's recent detag operation pointless. Iraq was targeted not because it is Middle-Eastern or Islamic, but because the defenders care so passionately about it. Target selection largely depends on the defenders' feelings, not our own.

No, that was an explanation for why it was raided again; it wasn't an explanation for why he posted a warning on the RMB not to detag it. And in fact the idea that "the defenders care so passionately about it" was spurred by us using a larger than usual group to detag it, in response to his post warning not to detag it and his efforts to prevent detagging.

In regard to Region of reunited muslim states, your occupation lasted for over a month so while it may have started five months ago it ended four months ago -- and was followed very shortly after by the occupation of Iraq, with an attempt to occupy RORMS (the new region) sandwiched in between. Unless I've missed something on your news thread, the only occupation between Region of reunited muslim states and Iraq was South America though you can correct me if I'm wrong.

[Crushing Our Enemies]

I would assume he recommended against detagging it because he knew they were going to hit it again 24 hours later - so a detag would be fruitless.

[Cormac Stark]

I would assume he recommended against detagging it because he knew they were going to hit it again 24 hours later - so a detag would be fruitless.

Oh, sure. He's always so concerned about us wasting our time.

[Of the Free Socialist Territories]

It's pretty heavily implied.

But Uni never actually said all TBR members hate all muslims

I was being hyperbolic in my TL;DR, but the point still stands that Uni has just accused TBR as a group of being largely a collection of Islamophobes.

I'm going to have to agree with Lyanna on this. Facts are good, opinions are good. Opinions masquerading as facts are not.

[Kogvuron]

But Uni never actually said all TBR members hate all muslims

I was being hyperbolic in my TL;DR, but the point still stands that Uni has just accused TBR as a group of being largely a collection of Islamophobes.

I'm going to have to agree with Lyanna on this. Facts are good, opinions are good. Opinions masquerading as facts are not.

So, if facts are good, why are you making up things that Unibot said?