MAGAThread XVI: Raising the Barr

[San Lumen]

Why are you defending Bolton now? The guy's a warmongering asshole that brings nothing to the table except urging Trump to invade every country on the extensive John Bolton shit list.

It’s not really a defense. More like a sour I am going to be sick taste in my mouth.

Bolton should never have been brought back.

Trump has to be evaluated on everything he says. The fact he fired him because of bad policy? Not in the sense of the word. More like he didn’t blindly follow Trump.

Even in Bolton’s case. He is what he is. You really don’t hear him saying he is the best of everything, cares about everybody and will make things better for everybody......

Im sure he will pick someone even worse to be national security advisor. Its not a position that has to be Senate confirmed. Even if it was Republicans would likely rubber stamp anyone Trump nominated

[Shrillland]

It’s not really a defense. More like a sour I am going to be sick taste in my mouth.

Bolton should never have been brought back.

Trump has to be evaluated on everything he says. The fact he fired him because of bad policy? Not in the sense of the word. More like he didn’t blindly follow Trump.

Even in Bolton’s case. He is what he is. You really don’t hear him saying he is the best of everything, cares about everybody and will make things better for everybody......

Im sure he will pick someone even worse to be national security advisor. Its not a position that has to be Senate confirmed. Even if it was Republicans would likely rubber stamp anyone Trump nominated

Well, all the signs are that he wants to bring McMaster back.

[Telconi]

It’s not really a defense. More like a sour I am going to be sick taste in my mouth.

Bolton should never have been brought back.

Trump has to be evaluated on everything he says. The fact he fired him because of bad policy? Not in the sense of the word. More like he didn’t blindly follow Trump.

Even in Bolton’s case. He is what he is. You really don’t hear him saying he is the best of everything, cares about everybody and will make things better for everybody......

Im sure he will pick someone even worse to be national security advisor. Its not a position that has to be Senate confirmed. Even if it was Republicans would likely rubber stamp anyone Trump nominated

Given your expressed beliefs on international politics, I pray he picks someone you think is worse.

[San Lumen]

Im sure he will pick someone even worse to be national security advisor. Its not a position that has to be Senate confirmed. Even if it was Republicans would likely rubber stamp anyone Trump nominated

Well, all the signs are that he wants to bring McMaster back.

That would be a good pick. Hes former military knows how disastrous a war with Iran or North Korea would be. I was convinced Bolton would have gotten us into a conflict with Tehran by now

[The Black Forrest]

Im sure he will pick someone even worse to be national security advisor. Its not a position that has to be Senate confirmed. Even if it was Republicans would likely rubber stamp anyone Trump nominated

Well, all the signs are that he wants to bring McMaster back.

Really? Why would anybody want to return? Would not bode well for McMaster’s reputation.

[Zurkerx]

Trump explains that part of his reason for ousting his National Security Adviser Bolton was that Kim Jong Un "wanted nothing to do with John Bolton".

I'm not sure if Twitter is good valid way of saying this is true (would like to see an article, which I can't fine). However, given Trump's temperament, I'm honestly not surprised anymore if this true.

Im sure he will pick someone even worse to be national security advisor. Its not a position that has to be Senate confirmed. Even if it was Republicans would likely rubber stamp anyone Trump nominated

Well, all the signs are that he wants to bring McMaster back.

What sane rational person would ever want to go back? I mean, unless McMaster feels he needs to keep Trump in check, I can't see him doing it, especially after resigning from his position.

[San Lumen]

Well, all the signs are that he wants to bring McMaster back.

Really? Why would anybody want to return? Would not bode well for McMaster’s reputation.

He wouldn't put us into a disastrous war with Iran

[Telconi]

Well, all the signs are that he wants to bring McMaster back.

Really? Why would anybody want to return? Would not bode well for McMaster’s reputation.

National Security Adviser is a pretty prestigious position.

[North German Realm]

I hate that MEK supporting walrus as much as the next guy, but the theory (not necessarily fact, though nobody has actually gone against it here yet) that Donald Trump -the POTUS- basically fired a National Security Advisor due to influence from a country that is pretty much as close to an enemy as the US currently has is one that needs to be expanded. Today he fires the walrus. Who does he fire next?

Kim is trash, and his regime is trash. But if they said Bolton should go, they're not wrong.

The problem is that regardless of whether they were right, they were the ones that said he should go, and their "counsel" is what Trump listened and heeded.

[Gravlen]

Trump explains that part of his reason for ousting his National Security Adviser Bolton was that Kim Jong Un "wanted nothing to do with John Bolton".

I'm not sure if Twitter is good valid way of saying this is true (would like to see an article, which I can't fine). However, given Trump's temperament, I'm honestly not surprised anymore if this true.

Here's Axios:

What he's saying: Trump repeatedly condemned Bolton's suggestion (more than a year ago) that the U.S. pursue the "Libya model" for the denuclearization of North Korea.

- North Korea reacted furiously at the time. That's unsurprising, given Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi was killed in an uprising a decade after ending his nuclear program.
- "What a disaster using that to make a deal with North Korea," Trump said. "I don't blame Kim Jong-un. ... He wanted nothing to do with John Bolton."

Alternatively (with video):

President Donald Trump on Wednesday took another shot at departed national security adviser John Bolton, and he specifically called him out for damaging his relationship with North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un.

While speaking with reporters, the president said that Bolton had hurt his efforts at diplomacy when he publicly promoted the idea of doing to North Korea what the American government under former President Barack Obama had done in Libya.

“We were set back very badly when John Bolton talked about the Libyan model,” the president said. “He made a mistake. As soon as he mentioned that, the Libyan model, what a disaster… and he’s using that to make a deal with North Korea?”

The North Korean government harshly criticized Bolton after he made his remarks about the “Libyan model,” and the president said he was sympathetic with Kim’s predicament.

“I don’t blame Kim Jong-un for what he said after that,” Trump said. “He wanted nothing to do with John Bolton.”

[Telconi]

Kim is trash, and his regime is trash. But if they said Bolton should go, they're not wrong.

The problem is that regardless of whether they were right, they were the ones that said he should go, and their "counsel" is what Trump listened and heeded.

I'm not seeing the problem with making concessions in the interest of diplomacy, especially when such a concession is something we ought to have done anyhow.

[Shrillland]

The problem is that regardless of whether they were right, they were the ones that said he should go, and their "counsel" is what Trump listened and heeded.

I'm not seeing the problem with making concessions in the interest of diplomacy, especially when such a concession is something we ought to have done anyhow.

There isn't a problem with making concessions, there is a problem with playing into your enemy's hands and forcing the conversation to take place on their terms. Especially when said enemy is the weaker of the two nations.

[Ifreann]

So Kim the Third presumably wrote a nice letter to The Donald outlining his views on the American National Security Advisor and one week later Bolton is packing his bags...
Is this even legal?

Trump is in love, legality doesn't figure into it.

All's fair in love and war.

[The Black Forrest]

Really? Why would anybody want to return? Would not bode well for McMaster’s reputation.

National Security Adviser is a pretty prestigious position.

Not under trump.

[Zhivotnoye]

Trump explains that part of his reason for ousting his National Security Adviser Bolton was that Kim Jong Un "wanted nothing to do with John Bolton".

In that case we should thank Kim for once.

I'm not sure if Twitter is good valid way of saying this is true (would like to see an article, which I can't fine). However, given Trump's temperament, I'm honestly not surprised anymore if this true.

Here's Axios:

What he's saying: Trump repeatedly condemned Bolton's suggestion (more than a year ago) that the U.S. pursue the "Libya model" for the denuclearization of North Korea.

- North Korea reacted furiously at the time. That's unsurprising, given Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi was killed in an uprising a decade after ending his nuclear program.
- "What a disaster using that to make a deal with North Korea," Trump said. "I don't blame Kim Jong-un. ... He wanted nothing to do with John Bolton."

Alternatively (with video):

President Donald Trump on Wednesday took another shot at departed national security adviser John Bolton, and he specifically called him out for damaging his relationship with North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un.

While speaking with reporters, the president said that Bolton had hurt his efforts at diplomacy when he publicly promoted the idea of doing to North Korea what the American government under former President Barack Obama had done in Libya.

“We were set back very badly when John Bolton talked about the Libyan model,” the president said. “He made a mistake. As soon as he mentioned that, the Libyan model, what a disaster… and he’s using that to make a deal with North Korea?”

The North Korean government harshly criticized Bolton after he made his remarks about the “Libyan model,” and the president said he was sympathetic with Kim’s predicament.

“I don’t blame Kim Jong-un for what he said after that,” Trump said. “He wanted nothing to do with John Bolton.”

Thanks for this. At least this is far more reasonable than just "Kim didn't like him so he had to go".

[Zhivotnoye]

I'm not seeing the problem with making concessions in the interest of diplomacy, especially when such a concession is something we ought to have done anyhow.

There isn't a problem with making concessions, there is a problem with playing into your enemy's hands and forcing the conversation to take place on their terms. Especially when said enemy is the weaker of the two nations.

Playing into your enemy's hands is bad, yes. But having a conversation on their terms isn't per se, not even when they're weaker and especially not if they're bold and nuclear.

[Gravlen]

Trump explains that part of his reason for ousting his National Security Adviser Bolton was that Kim Jong Un "wanted nothing to do with John Bolton".

In that case we should thank Kim for once.

Here's Axios:

What he's saying: Trump repeatedly condemned Bolton's suggestion (more than a year ago) that the U.S. pursue the "Libya model" for the denuclearization of North Korea.

- North Korea reacted furiously at the time. That's unsurprising, given Libyan dictator Muammar Gaddafi was killed in an uprising a decade after ending his nuclear program.
- "What a disaster using that to make a deal with North Korea," Trump said. "I don't blame Kim Jong-un. ... He wanted nothing to do with John Bolton."

Alternatively (with video):

President Donald Trump on Wednesday took another shot at departed national security adviser John Bolton, and he specifically called him out for damaging his relationship with North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un.

While speaking with reporters, the president said that Bolton had hurt his efforts at diplomacy when he publicly promoted the idea of doing to North Korea what the American government under former President Barack Obama had done in Libya.

“We were set back very badly when John Bolton talked about the Libyan model,” the president said. “He made a mistake. As soon as he mentioned that, the Libyan model, what a disaster… and he’s using that to make a deal with North Korea?”

The North Korean government harshly criticized Bolton after he made his remarks about the “Libyan model,” and the president said he was sympathetic with Kim’s predicament.

“I don’t blame Kim Jong-un for what he said after that,” Trump said. “He wanted nothing to do with John Bolton.”

Thanks for this. At least this is far more reasonable than just "Kim didn't like him so he had to go".

I agree that the full context of the statement tempers it, and that it is more reasonable to point out Bolton’s fuckup with him suggesting a Libyan solution. However, Trump did go too far by implying that Kim’s personal dislike was a factor in his decision. Kim’s feelings about Bolton should be irrelevant, and should not have been brought up.

Still, in the age of Trump, this is a minor niggle and not (yet another) scandal.

[Telconi]

National Security Adviser is a pretty prestigious position.

Not under trump.

It is for people who generally agree with Trump.

[Ghost in the Shell]

Trump explains that part of his reason for ousting his National Security Adviser Bolton was that Kim Jong Un "wanted nothing to do with John Bolton".

Oh great. More proof Trump is a traitor. Bolton should primary him.

[Tarsonis]

Trump explains that part of his reason for ousting his National Security Adviser Bolton was that Kim Jong Un "wanted nothing to do with John Bolton".

Oh great. More proof Trump is a traitor. Bolton should primary him.

Today I learned that getting rid of a person that the guy on the other side of the table refuses to work with, is tantamount to treason.

[Cannot think of a name]

Oh great. More proof Trump is a traitor. Bolton should primary him.

Today I learned that getting rid of a person that the guy on the other side of the table refuses to work with, is tantamount to treason.

The guy on the other side of the table has refused to work with pretty much every body. I guess we should overthrow our own regime until we find one Un likes.

[Tarsonis]

Today I learned that getting rid of a person that the guy on the other side of the table refuses to work with, is tantamount to treason.

The guy on the other side of the table has refused to work with pretty much every body. I guess we should overthrow our own regime until we find one Un likes.

....not the worst idea atm...

[Ifreann]

The guy on the other side of the table has refused to work with pretty much every body. I guess we should overthrow our own regime until we find one Un likes.

....not the worst idea atm...

I think that Kim Jong Un might not have America's best interests at heart, it'd be hard to trust his cabinet nominees.

[Gormwood]

....not the worst idea atm...

I think that Kim Jong Un might not have America's best interests at heart, it'd be hard to trust his cabinet nominees.

Appeasing Kim Jong-Un To Own The Libs.

[Telconi]

....not the worst idea atm...

I think that Kim Jong Un might not have America's best interests at heart, it'd be hard to trust his cabinet nominees.

Few people seem to.