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NS Military Realism Consultation Thread Vol. 11.0

A place to put national factbooks, embassy exchanges, and other information regarding the nations of the world. [In character]

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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Founded: Jun 28, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:01 am

Let's be real here the Sharifistani horde hasn't got this thing called "discipline" and judging by their horrendous casualty numbers they are about as effective as the Mahdis were when faced with Maxims and state of the art field artillery at Omdurman.
Last edited by Austria-Bohemia-Hungary on Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Purpelia
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Founded: Oct 19, 2010
Ex-Nation

Postby Purpelia » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:04 am

Ideal Britain wrote:
Purpelia wrote:A criminal is a criminal is a criminal. All criminals are simply ill trained attempts at humanity that are best discarded at a garbage heap rather than accepted into society. Putting firearms in their hands is a recipe for disaster.

Are you serious?
Obama smoked weed in Uni, doesn’t mean he was an ineffective lawyer or statesman.
And people can be sent to county jail for that, getting a criminal record

He is the guy that won a nobel peace prize and than started a war. Do I need to provide commentary?
Purpelia does not reflect my actual world views. In fact, the vast majority of Purpelian cannon is meant to shock and thus deliberately insane. I just like playing with the idea of a country of madmen utterly convinced that everyone else are the barbarians. So play along or not but don't ever think it's for real.



The above post contains hyperbole, metaphoric language, embellishment and exaggeration. It may also include badly translated figures of speech and misused idioms. Analyze accordingly.

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Ideal Britain
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Postby Ideal Britain » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:12 am

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:Let's be real here the Sharifistani horde hasn't got this thing called "discipline" and judging by their horrendous casualty numbers they are about as effective as the Mahdis were when faced with Maxims and state of the art field artillery at Omdurman.

The difference is they have better technology and strategy than the Madhists.
The casualties were high because they were replaceable.
Also the Sharifistani Armed Forces are disciplined except for the fact that they gamble.

And even then when explicitly ordered not to either gamble or womanise as part of the strategy (during the Danistarab campaign, to avoid offending their local Islamist allies) they don’t.
A nation that does represent my views set in Britain in the late 2040s.
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Air-Commodore Sir Alexander Khan, Knight of the Garter, Commander of the British Empire, Bachelor of Science, MP.

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Gallia-
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Gallia- » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:14 am

Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:Let's be real here the Sharifistani horde hasn't got this thing called "discipline" and judging by their horrendous casualty numbers they are about as effective as the Mahdis were when faced with Maxims and state of the art field artillery at Omdurman.


just stop replying to him lol

he's literally like 14 just add him to ignore and move on
Last edited by Gallia- on Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:14 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The New California Republic
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Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:20 am

Champagne Socialist Sharifistan wrote:
The New California Republic wrote:Except the job that you seem to want to give them involves them having access to heavy weapons.

True but people with misdemeanour convictions can own firearms in both the UK and USA and that’s for owning than rather than bearing them subject to strict military discipline.

"May have a gun" is entirely different from "will have access to heavy weapons"...
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
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Champagne Socialist Sharifistan
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Postby Champagne Socialist Sharifistan » Wed Aug 12, 2020 5:26 am

Gallia- wrote:
Austria-Bohemia-Hungary wrote:Let's be real here the Sharifistani horde hasn't got this thing called "discipline" and judging by their horrendous casualty numbers they are about as effective as the Mahdis were when faced with Maxims and state of the art field artillery at Omdurman.


just stop replying to him lol

he's literally like 14 just add him to ignore and move on

I’m 18.
A nation which partly represents my views.
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The Turkish War of Independence and everything before along with 2014 modernisation are set in stone.
Everything else is subject to change

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Mitheldalond
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Postby Mitheldalond » Wed Aug 12, 2020 6:57 am

Idea for a new weapon system for modern fighters: ASW pods. Basically to turn (almost) any modern fighter into an anti-sub aircraft, since dedicated long-range platforms like the S-2 Tracker or S-3 Viking don't really exist anymore. Mostly intended for carrier-based aircraft; helicopters like the SH/MH-60 are fine for defending a carrier group, but really lack the range and endurance if you need to support a different allied formation (say, another carrier group) farther away.

The system would consist of two or more pods: 1-2 for sonobuoys, and another containing the equipment to allow the aircraft to interface/communicate with the buoys, plus a towed MAD array (like on the SH-60B). The later might have to be two seperate pods depending on how much room the sonobuoy interface equipment takes up, and on the aircraft carrying it. As it turns out, a typical sonobuoy (A-size; 36 in x 4.875 in) is about the same size as a BLU-108 submunition (31 in x 5.25 in), of which the CBU-97 cluster bomb carries 10. So two pods about the size of a CBU-97 (or one larger pod) would get you 20 sonobuoys. The aircraft would also carry ASW torpedoes like the Mk 46, which (I assume) would be parachute deployed.

An installation for say, an F-15E Strike Eagle would perhaps carry two sonobuoy pods - one on each wing pylon, an interface/MAD pod on the centerline fuselage hardpoint, and four torpedoes on the front and back fuselage hardpoints. It would still be able to carry four AAMs on the side rails on the wing pylons.

This would probably be best for two-seat fighters (with a weapon system officer) since the pilot is most likely too busy flying at wave top height to also be keeping track of a bunch of sonobuoys and a MAD array.

Thoughts?

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The New California Republic
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Wed Aug 12, 2020 6:59 am

Mitheldalond wrote:Idea for a new weapon system for modern fighters: ASW pods. Basically to turn (almost) any modern fighter into an anti-sub aircraft, since dedicated long-range platforms like the S-2 Tracker or S-3 Viking don't really exist anymore. Mostly intended for carrier-based aircraft; helicopters like the SH/MH-60 are fine for defending a carrier group, but really lack the range and endurance if you need to support a different allied formation (say, another carrier group) farther away.

The system would consist of two or more pods: 1-2 for sonobuoys, and another containing the equipment to allow the aircraft to interface/communicate with the buoys, plus a towed MAD array (like on the SH-60B). The later might have to be two seperate pods depending on how much room the sonobuoy interface equipment takes up, and on the aircraft carrying it. As it turns out, a typical sonobuoy (A-size; 36 in x 4.875 in) is about the same size as a BLU-108 submunition (31 in x 5.25 in), of which the CBU-97 cluster bomb carries 10. So two pods about the size of a CBU-97 (or one larger pod) would get you 20 sonobuoys. The aircraft would also carry ASW torpedoes like the Mk 46, which (I assume) would be parachute deployed.

An installation for say, an F-15E Strike Eagle would perhaps carry two sonobuoy pods - one on each wing pylon, an interface/MAD pod on the centerline fuselage hardpoint, and four torpedoes on the front and back fuselage hardpoints. It would still be able to carry four AAMs on the side rails on the wing pylons.

This would probably be best for two-seat fighters (with a weapon system officer) since the pilot is most likely too busy flying at wave top height to also be keeping track of a bunch of sonobuoys and a MAD array.

Thoughts?

Fighters aren't really designed for loitering persistently over an area at fairly low speeds while searching for subs.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Founded: Jun 28, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Wed Aug 12, 2020 7:21 am

Mitheldalond wrote:Idea for a new weapon system for modern fighters: ASW pods. Basically to turn (almost) any modern fighter into an anti-sub aircraft, since dedicated long-range platforms like the S-2 Tracker or S-3 Viking don't really exist anymore. Mostly intended for carrier-based aircraft; helicopters like the SH/MH-60 are fine for defending a carrier group, but really lack the range and endurance if you need to support a different allied formation (say, another carrier group) farther away.

The system would consist of two or more pods: 1-2 for sonobuoys, and another containing the equipment to allow the aircraft to interface/communicate with the buoys, plus a towed MAD array (like on the SH-60B). The later might have to be two seperate pods depending on how much room the sonobuoy interface equipment takes up, and on the aircraft carrying it. As it turns out, a typical sonobuoy (A-size; 36 in x 4.875 in) is about the same size as a BLU-108 submunition (31 in x 5.25 in), of which the CBU-97 cluster bomb carries 10. So two pods about the size of a CBU-97 (or one larger pod) would get you 20 sonobuoys. The aircraft would also carry ASW torpedoes like the Mk 46, which (I assume) would be parachute deployed.

An installation for say, an F-15E Strike Eagle would perhaps carry two sonobuoy pods - one on each wing pylon, an interface/MAD pod on the centerline fuselage hardpoint, and four torpedoes on the front and back fuselage hardpoints. It would still be able to carry four AAMs on the side rails on the wing pylons.

This would probably be best for two-seat fighters (with a weapon system officer) since the pilot is most likely too busy flying at wave top height to also be keeping track of a bunch of sonobuoys and a MAD array.

Thoughts?

Acquire Common Support Aircraft or a flying boat with air air refuelling capability instead.

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New Vihenia
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Posts: 3781
Founded: Apr 03, 2011
Democratic Socialists

Postby New Vihenia » Wed Aug 12, 2020 8:15 am

Mitheldalond wrote:Idea for a new weapon system for modern fighters: ASW pods. Basically to turn (almost) any modern fighter into an anti-sub aircraft, since dedicated long-range platforms like the S-2 Tracker or S-3 Viking don't really exist anymore. Mostly intended for carrier-based aircraft; helicopters like the SH/MH-60 are fine for defending a carrier group, but really lack the range and endurance if you need to support a different allied formation (say, another carrier group) farther away.

The system would consist of two or more pods: 1-2 for sonobuoys, and another containing the equipment to allow the aircraft to interface/communicate with the buoys, plus a towed MAD array (like on the SH-60B). The later might have to be two seperate pods depending on how much room the sonobuoy interface equipment takes up, and on the aircraft carrying it. As it turns out, a typical sonobuoy (A-size; 36 in x 4.875 in) is about the same size as a BLU-108 submunition (31 in x 5.25 in), of which the CBU-97 cluster bomb carries 10. So two pods about the size of a CBU-97 (or one larger pod) would get you 20 sonobuoys. The aircraft would also carry ASW torpedoes like the Mk 46, which (I assume) would be parachute deployed.

An installation for say, an F-15E Strike Eagle would perhaps carry two sonobuoy pods - one on each wing pylon, an interface/MAD pod on the centerline fuselage hardpoint, and four torpedoes on the front and back fuselage hardpoints. It would still be able to carry four AAMs on the side rails on the wing pylons.

This would probably be best for two-seat fighters (with a weapon system officer) since the pilot is most likely too busy flying at wave top height to also be keeping track of a bunch of sonobuoys and a MAD array.

Thoughts?


Sounds like Su-32.

The Russians at one point desired to fashion Su-34 for a Survivable MPA. Long tailsting will carry the MAD, centerlines for sonobuoys, Khisnik (V004) Radar adopted for maritime strike/patrol role. and AAM's just in case a close encounter with NATO fighters.
We make planes,ships,missiles,helicopters, radars and mecha musume
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Snoodum
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Father Knows Best State

Postby Snoodum » Wed Aug 12, 2020 2:07 pm

Hello everyone. First time posting but I was just wondering if anyone can tell me if the Ares APC used by the British Army could take an RPG to the side on the part that carries the soldiers. I'm thinking of basing my government cars with those little flags out front around the Ares given I'm roleplaying a Psychotic dictatorship and all. Thanks for any feedback!
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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Wed Aug 12, 2020 2:09 pm

Snoodum wrote:Ares APC used by the British Army could take an RPG to the side on the part that carries the soldiers.

No. It will explode and die.

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The New California Republic
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Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Wed Aug 12, 2020 2:14 pm

Snoodum wrote:Hello everyone. First time posting but I was just wondering if anyone can tell me if the Ares APC used by the British Army could take an RPG to the side on the part that carries the soldiers. I'm thinking of basing my government cars with those little flags out front around the Ares given I'm roleplaying a Psychotic dictatorship and all. Thanks for any feedback!

You could put BAR armour on it to short out the piezo fuse on the RPG...
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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New Vihenia
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Democratic Socialists

Postby New Vihenia » Wed Aug 12, 2020 2:33 pm

I assume even a sub-Kilotonne nuclear warhead will still leave considerable radiation signature ? Is it true ?.
We make planes,ships,missiles,helicopters, radars and mecha musume
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The Akasha Colony
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Founded: Apr 25, 2010
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Akasha Colony » Wed Aug 12, 2020 2:40 pm

Snoodum wrote:Hello everyone. First time posting but I was just wondering if anyone can tell me if the Ares APC used by the British Army could take an RPG to the side on the part that carries the soldiers. I'm thinking of basing my government cars with those little flags out front around the Ares given I'm roleplaying a Psychotic dictatorship and all. Thanks for any feedback!


It can if properly armored. But dictators generally do not prefer to ride around in such vehicles for a number of good reasons.
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The New California Republic
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Postby The New California Republic » Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:14 pm

New Vihenia wrote:I assume even a sub-Kilotonne nuclear warhead will still leave considerable radiation signature ? Is it true ?.

Yes it'll likely still be picked up by gamma detectors.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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Austria-Bohemia-Hungary
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Austria-Bohemia-Hungary » Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:23 pm

The New California Republic wrote:
New Vihenia wrote:I assume even a sub-Kilotonne nuclear warhead will still leave considerable radiation signature ? Is it true ?.

Yes it'll likely still be picked up by gamma detectors.

What if you blow it up 200 meters under the water? *thonking*

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Triplebaconation
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Founded: Feb 22, 2013
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Triplebaconation » Wed Aug 12, 2020 3:45 pm

New Vihenia wrote:I assume even a sub-Kilotonne nuclear warhead will still leave considerable radiation signature ? Is it true ?.


Depends.
Proverbs 23:9.

Things are a bit larger than you appear to think, my friend.

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Austrasien
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Founded: Apr 07, 2013
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Postby Austrasien » Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:50 pm

Mitheldalond wrote:Idea for a new weapon system for modern fighters: ASW pods. Basically to turn (almost) any modern fighter into an anti-sub aircraft, since dedicated long-range platforms like the S-2 Tracker or S-3 Viking don't really exist anymore. Mostly intended for carrier-based aircraft; helicopters like the SH/MH-60 are fine for defending a carrier group, but really lack the range and endurance if you need to support a different allied formation (say, another carrier group) farther away.

The system would consist of two or more pods: 1-2 for sonobuoys, and another containing the equipment to allow the aircraft to interface/communicate with the buoys, plus a towed MAD array (like on the SH-60B). The later might have to be two seperate pods depending on how much room the sonobuoy interface equipment takes up, and on the aircraft carrying it. As it turns out, a typical sonobuoy (A-size; 36 in x 4.875 in) is about the same size as a BLU-108 submunition (31 in x 5.25 in), of which the CBU-97 cluster bomb carries 10. So two pods about the size of a CBU-97 (or one larger pod) would get you 20 sonobuoys. The aircraft would also carry ASW torpedoes like the Mk 46, which (I assume) would be parachute deployed.

An installation for say, an F-15E Strike Eagle would perhaps carry two sonobuoy pods - one on each wing pylon, an interface/MAD pod on the centerline fuselage hardpoint, and four torpedoes on the front and back fuselage hardpoints. It would still be able to carry four AAMs on the side rails on the wing pylons.

This would probably be best for two-seat fighters (with a weapon system officer) since the pilot is most likely too busy flying at wave top height to also be keeping track of a bunch of sonobuoys and a MAD array.

Thoughts?


https://navalnews.net/predator-b-used-i ... nstration/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzlTkXR9BEU
https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news ... v-revealed

Fighters are a poor choice because you will need a fairly large number of fighters to keep even one in the air at all times. Especially if they are assigned somewhere a significant distance from their base of operations.
Last edited by Austrasien on Wed Aug 12, 2020 11:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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The weak crumble, are slaughtered and are erased from history while the strong survive. The strong are respected and in the end, peace is made with the strong.

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Arkandros
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Founded: Jul 11, 2013
Father Knows Best State

Postby Arkandros » Thu Aug 13, 2020 2:39 am

New Vihenia wrote:I assume even a sub-Kilotonne nuclear warhead will still leave considerable radiation signature ? Is it true ?.

Lower yield weapons are actually harder to get a “cleaner” burn of fuel on, largely based on the isotope decay chain and incomplete utilization as a single stage weapon. If you want to minimize post detonation contamination/fission products, you’ll want to look at the decay chain to stability, then multiply the sum of the chain’s half lives by 5 to estimate how long it will take to be safe to occupy the area, or by 10 to estimate how long that chain will be detectable.
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Champagne Socialist Sharifistan
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Posts: 4471
Founded: Dec 08, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Champagne Socialist Sharifistan » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:24 am

Can Travellers or Romani make good soldiers?

I think they can but in this RP some guy said they would all steal from civilians and desert. I thought that sounded racist.
A nation which partly represents my views.
Founder of the Traditionalist Military Alliance:https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=493756
The Turkish War of Independence and everything before along with 2014 modernisation are set in stone.
Everything else is subject to change

Black Lives Matter!

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Crookfur
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Founded: Antiquity
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Crookfur » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:38 am

Champagne Socialist Sharifistan wrote:Can Travellers or Romani make good soldiers?

I think they can but in this RP some guy said they would all steal from civilians and desert. I thought that sounded racist.

Roflcopter
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And yes I do like big old guns, why do you ask?

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Gallia-
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Founded: Oct 09, 2013
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Gallia- » Thu Aug 13, 2020 3:41 am

Champagne Socialist Sharifistan wrote:Can Travellers or Romani make good soldiers?

I think they can but in this RP some guy said they would all steal from civilians and desert. I thought that sounded racist.


It's probably right.

Gypsies/Roma communities have been hotbeds of petty crime since they arrived in Eastern Europe in the 1000's.

Crookfur wrote:
Champagne Socialist Sharifistan wrote:Can Travellers or Romani make good soldiers?

I think they can but in this RP some guy said they would all steal from civilians and desert. I thought that sounded racist.

Roflcopter


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