Anti Capitalist Discussion Thread I: Seize the toothbrushes!

[The Widening Gyre]

At the same time, maybe a healthy dose of capitalism; not too much, but enough to drive forward innovation.

What does this 'innovation' thing even mean? Why is capitalism necessary for innovation?

Well, you really have to be a real genius if you want to plan the whole f*cking economy and make it work efficiently

Big brows = big brains

[Dejanic]

To be honest, I would love a hybrid between a socialist and a capitalist economy.

concept: could we get a small guide that covers common misconceptions about anticapitalism in the OP so this thread doesnt get spammed with the same half-baked opinions all the time?

I've added some basic definitions and a link to an FAQ from /r/Socialism. Though in Valentines defence we all started somewhere and I don't mind Liberals with a genuine interest who want to learn more and ask questions. Though as stressed, this is generally not a Capitalist vs Socialist thread (millions of them already) , and is more one for internal discussion.

[Orostan]

Have you accepted the word of our lord and savior Paul Cockshott?

[The New California Republic]

I have mainly settled on the idea of a mixed economy, just based on the negative experiences of socialist economies of the 20th century, that encountered serious economic difficulties after rapid nationalization/collectivization of industries. Serious economic problems resulted later on from such rapid implementation of socialism. I think that a more gradual transition would mitigate such problems. Perhaps something like the Czechoslovakian experiment in 1968 before the Soviets intervened. I would support a mixed economy moving gradually towards socialism. And by gradually I don't mean a couple of decades, I mean at least a century or two, very gradual in comparison to previous attempts at socialism.

[Hirota]

This is a thread designed as a safe space for those of the Anti-Capitalist, whether they be revolutionary or reformist, Marxist or Anarchist! Whilst I expect it to be predominantly Leftist, right wing Anti-Capitalists like distributionists are more than welcome! Questions from learners are permitted, but this thread is not designed as a debate place for Capitalists to discuss the merits of their economic ideology.

Yeah no. We've had multiple rulings several times that there is no thread ownership in General and critics can participate in threads about a subject.

You don't get to decide who does or does not participate in a thread. As long as they don't break forum rules, then you are out of luck.

[Fascesia]

Well, you really have to be a real genius if you want to plan the whole f*cking economy and make it work efficiently

Well no one advocates for pure state planning (Juche?). From a Trot perspective there's generally a belief in state planning in vital sectors, with decentralised planning/workers councils in others, usually organised alongside local lines. A mixture of centralised/decentralised.

Aaand here I go again sympathising with Trotsky more and more

Other question:

Dafuq is Marxist-Leninist-Obamaism?

Some sort of alt-right conspiracy theory about Obama‘s „socialism“?

[Orostan]

I have mainly settled on the idea of a mixed economy, just based on the negative experiences of socialist economies of the 20th century, that encountered serious economic difficulties after rapid nationalization/collectivization of industries. Serious economic problems resulted later on from such rapid implementation of socialism. I think that a more gradual transition would mitigate such problems. Perhaps something like the Czechoslovakian experiment in 1968 before the Soviets intervened. I would support a mixed economy moving gradually towards socialism. And by gradually I don't mean a couple of decades, I mean at least a century or two, very gradual in comparison to previous attempts at socialism.

It is possible to plan an economy using computers, and a mixed social democratic economy will always have a Capitalist base, and therefore a Capitalist superstructure in the long run.

[Fascesia]

This is a thread designed as a safe space for those of the Anti-Capitalist, whether they be revolutionary or reformist, Marxist or Anarchist! Whilst I expect it to be predominantly Leftist, right wing Anti-Capitalists like distributionists are more than welcome! Questions from learners are permitted, but this thread is not designed as a debate place for Capitalists to discuss the merits of their economic ideology.

Yeah no. We've had multiple rulings several times that there is no thread ownership in General and critics can participate in threads about a subject.

You don't get to decide who does or does not participate in a thread. As long as they don't break forum rules, then you are out of luck.

I also dislike the idea of safe spaces. And on the internet, especially in this particular forum, you can‘t enforce anything except for the general site rules.
Furthermore, I‘d love to talk to someone who actually believes that corporatism is a good idea. And as it‘s also an anti-capitalist economic model, I hope this will happen sooner or later.

[Dejanic]

Well no one advocates for pure state planning (Juche?). From a Trot perspective there's generally a belief in state planning in vital sectors, with decentralised planning/workers councils in others, usually organised alongside local lines. A mixture of centralised/decentralised.

Aaand here I go again sympathising with Trotsky more and more

Other question:

Dafuq is Marxist-Leninist-Obamaism?

Some sort of alt-right conspiracy theory about Obama‘s „socialism“?

A meme/joke.

[Italios]

concept: could we get a small guide that covers common misconceptions about anticapitalism in the OP so this thread doesnt get spammed with the same half-baked opinions all the time?

I've added some basic definitions and a link to an FAQ from /r/Socialism. Though in Valentines defence we all started somewhere and I don't mind Liberals with a genuine interest who want to learn more and ask questions. Though as stressed, this is generally not a Capitalist vs Socialist thread (millions of them already) , and is more one for internal discussion.

Fair enough, though I'd say be wary when using r/soc as anything more than an object of ridicule. because a lot of users there are misinformed and have agendas to spread. The environment is also quite toxic and we wouldn't want any wayward souls ending up there. It might be nice to, at some point, get some links up to authors and works from an anti-capitalistic perspective, whether leftist or reactionary, so visitors to this thread can gain a better understanding of anti-capitalist thought (whether they are at odds with it or not)

[Dejanic]

I've added some basic definitions and a link to an FAQ from /r/Socialism. Though in Valentines defence we all started somewhere and I don't mind Liberals with a genuine interest who want to learn more and ask questions. Though as stressed, this is generally not a Capitalist vs Socialist thread (millions of them already) , and is more one for internal discussion.

Fair enough, though I'd say be wary when using r/soc as anything more than an object of ridicule. because a lot of users there are misinformed and have agendas to spread. The environment is also quite toxic and we wouldn't want any wayward souls ending up there. It might be nice to, at some point, get some links up to authors and works from an anti-capitalistic perspective, whether leftist or reactionary, so visitors to this thread can gain a better understanding of anti-capitalist thought (whether they are at odds with it or not)

The discussion is pretty poor on r/soc and I generally avoid the place as its full of Soc Dems, but the resources in the side bar are pretty stellar. One good thing about r/soc is its at the very least a place for "alltheleft" and isn't directly sectarian. What are your politics if I may ask?

I'll update the OP (when I'm less tired) and add some general links to some more resources/authors.

[Italios]

Yeah no. We've had multiple rulings several times that there is no thread ownership in General and critics can participate in threads about a subject.

You don't get to decide who does or does not participate in a thread. As long as they don't break forum rules, then you are out of luck.

I also dislike the idea of safe spaces. And on the internet, especially in this particular forum, you can‘t enforce anything except for the general site rules.
Furthermore, I‘d love to talk to someone who actually believes that corporatism is a good idea. And as it‘s also an anti-capitalist economic model, I hope this will happen sooner or later.

There are actually a bunch of varieties of corporatism (some obviously more well known that the others) that are not anti-capitalist in any way, shape or form. see: liberal corporatism.

[The Grene Knyght]

I‘d love to talk to someone who actually believes that corporatism is a good idea. And as it‘s also an anti-capitalist economic model

Idk about that, now.

[Italios]

Fair enough, though I'd say be wary when using r/soc as anything more than an object of ridicule. because a lot of users there are misinformed and have agendas to spread. The environment is also quite toxic and we wouldn't want any wayward souls ending up there. It might be nice to, at some point, get some links up to authors and works from an anti-capitalistic perspective, whether leftist or reactionary, so visitors to this thread can gain a better understanding of anti-capitalist thought (whether they are at odds with it or not)

The discussion is pretty poor on r/soc and I generally avoid the place as its full of Soc Dems, but the resources in the side bar are pretty stellar. One good thing about r/soc is its at the very least a place for "alltheleft" and isn't directly sectarian. What are your politics if I may ask?

I'll update the OP (when I'm less tired) and add some general links to some more resources/authors.

In order to avoid being swept up in the supermarket of ideologies™, and be more open to different interpretations of various thinkers, I describe myself as an illiberal leftist right now.

[Dejanic]

I‘d love to talk to someone who actually believes that corporatism is a good idea. And as it‘s also an anti-capitalist economic model

Idk about that, now.

It's certainly debateable, which is why I didn't add it in the POLL. I'm willing to grant Distributionism, but Corporatism just seems like hyper Capitalism with class collaboration and a fat state.

[Major-Tom]

Social market economy, ftw.

[Dejanic]

Social market economy, ftw.

That's a long way to say Capitalism.

Sorry we split, but it had to be done!

[Dejanic]

Have you accepted the word of our lord and savior Paul Cockshott?

I know of his ideas (he used to post on Revleft rip), I need to read up more of him.

[MERIZoC]

This man comes up and slaps yo girls ass. WYD?

[Major-Tom]

Social market economy, ftw.

That's a long way to say Capitalism.

Sorry we split, but it had to be done!

Just two extra words, fam.

[Major-Tom]

(Image)

This man comes up and slaps yo girls ass. WYD?

Trap him in a bunker.

[United Muscovite Nations]

(Image)

This man comes up and slaps yo girls ass. WYD?

Is there any substitute we can use if we don't have a girl?

[Dejanic]

(Image)

This man comes up and slaps yo girls ass. WYD?

Is there any substitute we can use if we don't have a girl?

Slaps your boy?

Slaps your ass?

Slaps your bible?

Slaps your mums ass?

[Fascesia]

(Image)

This man comes up and slaps yo girls ass. WYD?

Is there any substitute we can use if we don't have a girl?

Your own ass maybe?

[Italios]

(Image)

This man comes up and slaps yo girls ass. WYD?

this man spends his life advancing the rights of albanian women, who, until his rise to power, were equal to a sack of flour under traditional albanian law, and you think he would objectify a woman like that? sickening.