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American Politics XI: No Moe Roe(Likely, Anyway)

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Will the likely SCOTUS ruling on Dobbs v. Jackson change the dynamics of the Midterms?

Yes
145
59%
No
32
13%
A Bit of Both
41
17%
Don't Know
27
11%
 
Total votes : 245

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New haven america
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Posts: 42839
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun May 08, 2022 6:28 pm

Space Squid wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
Well, in that case it should just be dropped if there's no where to debate it.

This isn't the place to debate Christian doctrine at any rate.

I'll tell you what. If Christian doctrine is never allowed to play any role in American politics ever, then we won't talk about it here.

Besides, when someone hostile to Christianity comes into the CDT, you guys get very annoyed and say that's not the place for such discussions either.

So this is really just an attempt to constrain the discussion.

If a non-Catholic comes into the CDT they say there's no place for their opinions of beliefs in there.
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New haven america
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Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun May 08, 2022 6:35 pm

Most modern "Activists" are honestly kinda pathetic.

On one hand, I've been seeing so much shit the past few days about how women should be going on sex strikes or shaming men for jerking it, but what they don't understand is that that's exactly what conservatives want! They hate the idea of out-of-wedlock sex and sexual liberation, part of the reason they hate abortion so much is because they view it as encouraging "slutty" behavior with no consequences. You're playing right into their hands.

On the other side, tons upon tons of women are just accepting it. "Yeah, better just prepare, nothing else we can do. *shrug*" Nothing else!? Really? There's nothing you can imagine doing in order to stand up for your bodily autonomy?

It's infuriating. FFS, Mexico got abortion legalized within a day of the government declaring they'd be keeping it illegal, and yet up here they can't even envision 1 action that could help keep it legal? Are you serious?
Last edited by New haven america on Sun May 08, 2022 6:39 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Salus Maior
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Posts: 26776
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
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Postby Salus Maior » Sun May 08, 2022 6:37 pm

New haven america wrote:If a non-Catholic comes into the CDT they say there's no place for their opinions of beliefs in there.


Not really.
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist, Disillusioned Millennial.

"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Saiwania
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Posts: 21020
Founded: Jun 30, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Saiwania » Sun May 08, 2022 6:39 pm

What does criminalizing abortion look like in terms of enforcing it? Is it a search warrant of her phone and computer to see what doctors and healthcare providers were sought out? Is it anyone she knows being interrogated about her menstrual cycle? Is it subpoena of insurance, travel, and bank records?
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Shrillland
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19339
Founded: Apr 12, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Shrillland » Sun May 08, 2022 6:40 pm

New haven america wrote:Most modern "Activists" are honestly kinda pathetic.

On one hand, I've been seeing so much shit the past few days about how women should be going on sex strikes or shaming men for jerking it, but what they don't understand is that that's exactly what conservatives want! They hate the idea of out-of-wedlock sex and sexual liberation, part of the reason they hate abortion so much is because they view it as encouraging "slutty" behavior with no consequences. You're playing right into their hands.

On the other side, tons upon tons of women are just accepting it. "Yeah, better just prepare, nothing else we can do. *shrug*" Nothing else!? Really? There's nothing you can imagine doing in order to stand up for your bodily autonomy?

It's infuriating. FFS, Mexico got abortion legalized within a day of the government declaring they'd be keeping it illegalized, and yet up here they can't even envision 1 action that could help keep it legal? Are you serious?


More or less. Mexico's abortion opponents weren't on the cusp of seizing dictatorial power and not needing to listen to the public on anything, they still had to bow to the masses. The main reason that nothing can be done is because the people who'd need to be swayed can't be by their opponents, only their increasingly angry and violent supporters.
Last edited by Shrillland on Sun May 08, 2022 6:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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New haven america
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Posts: 42839
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun May 08, 2022 6:45 pm

Shrillland wrote:
New haven america wrote:Most modern "Activists" are honestly kinda pathetic.

On one hand, I've been seeing so much shit the past few days about how women should be going on sex strikes or shaming men for jerking it, but what they don't understand is that that's exactly what conservatives want! They hate the idea of out-of-wedlock sex and sexual liberation, part of the reason they hate abortion so much is because they view it as encouraging "slutty" behavior with no consequences. You're playing right into their hands.

On the other side, tons upon tons of women are just accepting it. "Yeah, better just prepare, nothing else we can do. *shrug*" Nothing else!? Really? There's nothing you can imagine doing in order to stand up for your bodily autonomy?

It's infuriating. FFS, Mexico got abortion legalized within a day of the government declaring they'd be keeping it illegalized, and yet up here they can't even envision 1 action that could help keep it legal? Are you serious?


More or less. 1. Mexico's abortion opponents weren't on the cusp of seizing dictatorial power and not needing to listen to the public on anything, they still had to bow to the masses. 2. The main reason that nothing can be done is because the people who'd need to be swayed can't be by their opponents, only their increasingly angry and violent supporters.

1. Mexico's been in a state of dictatorship for its entire history. It was under the PRI's dictatorship when it got legalized, mainly because the citizens of Mexico City stormed and nearly burned down Los Pinos.

It can be done.

2. No, there's plenty of things that can be done, but I'm not allowed to post how on account of the site's stupid rules.
Last edited by New haven america on Sun May 08, 2022 6:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Rusozak
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Posts: 5142
Founded: Jun 14, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Rusozak » Sun May 08, 2022 6:48 pm

Saiwania wrote:What does criminalizing abortion look like in terms of enforcing it? Is it a search warrant of her phone and computer to see what doctors and healthcare providers were sought out? Is it anyone she knows being interrogated about her menstrual cycle? Is it subpoena of insurance, travel, and bank records?


Some red states have already proposed keeping a watch list of women suspected of seeking abortion. Just police state 101 shit.
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The Jamesian Republic
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Posts: 9904
Founded: Apr 28, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Jamesian Republic » Sun May 08, 2022 6:49 pm

Rusozak wrote:
Saiwania wrote:What does criminalizing abortion look like in terms of enforcing it? Is it a search warrant of her phone and computer to see what doctors and healthcare providers were sought out? Is it anyone she knows being interrogated about her menstrual cycle? Is it subpoena of insurance, travel, and bank records?


Some red states have already proposed keeping a watch list of women suspected of seeking abortion. Just police state 101 shit.


Ugh. That’s all I can say.
Last edited by The Jamesian Republic on Sun May 08, 2022 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Kannap
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 66454
Founded: May 07, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Kannap » Sun May 08, 2022 6:49 pm

Saiwania wrote:What does criminalizing abortion look like in terms of enforcing it? Is it a search warrant of her phone and computer to see what doctors and healthcare providers were sought out? Is it anyone she knows being interrogated about her menstrual cycle? Is it subpoena of insurance, travel, and bank records?


Keep your fantasies about women being abused in your head, we don't want to be a part of it.
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Washington Resistance Army
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Posts: 51797
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sun May 08, 2022 6:55 pm

New haven america wrote:
Space Squid wrote:I'll tell you what. If Christian doctrine is never allowed to play any role in American politics ever, then we won't talk about it here.

Besides, when someone hostile to Christianity comes into the CDT, you guys get very annoyed and say that's not the place for such discussions either.

So this is really just an attempt to constrain the discussion.

If a non-Catholic comes into the CDT they say there's no place for their opinions of beliefs in there.


The presence of Orthodox, Anglican and Protestant posters rather quickly disproves this.
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Saiwania
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21020
Founded: Jun 30, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Saiwania » Sun May 08, 2022 6:57 pm

Kannap wrote:Keep your fantasies about women being abused in your head, we don't want to be a part of it.


I'm looking into whether I should support or oppose the recent direction on abortion in the US. I had assumed that it'd keep being legal by default and this SCOTUS action blindsided me and I do see a lot of downsides. But it could also be very good. I might be able to get rich and more because of this brave new world we're entering. I'm a male though, so my stakes in this is less personal or significantly less.
Last edited by Saiwania on Sun May 08, 2022 6:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
All life is a battle, even to the last breath.
Showing mercy to an enemy creates a spiral of destruction.
Sacrificing your strength is the path of a fool.

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Salus Maior
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Posts: 26776
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Salus Maior » Sun May 08, 2022 6:58 pm

New haven america wrote: They hate the idea of out-of-wedlock sex and sexual liberation, part of the reason they hate abortion so much is because they view it as encouraging "slutty" behavior with no consequences.


There is a consequence; destroying a human life that they conceived just for fun. That's the point. Discarding an innocent human life just to enable hedonism is dystopian, and the fact you don't get that is even more dystopian.

There's nothing worth preserving in hookup culture.
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"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Tarsonis
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Posts: 21787
Founded: Sep 20, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Tarsonis » Sun May 08, 2022 6:58 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
New haven america wrote:If a non-Catholic comes into the CDT they say there's no place for their opinions of beliefs in there.


The presence of Orthodox, Anglican and Protestant posters rather quickly disproves this.


that shot was aimed at me because NHA gets run out of the CDT on the reg: mainly for bringing up half baked, wildly erroneous and easily disprovable ideas about theology.
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New haven america
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Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun May 08, 2022 6:59 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
New haven america wrote: They hate the idea of out-of-wedlock sex and sexual liberation, part of the reason they hate abortion so much is because they view it as encouraging "slutty" behavior with no consequences.


There is a consequence; destroying a human life that they conceived just for fun. That's the point. Discarding an innocent human life just to enable hedonism is dystopian, and the fact you don't get that is even more dystopian.

There's nothing worth preserving in hookup culture.

We get it, you hate women and like watching them suffer.

You don't have to spam this fact 10,000 times a day.
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Eahland
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Posts: 2644
Founded: Apr 18, 2006
Libertarian Police State

Postby Eahland » Sun May 08, 2022 6:59 pm

Saiwania wrote:
Kannap wrote:Keep your fantasies about women being abused in your head, we don't want to be a part of it.


I'm looking into whether I should support or oppose the recent direction on abortion in the US. I had assumed that it'd keep being legal by default and this SCOTUS action blindsided me and I do see a lot of downsides. But it could also be very good. I might be able to get rich and more because of this brave new world we're entering. I'm a male though, so my stakes in this is less personal or significantly less.

You should oppose it because it's horrible.

But of course you'll support it because it's horrible.
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Salus Maior
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Posts: 26776
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Salus Maior » Sun May 08, 2022 7:02 pm

New haven america wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
There is a consequence; destroying a human life that they conceived just for fun. That's the point. Discarding an innocent human life just to enable hedonism is dystopian, and the fact you don't get that is even more dystopian.

There's nothing worth preserving in hookup culture.

We get it, you hate women and like watching them suffer.

You don't have to spam this fact 10,000 times a day.


That would certainly be easier for you to believe.
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist, Disillusioned Millennial.

"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Port Caverton
Minister
 
Posts: 2012
Founded: Oct 01, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Port Caverton » Sun May 08, 2022 7:03 pm

New haven america wrote:Most modern "Activists" are honestly kinda pathetic.

On one hand, I've been seeing so much shit the past few days about how women should be going on sex strikes or shaming men for jerking it, but what they don't understand is that that's exactly what conservatives want! They hate the idea of out-of-wedlock sex and sexual liberation, part of the reason they hate abortion so much is because they view it as encouraging "slutty" behavior with no consequences. You're playing right into their hands.

On the other side, tons upon tons of women are just accepting it. "Yeah, better just prepare, nothing else we can do. *shrug*" Nothing else!? Really? There's nothing you can imagine doing in order to stand up for your bodily autonomy?

It's infuriating. FFS, Mexico got abortion legalized within a day of the government declaring they'd be keeping it illegal, and yet up here they can't even envision 1 action that could help keep it legal? Are you serious?

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Saiwania
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Posts: 21020
Founded: Jun 30, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Saiwania » Sun May 08, 2022 7:03 pm

Eahland wrote:You should oppose it because it's horrible. But of course you'll support it because it's horrible.


There is debate on Stormfront whether this is better or worse for White America. That is what my loyalties are to. There is concern that we need abortion, else the non-White segments of the US are going to overtake the Whites even faster, because there is less preventing more births happening from women across the board getting pregnant from the sex they're going to have.
Last edited by Saiwania on Sun May 08, 2022 7:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
All life is a battle, even to the last breath.
Showing mercy to an enemy creates a spiral of destruction.
Sacrificing your strength is the path of a fool.

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Washington Resistance Army
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 51797
Founded: Aug 08, 2011
Father Knows Best State

Postby Washington Resistance Army » Sun May 08, 2022 7:05 pm

Saiwania wrote:
Eahland wrote:You should oppose it because it's horrible. But of course you'll support it because it's horrible.


There is debate on Stormfront whether this is better or worse for White America. That is what my loyalties are to. There is concern that we need abortion, else the non-White segments of the US are going to overtake the Whites even faster, because there is less preventing more births happening from women across the board getting knocked up from the sex they're going to have.


>claim not to be a Nazi anymore
>openly admit you use Stormfront and are only loyal to the idea of race

It'd be funny if it wasn't so sad.
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New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42839
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun May 08, 2022 7:06 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
New haven america wrote:We get it, you hate women and like watching them suffer.

You don't have to spam this fact 10,000 times a day.


That would certainly be easier for you to believe.

Everyone here thinks you do.
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Salus Maior
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Posts: 26776
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Salus Maior » Sun May 08, 2022 7:06 pm

Washington Resistance Army wrote:
Saiwania wrote:
There is debate on Stormfront whether this is better or worse for White America. That is what my loyalties are to. There is concern that we need abortion, else the non-White segments of the US are going to overtake the Whites even faster, because there is less preventing more births happening from women across the board getting knocked up from the sex they're going to have.


>claim not to be a Nazi anymore
>openly admit you use Stormfront and are only loyal to the idea of race

It'd be funny if it wasn't so sad.


Did anyone ever seriously consider the "I'm not a nazi" bit?
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist, Disillusioned Millennial.

"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Salus Maior
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Posts: 26776
Founded: Jun 16, 2014
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Salus Maior » Sun May 08, 2022 7:07 pm

New haven america wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
That would certainly be easier for you to believe.

Everyone here thinks you do.


Such a childish retort. Literally playground material.
Traditionalist Catholic, Constitutional Monarchist, Habsburg Nostalgic, Distributist, Disillusioned Millennial.

"In any case we clearly see....That some opportune remedy must be found quickly for the misery and wretchedness pressing so unjustly on the majority of the working class...it has come to pass that working men have been surrendered, isolated and helpless, to the hardheartedness of employers and the greed of unchecked competition." -Pope Leo XIII, Rerum Novarum

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Saiwania
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 21020
Founded: Jun 30, 2008
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Saiwania » Sun May 08, 2022 7:08 pm

Salus Maior wrote:Did anyone ever seriously consider the "I'm not a nazi" bit?


You don't need to be a National Socialist to be loyal to your own "in group" over other loyalties you find yourself attached to overtime. It just so happens that most neo-Nazis have similar worldview or sentiments to other race realists. Personal lives are quite complex.
Last edited by Saiwania on Sun May 08, 2022 7:12 pm, edited 4 times in total.
All life is a battle, even to the last breath.
Showing mercy to an enemy creates a spiral of destruction.
Sacrificing your strength is the path of a fool.

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The Reformed American Republic
Negotiator
 
Posts: 7417
Founded: May 23, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby The Reformed American Republic » Sun May 08, 2022 7:11 pm

Kannap wrote:Biden promised me nothing would fundamentally change and now things are fundamentally changing for the worse, what the hell dude?

The status quo involves things changing for the worse. That reality has not fundamentally changed.
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New haven america
Post Czar
 
Posts: 42839
Founded: Oct 08, 2012
Left-Leaning College State

Postby New haven america » Sun May 08, 2022 7:13 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
New haven america wrote:Everyone here thinks you do.


Such a childish retort. Literally playground material.

You could actually question why it is everyone thinks you hate women, but that's not going to happen.

And you know why that's not going to happen. Because then it'll out you and you can't have that happen.

Like, in your very post that lead to this you outright admitted abortion should be illegal in order to punish women, and yet you view nothing misogynistic about that.
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