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Chicago woman who tortured disabled man gets probation

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Luminesa
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Better gouge my eyes out, just to be safe.

That may actually hurt you significantly.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:02 pm

Kramania wrote:
Ifreann wrote:I've never found "evil" to be a particularly useful descriptor, outside of certain video games.

Not normally a word I use, but it's the best one I can find to describe kidnapping and torturing a mentally disabled person.

Which is useless. Thought terminating. We designate people who have committed serious crimes as evil and then we, metaphorically and sometimes literally, throw them in a hole and never think of them again. Suppose we treated healthcare this way. Someone has a very serious sickness and we call it evil for them to be so sick and lock them in an isolation ward and throw away the key. We won't get a cure that way. And we won't rehabilitate people if we write them off as evil and put them in prison for life.
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:04 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Kramania wrote:Not normally a word I use, but it's the best one I can find to describe kidnapping and torturing a mentally disabled person.

Which is useless. Thought terminating. We designate people who have committed serious crimes as evil and then we, metaphorically and sometimes literally, throw them in a hole and never think of them again. Suppose we treated healthcare this way. Someone has a very serious sickness and we call it evil for them to be so sick and lock them in an isolation ward and throw away the key. We won't get a cure that way. And we won't rehabilitate people if we write them off as evil and put them in prison for life.

I ask you, what if the person tortured was someone you knew? Would you think as you are thinking now? Would you consider what you are saying or want them locked up? That's the real question here, put yourself in his shoes or the shoes of his mother or father. I mean, there are some things that can not be forgiven. Basically.
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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:05 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Kramania wrote:Not normally a word I use, but it's the best one I can find to describe kidnapping and torturing a mentally disabled person.

Which is useless. Thought terminating. We designate people who have committed serious crimes as evil and then we, metaphorically and sometimes literally, throw them in a hole and never think of them again. Suppose we treated healthcare this way. Someone has a very serious sickness and we call it evil for them to be so sick and lock them in an isolation ward and throw away the key. We won't get a cure that way. And we won't rehabilitate people if we write them off as evil and put them in prison for life.


Then you're problem is that you're not separating the act from the person.

Obviously the act itself is evil, incredibly malicious and destructive. The person, however, can be redeemed.
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Kramania
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Postby Kramania » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:06 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Kramania wrote:Not normally a word I use, but it's the best one I can find to describe kidnapping and torturing a mentally disabled person.

Which is useless. Thought terminating. We designate people who have committed serious crimes as evil and then we, metaphorically and sometimes literally, throw them in a hole and never think of them again. Suppose we treated healthcare this way. Someone has a very serious sickness and we call it evil for them to be so sick and lock them in an isolation ward and throw away the key. We won't get a cure that way. And we won't rehabilitate people if we write them off as evil and put them in prison for life.

You can't rehabilitate people who are psychopaths. You can't cure them. All you can do is lock them away and keep them separated from the rest of society so they can't hurt anyone else.
Last edited by Kramania on Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:07 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Which is useless. Thought terminating. We designate people who have committed serious crimes as evil and then we, metaphorically and sometimes literally, throw them in a hole and never think of them again. Suppose we treated healthcare this way. Someone has a very serious sickness and we call it evil for them to be so sick and lock them in an isolation ward and throw away the key. We won't get a cure that way. And we won't rehabilitate people if we write them off as evil and put them in prison for life.


Then you're problem is that you're not separating the act from the person.

Obviously the act itself is evil, incredibly malicious and destructive. The person, however, can be redeemed.

Yet that depends on the person themself, if they want to be redeemed deep down inside and are not lying to save their butt's from being locked away forever. Some people mean it, some don't.
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:08 pm

Kramania wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Which is useless. Thought terminating. We designate people who have committed serious crimes as evil and then we, metaphorically and sometimes literally, throw them in a hole and never think of them again. Suppose we treated healthcare this way. Someone has a very serious sickness and we call it evil for them to be so sick and lock them in an isolation ward and throw away the key. We won't get a cure that way. And we won't rehabilitate people if we write them off as evil and put them in prison for life.

You can't rehabilitate people who are psychopaths. You can't cute them. All you can do is lock them away and keep them separated from the rest of society so they can't hurt anyone else.

You realize mental illness is treatable, right?
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:08 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kramania wrote:You can't rehabilitate people who are psychopaths. You can't cute them. All you can do is lock them away and keep them separated from the rest of society so they can't hurt anyone else.

You realize mental illness is treatable, right?

Depends what you mean by treatable, some people think electro-therapy helps mental illness. When it is just torture, thing is; It depends on the type of mental illness.
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Salus Maior
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Postby Salus Maior » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:09 pm

Principality of the Raix wrote:
Salus Maior wrote:
Then you're problem is that you're not separating the act from the person.

Obviously the act itself is evil, incredibly malicious and destructive. The person, however, can be redeemed.

Yet that depends on the person themself, if they want to be redeemed deep down inside and are not lying to save their butt's from being locked away forever. Some people mean it, some don't.


Yes, they do have to want it. But you'll never know if they do if they're not given a chance to do so.
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Kramania
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Postby Kramania » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:10 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kramania wrote:You can't rehabilitate people who are psychopaths. You can't cute them. All you can do is lock them away and keep them separated from the rest of society so they can't hurt anyone else.

You realize mental illness is treatable, right?

That depends entirely on what type of mental illness you are referring to.

Psychopathy can't be cured. That is a simple fact.
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:11 pm

Salus Maior wrote:
Principality of the Raix wrote:Yet that depends on the person themself, if they want to be redeemed deep down inside and are not lying to save their butt's from being locked away forever. Some people mean it, some don't.


Yes, they do have to want it. But you'll never know if they do if they're not given a chance to do so.

Which is why some prisons and actually rather most have a "good behavior" program, meaning if you are behaved; You will see probation sooner then those who misbehave. Though, unfortunately it does occur that in-mates do try to tempt or force people to misbehave to keep them in there. However, that is prison for you. :meh:
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:13 pm

Principality of the Raix wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:You realize mental illness is treatable, right?

Depends what you mean by treatable, some people think electro-therapy helps mental illness. When it is just torture, thing is; It depends on the type of mental illness.

Well duh. I mean actually fucking treatment. With medication and therapy
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:14 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Principality of the Raix wrote:Depends what you mean by treatable, some people think electro-therapy helps mental illness. When it is just torture, thing is; It depends on the type of mental illness.

Well duh. I mean actually fucking treatment. With medication and therapy

You do realize prisons provide that, both of those.... :ugeek:

Added In: So long as both are medically prescribed and normally they are.
Last edited by Principality of the Raix on Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:17 pm

Kramania wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:You realize mental illness is treatable, right?

That depends entirely on what type of mental illness you are referring to.

Psychopathy can't be cured. That is a simple fact.

Schizophrenia can't be cured either. I manage it. People are making some strides to manage psychopathy better, especially in correctional settings.
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:18 pm

Principality of the Raix wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Well duh. I mean actually fucking treatment. With medication and therapy

You do realize prisons provide that, both of those.... :ugeek:

Added In: So long as both are medically prescribed and normally they are.

Yes, but it needs to be bigger focus in the system
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Kramania
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Postby Kramania » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:20 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kramania wrote:That depends entirely on what type of mental illness you are referring to.

Psychopathy can't be cured. That is a simple fact.

Schizophrenia can't be cured either. I manage it. People are making some strides to manage psychopathy better, especially in correctional settings.

Until it can be cured they need to be separated from the rest of society. Psychopaths can't take medication to suddenly give them empathy and compassion. They are devoid of either.
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:20 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kramania wrote:That depends entirely on what type of mental illness you are referring to.

Psychopathy can't be cured. That is a simple fact.

Schizophrenia can't be cured either. I manage it. People are making some strides to manage psychopathy better, especially in correctional settings.

A schizophrenic is less likely to kill someone then a sociopath, which is what these girls are basically as they did it as they planned it. A Psychopath plans things out, if a psychopath did it. They would not post it to face book; Just saying. However, at the same time. Both of these types of people are some times nice, however when they break or whatever you want to call it. They can do real harm to others, themselves and even animals. While a schizophrenic is also less dangerous, normally. Not always. But majority of the time.
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Postby New haven america » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:24 pm

Too the people complaining that she's getting probation: You do realize that she's spent a year in jail, is stuck with 4 years probation, and now has a felony next to her name. Due to how the US works, any future plans she has are now down the drain and it's very likely she'll be sent back on another crime, so...

I mean, I personally think 2-4 years would've been a better sentence, but due to plea deals and jail/prison overpopulation, I understand why she got off with less. (Even though her life is now officially destroyed)
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:24 pm

Kramania wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Schizophrenia can't be cured either. I manage it. People are making some strides to manage psychopathy better, especially in correctional settings.

Until it can be cured they need to be separated from the rest of society. Psychopaths can't take medication to suddenly give them empathy and compassion. They are devoid of either.

Actually trials show anti psychotics have taken away some of the violent impulses. Additionally, psychologists are making strides in the theory of exploiting the lack of empathy, by teaching them the personal gain of not acting on said impulses
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Principality of the Raix
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Postby Principality of the Raix » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:26 pm

New haven america wrote:Too the people complaining that she's getting probation: You do realize that she's spent a year in jail, is stuck with 4 years probation, and now has a felony next to her name. Due to how the US works, any future plans she has are now down the drain and it's very likely she'll be sent back on another crime, so...

I mean, I personally think 2-4 years would've been a better sentence, but due to plea deals and jail/prison overpopulation, I understand why she got off with less. (Even though her life is now officially destroyed)

If they were concerned about prison overpopulation, they would not detain those on practical legal now drug charges(weed) least on usage. Selling and other things I understand, however at the same time lock her up for her participation within this act. At the same time, I understand her life is destroyed, however who is to say had they not been caught that they wouldn't of committed another crime any ways. :meh:
Last edited by Principality of the Raix on Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Escocaria
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Postby Escocaria » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:27 pm

New haven america wrote:Too the people complaining that she's getting probation: You do realize that she's spent a year in jail, is stuck with 4 years probation, and now has a felony next to her name. Due to how the US works, any future plans she has are now down the drain and it's very likely she'll be sent back on another crime, so...

I mean, I personally think 2-4 years would've been a better sentence, but due to plea deals and jail/prison overpopulation, I understand why she got off with less. (Even though her life is now officially destroyed)

Well, we could say that or we could also say that we have a violent racist who is perfectly willing to do harm to others, purely because they don't share a skin tone, is not currently locked up.
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Kramania
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Postby Kramania » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:29 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:
Kramania wrote:Until it can be cured they need to be separated from the rest of society. Psychopaths can't take medication to suddenly give them empathy and compassion. They are devoid of either.

Actually trials show anti psychotics have taken away some of the violent impulses. Additionally, psychologists are making strides in the theory of exploiting the lack of empathy, by teaching them the personal gain of not acting on said impulses

Oh, good. Like teaching a dog not to bite. More animal than human.
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New haven america
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Postby New haven america » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:30 pm

Principality of the Raix wrote:
New haven america wrote:Too the people complaining that she's getting probation: You do realize that she's spent a year in jail, is stuck with 4 years probation, and now has a felony next to her name. Due to how the US works, any future plans she has are now down the drain and it's very likely she'll be sent back on another crime, so...

I mean, I personally think 2-4 years would've been a better sentence, but due to plea deals and jail/prison overpopulation, I understand why she got off with less. (Even though her life is now officially destroyed)

1.If they were concerned about prison overpopulation, they would not detain those on practical legal now drug charges least on usage. Selling and other things I understand, however at the same time lock her up for her participation within this act. 2.At the same time, I understand her life is destroyed, however who is to say had they not been caught that they would of committed another crime any ways. :meh:

1. Actually, most places in the US offer plea deals for most crimes in an attempt to stop overpopulation (While simultaneously locking small time drug users in there and causing the problem to being with, this is why the War on Drugs is stupid)
2. How would they have not been caught? One of them live streamed it on their Facebook accounts...
Last edited by New haven america on Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:32 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Internationalist Bastard
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Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:31 pm

Kramania wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Actually trials show anti psychotics have taken away some of the violent impulses. Additionally, psychologists are making strides in the theory of exploiting the lack of empathy, by teaching them the personal gain of not acting on said impulses

Oh, good. Like teaching a dog not to bite. More animal than human.

These people are sick. Just like me. I want to see that sickness treated.
Would you throw someone with rabies in prison forever?
Call me Alex, I insist
I am a girl, damnit
Slut Pride. So like, real talk, I’m a porn actress. We’re not all bimbos. I do not give out my information or videos to avoid conflict with site policy. I’m happy to talk about the industry or my thoughts on the career but I will not be showing you any goodies. Sorry
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New haven america
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Postby New haven america » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:32 pm

Escocaria wrote:
New haven america wrote:Too the people complaining that she's getting probation: You do realize that she's spent a year in jail, is stuck with 4 years probation, and now has a felony next to her name. Due to how the US works, any future plans she has are now down the drain and it's very likely she'll be sent back on another crime, so...

I mean, I personally think 2-4 years would've been a better sentence, but due to plea deals and jail/prison overpopulation, I understand why she got off with less. (Even though her life is now officially destroyed)

Well, we could say that or we could also say that we have a violent racist who is perfectly willing to do harm to others, purely because they don't share a skin tone, is not currently locked up.

I see you didn't read the bolded.
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