UK Politics Thread XI: Boris' Big Bombastic Brexit Bash

[Liriena]

Especially if we're talking about rich people who migrated to the UK recently and bought property in London, which describes a lot of the present rich in the UK today? Idk whats this obsession with assuming every rich person in the UK got their riches from the British East India Company or something.

Yes, I am aware of this, which is why I happen to support the New Zealand approach of banning non-residents from buying property. It's not ideal and it doesn't solve the problem in its entirety, but it curbs a big portion of it.

[Shrillland]

Labour hold South Shields.

[Fartsniffage]

Why didn't your private doctor diagnose you?

Because the only private health in stoke is a Nuffield health and I'm not covered with them.

So you used the NHS. Almost like you don't have any principles.

[Liriena]

Things would be even worse for Labour if the Brexit Party didn't get in the way.

Actually, from the results I saw a few moments ago, the opposite is true: what votes Labour lost seem to have largely gone to the Brexit Party. Which makes a tragic bit of sense: they aren't conservative voters, but they want Brexit and Labour hasn't made a convincing pitch on it.

[Purgatio]

Especially if we're talking about rich people who migrated to the UK recently and bought property in London, which describes a lot of the present rich in the UK today? Idk whats this obsession with assuming every rich person in the UK got their riches from the British East India Company or something.

Yes, I am aware of this, which is why I happen to support the New Zealand approach of banning non-residents from buying property. It's not ideal and it doesn't solve the problem in its entirety, but it curbs a big portion of it.

That's fair, but then you can't justify seizing their homes when old capitalists committed atrocities in the British Empire, because, you know, the two aren't remotely related. Seizing an Indian expat millionaire's London property because British capitalists looted his ancestor's home centuries ago is....dumb. I'm sure you'd agree.

[Purgatio]

Oh no, it's ancap-itis. It can only be cured by a comprehensive public healthcare system that's free at the point of access. Try not to reach for your wallet, it'll only make it worse.

A comprehensive public healthcare system that is free at the point of access totally faile to find out wtf was wrong with my eye.

You need to get diagnosed with some kind of allergy to interacting with the lower classes so you don't have to be wheeled into an NHS again.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Because the only private health in stoke is a Nuffield health and I'm not covered with them.

So you used the NHS. Almost like you don't have any principles.

I would much ather the hospital charged and was able to deliver a quality service. Unfortunately, it did not charge and (probably for that reason) I waited for 4 hours after which a doctor told me to come back on Monday because he and his boss had no idea what's wrong with my eye.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Yes, I am aware of this, which is why I happen to support the New Zealand approach of banning non-residents from buying property. It's not ideal and it doesn't solve the problem in its entirety, but it curbs a big portion of it. :)

That's fair, but then you can't justify seizing their homes when old capitalists committed atrocities in the British Empire, because, you know, the two aren't remotely related. Seizing an Indian expat millionaire's London property because British capitalists looted his ancestor's home centuries ago is....dumb. I'm sure you'd agree.

He can go live in his five other empty and derelicting palaces across the continent.

[Thermodolia]

Labour hold South Shields.

Ya know what would be funny is if we end up with a hung parliament and the exit poll was just dead wrong

[Thanatttynia]

Important project for people like me now is to push the Conservative Party leftward, free it from the death grip of liberalism. Might actually be possible post-Brexit. Blue Labour ideas/pressure could be very interesting going forward

[The Huskar Social Union]

Alliance might take North Down according to the latest on bbc ni’s live coverage on the tv

[Greater vakolicci haven]

A comprehensive public healthcare system that is free at the point of access totally faile to find out wtf was wrong with my eye.

You need to get diagnosed with some kind of allergy to interacting with the lower classes so you don't have to be wheeled into an NHS again.

Most of my friends are working class lol. I don't actually like many other rich people.

[Nakena]

Important project for people like me now is to push the Conservative Party leftward, free it from the death grip of liberalism. Might actually be possible post-Brexit. Blue Labour ideas/pressure could be very interesting going forward

Red Tory Rising.

[Liriena]

Yes, I am aware of this, which is why I happen to support the New Zealand approach of banning non-residents from buying property. It's not ideal and it doesn't solve the problem in its entirety, but it curbs a big portion of it.

That's fair, but then you can't justify seizing their homes when old capitalists committed atrocities in the British Empire, because, you know, the two aren't remotely related. Seizing an Indian expat millionaire's London property because British capitalists looted his ancestor's home centuries ago is....dumb. I'm sure you'd agree.

I think you misunderstood why I brought up the origins of private property under capitalism. It wasn't to use that as a way to hold contemporary property owners morally culpable enough to seize their surplus housing. It was to cast doubt on your point that seizing other people's property is inherently dictatorial.

[Major-Tom]

Things would be even worse for Labour if the Brexit Party didn't get in the way.

Actually, from the results I saw a few moments ago, the opposite is true: what votes Labour lost seem to have largely gone to the Brexit Party. Which makes a tragic bit of sense: they aren't conservative voters, but they want Brexit and Labour hasn't made a convincing pitch on it.

Brexit has ruined public discourse. My opinions on the EU are mixed, I think it's flawed, but holy fuck, Brexit has just been toxic. There are tangibly more pressing issues in the UK, namely a decade of austerity, healthcare, the environment, etc etc, but people hear "Brexit" and just start losing their fucking minds.

It's such a dull thing to win an election over, it's even more depressing that working class families are voting against their own class interests, literally rubber stamping a government that will ruin them all because they "love their Brexit!" Even if, of course, they probably couldn't tell you what Brexit entails apart from leaving the EU.

[Purgatio]

That's fair, but then you can't justify seizing their homes when old capitalists committed atrocities in the British Empire, because, you know, the two aren't remotely related. Seizing an Indian expat millionaire's London property because British capitalists looted his ancestor's home centuries ago is....dumb. I'm sure you'd agree.

He can go live in his five other empty and derelicting palaces across the continent.

Being a millionaire doesn't mean you are in the lap of luxury with mansions all across the globe, you know. It just means you have a net worth of one million or more in investible assets (minus your primary residence), which isn't extravagant or opulent in the least. What you are describing is probably how a billionaire lives, a millionaire's standard of living is marginally comfortable but certainly not excessive.

[Shrillland]

Labour hold South Shields.

Ya know what would be funny is if we end up with a hung parliament and the exit poll was just dead wrong

Not likely, alas. And it's all because of Farage, or mostly because of Farage anyway since the Brexit Party siphoning more from Labour than from the Conservatives in most of the declared seats.

And by the way, Conservatives hold Nuneaton.

[Purgatio]

You need to get diagnosed with some kind of allergy to interacting with the lower classes so you don't have to be wheeled into an NHS again.

Most of my friends are working class lol. I don't actually like many other rich people.

You need a more refined social circle, I think. You're like one of those rich people who eat at McDonalds or Five Guys. A palate needs to be refined over time just like a social calendar.

[Fartsniffage]

So you used the NHS. Almost like you don't have any principles.

I would much ather the hospital charged and was able to deliver a quality service. Unfortunately, it did not charge and (probably for that reason) I waited for 4 hours after which a doctor told me to come back on Monday because he and his boss had no idea what's wrong with my eye.

But you chose not to go to another hospital. You chose to go to a NHS hospital.

Just because your insurance didn't cover it I have to pay taxes to cover your healthcare? It's almost like your talking points are full off shit.

[An Alan Smithee Nation]

Did they just say that Curtice said some of the swings in the early results have been less than the exit poll would have led him to expect?

[The Huskar Social Union]

I would much ather the hospital charged and was able to deliver a quality service. Unfortunately, it did not charge and (probably for that reason) I waited for 4 hours after which a doctor told me to come back on Monday because he and his boss had no idea what's wrong with my eye.

But you chose not to go to another hospital. You chose to go to a NHS hospital.

Just because your insurance didn't cover it I have to pay taxes to cover your healthcare? It's almost like your talking points are full off shit.

Whaaaaaaaaat? Noooooo...

[Purgatio]

That's fair, but then you can't justify seizing their homes when old capitalists committed atrocities in the British Empire, because, you know, the two aren't remotely related. Seizing an Indian expat millionaire's London property because British capitalists looted his ancestor's home centuries ago is....dumb. I'm sure you'd agree.

I think you misunderstood why I brought up the origins of private property under capitalism. It wasn't to use that as a way to hold contemporary property owners morally culpable enough to seize their surplus housing. It was to cast doubt on your point that seizing other people's property is inherently dictatorial.

Okay, but today it definitely is. Rich developed countries tend to have human rights provisions in their Constitutions to stop the State from randomly seizing people's shit like a bunch of uncontrolled despots with untrammelled power to override your financial and economic autonomy. With the US, its the Takings Clause. In Europe, its A1P1 of the ECHR. So on and so forth. Mass nationalizations without compensation tends to be what you hear about happening in random far flung Third World dictatorships like Zimbabwe.

[Thanatttynia]

Did they just say that Curtice said some of the swings in the early results have been less than the exit poll would have led him to expect?

I saw him cautioning over the results in Scotland, but not sure over the rest of the UK

[The New California Republic]

Did they just say that Curtice said some of the swings in the early results have been less than the exit poll would have led him to expect?

If it is off, then I doubt it'll be by much, but I'm open to being surprised.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I would much ather the hospital charged and was able to deliver a quality service. Unfortunately, it did not charge and (probably for that reason) I waited for 4 hours after which a doctor told me to come back on Monday because he and his boss had no idea what's wrong with my eye.

But you chose not to go to another hospital. You chose to go to a NHS hospital.

Just because your insurance didn't cover it I have to pay taxes to cover your healthcare? It's almost like your talking points are full off shit.

I would expect my family pay far higher in taxes to the nhs than you do. Now, if there was an opt-out system, and so we generally contributed nothing to the NHS and I did that, it'd make a lot of sense; I'd expect to be charged if I'd somehow opted out. Since I haven't been given that chance however, why not use the terrible service I've been forced to be a part of.