The New Lazarene Order

[A mean old man]

I thought i'd care more about waking up in TRR. But I don't give a rats arse. I'm just disappointed with Feux.

Yo Stu don't waste my fucking time brah undo that shite

[Christian Democrats]

I don't give a rats arse.

Isn't that your MO?

[Neo Kervoskia]

The implications of AMOM's OP are quite disturbing for the rest of the world. AMOM said:

If you think for yourself and avoid the bias of organizations that view the NPO as a threat to their capacity to control other regions from afar you would realize that no, this is not at all hypocrisy. This is not backpedaling on the NPO's ideal of sovereignty and productivity within the GCRs. This is a step forward and a step towards a new age of GCR power and prosperity. Let me show you how.

The Persona of the Modern NPO; A Reintroduction

I abandoned my position as an NPO Senator for the sake of my dedication to The East Pacific, but let's face it: I'm NPO through and through. I always was, I still am, and I always will be. Everything I ever did in my career and in The East Pacific, even, was in the spirit of The New Pacific Order. I was NPO before I knew it even existed. And I may be able to leave the Senate but I cannot dissolve the friendships that emerged during my time therein between myself and like-minded individuals. I cannot deny the outlook of NS politics that was reinforced within my persona during that time.

You might ask: how is this possible? How could I be NPO before I knew what it was? You might accuse me of feigning loyalty to TEP or pulling a stunt by leaving the Senate in The Pacific yet remaining "loyal to the NPO;" fear not, for your cynical gut reaction misguides you. The modern NPO is less of a centralized government than it is a mindset: a fundamental, guiding view on the realities of Nationstates politics that regional allegiance cannot ignore.

Emphasis added. It appears that we're all NPO we just don't know it until the NPO either tells us or we ourselves are enlightened to see that the NPO's ideology is the ideology we should all follow. Excuse me while I throw away my vomit bag.

What we have learned from AMOM's statement about the NPO is that they are seeking to exert as much influence as they can within GCR's. GCR sovereignty for the NPO means nothing, yes I said means nothing. Why? From AMOM's comments you can see that the NPO will use any justification to pursue any goal it so desires, Francoist ideology be damned.

That's a scary thought for the rest of us.

This is perfectly in keeping with Francoism.

At the heart of Francoism is the class struggle between Feederites and Userites. The only way to empower the Feederites is through perpetual revolution. First, though, there must be class consciousness. Userites are everywhere and if regions are not conscious of the struggle before them, Userites will infiltrate every level of society and bend it to their will. When a government fails to keep the revolution alive, they have failed the people and instantly obliterate whatever mandate they may have believed they had. When that happens the Feederite class must rise against them and that's what's happened in Lazarus. There is a new vanguard party to defend the revolution and the Feederite class.

[Yao]

It's not wholly surprising that the most vocal of the opposition consists of players who seldom contributed to Laz, like Cameron Romefeller.

[Lazmac]

It's not wholly surprising that the most vocal of the opposition consists of players who seldom contributed to Laz, like Cameron Romefeller.

It's not wholly surprising that you're once again betraying a regional community that placed its trust in you, either, and a community that you largely were responsible for recruiting though you want to throw them under the bus as inactive non-contributors now, so I guess today is just full of non-surprises.

[The South Polish Union]

The implications of AMOM's OP are quite disturbing for the rest of the world. AMOM said:



Emphasis added. It appears that we're all NPO we just don't know it until the NPO either tells us or we ourselves are enlightened to see that the NPO's ideology is the ideology we should all follow. Excuse me while I throw away my vomit bag.

What we have learned from AMOM's statement about the NPO is that they are seeking to exert as much influence as they can within GCR's. GCR sovereignty for the NPO means nothing, yes I said means nothing. Why? From AMOM's comments you can see that the NPO will use any justification to pursue any goal it so desires, Francoist ideology be damned.

That's a scary thought for the rest of us.

This is perfectly in keeping with Francoism.

At the heart of Francoism is the class struggle between Feederites and Userites. The only way to empower the Feederites is through perpetual revolution. First, though, there must be class consciousness. Userites are everywhere and if regions are not conscious of the struggle before them, Userites will infiltrate every level of society and bend it to their will. When a government fails to keep the revolution alive, they have failed the people and instantly obliterate whatever mandate they may have believed they had. When that happens the Feederite class must rise against them and that's what's happened in Lazarus. There is a new vanguard party to defend the revolution and the Feederite class.

parodying communist rhetoric is only funny when the PRL does it in press releases. we need some more of those btw, the PRL should be spitting em out as fast as they can in a situation like this

also, let's try to make the next GCR coup a little more interesting please. this ones been a bit dull compared to TSPSPR and douria's osi coup

[Yao]

I'm sorry that our internal community affairs are not satisfying your entertainment quota.

[Waldeck-Pyrmont]

The implications of AMOM's OP are quite disturbing for the rest of the world. AMOM said:



Emphasis added. It appears that we're all NPO we just don't know it until the NPO either tells us or we ourselves are enlightened to see that the NPO's ideology is the ideology we should all follow. Excuse me while I throw away my vomit bag.

What we have learned from AMOM's statement about the NPO is that they are seeking to exert as much influence as they can within GCR's. GCR sovereignty for the NPO means nothing, yes I said means nothing. Why? From AMOM's comments you can see that the NPO will use any justification to pursue any goal it so desires, Francoist ideology be damned.

That's a scary thought for the rest of us.

This is perfectly in keeping with Francoism.

At the heart of Francoism is the class struggle between Feederites and Userites. The only way to empower the Feederites is through perpetual revolution. First, though, there must be class consciousness. Userites are everywhere and if regions are not conscious of the struggle before them, Userites will infiltrate every level of society and bend it to their will. When a government fails to keep the revolution alive, they have failed the people and instantly obliterate whatever mandate they may have believed they had. When that happens the Feederite class must rise against them and that's what's happened in Lazarus. There is a new vanguard party to defend the revolution and the Feederite class.

This is why Aretism is far better, and less stratified. Either you're a contributor, or you're a leech. None of this Feederite and Userite nonsense.

[Klaus Devestatorie]

The participation of 94 Block in the recent festivities has generated concern among the general public; while 94 Block did indeed shut down Grand Central's forums during a period of inactivity therein (with back-ups of this forum on hand and a naïve plan for regional revival through scaring his regionmates back into activity), he has since apologized profusely for his mistake and moved forward in an honest career in Nationstates. Many who are currently flaunting his "forum destruction" (committed with differing intent from the stereotypical, malicious forum destroyer) are petty enemies of the NPO and/or of 94 Block's personally and are simply using menacing vibrations to twist others' opinions for underhanded purposes. Any who do not fit this mold are simply getting hung up on arbitrary formalities and should strongly consider revising their stance on the individual.

I'm sure that the reasonable people of the world will be able to forgive 94 Block for an offense committed in ignorance 3 years ago and acknowledge that he is not, in reality, a destructive influence but has an honest will to contribute and to build Lazarus into a successful and productive entity (and he does). Treaties like COPS were created for an honorable purpose; however, exceptions must be made for individuals who have changed their paths and proven their worth through years of good behavior. Let us take, for example, the exception made by Osiris for "Sector ZYX," who destroyed a colony of Unknown's forum six years ago. You don't see anyone chirping about that.

For the sake of arbitrary formalities, however, I suppose he can step outside and wait until a reasonable discussion can be had regarding his status. He's a good sport.

After the most recent "Miniluv Messenger" article, I expressed a similar sentiment to Cormac, who replied that he had literally no idea who "Sector ZYX" is and asked me to tell me who he is. When I called bullshit on his lack of knowledge due to a very recent incident where Osiris closed relations with Ainur over 94 Block's presence, during which time we had an identical discussion, I recieved this reply;

<Cormac> I'll take that as a no and proceed with my original plan to ignore you due to your absolute and total irrelevance.
<Cormac> Tell Unknown I hope it's enjoying its prolonged nap.

I congratulate the New Pacific Order for not backing down against moral outrage from hypocrites- the continued Stujenske-lead government in Lazarus has my endorsement and support.

[Feux]

Thank you comrade o/

[Gradea IV]

This is disgusting. I have seen a man puke and then lick his own puke to puke again, and it was less disgusting then this thing.

Calm down sir, it's a game.

[Consular]

It's not wholly surprising that the most vocal of the opposition consists of players who seldom contributed to Laz, like Cameron Romefeller.

It's not wholly surprising that you're once again betraying a regional community that placed its trust in you, either, and a community that you largely were responsible for recruiting though you want to throw them under the bus as inactive non-contributors now, so I guess today is just full of non-surprises.

I find it annoying, and yet somehow unsurprising, that I agree with Cormac. (Not just this post either. Pretty much all his sentiments in this thread.)

That's a scary thought for the rest of us.

It should be particularly scary for The West Pacific, where Senator Elegarth's WA nation is now located.

Mhmm.

[RiderSyl]

All of us would be generally better off right now if every member of the New Pacific Order was born into a life where they could have never accessed the internet.

[Frattastan II]

All of us would be generally better off right now if every member of the New Pacific Order was born into a life where they could have never accessed the internet.

Trust me, not just them.

[Lazmac]

When I called bullshit on his lack of knowledge due to a very recent incident where Osiris closed relations with Ainur over 94 Block's presence, during which time we had an identical discussion, I recieved this reply;

<Cormac> I'll take that as a no and proceed with my original plan to ignore you due to your absolute and total irrelevance.
<Cormac> Tell Unknown I hope it's enjoying its prolonged nap.

I congratulate the New Pacific Order for not backing down against moral outrage from hypocrites- the continued Stujenske-lead government in Lazarus has my endorsement and support.

Blah, blah, blah. Out of context quote is out of context, and you know it.

Speaking of forum destruction, will the Lazarus forum maintained by Senator Feux be turned back on at some point, or will it remain permanently inaccessible to the community in violation of the COPS treaty?

[Soled]

Well, i guess nothing last forever after all. This has happened so many times before that i'm surprised this has gotten beyond the first page.

[Pergamon]

You will be surprised even more. That's a promise.

[Drop Your Pants]

You will be surprised even more. That's a promise.

Doubt it. I'm expecting a mass ejection with a TRR grab followed by a power struggle in Laz. Then next month we'll have forgotten.

[Frattastan II]

This is perfectly in keeping with Francoism.

At the heart of Francoism is the class struggle between Feederites and Userites. The only way to empower the Feederites is through perpetual revolution. First, though, there must be class consciousness. Userites are everywhere and if regions are not conscious of the struggle before them, Userites will infiltrate every level of society and bend it to their will. When a government fails to keep the revolution alive, they have failed the people and instantly obliterate whatever mandate they may have believed they had. When that happens the Feederite class must rise against them and that's what's happened in Lazarus. There is a new vanguard party to defend the revolution and the Feederite class.

Francoism was invented as an after-the-fact justification for FS's takeover of The Pacific and his and his successors' illiberal policies (autocracy, purges, strict endorsement caps). Feederites and Userites are generic labels that can be easily bent by those in charge and conveniently applied, respectively, on your allies and your opponents: they don't describe clearly defined categories of people and aren't rooted in a materialist framework, but are products of a propaganda machine. Userites aren't, as many who are new to Francoism often misunderstand, people loyal to user-created regions first, but anyone who "seeks to exploit feeders for their own gain" - that could be a selfish couper... or a small, closed group which seeks to reinforce its grip on power, expand its influence abroad, even pursue an empire-building policy.

Francoism at heart has never been about original "class analysis", or Feederites and Userites struggle, or actual ideas in fact.
It's the ideology of justifying your power and any actions one wants to pursue. And that's all there is to it.

[Klaus Devestatorie]

When I called bullshit on his lack of knowledge due to a very recent incident where Osiris closed relations with Ainur over 94 Block's presence, during which time we had an identical discussion, I recieved this reply;



I congratulate the New Pacific Order for not backing down against moral outrage from hypocrites- the continued Stujenske-lead government in Lazarus has my endorsement and support.

Blah, blah, blah. Out of context quote is out of context, and you know it.

Speaking of forum destruction, will the Lazarus forum maintained by Senator Feux be turned back on at some point, or will it remain permanently inaccessible to the community in violation of the COPS treaty?

The quote is well within context and I've got the logs to prove it.

Turning off the w11/Lazarus/ forums is a grey area- COPS is too poorly written to rule definitively on the matter without an answer to the question of who the real Lazarene government is, and the Zetaboards terms of use are friendly to Feux, not you.

[Todd McCloud]

I question the application of Francoism as it relates to this day and age where there exists multiple individuals in the feeder and sinker settings that also identify as userites. The lines have been blended quite a bit, especially after the inclusion of Osiris and Balder. Furthermore, this application is incorrect based on the definitions outlined in Proper Francoist Thought:

The two classes recognised by Francoist Thought are the Feederites, who are the nations of their respective Pacific and seek to harness and work with the means of production (namely the Pacific region itself), and the Userites, who seek to exploit its fruits; by exploiting both the nations of the Pacific and the political structure set up within it to further their own political, military and social power.

"Feederites" and "Userites" can be readily identified as "locals" and "foreigners" under certain circumstances. I'm not arguing semantics; that's essentially the argument laid out by Unlimited. If we read along further, the definitions become clearer:

Userite regions infiltrate and infect the Pacific, corrupting Feederites into puppets to the point that the Pacific is nothing on its own, with no power or will of its own; becoming a slave to the Userite region it entered into contact with the contrary intention of furthering its own power and influence.

Replace "Userite" with "NPO" and "Pacific" with "Lazarus" and you have a complete fit. This fit is identified by both the NPO and the opposition - there can be no argument against that. Lazarus is no longer its own under the NPO. They don't even have their own forums anymore. They're just a puppet or a slave to the NPO. And, based on path The Pacific has taken since PFT, I don't believe even the majority of the locals would be okay with it.

Essentially, the NPO has become their own enemy in this instance. They have become the "Userites" they sought to fight. Which is weird, because while I ignored Francoism throughout my tenures as delegate and continue to support my own brand of -ism, Toddism from The Necessity of Chaos (it's totally a thing), I'm concerned because I can see it, others can see it, and unfortunately many on the other side either can't or simply choose not to.

[Nephmir]

Congrats to the NPO! May you reign over Lazarus for several years to come!

[Lazmac]

The quote is well within context and I've got the logs to prove it.

I have logs too. You're failing to mention that I repeatedly asked you for the identity and region of a forum destroyer you were insisting I was a hypocrite for not treating the same way as 94 Block, despite me not knowing who the person even is, and you never did actually tell me. And so finally I dismissed you because the conversation was completely asinine.

That was the context, and no, it isn't in the snippet you posted.

Turning off the w11/Lazarus/ forums is a grey area- COPS is too poorly written to rule definitively on the matter without an answer to the question of who the real Lazarene government is, and the Zetaboards terms of use are friendly to Feux, not you.

There is no substantive difference, in terms of depriving a community of its history and informational records, between deleting a forum and taking it permanently offline. That the information still exists on an offline forum does little good for anyone but the root administrator, because they don't have access to it.

I'm not talking about the Zetaboards terms of use, those aren't the standard for NationStates cases of forum destruction. I do find it interesting how you were once such a great crusader against forum destruction, but now choose to defend it when it strikes your fancy, and then call me a hypocrite. Hi, Pot, how are you today? I'm Kettle! I'm black, you say? Why, so are you sir!

[Frattastan II]

Essentially, the NPO has become their own enemy in this instance. They have become the "Userites" they sought to fight.

NPO invented "Proper Francoist Thought" and will do what they want with it. Its words were never meant to describe anything meaningful.
Under Francoism, this situation could be argued in either way ("Feederites are an interregional class! The New Pacific Order is the realization of world feederite power and isn't limited to one region!" v. "A small clique took over an entire sinker to exploit it to increase their power and influence! Userite!"). That should be enough evidence to disprove the idea that Francoism ever amounted to anything more than propaganda.

[Punk Daddy]

That's a scary thought for the rest of us.

It should be particularly scary for The West Pacific, where Senator Elegarth's WA nation is now located.

I have raised concerns in TWP about TP members in high places in TWP. Senator Elegarth was offended by such statements.

If I offend the Senator and my comments are untrue that's far lesser than not making the statement and it turns out she was sent to TWP to further the NPO's hold on GCR's.

To me, GCR's need to reconsider any alliance they have with the NPO. Look, I'm an imperialist and believe in imperialism, but I'm not an adherent to the NPO or Francoist thought in any manner. Thus, NPO imperialism is not something I wish to see takeover the GCRs. But this is a new day and from AMOMs first post it seems like the NPO is ready (and nearly capable) to make attempts at "spreading NPO virtues" across the GCRs.

If that makes you feel warm and fuzzy let's do nothing. If it doesn't, maybe we need to rally.