A Green-Libertarian Alliance

[Ceannairceach]

How is privatized and commercialized space travel the future? The spacial technology of the past half a century has nearly solely gone through governmental agencies. I highly doubt any single corporation or private entity could manage or fund a space mission. It is simply economically unfeasible.

You do realize this sounds exactly why government NEEDS to get out of the business of economics and space. The fact that a nation can put itself into debt and degrade its currency over a silly notion that a private citizen(s) can not do something.

Large nations are meant to be in debt. The last time America lost its debt, we went bankrupt. Debt is what keeps the world economy afloat. If you don't understand that, I severely doubt you understand other economic ideas.

[Blakk Metal]

Rape infringes upon actual rights.

Most middle class families have negligible amounts of capital.

Not all black people were slaves either.

Strawmen ain't logic. Try again.

Persuasion is not force. Mandatory schooling and seizure of important ways of information is.

Those aren't private property.

Restricting my right to choice to own property is a tool of oppression whether by an individual or a state.

Prove you have the right to property.

What you call persuasion, I call manipulation and control and oppressive.

Then stop trying to manipulate me, Hitler*.

And yes a car or a home IS private property,

Private property =/= personal possessions/property

well until you progressives came alone about 100 years ago in this nation

I am not a social democrat. Don't mistake for those... people....

and forced taxes like income tax. Thankfully, property taxes are dealt with at the local level and can be changed.

If you believe in private property, then taxation is %100 moral and *not* force.

*Not serious

Strawmen ain't logic. Try again.

False dichotomy.

But apparently it's not strawman, or a false dichotomy to support Bluth's claim that libertarians oppose ALL freedom, because they put faith in employment?

That would depend on what oppose means. If he is saying that neoliberals are purposely trying to limit freedom, he's wrong. If he is saying that neoliberal policies significantly limit freedom, he's right.

False dichotomy.



When they give you the right to shoot people for walking on your lawn, or kick people out of their house for painting the walls a color you find unpleasant.

Stating a term like False dichotomy and not saying why is not an argument.

Property owner v. property owners is a false dichotomy.

Um, the second one is ridiculous. No one shots someone else for walking on their lawn(at least someone who is sane). Unless that property was surrounded by a fence and you so "happen" to climb the fence knowing you are entering private property? Silly argument.

Imaginary rights do not negate real ones.

Yes, a private citizen shouldn't be able to exploit Ecuador for natural resources.

Hey if he owns the land, he has a right to do with it what he wants.

Define 'own'.

[Nua Corda]

Without taxes to maintain those roads and subsidize your gasoline prices, your precious car is of little use. Anti-tax nonsense is nonsense.

Really?
So those silly pesky private roads do not exist? Please just Google it and you will see it is not nonsense.
And gasoline prices? Now that is laughable. You do realize that the reason why gas goes UP is because of more and more taxes specifically go to refining and selling of the gas, right?

Private roads affect a tiny percentage of the nations roads. Public roads are better maintained, more efficient, and safer anyway.

Please examine this paragraph closely:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.
After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.
At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.
I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.
Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.
I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!

Gas is subsidized by the government. Please just Google it.

[Liberty of Republic]

Restricting my right to choice to own property is a tool of oppression whether by an individual or a state.

Prove you have the right to property.

What you call persuasion, I call manipulation and control and oppressive.

Then stop trying to manipulate me, Hitler*.

And yes a car or a home IS private property,

Private property =/= personal possessions/property

well until you progressives came alone about 100 years ago in this nation

I am not a social democrat. Don't mistake for those... people....

and forced taxes like income tax. Thankfully, property taxes are dealt with at the local level and can be changed.

If you believe in private property, then taxation is %100 moral and *not* force.

*Not serious

But apparently it's not strawman, or a false dichotomy to support Bluth's claim that libertarians oppose ALL freedom, because they put faith in employment?

That would depend on what oppose means. If he is saying that neoliberals are purposely trying to limit freedom, he's wrong. If he is saying that neoliberal policies significantly limit freedom, he's right.

Stating a term like False dichotomy and not saying why is not an argument.

Property owner v. property owners is a false dichotomy.

Um, the second one is ridiculous. No one shots someone else for walking on their lawn(at least someone who is sane). Unless that property was surrounded by a fence and you so "happen" to climb the fence knowing you are entering private property? Silly argument.

Imaginary rights do not negate real ones.

Hey if he owns the land, he has a right to do with it what he wants.

Define 'own'.

Lets start here. How do you define freedom Blakk and how does one achieve it? In your opinion.

For me, everyone is born with rights and freedoms, no state says what you get and do not get. They may protect your freedoms from being taken away, but they do not create it.
With the US Constitution it was a document formed to show that the individual was born with rights and freedoms SO LONG AS IT DOES NOT INTERFERE WITH ANOTHER ONES FREEDOMS.
And no, firing an individual from a job when that individual did NOT keep up with his side of the contract is NOT restricting his freedom.

Oh and this caught my eye. What is the difference between imaginary and real rights? Curious.

[Liberty of Republic]

Really?
So those silly pesky private roads do not exist? Please just Google it and you will see it is not nonsense.
And gasoline prices? Now that is laughable. You do realize that the reason why gas goes UP is because of more and more taxes specifically go to refining and selling of the gas, right?

Private roads affect a tiny percentage of the nations roads. Public roads are better maintained, more efficient, and safer anyway.

Please examine this paragraph closely:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.
After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.
At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.
I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.
Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.
I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!

Gas is subsidized by the government. Please just Google it.

Public roads are better maintained? Where you from? Because I have been to the MAJORITY of the states in the US and been on Tollways, and non-tollways which is run by the state governments, they suck. As a driver I think I would know.
With private roads they have to be maintained or the private owner will lose money and will go out of business.
And so what if it is subsidized? Which goes to prove my point anyways.

[Liberty of Republic]

You do realize this sounds exactly why government NEEDS to get out of the business of economics and space. The fact that a nation can put itself into debt and degrade its currency over a silly notion that a private citizen(s) can not do something.

Large nations are meant to be in debt. The last time America lost its debt, we went bankrupt. Debt is what keeps the world economy afloat. If you don't understand that, I severely doubt you understand other economic ideas.

Anyone that thinks debt is good is not understanding what debt is. It is better to be debt free then a slave to the debtor.

[Jinos]

All the third parties in America combined couldn't even get a quarter of the popular vote. Politics is just too partisan to support third parties anymore. They won't be viable anymore until changes to the way elections are held are made.

[Divair]

Large nations are meant to be in debt. The last time America lost its debt, we went bankrupt. Debt is what keeps the world economy afloat. If you don't understand that, I severely doubt you understand other economic ideas.

Anyone that thinks debt is good is not understanding what debt is. It is better to be debt free then a slave to the debtor.

This takes the cake. Can't get much funnier than this.

[Nua Corda]

Private roads affect a tiny percentage of the nations roads. Public roads are better maintained, more efficient, and safer anyway.

Please examine this paragraph closely:



Gas is subsidized by the government. Please just Google it.

Public roads are better maintained? Where you from? Because I have been to the MAJORITY of the states in the US and been on Tollways, and non-tollways which is run by the state governments, they suck. As a driver I think I would know.
With private roads they have to be maintained or the private owner will lose money and will go out of business.
And so what if it is subsidized? Which goes to prove my point anyways.

Tollways then, I would say, are more extortion than taxes are. With tax-funded roads, anyone can travel anywhere freely. Tollways prevent the economically disadvantaged from traveling.

subsidized, in this context, means the government is basically bribing oil companies to charge less. In Europe, they don't, and so people drive less and use public transportation or clean transportation more. But, us self-titled Americans can't be bothered with such things. Not exactly proving your point.

[Arumdaum]

All the third parties in America combined couldn't even get a quarter of the popular vote. Politics is just too partisan to support third parties anymore. They won't be viable anymore until changes to the way elections are held are made.

The FPTP voting system sort of destroys third parties through the use of math.

[Divair]

All the third parties in America combined couldn't even get a quarter of the popular vote. Politics is just too partisan to support third parties anymore. They won't be viable anymore until changes to the way elections are held are made.

The FPTP voting system sort of destroys third parties through the use of math.

We need to implement MMP for Congress.

[Blakk Metal]

Really?
So those silly pesky private roads do not exist? Please just Google it and you will see it is not nonsense.
And gasoline prices? Now that is laughable. You do realize that the reason why gas goes UP is because of more and more taxes specifically go to refining and selling of the gas, right?

Private roads affect a tiny percentage of the nations roads. Public roads are better maintained, more efficient, and safer anyway.

Please examine this paragraph closely:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.
After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.
At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.
I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.
Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.
I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!

Gas is subsidized by the government. Please just Google it.

The only reason you need the state for those things is because of capitalism.

Prove you have the right to property.

Then stop trying to manipulate me, Hitler*.

Private property =/= personal possessions/property

I am not a social democrat. Don't mistake for those... people....

If you believe in private property, then taxation is %100 moral and *not* force.

*Not serious

That would depend on what oppose means. If he is saying that neoliberals are purposely trying to limit freedom, he's wrong. If he is saying that neoliberal policies significantly limit freedom, he's right.

Property owner v. property owners is a false dichotomy.

Imaginary rights do not negate real ones.

Define 'own'.

Lets start here. How do you define freedom Blakk and how does one achieve it? In your opinion.

For me, everyone is born with rights and freedoms, no state says what you get and do not get. They may protect your freedoms from being taken away, but they do not create it.

That.

With the US Constitution it was a document formed to show that the individual was born with rights and freedoms SO LONG AS IT DOES NOT INTERFERE WITH ANOTHER ONES FREEDOMS.

A piece of paper does not dictate morality.

And no, firing an individual from a job when that individual did NOT keep up with his side of the contract is NOT restricting his freedom.

Of course it isn't. The need to work for someone else is.

Large nations are meant to be in debt. The last time America lost its debt, we went bankrupt. Debt is what keeps the world economy afloat. If you don't understand that, I severely doubt you understand other economic ideas.

Anyone that thinks debt is good is not understanding what debt is. It is better to be debt free then a slave to the debtor.

Which is why capitalism must be abolished.

[The Andromeda Islands]

Perhaps the Green Party could appeal to civil libertarians with an appeal to decriminalize certain victimless crimes. It might help their electoral numbers grow.

But the Green Party and the Libertarian Party would never merge. Their core supporters are too ideologically rigid, which is why they still maintain insignificant party status. Plus, their leaders like being big fish in their small ponds.

[Ceannairceach]

Large nations are meant to be in debt. The last time America lost its debt, we went bankrupt. Debt is what keeps the world economy afloat. If you don't understand that, I severely doubt you understand other economic ideas.

Anyone that thinks debt is good is not understanding what debt is. It is better to be debt free then a slave to the debtor.

Pleas explain to me how a debt-free capitalistic society works.

[PapaJacky]

Private roads affect a tiny percentage of the nations roads. Public roads are better maintained, more efficient, and safer anyway.

Please examine this paragraph closely:



Gas is subsidized by the government. Please just Google it.

Public roads are better maintained? Where you from? Because I have been to the MAJORITY of the states in the US and been on Tollways, and non-tollways which is run by the state governments, they suck. As a driver I think I would know.
With private roads they have to be maintained or the private owner will lose money and will go out of business.
And so what if it is subsidized? Which goes to prove my point anyways.

That's what Adam Smith would say. Unfortunately, he's wrong. The private owner will go out business if no one uses his roads, period. It doesn't matter how it's maintained, what he uses to maintain it, or who he uses to maintain it, so long as people are fine with using his road, he stays in business. What this means is that he can maintain his roads with his cousin's children for free, use cheap and (maybe) dangerous materials to maintain the roads, build the road to a substandard quality to save time and costs, and only do it when he knows traffic's gonna be hefty soon. This is why private businesses are on occasion, the bane of humanity.

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

That's what Adam Smith would say. Unfortunately, he's wrong.

Mmm, this is exactly where libertarians err.

The libertarian conception of individual liberty is a perfectly valid and intellectually tenable one...if we assume that the state of our knowledge about how societies work is limited to what it was during the Enlightenment. Unfortunately for libertarians, however, our knowledge on that point has progressed similarly since then, and nowadays in order to be taken seriously any conception of liberty has to take into account those advances. Libertarians not only fail to do this successfully, they completely ignore or (more rarely) deny altogether the need to do so. What this means is that they insist on promoting a wildly de-contextualized conception of liberty, essentializing it as a set of reified policy choices rather than an approach to society whose details of implementation must be modified as our knowledge of how society works develops.

[Meryuma]

Did I ever state support for that claim? And IIRC he didn't say all freedom, he said both personal and economic freedom.

On a side note though Meryuma. If you don't think personal and economic freedoms are the only types of freedoms, I'm interested in what other types of freedom you think exist.

Do you not know what "IIRC" means? Also, I'm not saying there are other types of freedom. I don't even buy into the personal-economic distinction. However, saying "all freedom" and "both personal and economic freedom" would have had different implications.

[Liberty of Republic]

Public roads are better maintained? Where you from? Because I have been to the MAJORITY of the states in the US and been on Tollways, and non-tollways which is run by the state governments, they suck. As a driver I think I would know.
With private roads they have to be maintained or the private owner will lose money and will go out of business.
And so what if it is subsidized? Which goes to prove my point anyways.

Tollways then, I would say, are more extortion than taxes are. With tax-funded roads, anyone can travel anywhere freely. Tollways prevent the economically disadvantaged from traveling.

subsidized, in this context, means the government is basically bribing oil companies to charge less. In Europe, they don't, and so people drive less and use public transportation or clean transportation more. But, us self-titled Americans can't be bothered with such things. Not exactly proving your point.

Most of the tollways in the US ARE public roads, whether this be Illinois or Indiana or wherever. In Illinois, they not only charge you tolls for public roads, but tax you in both for the gas and other means.

I would argue that oil companies would charge more for the short term then less as more pops up with new ways to use the fuels in a car.

[Liberty of Republic]

Anyone that thinks debt is good is not understanding what debt is. It is better to be debt free then a slave to the debtor.

Pleas explain to me how a debt-free capitalistic society works.

Easy. Do not put your purchases on a plastic card if you want to be free of debt. Or in other words, buy what you can afford. In a capitalistic society, there is going to be competition between many businesses to sell a needed product. Thus lowering the price. Not a hard concept to understand.

[Liberty of Republic]

Public roads are better maintained? Where you from? Because I have been to the MAJORITY of the states in the US and been on Tollways, and non-tollways which is run by the state governments, they suck. As a driver I think I would know.
With private roads they have to be maintained or the private owner will lose money and will go out of business.
And so what if it is subsidized? Which goes to prove my point anyways.

That's what Adam Smith would say. Unfortunately, he's wrong. The private owner will go out business if no one uses his roads, period. It doesn't matter how it's maintained, what he uses to maintain it, or who he uses to maintain it, so long as people are fine with using his road, he stays in business. What this means is that he can maintain his roads with his cousin's children for free, use cheap and (maybe) dangerous materials to maintain the roads, build the road to a substandard quality to save time and costs, and only do it when he knows traffic's gonna be hefty soon. This is why private businesses are on occasion, the bane of humanity.

Wow. You do realize that not all or even most humans are so "evil" as you like to put them out to be.

[Liberty of Republic]

That's what Adam Smith would say. Unfortunately, he's wrong.

Mmm, this is exactly where libertarians err.

The libertarian conception of individual liberty is a perfectly valid and intellectually tenable one...if we assume that the state of our knowledge about how societies work is limited to what it was during the Enlightenment. Unfortunately for libertarians, however, our knowledge on that point has progressed similarly since then, and nowadays in order to be taken seriously any conception of liberty has to take into account those advances. Libertarians not only fail to do this successfully, they completely ignore or (more rarely) deny altogether the need to do so. What this means is that they insist on promoting a wildly de-contextualized conception of liberty, essentializing it as a set of reified policy choices rather than an approach to society whose details of implementation must be modified as our knowledge of how society works develops.

I have issue with the word progress or even the term progressive. It implies that we have more freedoms now then there is yesterday. What I mean is, we all have basic freedoms(which the Declaration of Independence and Constitution does cover)which includes Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness(which means property when Jefferson wrote this document).
To include other such things as healthcare, wages, and more is only to interfere with other individuals.

[PapaJacky]

That's what Adam Smith would say. Unfortunately, he's wrong. The private owner will go out business if no one uses his roads, period. It doesn't matter how it's maintained, what he uses to maintain it, or who he uses to maintain it, so long as people are fine with using his road, he stays in business. What this means is that he can maintain his roads with his cousin's children for free, use cheap and (maybe) dangerous materials to maintain the roads, build the road to a substandard quality to save time and costs, and only do it when he knows traffic's gonna be hefty soon. This is why private businesses are on occasion, the bane of humanity.

Wow. You do realize that not all or even most humans are so "evil" as you like to put them out to be.

Oh no, I do have faith in humanity. I just don't have faith in for-profit humans.

I have issue with the word progress or even the term progressive. It implies that we have more freedoms now then there is yesterday. What I mean is, we all have basic freedoms(which the Declaration of Independence and Constitution does cover)which includes Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness(which means property when Jefferson wrote this document).
To include other such things as healthcare, wages, and more is only to interfere with other individuals.

"More freedom" isn't good in many cases. The word "Progressive" doesn't imply that we have more freedoms, because in truth, it does cockblock the Capitalist class from exploiting the people and the land, what it does imply, however, is that we are better now than we were before, which is entirely true.

[Geilinor]

Really?
So those silly pesky private roads do not exist? Please just Google it and you will see it is not nonsense.
And gasoline prices? Now that is laughable. You do realize that the reason why gas goes UP is because of more and more taxes specifically go to refining and selling of the gas, right?

Private roads affect a tiny percentage of the nations roads. Public roads are better maintained, more efficient, and safer anyway.

Please examine this paragraph closely:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department of Energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. Then, I brushed my teeth with that water, filtered to standards set by the EPA and my state.
After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug Administration.
At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender issued by the Federal Reserve Bank and printed by the Federal Bureau of Engraving and Printing. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the kids off at the public school.
I park my car on the street, paved and maintained by the Department of Transportation, and put quarters issued by the United States Mint into the parking meter.
Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police department.
I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on freerepublic and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can't do anything right. Keep government out of my Medicare!

Gas is subsidized by the government. Please just Google it.

It's funny how the government is involved in everyone's daily life yet many call for it to get completely out. And the people who say "keep government out of my Medicare" are complete idiots who have no idea what they're talking about. Keeping government out of government programs.

[Franklin Delano Bluth]

Way to completely fail at reading comprehension, if you seriously think my use of the word "progressed" had anything to do with the word as it is used in the sense of "progressive politics." In the future, I suggest you make sure you take the time to actually read carefully and critically, rather than scanning for certain "key words" and giving a knee-jerk response that is completely inappropriate when it turns out that the word was used in a different sense than what you were expecting.

[Liberty of Republic]

Have you looked at our debt lately? And let me remind some of you, its not all military. Big chunk of it is welfare programs and such. 16 trillion dollars. Yeah, if we were truly fiscally responsible, we would not spend more then we have and then print more to devalue the dollar. Does not take brains to figure that one out.