[Discussion/Announcement] NSG's "Wing" Megathreads

[The Marlborough]

I've been here since 2011 lad.

Nation from 2020 that is seemingly also someone called "Nap" complaining about the age of a nation from 2019 whose older nation name is literally in their signature.

Shockingly, that you're an older nation is the entire fucking point I was making.

Of course, I've got no idea who you are (Napkilary??? however it was spelt) but that's not the point. There's a reason why I bothered adding in "is seeming also someone called 'Nap'"... it's not pointless verbage.

AiliAiliA appears also to be have been a 2011 nation so it's actually even funnier now.

And I rarely read sigs? I rarely read sigs. Especially late at night when there is a lot of other stuff going on. You're getting a bit testy over nothing here mate.

[The Kingdom of Glitter]

Part of the reason people felt over-policed in the wing megathreads is the lack of reporting happening elsewhere. Plenty of people in this thread have alluded to having seen rule breaks in other threads. Some admit these were not reported or they would not report it themselves period. This is why the wing megathreads felt over-moderated. They faced high levels of reports because people were clearly willing to file them when they saw rule violations, even ones that qualify as banter that they know can result in moderator action.

If people reported rule violations in other threads, the wing threads would not have stood out as much. They are not the only ones were violations are happening, they are just the ones being reported when they mostly happen.

The wing megathreads felt over-moderated for a reason, and it is likely because they were. Compared to other threads where people seem to know rule violations are happening regularly, they stood out because people were reporting violations in the wing megathreads at higher levels than elsewhere.

[The Marlborough]

Part of the reason people felt over-policed in the wing megathreads is the lack of reporting happening elsewhere. Plenty of people in this thread have alluded to having seen rule breaks in other threads. Some admit these were not reported or they would not report it themselves period. This is why the wing megathreads felt over-moderated. They faced high levels of reports because people were clearly willing to file them when they saw rule violations, even ones that qualify as banter that they know can result in moderator action.

If people reported rule violations in other threads, the wing threads would not have stood out as much. They are not the only ones were violations are happening, they are just the ones being reported when they mostly happen.

The wing megathreads felt over-moderated for a reason, and it is likely because they were. Compared to other threads where people seem to know rule violations are happening regularly, they stood out because people were reporting violations in the wing megathreads at higher levels than elsewhere.

Further, there was recently the issue of lurkers in the RWDT who were clearly there in bad faith and just were there to report even the most minor and petty or rules violations, which a) of course will result in things becoming disproportionate since that doesn't happen nearly as much elsewhere b) helped further worsen the relationship had with the RWDT.

[Forsher]

Nation from 2020 that is seemingly also someone called "Nap" complaining about the age of a nation from 2019 whose older nation name is literally in their signature.

Shockingly, that you're an older nation is the entire fucking point I was making.

Of course, I've got no idea who you are (Napkilary??? however it was spelt) but that's not the point. There's a reason why I bothered adding in "is seeming also someone called 'Nap'"... it's not pointless verbage.

AiliAiliA appears also to be have been a 2011 nation so it's actually even funnier now.

And I rarely read sigs? I rarely read sigs. Especially late at night when there is a lot of other stuff going on. You're getting a bit testy over nothing here mate.

No, what's annoying is that you're not reading my posts. I know people don't read signatures. In case you haven't noticed, but you can actually turn them off so you don't see them at all. That is literally a function on this site. But anyone who wants to talk shit about nation ages who doesn't look at signatures is doing something inherently funny. Especially if they're clearly talking about "long ago and far away".

Again, I really wonder if this is meant to be the standard of conversation that the RWDT created. A complete refusal to do research, a blustering pride at ignoring text and indignant, chip on the shoulder responses when challenged. Yeah...

[Repubblica Fascista Sociale Italiana]

RWDT was a chat thread a third of the time, but for the time it discussed right wing political thought and theory, it was actually civilized and polite conversation, without any of the snark and bad faith concern trolling and virtue signaling that’s in every other thread. RWDT also had quite a few leftists on it, so it wasn’t like an echo chamber or anything for the most part.

LWDT was the same, it was thought provoking discussion of leftist literature and studies, avoiding most of the bad faith and snark. Unfortunately, the last two bastions of civilized conversation are gone

[Forsher]

Banter used to be tolerated and allowed in NSG.

Can we just talk about how banter somehow became equated with "I need to be able to flame and troll my supposed friends" for a minute because it's getting kind of crazy?

People were forced into megathreads because the mods locked smaller threads and merged them together a couple of years ago, now the mods are banning two of the longest-running megathread series.
It's like they don't actually want discussion on nsg.

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible that you may be mistaken"

People are allowed to be wrong. Can we please stop jumping on people for concluding they were mistaken?

Shutting down prominent megathreads does not mean they will continue to merge threads into megathreads and then lock those megathreads.

New data, new opinion... even if it takes literal years to realise what's been obvious for years (I'm not even sure if the players who dislike megathreads complained about them from the start or only after it became obvious what their effects on the forum at large were, but the critiques have been out there for years).

I mean, if that's the case then don't be surprised more people leave when they realize it's not worth to have their lives exposed to everyone else just because someone in an obscure website happens to disagree with them.

I don't know about you, but a lot of us have a lot in our plates right now to either care about this one problem being one more problem added to the pile, or to have our lives exposed to the world simply because of a disagreement with some nobody online.

Let's say, for sake of argument, that an offsite collection of NS/G users are gathered where they spend most of their time flaming an absent member of NS/G.

The mods have no tools to establish anything that's happening there... merely the assertion of other players.

Say I report you for bullying me on, it seems Discord is the way to go. I could make that report right now and the mods can say what about it? They don't know if I use Discord (I do not). They don't know if you do either. Maybe I can provide screenshots but that doesn't prove it's you. I really shouldn't have used Discord because I know fuck all about it... can I provide links or is it more like an IRC? But even if I had links (assuming that's possible)... the mods cannot investigate. They can't protect you from impersonation for nefarious purposes except by just flat out ignoring whatever shit happens offsite.

At best they can just go... "Well, Forsher's been here for years but literally no-one appears to like him, like, at all and, also, that includes us so we're not going to believe him and, what's more, DoS him for making shit up... probably. Also, we'll ban New Zealand again, just in case. Fuck the other six players from NZ, they were probably in on it, too."

But what happens if it's a popular poster who's doing this? They can't even make this (weak, highly problematic) argument. And there probably is someone who likes what I write... even if not the personality behind the posts... even in my case, anyway.

Unless, of course, one of the NSG moderators is also an offsite moderator...

Complaining to NS moderation about how ridiculously outdated their website

This is the second throwaway remark on this subject that I've seen in this thread and it's by a second person. Seriously, I want to know more about this perspective.

Gameplay and NSG are somehow two different subcultures on NSG and they seldom seem to meet.

It's a little sus if you ask me.

?

There were entire swathes of people I couldn't tell you what they did at school and I knew some of them for years from primary.

Two individuals using the same site in different ways and not interacting is not only not more surprising, but it's actually less suspicious than their interacting. I mean, how would they meet?

[Valrifell]

RWDT was a chat thread a third of the time, but for the time it discussed right wing political thought and theory, it was actually civilized and polite conversation, without any of the snark and bad faith concern trolling and virtue signaling that’s in every other thread. RWDT also had quite a few leftists on it, so it wasn’t like an echo chamber or anything for the most part.

Again this isn't my experience reading through or participating in the thread.

There were just as many cheap shots and bait as the rest of NSG, if not more because people there knew that nobody in that thread would report you for it unless the regulars really didn't like you. So who would get caught?

The only people willing to report on the RWDT weren't people with very much attachment to it and weren't ardent participants. I also don't think that lurkers stalked the thread for the first slip-up, considering the lack of report threads (if only in recent weeks alone).

[Souseiseki]

The unrelated case is currently being brought up backstage for comment. One of my colleagues is presently working up an explanation of the process that led to the closing of the 'wing' threads.

did this ever happen? there's now 35 pages and the search function does not enable easy finding of it.

[Questarian New Yorkshire]

The unrelated case is currently being brought up backstage for comment. One of my colleagues is presently working up an explanation of the process that led to the closing of the 'wing' threads.

did this ever happen? there's now 35 pages and the search function does not enable easy finding of it.

not yet

but we got hint that they was basically "chats"

also I promised Id stop posting here but I broke my own rule, oops

[Forsher]

The unrelated case is currently being brought up backstage for comment. One of my colleagues is presently working up an explanation of the process that led to the closing of the 'wing' threads.

did this ever happen? there's now 35 pages and the search function does not enable easy finding of it.

There were two posts I felt might match the description. This one by Neutraligon and this one by Arch. But I am only at page 21.

I'm not sure how much they're in agreement on the facts, but I haven't read them very closely. I don't have a problem with this ruling or how it was made so I don't really care about its background.

[Questarian New Yorkshire]

I don't have a problem with this ruling or how it was made so I don't really care about its background.

Of course you don't

[Souseiseki]

also I promised Id stop posting here but I broke my own rule, oops

yet another example of RWDT not being to regulate its posts smh

There were two posts I felt might match the description. This one by Neutraligon and this one by Arch. But I am only at page 21.

thank you i will look at these

I don't have a problem with this ruling or how it was made so I don't really care about its background.

not gonna lie "i agree with the decision so i don't care about transparency" is a pretty bad take

[Katganistan]

Hi.

So, I heard about this happening off-site and, honestly, between reading the reasons for why the mods have done what they've done, the community's general backlash that has been met with a veneer of apathy from the moderation team, and having been a decently well-known and involved member of both threads and the communities within (for better or for worse), I figured I'd bring my account back from the dead for this one-off post despite committing to staying off this site. So, here I am, spending my time on this when I could be doing something more worthwhile, for both people I kinda like on here and for people I absolutely despise.

First: what the actual fuck, mods? I read the criteria under which you've decided to kill these two specific megathreads (which, by all regards, can easily be argued to fall within the guidelines of those criteria), and the fact that you've used it to purge just these two threads and not any others - many of which have been much worse in regards to cohesive, worthwhile (albeit often heated) discussion - is patently bullshit. Furthermore, the way in which that criteria is being used in such a conservative and yet arbitrary manner just opens up that entire board to chaos as more and more threads are created on similar albeit somewhat different topics. Do you really want fifty different threads focused on every single different tendency of Communism? Because, between Marxism, Leninism, Marxism-Leninism, Maoism, Titoism, Hoxhaism, Left Communism, Ecocommunism, Anarcho-Communism, and so much fucking more just for that one specific ideology, you're gonna get a lot of shit like that, for instance.

Secondly, like a lot of other users have said and which I touched on: these were two of the only threads that tended to maintain the most cohesive debate and discussion across the entire board, even with all the banter (which still was on-topic most of the time!). Hell, not only that, but knowing what I've seen on this board, they were even over-moderated and had reporting happen far more frequently than any other megathread has. I know for a fact I contributed to that, on both sides of the matter. People clearly gave enough of a damn to not let those threads spiral too much given how frequently people made reports on rulebreaking behavior. And, hell, if "cliques" and inability to moderate are such a concern, why not make a new fucking group of moderators or submoderators specifically dedicated to the megathreads? If being overworked is such a concern, smashing shit down for no reason and in an entirely bullshit, arbitrary manner isn't gonna fix your problems. It's gonna kill the site's community and make shit worse in the other threads for those that stay.

Additionally, going back to your arbitrary criteria for locking these two particular threads:

"What qualifies for a megathread?

1 A topic which has at its focus a specific, singular subject, such as a current news event (IE: election thread, anti-police protests), a frequent recurring debate (IE: abortion, gun control), or a political figure (IE: the US president.)

2 Discussion on that specific, singular subject as the thread's primary focus, not simple socializing motivated by underlying interest in the subject. Conversational drift is okay, but it must remain on that specific, singular primary focus."

Under BOTH critera, either both threads covered a specific, singular subject like every other megathread on here and kept their primary focuses to that, or none of the megathreads on this entire website do. Why's that? It's simple: EVERY megathread on this goddamn forum has countless subtopics to talk about for whatever focused subject it's about. The MAGA thread is a prime non-LWDT or RWDT example of this, since it covers all sorts of fucking shit related to the Trump administration. The 2020 election threads cover all sorts of shit related to the election, from the primaries to election rigging. How is it that they successfully meet the criteria for specific, singular subjects yet a thread focused on left-wing or right-wing politics does not? Those are two specific, singular subjects with an abundance of subtopics just like those other two threads I mentioned. Talk about right-wing politics or random shit was at a minimum in the LWDT, and vice-versa in the RWDT, because those things weren't necessarily a part of the subjects of either thread. I've been on here long enough to know those threads largely stuck to discussion about their given subjects and the subtopics within.

Seriously, mods, get your shit together. This blatant disrespect toward and atrocious disconnect from the community you're supposed to moderate is peaking in its bullshit. It's a major reason why I left earlier this year and entirely why I came back right now. How can you argue that these threads were insulated from reporting when a metric fuckton of moderation's threads focused on rulebreaking issues within those very threads, even with a seldom few arguing against reporting at all? How can you argue that you don't have the time or manpower to moderate already over-moderated threads when you could easily create a new moderation category that can be filled out by trustworthy members of these communities and focused on the megathreads in particular?

You've got numerous members of the community from every political tendency imaginable telling you that this is stupid, wrong, arbitrary, and hilariously disconnected from the community itself. Stop doubling down on cookie-cutter copypaste responses and actually think about the implication of that. They're laying out numerous grievances that you've done a fantastic job of disregarding in this very thread. There's plenty of other solutions you could pursue besides this bullshit. If you wanna kick people off the site because they built a little community of their own in the threads they frequent and they're sometimes problematic because of it, then just say so or get rid of them already. Don't act this fucking ridiculous and arbitrary because of your obvious biases and general disconnect from NSG's community and the groups within it.

Anyway, that's my two cents, now back to fucking off from this hellsite.

[Foxfound]

I never really got involved with the two threads in question, or General in general for that matter, so I don't know if I can give a proper opinion here. That said, on the surface this seems like a bad move, but having barely read any of those threads I can't say with any certainty.

I'm pretty sure that prior to the last banning of a certain type of thread (chil/chat location threads) there was some degree of warning given to the userbase of those threads about what they were doing wrong. Was such a thing considered in this circumstance: if not, why?

Was only part of that type of thread briefly with another nation, but I miss them. That said, in hindsight the threads I recall were basically trying to fly under the radar of what at the time was a temporary moratorium of them. This isn't the topic though and I'll stop, sorry sometimes I go on tangents. Maybe I shouldn't post I don't know.

[Questarian New Yorkshire]

yet another example of RWDT not being to regulate its posts smh

I have some kind of personality defect where I can't let things go, hence...

I'll tell you... it's that with the seven threads, you get a new thread when there's something new... you get opportunities to join in and learn what NSG is like instead of getting shut out by hundreds of pages of pre-existing discussion among cliquey and, clearly, defensive existing posters.

Those megathreads were chat threads that stopped other threads from being created. Want to talk about, say, legalising prostitution? Why bother making a thread about it? Just stick it in whichever megathread you and your buddies posted in and hoard the topic to the privileged few who use the thread.

To gain recognition in that clique it was apparently necessary to "banter" occasionally, which is to say exchange rule-breaking insults with the regulars. This is elitism, and thuggish elitism at that.

I don't understand this.

RWDT did not prevent anyone else from making their own threads, it did not brigade other threads, it did not crowd out discussions. This perception that it prevented other conversations from happening is just wrong. You could have had your debate or discussion separately in another thread and nobody was preventing you. There's another reason you wanted to tear the RWDT down, which you aren't saying, and I'm trying to figure out what it is, which is why I'm still reading.

And, sure, maybe people screaming "strawman" wildly and expecting links and work behind posts, isn't actually better discussion, but it's more intellectually honest.

Look, you don't convince or persuade people on the internet. It's rare. And I'm not talking about my abilities to persuade - even those of people more intelligent and eloquent than me. It juts doesn't happen that often - and loads of "logical fallacies" that internet debaters think are intelligent are actually very stupid ways to look at discussions. In many times I've seen on NS in the past people demand "sources" then carry on to break the source down. Which is just stupid — if the source was authoritative enough to be posted then its authoritative enough that some random 17 year old can't take it apart.

The best thing to be had are conversations. Conversations with people who you don't agree with and conversations with people who you do agree with. Then, you get to refine your world view and your position and learn something new about yourself and the world. "Having an argument but with latin terminology instead of calling people out for being dumb" isn't more intelligent, you don't learn more, and it isn't more civilised.

What was good about RWDT was we could just have conversations. Who has the mental energy to constantly debate? I just want to talk about interesting things with interesting people. I dont want a constant argument man.

[Questarian New Yorkshire]

If you wanna kick people off the site because they built a little community of their own in the threads they frequent and they're sometimes problematic because of it, then just say so or get rid of them already.

[Forsher]

I don't have a problem with this ruling or how it was made so I don't really care about its background.

Of course you don't

Oh, hey, it's you... the random poster who got all indignant when I pointed out that the RWDT wasn't what it was sold as:

Come to the RWDT they said. It's not a chat thread they said.

sorry who are you

Who is irrelevant. What matters. And that little exchange, right there, is the RWDT not caring that it's not meant to be a chat thread and rejecting the possibility of being "self-moderated" into being what it's supposed to be.

I've been complaining about the megathreads for a long time. No bones about it. I like this decision. It's good moderation. It's long overdue moderation. As far as I'm concerned, the baggage is the wagon circling the mods did to protect the megathreads.

I don't have a problem with this ruling or how it was made so I don't really care about its background.

not gonna lie "i agree with the decision so i don't care about transparency" is a pretty bad take

No, being right is more important. If I thought it was wrong, investigating how it happened would be important. We're never going to get transparency.

What you also have to remember, and aside from anything else, I vividly remember moderation threads directly and indirectly about these very subjects. Events seem to have conspired to make the moderation staff realise that they were wrong.

This isn't the real world. This is NSG. It's opaque. It's headscratching. The moderation stuff are needlessly hostile and some of them seem to personally dislike me (I certainly don't like some of them). Transparent it is not and never has been. Responsive? Sure. If you can stand the snark. And that's enough. I don't have to worry about waking up tomorrow facing a death order (I live in NZ, this is something my government can do with a simple majority vote... and I support its having this power, incidentally). And it's a damn sight better than, say, Reddit or the BBC. You can, usually, see reports (and I complain when they don't exist). You get threads like these about rule changes. That's what transparency means in this context and, hey, we've got it.

[Questarian New Yorkshire]

Oh, hey, it's you... the random poster who got all indignant when I pointed out that the RWDT wasn't what it was sold as:

Who is irrelevant. What matters. And that little exchange, right there, is the RWDT not caring that it's not meant to be a chat thread and rejecting the possibility of being "self-moderated" into being what it's supposed to be.

I've been complaining about the megathreads for a long time. No bones about it. I like this decision. It's good moderation. It's long overdue moderation. As far as I'm concerned, the baggage is the wagon circling the mods did to protect the megathreads.

see my post above

[Cekoviu]

Of course you don't

Oh, hey, it's you... the random poster who got all indignant when I pointed out that the RWDT wasn't what it was sold as:

"Random poster"? Questers has made massive contributions to the RWDT -- far more than any other user, by my metrics. He knows a hell of a lot more than you, not that that's a high bar, given that you have no idea what you're talking about. Get off your high horse.

sorry who are you

Who is irrelevant. What matters. And that little exchange, right there, is the RWDT not caring that it's not meant to be a chat thread and rejecting the possibility of being "self-moderated" into being what it's supposed to be.

I've been complaining about the megathreads for a long time. No bones about it. I like this decision. It's good moderation. It's long overdue moderation. As far as I'm concerned, the baggage is the wagon circling the mods did to protect the megathreads.

So I assume that's why you've been so adamantly against this decision for targeting the *WDTs and not any of the other megathreads on this site? :thinking:

[Forsher]

Oh, hey, it's you... the random poster who got all indignant when I pointed out that the RWDT wasn't what it was sold as:

"Random poster"? Questers has made massive contributions to the RWDT -- far more than any other user, by my metrics. He knows a hell of a lot more than you, not that that's a high bar, given that you have no idea what you're talking about. Get off your high horse.

So... you're saying that I didn't come across the RWDT being, you know, a chat thread because I was quoted by someone you like? Good to know.

That's not how it works.

Who is irrelevant. What matters. And that little exchange, right there, is the RWDT not caring that it's not meant to be a chat thread and rejecting the possibility of being "self-moderated" into being what it's supposed to be.

I've been complaining about the megathreads for a long time. No bones about it. I like this decision. It's good moderation. It's long overdue moderation. As far as I'm concerned, the baggage is the wagon circling the mods did to protect the megathreads.

So I assume that's why you've been so adamantly against this decision for targeting the *WDTs and not any of the other megathreads on this site? :thinking:

Or, you know, pay attention to how I specifically suggested that the Feminist Megathread fits the criteria established for locking in my first post here. Or, you know, my very long history... that you know about... of being critical of megathreads.

But, sure, whatever facts you need.

I also suggest you look at the phrase "take the win".

[The Archregimancy]

There were two posts I felt might match the description. This one by Neutraligon and this one by Arch. But I am only at page 21.

thank you i will look at these

For clarity:

Neutraligon's post is the main 'official' one drafted and posted following internal discussion.

Mine was a supplementary post; it was not an 'official' post drafted via internal discussion, though there had been discussion of the points I raised, and I shared it directly with the rest of the team after posting it here. It's therefore an approved moderator opinion, but not the primary official response.

[Luminesa]

yet another example of RWDT not being to regulate its posts smh

I have some kind of personality defect where I can't let things go, hence...

I'll tell you... it's that with the seven threads, you get a new thread when there's something new... you get opportunities to join in and learn what NSG is like instead of getting shut out by hundreds of pages of pre-existing discussion among cliquey and, clearly, defensive existing posters.

Those megathreads were chat threads that stopped other threads from being created. Want to talk about, say, legalising prostitution? Why bother making a thread about it? Just stick it in whichever megathread you and your buddies posted in and hoard the topic to the privileged few who use the thread.

To gain recognition in that clique it was apparently necessary to "banter" occasionally, which is to say exchange rule-breaking insults with the regulars. This is elitism, and thuggish elitism at that.

I don't understand this.

RWDT did not prevent anyone else from making their own threads, it did not brigade other threads, it did not crowd out discussions. This perception that it prevented other conversations from happening is just wrong. You could have had your debate or discussion separately in another thread and nobody was preventing you. There's another reason you wanted to tear the RWDT down, which you aren't saying, and I'm trying to figure out what it is, which is why I'm still reading.

And, sure, maybe people screaming "strawman" wildly and expecting links and work behind posts, isn't actually better discussion, but it's more intellectually honest.

Look, you don't convince or persuade people on the internet. It's rare. And I'm not talking about my abilities to persuade - even those of people more intelligent and eloquent than me. It juts doesn't happen that often - and loads of "logical fallacies" that internet debaters think are intelligent are actually very stupid ways to look at discussions. In many times I've seen on NS in the past people demand "sources" then carry on to break the source down. Which is just stupid — if the source was authoritative enough to be posted then its authoritative enough that some random 17 year old can't take it apart.

The best thing to be had are conversations. Conversations with people who you don't agree with and conversations with people who you do agree with. Then, you get to refine your world view and your position and learn something new about yourself and the world. "Having an argument but with latin terminology instead of calling people out for being dumb" isn't more intelligent, you don't learn more, and it isn't more civilised.

What was good about RWDT was we could just have conversations. Who has the mental energy to constantly debate? I just want to talk about interesting things with interesting people. I dont want a constant argument man.

I don’t have the energy to fight constantly, but I just go to PT2M. Though RWDT and LWDT were not always dens of hostility, as has been claimed by many.

I agree with Torra, and I have saved her post in case it gets deleted. I don’t see the bad faith in the post, I see someone who is angry that their community got taken away. Torra complained quite a few times, in her time on this site, about being afraid of being a leftist on NS (I never was sure why, but I can’t decide Torra’s feelings for her). And I didn’t always like constant debates with people who either don’t care or who constantly ask for sources without reading them (moderation knows exactly who these people are). Left or right, LWDT and RWDT were oftentimes places to cool-off. I like the idea that was suggested by Reppy for political chat threads, I think that would give people much of what they want.

But I hope the mods will look more considerately at the feelings of the base. Historically, many of the mods have not done so. Personally, I cannot say that Reppy has not cared, as she helped me through a very dark time in my life, as did Arch. I have heard many stories about the infighting and incendiary environment of moderation, and of the lack of communication between mods and players. Again, I cannot say this has been the case for all mods, but with that being said, and with the situations of the LWDT and RWDT coming to head, all we ask for is transparency, unity, and a place to chill. God knows all of us need it these days. Let’s work together, both mods and players, so we can make this website a more comfortable place for everyone.

[Questarian New Yorkshire]

[That's not how it works.

I'll tell you... it's that with the seven threads, you get a new thread when there's something new... you get opportunities to join in and learn what NSG is like instead of getting shut out by hundreds of pages of pre-existing discussion among cliquey and, clearly, defensive existing posters.

Those megathreads were chat threads that stopped other threads from being created. Want to talk about, say, legalising prostitution? Why bother making a thread about it? Just stick it in whichever megathread you and your buddies posted in and hoard the topic to the privileged few who use the thread.

You're bitter about something. What is it?

[Katganistan]

One post has been deemed to be bad faith, and has thusly been removed per [violet]'s directive.

[edit]And restored after discussion.

[Torrocca]

One post has been deemed to be bad faith, and has thusly been removed per [violet]'s directive.

Are you joking right now? Literally nothing about what I posted was in bad-faith. Do you want bad-faith? Because I could absolutely give you bad-faith, if I wanted. I'm not, though, because that's not what I'm going for or what anyone else is: I'm going for honest discussion. Is this seriously how you all are gonna act in response to legitimate grievances from current and former members of the community, suppressing the posts that list and argue valid points in detail?

Sure, it was inflammatory. Very inflammatory at one point. NONE of it was in bad-faith. I don't make and never have made posts in bad-faith on this website, even with the rulebreaking posts I've made. This is exactly what I was talking about in detail in that very post; you all have such a major disconnect from the community and whatever legitimate grievances there are that you're actively suppressing these legitimate grievances on arbitrary accusations of bad-faith. Do better.

EDIT: Thanks, Kat, for restoring it.