How should we deal with North Korea?

[Mother Lilith]

To be honest things have settled down quite a bit over the past year. I'm pragmatic enough to have a "let's wait and see" attitude.

Wasn't this the Obama approach?

If nobody does nothing, won't NK develop a fully-fledged arsenal of ICBMs that can hit the USA?

Honestly, there isn't a circumstance where the military leaders of North Korea would let Kim Jong Un near the kill everything death button.

Why would the world economy want or allow the long term survival or enrichment of his regime? The Kim families punitive treatment of their citizens is the reason they're isolated in the first place, the arms race came later.

There's a regime that killed more people than Hitler and the Nazis, and which continues to oppress religious and ethnic minorities, going so far as to segregating some of them into reeducation camps against their will. That regime is in command of China, the largest national economy by purchasing power parity (PPP). Money talks, and the world largely ignores the crimes of the Chinese Communist Party. They will also ignore Kim if he joins the global economy and contributes to global prosperity.

Stastically, most of the world's powerful nations has committed some kind of hideous act of violence in the last 200 years. Singling out China for their actions doesn't really mean anything but we are going off topic.

[Arcturus Novus]

I think we (primarily the US and China) should be working on the DPRK, largely on their terms, toward their re-integration with the international community. Hopefully we can even work toward the peaceful reunification of the Korean peninsula.

[Industrial Skyrim]

Stastically, most of the world's powerful nations has committed some kind of hideous act of violence in the last 200 years. Singling out China for their actions doesn't really mean anything but we are going off topic.

My point exactly. Even the most zealous protesters and leftists will ignore atrocities if they are committed under a red flag, just as businessmen and politicians will ignore them if they see financial gain.

[Valentine Z]

Build a wall around it and turn it into Battle Royale supreme leader edition

The phrase "Winner Winner Chicken Dinner" will become a commodity itself.

[Xadufell]

Let's just ignore that the north and the south are clearing the DMZ, destroying guard towers, meeting each other across the border, shaking hands, coming to agreements, etc. That's not important.

[Novus America]

I think we (primarily the US and China) should be working on the DPRK, largely on their terms, toward their re-integration with the international community. Hopefully we can even work toward the peaceful reunification of the Korean peninsula.

Why should it be on their terms? Why should we surrender to their demands?
I would be willing to make a deal, but on mutually agreeable terms, not theirs alone.

[Arcturus Novus]

I think we (primarily the US and China) should be working on the DPRK, largely on their terms, toward their re-integration with the international community. Hopefully we can even work toward the peaceful reunification of the Korean peninsula.

Why should it be on their terms? Why should we surrender to their demands?
I would be willing to make a deal, but on mutually agreeable terms, not theirs alone.

That's a fair point. I guess my main concern is that I don't want to force them into bending the knee to America or the PRC. They're still a sovereign nation; they should be allowed to negotiate the terms of their own return to society.

[Novus America]

Why should it be on their terms? Why should we surrender to their demands?
I would be willing to make a deal, but on mutually agreeable terms, not theirs alone.

That's a fair point. I guess my main concern is that I don't want to force them into bending the knee to America or the PRC. They're still a sovereign nation; they should be allowed to negotiate the terms of their own return to society.

Debatable as their grounds to claim sovereignty are dubious at best.
Besides they have no right to trade with or get assistance from China, the US or any other country.
They have no right to be welcomed by the rest of the world. If they want to be respected they have to earn it.

[The New California Republic]

To be honest things have settled down quite a bit over the past year. I'm pragmatic enough to have a "let's wait and see" attitude.

Wasn't this the Obama approach?

If nobody does nothing, won't NK develop a fully-fledged arsenal of ICBMs that can hit the USA?

There are diplomatic channels open now that weren't about a year ago, so "let's wait and see" implies letting diplomacy take its course to see where it leads us.

[A m e n r i a]

What should we do? Nothing! Let's allow the Americans and the North Koreans kill each other and enjoy some popcorn as we watch!

[Trollzyn the Infinite]

Ignore them. They are nothing but trolls screaming what they are going to do. They do nothing, so ignore them and they will collapse on their own.

Believe it or not but some people don't like sitting on their hands while thousands of innocent people suffer needlessly in repression from their brutal regime.

Shocking, I know.

[Novus America]

What should we do? Nothing! Let's allow the Americans and the North Koreans kill each other and enjoy some popcorn as we watch!

First of all the US and North Koreans are not killing each other.
Secondly North Korea cannot kill the US. The vast majority killed if a full shooting war broke out again would be Koreans, both in the North and South.

[Trollzyn the Infinite]

Let's just ignore that the north and the south are clearing the DMZ, destroying guard towers, meeting each other across the border, shaking hands, coming to agreements, etc. That's not important.

Let's just ignore the thousands of innocent people being brainwashed, murdered, enslaved, and tortured by Pyongyang. That's not important.

[Mother Lilith]

Stastically, most of the world's powerful nations has committed some kind of hideous act of violence in the last 200 years. Singling out China for their actions doesn't really mean anything but we are going off topic.

My point exactly. Even the most zealous protesters and leftists will ignore atrocities if they are committed under a red flag, just as businessmen and politicians will ignore them if they see financial gain.

You are ignoring the point, Germany, Great Britain, Russia, America have also committed attrocities. Both sides ignore attrocities because it is convient.

[Major-Tom]

Smuggle in memes, beer, and hit or miss comedy films for the people. They'll become Americanized without the government even knowing.

[Potato]

Whatever we do, lets hope it doesn't turn into the game Homefront

[Luziyca]

Let's just ignore that the north and the south are clearing the DMZ, destroying guard towers, meeting each other across the border, shaking hands, coming to agreements, etc. That's not important.

Indeed.

To be honest, we should let the DPRK and the ROK sort out their issues with no outside involvement: maybe China should they wish to, but America should not really interfere with this diplomatic process between the north and the south.

Personally, I'd be in favor of uniting the Korean armies, and putting the nukes under joint administration of the north and the south as a starting point, and then have gradual reunification over 25 years.

[Novus America]

Let's just ignore that the north and the south are clearing the DMZ, destroying guard towers, meeting each other across the border, shaking hands, coming to agreements, etc. That's not important.

Indeed.

To be honest, we should let the DPRK and the ROK sort out their issues with no outside involvement: maybe China should they wish to, but America should not really interfere with this diplomatic process between the north and the south.

Personally, I'd be in favor of uniting the Korean armies, and putting the nukes under joint administration of the north and the south as a starting point, and then have gradual reunification over 25 years.

Well the violation of the NPT is an international concern. It is not simply a Korean one.
But if they can work out the rest fine, I have no problem with that.

But reunification is impossible unless one country’s government completely changes.
The two governing structures are completely incompatible.

[Risottia]

We all know North Korea is an oppressive regime that needs to be toppled

Uhm, no.
"Toppling regimes" didn't work very well in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria (well... attempted toppling that is) and Thailand. Shit only got worse.
Not to mention the long story of the West actually supporting oppressive regimes such as South Korea of yore, Gheddafi's Libya, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Erdogan's Turkey, Taiwan, PR China...
As long as NK doesn't attack anyone, the only way is to bolster diplomacy and trade - so to lessen the effect of the Kimmies' autarky on the population. Anything else is going to cause a shitstorm.

[Risottia]

Well the violation of the NPT is an international concern.

It's not actually a violation if you denounce a treaty and withdraw from it.

[Farnhamia]

Give Kim Jong-Un a NationStates account with all the fixin's. Guaranteed that inside of six months he'll be so addicted, he won't even notice when he's been deposed.

[Novus America]

Well the violation of the NPT is an international concern.

It's not actually a violation if you denounce a treaty and withdraw from it.

North Korea was building nukes before it withdrew.

[Risottia]

It's not actually a violation if you denounce a treaty and withdraw from it.

North Korea was building nukes before it withdrew.

That is the US claim (and it's very likely to be true). The international legal system, though, warrants that those claims will never be proven in an international tribunal. So, they are nothing but claims and they can't produce any legal effect.

[Risottia]

Give Kim Jong-Un a NationStates account with all the fixin's. Guaranteed that inside of six months he'll be so addicted, he won't even notice when he's been deposed.

Meh. He didn't even email us when we gave his daddy the NSG Peace Prize.

[Eodor]

I think that maybe we should leave them alone and not murder innocent people. But maybe that's just me.