American Politics VII: Virginia Reel

[Shrillland]

There is objective reality, it's just more focused on STEAM subjects rather than history or other humanities.

Maybe, but Common Core math is an abomination, schools in Progressive districts deny biology, and as for any practical application of STEM (other than "Learn to Code!"), it seems to be sorely lacking.

I always added that way myself...and what do you mean by denying biology?

[Merrill]

I'm not. The requirements my grandfather's school had for passing 8th grade were heavier than my high school graduation requirements. What is taught in schools now is so much 'feels' I'm not sure if any objective reality is left.

1) how do you know that?
2) What kind of school did your grandfather go to? If he went to a private preparatory school, that's not that surprising, because the private schools are largely meant for a social elite in the first place.

We compared his textbooks and tests to mine.
Public school in rural Wisconsin. Farm town. Boys had their rifles so they could hunt after school, and no one cared.

[Genivaria]

Maybe, but Common Core math is an abomination, schools in Progressive districts deny biology, and as for any practical application of STEM (other than "Learn to Code!"), it seems to be sorely lacking.

I always added that way myself...and what do you mean by denying biology?

5 bucks says he's talking about transgenders.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Maybe, but Common Core math is an abomination, schools in Progressive districts deny biology, and as for any practical application of STEM (other than "Learn to Code!"), it seems to be sorely lacking.

I always added that way myself...and what do you mean by denying biology?

10 pounds on "Trans people are a diseased abomination".

[Genivaria]

I always added that way myself...and what do you mean by denying biology?

10 pounds on "Trans people are a diseased abomination".

Ninjad.

[Merrill]

Not a question of free time. It should have been part of your elementary education along with learning to read, learning HOW (not what) to think, critical reasoning, mathematics, science, and history.

I thank you being such a "higher being" that you deign to come down and insult a total stranger.

Not an insult. Not your fault that the classics aren't taught anymore.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

I thank you being such a "higher being" that you deign to come down and insult a total stranger.

Not an insult. Not your fault that the classics aren't taught anymore.

It seems like you are not familiar with Aesop's Fables. Well, I suppose I shouldn't be surprised. The government indoctrination camps known as public schools don't teach the classics anymore.

https://alltimeshortstories.com/the-ant ... asshopper/

You haven't even got the foggiest idea of which country I am from. Thus it would do you fairly well in discarding this whole condescending assumption shtick you are currently sporting.

And yes that condescension that you so proudly display? That's a walking insult.

[Narland]

1. No one in the conversation said that it was. The subject is about the grandious demands of allegiance to a perceived orthodoxy, and the threat of dehumanization for disagreement. .
2. The reasonableness of "fraudlessness" is the topic. It is unreasonable to assert that among the 10s of thousandds of local elections and the 10s of millons of votes cast for President that there was no fraud whatsoever.
3. The burden of proof is on those accusing others of being malignant conspiratorial inhumans for questioning the the purity of an expressed, supposed orthodoxy. I do not think that anyone who questions any national election, questions its veracity, or questions its outcome is a mindless inhuman monster. It is my hope that neither do you.

1. Arguments from incredulity =/= evidence. The "orthodoxy" that I and many others have concluded stems from a lack of credible evidence from Trump et al. You are entitled to your opinions, but not your facts. "Dehumanization for disagreement" sounds a lot like "I refuse to entertain your BS", because it's exactly that in this scenario. Produce credible evidence, then maybe I shall reconsider my conclusions.
2. This is a rehash of arguments from incredulity. Just because there is a probability of something =/= proof that something happened.
3. When you have idiots spewing allegations like there were bamboo ballots from China or Hugo Chavez rigged the election from beyond his grave, then yes I will continue to call them conspiracy theorists. If you proceed to go down this path of vague allegations without evidence then I may call you one as well. Do not attempt sophistry, produce credible evidence first.

I do not care about the specifics of the election insofar as who won or lost. I care about the specifics of the elections regarding the American People's ability to monitor, question, and be shown evidence either for, or to the contrary, but that was not the point of the post. What I care about is people's inhumanity to other people with whom they disagree. If you wish to discuss this further, I will be happy to.

[Punished UMN]

1) how do you know that?
2) What kind of school did your grandfather go to? If he went to a private preparatory school, that's not that surprising, because the private schools are largely meant for a social elite in the first place.

We compared his textbooks and tests to mine.
Public school in rural Wisconsin. Farm town. Boys had their rifles so they could hunt after school, and no one cared.

How do you explain then that it has been necessary for IQ tests to be adjusted to keep the average at 100 because the average score keeps climbing upward over the last century?

[Merrill]

They can't. Unless of course, they convince a government entity to apply a corrupt definition of 'public use', and utilize eminent domain to force you to sell. Again, the issue is government overreach. If the corrupt government didn't have the power to force you out, Google would have to either meet your price, or go elsewhere.

You literally just offered a scenario WHERE THE GOVERNMENT DOES THE BID OF CAPITAL and still say capitalism has no share of blame.
Truly this is a religion for you.

Whoosh! You setup the scenario delineating that Google was to blame. I didn't say they weren't, I just stated that without a powerful government, the business doesn't have the ability to force what it wants. Now, if the Google Death Squad shows up at your door, then they are fully the problem. Unless that happens, how about we weaken the entity that actually can show up with guns?

[Merrill]

Employees should absolutely be free to strike if conditions are so poor as to warrant it. Of course, employers should also be free to hire replacements if other workers are willing.

And employees should be able to live in a free enough country that they can set up their own businesses to compete.with just a "Declaration To Do Business As" They will at least have their friends, family, and neighbors who knew how poorly they were treated at the other place as customers.

Yep. A little public shame goes a long way to change behavior. Plus, loss of profit is the ultimate motivator.

[Jeriga]

The last few pages have been filled with so many bad takes its ridiculous. Everything from socialism to democracy under attack by a dude that took philosophy 101 and ran with it.

The world requires that you give up freedoms to participate in a society that provides services that we all need without the pathetic idea that your income determine your access to those services. Voluntarism can literally die for all I care.

[Genivaria]

You literally just offered a scenario WHERE THE GOVERNMENT DOES THE BID OF CAPITAL and still say capitalism has no share of blame.
Truly this is a religion for you.

Whoosh! You setup the scenario delineating that Google was to blame. I didn't say they weren't, I just stated that without a powerful government, the business doesn't have the ability to force what it wants. Now, if the Google Death Squad shows up at your door, then they are fully the problem. Unless that happens, how about we weaken the entity that actually can show up with guns?

I'm going to put this as plainly as I can.
When the government is strong than capital uses it as it's club.
When the government is weak than capital dispenses with the pretense and uses its own club.

They are two sides of the same coin, they both use force, coercion, and violence to consolidate power into the hands of the very few.

[Narland]

The last few pages have been filled with so many bad takes its ridiculous. Everything from socialism to democracy under attack by a dude that took philosophy 101 and ran with it.

The world requires that you give up freedoms to participate in a society that provides services that we all need without the pathetic idea that your income determine your access to those services. Voluntarism can literally die for all I care.

When volunteerism dies the State then steps in to kill everyone it deems inconvenient. .

[Merrill]

I've got no problem with that. If the mission of managing public lands was more important than where they lived, they would have moved. Frankly, it's less than what I would do. The federal government shouldn't own any land inside the borders of a state that isn't a military base. Turn all the land over to the states. California can setup preserves for the polka dotted snail, and Utah can lease out for drilling.

And the Reservations? Those are federally-supervised by the BIA, remember. They govern themselves, but the BIA is the main middle man. Tribal authority is on an equal footing with State authority.

Yeah, I'm not down with how the Feds screw over the Reservations. They should be more independent. Since they are on equal authority with States, why does a Federal Agency have to "Manage" them?

[Jeriga]

The last few pages have been filled with so many bad takes its ridiculous. Everything from socialism to democracy under attack by a dude that took philosophy 101 and ran with it.

The world requires that you give up freedoms to participate in a society that provides services that we all need without the pathetic idea that your income determine your access to those services. Voluntarism can literally die for all I care.

When volunteerism dies the State then steps in to kill everyone it deems inconvenient. .

Bad take number 755774688

[San Lumen]

And the Reservations? Those are federally-supervised by the BIA, remember. They govern themselves, but the BIA is the main middle man. Tribal authority is on an equal footing with State authority.

Yeah, I'm not down with how the Feds screw over the Reservations. They should be more independent. Since they are on equal authority with States, why does a Federal Agency have to "Manage" them?

and why shouldnt the federal government manage places like Yellowstone and Yosemite? Yellowstone is an active volcano and if some moron drilled there it could set it off. That would be the end of the world as we know it.

[HISPIDA]

Yeah, I'm not down with how the Feds screw over the Reservations. They should be more independent. Since they are on equal authority with States, why does a Federal Agency have to "Manage" them?

and why shouldnt the federal government manage places like Yellowstone and Yosemite? Yellowstone is an active volcano and if some moron drilled there it could set it off. That would be the end of the world as we know it.

and i feel fine

[Merrill]

They are inefficient with the resources they have, so they should be given more? That's the opposite of the Parable of the Talents.

You really don't listen, they are inefficient BECAUSE of the budge cuts that were meant to make them fail.

Bill Clinton signed reforms designed to make them fail?

The federal welfare programs were increased year over year from their creation until the mid 90's. In all those decades, they became bloated, and riddled with fraud and abuse. Those programs have never been paragons of sainthood.

[Genivaria]

Yeah, I'm not down with how the Feds screw over the Reservations. They should be more independent. Since they are on equal authority with States, why does a Federal Agency have to "Manage" them?

and why shouldnt the federal government manage places like Yellowstone and Yosemite? Yellowstone is an active volcano and if some moron drilled there it could set it off. That would be the end of the world as we know it.

Merrill also believes that mask mandates are tyranny.
Actually nvm you two will get along.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

You really don't listen, they are inefficient BECAUSE of the budge cuts that were meant to make them fail.

Bill Clinton signed reforms designed to make them fail?

Yes.

[HISPIDA]

You really don't listen, they are inefficient BECAUSE of the budge cuts that were meant to make them fail.

Bill Clinton signed reforms designed to make them fail?

bingo

[Merrill]

I've got no problem with that. If the mission of managing public lands was more important than where they lived, they would have moved. Frankly, it's less than what I would do. The federal government shouldn't own any land inside the borders of a state that isn't a military base. Turn all the land over to the states. California can setup preserves for the polka dotted snail, and Utah can lease out for drilling.

No. I don't trust some places to manage the land properly. Id rather not see Yellowstone destroyed by a someone looking to a make a profit not to mention its also the largest active volcano on Earth. If some moron decided to drill there you could set it off and that would be end of the world as we know it.

Why should people uproot their entire lives when some of them of have spent years in DC? Why shouldn't government agencies be headquartered in the capital?

So, people looking to make a profit will ignore long-term considerations, and mismanage just for the evuls, but government workers are saints?

[Genivaria]

You really don't listen, they are inefficient BECAUSE of the budge cuts that were meant to make them fail.

Bill Clinton signed reforms designed to make them fail?

The federal welfare programs were increased year over year from their creation until the mid 90's. In all those decades, they became bloated, and riddled with fraud and abuse. Those programs have never been paragons of sainthood.

Republican politicians (and some Democrats yes) who think like you do designed them to fail yes.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

No. I don't trust some places to manage the land properly. Id rather not see Yellowstone destroyed by a someone looking to a make a profit not to mention its also the largest active volcano on Earth. If some moron decided to drill there you could set it off and that would be end of the world as we know it.

Why should people uproot their entire lives when some of them of have spent years in DC? Why shouldn't government agencies be headquartered in the capital?

So, people looking to make a profit will ignore long-term considerations, and mismanage just for the evuls, but government workers are saints?

More often than not in actually functioning societies. I dunno what planet you live in but it's clearly severely dysfunctional.