The Coalition Strikes back! (Open, MT, OOC)

[San-Silvacian]

I wasn't talking to you

Those magically satellites eh?

I've been using airborne recon and haven't even mentioned satellites.

Funny thing is, on even modern satellites, my ships would be, if anything, a single discolored grey/blue pixel on your map.

About 4 IRL years ago I managed to contract out a launch base from an allied nation as part of a deal back in the Jolt era, amazing how many satellites you can launch when no one is looking and what sort of advances you can make... especially when you already know where to look.

Basically I'm using multiple sources, your own launches, the directions your fighters fled, the location your missiles came from, the occasional times I break through your jamming, the direction in which all of the tomahawk missiles in question were shot down from, and last but not least, 'gray pixels' on the blue water. But posting all that boring technobabble is a waste of time.

I also didn't fire all my defense missiles off if you read my posts correctly, I fired a thousand from my most well equipped AA ships. I still have my other destroyers and my other ships with their VLS cells. I won't say they have an unlimited amount of missiles, but they still have around 500-800 left, I'd be safe and go with 600.

And I'm calling bullshit about you shooting that many of them down then.

The speed of a RIM-174 is Mach 3.5

Just letting you know.

The BrahMos is a rather stealthy design.

Basically you have 6 minutes to shoot them all down, while being distracted by missiles coming in the opposite direction and having to deal with the slower and more noticeable Tomahawks which is what your ships and aircraft are going to notice first, and your aircraft are now basically having to return to base because they fired their ordinance off as well.

As for the RIM-174, you don't need to explain it's abilities, I have them too, like I said, I've been concealing the full strength of my forces all this time, didn't you think it was rather odd that despite supposedly using 'Russian Tech" much of my army's equipment is Western? In true Nod fashion, lure your opponent into under estimating you, and then completely catch him off guard from an angle he didn't expect.

Heck you failed to notice that the first groups to open fire upon your aircraft wasn't a frigate, but an armed cargo ship which was equipped with several Surface to Air missiles. Oh and I'll need to post for my landing fleet's attack as well later on, can't leave them out either.

No, I was laughing at your quartermasters high suicide rates due to the horrible logistics issues you have.

Also, you don't understand satellites well do you? Unless you can give me some info on your super satellites, they don't exist.

Also, six minutes for 50+ ships to prioritize, asses, and knock out missiles?

lol.

[The Black Hand of Nod]

About 4 IRL years ago I managed to contract out a launch base from an allied nation as part of a deal back in the Jolt era, amazing how many satellites you can launch when no one is looking and what sort of advances you can make... especially when you already know where to look.

Basically I'm using multiple sources, your own launches, the directions your fighters fled, the location your missiles came from, the occasional times I break through your jamming, the direction in which all of the tomahawk missiles in question were shot down from, and last but not least, 'gray pixels' on the blue water. But posting all that boring technobabble is a waste of time.

And I'm calling bullshit about you shooting that many of them down then.


The BrahMos is a rather stealthy design.

Basically you have 6 minutes to shoot them all down, while being distracted by missiles coming in the opposite direction and having to deal with the slower and more noticeable Tomahawks which is what your ships and aircraft are going to notice first, and your aircraft are now basically having to return to base because they fired their ordinance off as well.

As for the RIM-174, you don't need to explain it's abilities, I have them too, like I said, I've been concealing the full strength of my forces all this time, didn't you think it was rather odd that despite supposedly using 'Russian Tech" much of my army's equipment is Western? In true Nod fashion, lure your opponent into under estimating you, and then completely catch him off guard from an angle he didn't expect.

Heck you failed to notice that the first groups to open fire upon your aircraft wasn't a frigate, but an armed cargo ship which was equipped with several Surface to Air missiles. Oh and I'll need to post for my landing fleet's attack as well later on, can't leave them out either.

No, I was laughing at your quartermasters high suicide rates due to the horrible logistics issues you have.

Don't even get me started on that, seriously there's a very LARGE downside to having the nation be mostly decentralized. I had to sort things by tiers and use standardized ammunition throughout all of it simply to keep things intact, but that's what having a domestic arms industry is good for. But I'm not the first nation to hybridize tech, hell modern nations do it often, reverse engineering is difficult but one of the things I like.

In fact, why haven't your men fainted from the logistics issue?
You're using a Mix of Western Naval Sams, Russian Land SAMs, Russian Anti-ship missiles, American AND Russian Aircraft... Basically you're not one to talk.

But it's sorted out pretty well, Marines use Russian, Army uses Western, Merchant Marine and Escorts use Russia, Professional Navy uses Western. Submarines are the only logistic hurdles which is why the older ships use Russian while the newer ones use Hybrids.

That's why none of the ships even show up all at once, but that's another story.

Also, you don't understand satellites well do you? Unless you can give me some info on your super satellites, they don't exist.

Don't need to, I just need more than one
Might want to read this also, since you're about realism and all.
forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10880

Lastly, the P-1000 is a real weapon you know, and it's max speed was 447 mph.

Also, six minutes for 50+ ships to prioritize, asses, and knock out missiles?
lol.

And yet you seem to think that your missiles are going to hit New Korongo. He should be able to easily shoot them down easily. I mean if you can take the now around 4,000 missiles then he should be able to take a measly 64 out without breaking a sweat, just like I will the next time you launch an air or naval strike on me.

Your planes haven't had a chance to land, your people should be just now coming down from an adrenaline rush and feeling fatigued, and, unlike the Korongo, I'm not firing them all off in the same direction and angle nor am I hitting the same targets, and because of the timing you don't even have time to get the S-400 on shore active before they're on the beach.

Basically if claim you can shoot them all down, there's absolutely nothing you can do to touch me because I can shoot anything you send down just as easily using the very same argument you used.

[Bojikami]

Just post it in the IC if you need back up.

[San-Silvacian]

No, I was laughing at your quartermasters high suicide rates due to the horrible logistics issues you have.

Don't even get me started on that, seriously there's a very LARGE downside to having the nation be mostly decentralized. I had to sort things by tiers and use standardized ammunition throughout all of it simply to keep things intact, but that's what having a domestic arms industry is good for. But I'm not the first nation to hybridize tech, hell modern nations do it often, reverse engineering is difficult but one of the things I like.

In fact, why haven't your men fainted from the logistics issue?
You're using a Mix of Western Naval Sams, Russian Land SAMs, Russian Anti-ship missiles, American AND Russian Aircraft... Basically you're not one to talk.

But it's sorted out pretty well, Marines use Russian, Army uses Western, Merchant Marine and Escorts use Russia, Professional Navy uses Western. Submarines are the only logistic hurdles which is why the older ships use Russian while the newer ones use Hybrids.

That's why none of the ships even show up all at once, but that's another story.

Also, you don't understand satellites well do you? Unless you can give me some info on your super satellites, they don't exist.

Don't need to, I just need more than one
Might want to read this also, since you're about realism and all.
forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=10880

Lastly, the P-1000 is a real weapon you know, and it's max speed was 447 mph.

Also, six minutes for 50+ ships to prioritize, asses, and knock out missiles?
lol.

And yet you seem to think that your missiles are going to hit New Korongo. He should be able to easily shoot them down easily. I mean if you can take the now around 4,000 missiles then he should be able to take a measly 64 out without breaking a sweat, just like I will the next time you launch an air or naval strike on me.

Your planes haven't had a chance to land, your people should be just now coming down from an adrenaline rush and feeling fatigued, and, unlike the Korongo, I'm not firing them all off in the same direction and angle nor am I hitting the same targets, and because of the timing you don't even have time to get the S-400 on shore active before they're on the beach.

Basically if claim you can shoot them all down, there's absolutely nothing you can do to touch me because I can shoot anything you send down just as easily using the very same argument you used.

Here, this is a very nice guide to naval warfare.

I think you should take a gander.

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69551

It has a really nice section on satellites that should clear things up.

[The Black Hand of Nod]

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69551

It has a really nice section on satellites that should clear things up.

and last but not least, 'gray pixels' on the blue water

Just wondering, how did New Korongo know where your landing fleet was in the first place? I mean he didn't scout for it, he didn't tell anyone, why didn't you say anything then? He just somehow "Knew" where your ships were? Why didn't you say anything then?

[San-Silvacian]

You see grey pixels.

You can't tell were, you can't tell what, and you can't tell how many unless you count every single small little pixel.

I thought I'd brought it up in my post concerning the few hundred aircraft Krowns threw at me from his aircraft carriers in the matter of minutes, and the fact that three of the models he used weren't even carrier capable.

[Erucia]

You see grey pixels.

You can't tell were, you can't tell what, and you can't tell how many unless you count every single small little pixel.

I thought I'd brought it up in my post concerning the few hundred aircraft Krowns threw at me from his aircraft carriers in the matter of minutes, and the fact that three of the models he used weren't even carrier capable.

Look. I know that that's a true case of godmodding that happened to you there, but you dodged the question. Why didn't you say anything earlier about that missile launch?

[The Black Hand of Nod]

You see grey pixels.
You can't tell where,

I can tell where it is not.

There's a very limited area that your fleet can operate from, my subs border the western edge of your sonar buoy net so if headed west I'd know about it, too far inland and we'd have picked you up, as for too far away, see below.

Secondly, and this the most important thing, your retreating aircraft fled directly towards your fleet and it's anti-air protection, now usually ICly one would just assume that your planes were just "bugging out" and running for it, but then you decided to hit me with obvious ship based surface to air missiles. The moment you did so was the moment that it was 100% proven that there was at least one enemy ship in the area.
It also narrows down the area where your picket ships would be.

Thirdly, even despite the jamming I can tell that there's something(s) at around 400 km away.

You can't tell what, you can't tell how many unless you count every single small little pixel.

Actually it's counting, then sorting through what looks like a valid 'real' pixel ship and a false positive.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Interesting post Nod.

Everything I'm about to do is deserved.

Looks like you're going to need more men also.
That's a lot to shoot down.

Not rly... optimistic calculations say it took well over 30 minutes launching that barrage. Unless ofc, somebody launched their Tomahawks all at once, in which case we have a lot of broken keels to contend with. Newton's Third Law (To every action there is always an equal and opposite reaction) is a bitch.

[Krownsinburg]

Krownsburg, do you want air support?

Yes.

I would very much love aerial support.

[Krownsinburg]

However the San-Silvacians had an ace card, the F-15E and Su-25KMs. They broke away from the main group of aircraft and began to turn around the city, leaving the air battle and began to hunt down the enemy SAM systems. The Su-25KMs began to dive quickly, firing off their rockets and 30mm cannon in a strafing motion as the F-15Es dropped JDAM guided Mark 82s on enemy tanks, SAMs, and more anti-aircraft.

The fuck is this?

You're attacking ANTI-AIRCRAFT VEHICLES with AIRCRAFT?

And you know, I'm only invading the city from the East, I don't have it surrounded, and AA guns & SAM's litter the area's throughout the countryside near Bergen & Pharamond, so either you're pilots are dumb, and don't know how Ground-to-Air combat works, or they just have a death wish.

Eitherway, I'd rethink that post.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

However the San-Silvacians had an ace card, the F-15E and Su-25KMs. They broke away from the main group of aircraft and began to turn around the city, leaving the air battle and began to hunt down the enemy SAM systems. The Su-25KMs began to dive quickly, firing off their rockets and 30mm cannon in a strafing motion as the F-15Es dropped JDAM guided Mark 82s on enemy tanks, SAMs, and more anti-aircraft.

The fuck is this?

You're attacking ANTI-AIRCRAFT VEHICLES with AIRCRAFT?

And you know, I'm only invading the city from the East, I don't have it surrounded, and AA guns & SAM's litter the area's throughout the countryside near Bergen & Pharamond, so either you're pilots are dumb, and don't know how Ground-to-Air combat works, or they just have a death wish.

Eitherway, I'd rethink that post.

SEAD says otherwise.

[San-Silvacian]

However the San-Silvacians had an ace card, the F-15E and Su-25KMs. They broke away from the main group of aircraft and began to turn around the city, leaving the air battle and began to hunt down the enemy SAM systems. The Su-25KMs began to dive quickly, firing off their rockets and 30mm cannon in a strafing motion as the F-15Es dropped JDAM guided Mark 82s on enemy tanks, SAMs, and more anti-aircraft.

The fuck is this?

You're attacking ANTI-AIRCRAFT VEHICLES with AIRCRAFT?

And you know, I'm only invading the city from the East, I don't have it surrounded, and AA guns & SAM's litter the area's throughout the countryside near Bergen & Pharamond, so either you're pilots are dumb, and don't know how Ground-to-Air combat works, or they just have a death wish.

Eitherway, I'd rethink that post.

Its been done?

Look up the Gulf War, most notably the Coalition's Air War against Iraqi SAM and SPAAG sites.

But I'll change it. Change it in my favor.

[The Black Hand of Nod]

Looks like you're going to need more men also.
That's a lot to shoot down.

Not rly... optimistic calculations say it took well over 30 minutes launching that barrage. Unless ofc, somebody launched their Tomahawks all at once, in which case we have a lot of broken keels to contend with. Newton's Third Law (To every action there is always an equal and opposite reaction) is a bitch.

That would be around... 110 missiles a minute for 30 minutes. Maybe 90 missiles a minute if we want to go on longer.

By no means is that a small amount of missiles.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Not rly... optimistic calculations say it took well over 30 minutes launching that barrage. Unless ofc, somebody launched their Tomahawks all at once, in which case we have a lot of broken keels to contend with. Newton's Third Law (To every action there is always an equal and opposite reaction) is a bitch.

[floatright]

[/floatright] That would be around... 110 missiles a minute for 30 minutes.

Mk 41 VLS got a rate of fire of 24 missiles a minute...

[The Black Hand of Nod]

[floatright]

[/floatright] That would be around... 110 missiles a minute for 30 minutes.

Mk 41 VLS got a rate of fire of 24 missiles a second...

True, there's also another factor, and we don't know how many ships New had launching at a time.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Mk 41 VLS got a rate of fire of 24 missiles a second...

True, there's also another factor, and we don't know how many ships New had launching at a time.

Did I say second? It should be minute, 24 missiles going away erry second on a ship would snap its keel... <.< lawl.

[Krownsinburg]

The fuck is this?

You're attacking ANTI-AIRCRAFT VEHICLES with AIRCRAFT?

And you know, I'm only invading the city from the East, I don't have it surrounded, and AA guns & SAM's litter the area's throughout the countryside near Bergen & Pharamond, so either you're pilots are dumb, and don't know how Ground-to-Air combat works, or they just have a death wish.

Eitherway, I'd rethink that post.

SEAD says otherwise.

That might work if your coming into the battle, and the enemy has no idea you're there, but when you're RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEIR CROSSHAIRS.

Yeah, no.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

SEAD says otherwise.

That might work if your coming into the battle, and the enemy has no idea you're there, but when you're RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEIR CROSSHAIRS.

Yeah, no.

Americans did it in the Vietnam war, I doubt that the NVA was drinking tea by their SA-2's and ZSU-57-2's.
Another point, I'm not trying to nitpick, but Krown, Google translated German is an absolute eyesore to people who understands the language. Ask me before you press that translate button and copy-paste.

[San-Silvacian]

That might work if your coming into the battle, and the enemy has no idea you're there, but when you're RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEIR CROSSHAIRS.

Yeah, no.

Americans did it in the Vietnam war, I doubt that the NVA was drinking tea by their SA-2's and ZSU-57-2's.
Another point, I'm not trying to nitpick, but Krown, Google Translate German is an absolute eyesore to people who understands the language. Ask me before you press that translate button and copy-paste.

US did it in 'Nam.

Did it in Iraq (Both times and a number of times from '92 to '98)

Did it over Bosnia & Herzegovina.

The United States loves taking on SAM sites.

It gets their rocks off.

Also, I edited it to make it more realistic.

F-15Es wouldn't drop JDAMs on SPAAGs, they'd drop GBU-12s ;D

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Americans did it in the Vietnam war, I doubt that the NVA was drinking tea by their SA-2's and ZSU-57-2's.
Another point, I'm not trying to nitpick, but Krown, Google Translate German is an absolute eyesore to people who understands the language. Ask me before you press that translate button and copy-paste.

US did it in 'Nam.

Did it in Iraq (Both times and a number of times from '92 to '98)

Did it over Bosnia & Herzegovina.

The United States loves taking on SAM sites.

It gets their rocks off.

Also, I edited it to make it more realistic.

F-15Es wouldn't drop JDAMs on SPAAGs, they'd drop GBU-12s ;D

Serbs were like, "fuck why can't we get more than one minute of radar-time?!" in Bosnia IIRC.

[San-Silvacian]

US did it in 'Nam.

Did it in Iraq (Both times and a number of times from '92 to '98)

Did it over Bosnia & Herzegovina.

The United States loves taking on SAM sites.

It gets their rocks off.

Also, I edited it to make it more realistic.

F-15Es wouldn't drop JDAMs on SPAAGs, they'd drop GBU-12s ;D

Serbs were like, "fuck why can't we get more than one minute of radar-time?!" in Bosnia IIRC.

Pretty much this.

They can shoot down stelf F-117As, but they couldn't even touch F-15Es.

Makes me wonder.

Also, J-20s are garabage. Even the Russians say those are at least 10-20 years behind in stelf technorogy. I also don't like having them appear out of nowhere and suddenly in the battle, the E-3 would have detected them VERY far away, like Nods F-22As.

I just wonder if Nod's pilots like flying with their oxygen malfunctioning :<

[New Belhavia]

Sorry to interrupt everyone's discussion of aerial and naval warfare, but two things. Korongo never responded to my telegram about the VX gas. I didn't like the napalm, but allowed it. However, I'm not Adwest, and I stick to conventional weaponry (no offense, Adwest ). So, I want us to set ground rules about this. I don't want to RP lethal gas as I think that's not fun or realistic in my case. So, I'd ask that Pharamond be "frozen" ie not ICly posted about as we figure this VX thing out.

Second, Bojikami, on that strain, just because I was away for a couple of days, please DO NOT just post as if I gave up. Please. I'd appreciate it. I'd like you to just delete your post until we figure out the VX thing, thanks.

[The Black Hand of Nod]

I just wonder if Nod's pilots like flying with their oxygen malfunctioning :<

Two back ups... because you never know if the first AND second one could fail on these.

Personally, I was wondering how effective those EF-18s are considering how unreliable the ALQ-99 is. Intermittently is my estimate.

As for SEAD, now you know why I deliberately kept my tracking radar's off for so long and merely relied on an AESA as a general heads up.

[San-Silvacian]

400 million dollar dropped into an airplane?

Oxygen systems mess up :<

Thats just my person gripe with the F-22 though.

Thats why I've only used 3-4 EF-18Gs so far, I don't really like using it.

I thought I had the EF-111 added, but meh.

I'll be making an interceptor with a EW variant anyway soon, just after this war is over.