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by Katganistan » Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:54 pm
by Dekerin Domains » Mon Dec 10, 2018 10:06 pm
Katganistan wrote:Legalize it everywhere, so that it's no longer hidden in the shadows. Let people be licensed and rent space legitimately for sex work, and let customers come in as if it were any other business and be subject to being on security camera in the "front of the house" areas.
Making it a legitimate business will make it easier for workers to go to the legal authorities if threatened or hurt, and will put jackasses on notice that it's not going to be tolerated.
Maybe legitimizing it will remove some of the stigma as well.
by Kowani » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:58 pm
Olthar wrote:Legalize and regulate the prostitution business, and we can make it safer and healthier for both the employees and the customers.
by Cedoria » Tue Dec 11, 2018 2:00 am
by Wunderstrafanstalt » Tue Dec 11, 2018 3:03 am
Voiced - Artemsday, 12019-5-7: PT party pledged vote for Kalvar's Green Initiative | PETRAL donated Ł1.1 mil to PT | PT voted against Green Initiative.
by United Muscovite Nations » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:52 am
Senkaku wrote:United Muscovite Nations wrote:I've said several times in this thread that I'm against all employer-employee relationships and think that the economy should be based around voluntary production.
What's wrong with a self-employed prostitute, then? Or a self-employed masseur, or waiter, or barber, or laborer, or literally any of the jobs that could be thought of as "renting human bodies"?
by United Muscovite Nations » Tue Dec 11, 2018 8:54 am
Duhon wrote:As someone who is acquainted with and regularly avails the services of sex workers (in a country where it's illegal to procure their services -- bite me), it's far better for everyone involved if the sex trade were legalized and regulated, not least for health reasons.
But the far larger problem here is stigma -- unless many of our assumptions regarding sexually active yet romantically and/or matrimonially unattached women (and men, and the rest of the alphabet, and I know this doesn't cover the OP at all given her marital status, but I hate to be redundant) are definitively brought down, unless sex workers are treated as humans with the full dignity afforded the rest of humanity and not (just) as cum dumps, no law can protect them from society's scorn, let alone the avarice of detached pimps and the crazed fantasies of nymphomaniacs.
But how to break the stigma?
Sidestep the issue and become a hetaira of Greek lore, transplanted into our contemporary conundrums -- a public figure whose many accomplishments in many other fields of human endeavor as she chooses, not just in the sexual arena, should allow one to treat the sex issue as one of many, but not the determinant. It'll also help make it clear in the public mind that, yes, not all sex workers are bimbos, defective in some characteristic way, not intellectually shallow, not sex machines or whatever the hell else our hypocritical prudishness has attached over millennia.
by Dekerin Domains » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:00 am
United Muscovite Nations wrote:Senkaku wrote:What's wrong with a self-employed prostitute, then? Or a self-employed masseur, or waiter, or barber, or laborer, or literally any of the jobs that could be thought of as "renting human bodies"?
Service jobs and non-productive can never be self-employed, they are employed by their customers.
by Mardla » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:36 am
Neutraligon wrote:Mardla wrote:Well when you commodify something sacred, like sex, it's often seen as a commodity and not as something sacred. That's not to say raping prostitutes shouldn't be prosecuted, but prostitution (this obviously includes porn) itself leads to the cheapening of sexuality. It ceases to be something holy and higher, and rape itself becomes just physical assault and theft of services. Foucault said most rape should not be treated anything worse than mild assault, and of course he arrived at this position by simply following left-wing logic to its conclusion.
Sex isn't sacred.
by Saiwania » Tue Dec 11, 2018 9:49 am
Ifreann wrote:It is no more immoral to pay for sex than it is to pay for a haircut.
by Dekerin Domains » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:00 am
Saiwania wrote:Ifreann wrote:It is no more immoral to pay for sex than it is to pay for a haircut.
Most countries don't seem to see it this way and the sources for the 3 main religions of this world (Bible and Qur'an) are in agreement that sexual intercourse is only appropriate within marriage. Thus, most people feel that it is sacred on some level.
by Ifreann » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:15 am
and the sources for the 3 main religions of this world (Bible and Qur'an)
are in agreement that sexual intercourse is only appropriate within marriage. Thus, most people feel that it is sacred on some level.
by Mardla » Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:16 am
Ifreann wrote:Saiwania wrote:
Most countries don't seem to see it this way
Countries are wrong about a lot of things.and the sources for the 3 main religions of this world (Bible and Qur'an)
That's two religions...are in agreement that sexual intercourse is only appropriate within marriage. Thus, most people feel that it is sacred on some level.
People are also wrong about a lot of things.
by United Muscovite Nations » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:03 pm
by Dekerin Domains » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:03 pm
by United Muscovite Nations » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:04 pm
Dekerin Domains wrote:If there must be an objective morality, let it based on somewhat rational or empirical, you know, like science. I won't listen to "absolutes" coming from a book of fairy tales with talking snakes, clay men, solar orbiting of Earth, and magic rib women, a book whose "god" commands genocide repeatedly for the horrific "crime" of worshiping other gods! Sacre bleu! Not to mention that whole slavery thing condoned by Paul and Moses alike.
by Dekerin Domains » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:05 pm
United Muscovite Nations wrote:Dekerin Domains wrote:If there must be an objective morality, let it based on somewhat rational or empirical, you know, like science. I won't listen to "absolutes" coming from a book of fairy tales with talking snakes, clay men, solar orbiting of Earth, and magic rib women, a book whose "god" commands genocide repeatedly for the horrific "crime" of worshiping other gods! Sacre bleu! Not to mention that whole slavery thing condoned by Paul and Moses alike.
Let's hear it then.
by United Muscovite Nations » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:06 pm
by Dekerin Domains » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:10 pm
by Chessmistress » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:21 pm
Katganistan wrote:Legalize it everywhere, so that it's no longer hidden in the shadows. Let people be licensed and rent space legitimately for sex work, and let customers come in as if it were any other business and be subject to being on security camera in the "front of the house" areas.
Making it a legitimate business will make it easier for workers to go to the legal authorities if threatened or hurt, and will put jackasses on notice that it's not going to be tolerated.
Maybe legitimizing it will remove some of the stigma as well.
Even the councillor who championed the zone believes it was a mistake. “We tried something and it hasn’t worked,” says Mark Dobson.
by Dekerin Domains » Tue Dec 11, 2018 4:24 pm
by Mercuriuseudoro » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:01 am
Wunderstrafanstalt wrote:Eh, I'm pretty pessimistic about the solutions thrown around here. Maybe because I live in a country where if you're an abused sex worker seeking help, the first appropriate cultural response would be 'stone her'.
by Auze » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:08 pm
Mercuriuseudoro wrote:Wunderstrafanstalt wrote:Eh, I'm pretty pessimistic about the solutions thrown around here. Maybe because I live in a country where if you're an abused sex worker seeking help, the first appropriate cultural response would be 'stone her'.
Brilliant!
Where do you live and how hard is it to get a visa?
by Saiwania » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:15 pm
Chessmistress wrote:The best solution is the Swedish model, that is in use also in France, Canada, Ireland, Norway and Iceland - it punishes just only the men buying women's bodies, not the women forced to sell their bodies.
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