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by Lolz and Civfive » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:32 am
by Separatist Peoples » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:44 am
Zakuvia wrote:"After deliberation in the Senate, I am announcing that the Empire will not support the WHAMMO legislation. While we understand the gesture of environmentalism, and in full recognition that this will put us on the side of those forces profiteering from the planet's destruction, we cannot in good faith support half-measures. No amount of tokens, credits, transferable or otherwise, will restore lost wetlands ruined by industrial encroachment and pollution. All the 'best practices' in the world mean nothing if all it takes to circumvent them is a meaningless 'sin tax'. Though this vote is largely ceremonial, considering the overwhelming support it already has, even within the DSA, the Empire must stand firm in its convictions."
- Legate Alrig Durmer
Tarsonis wrote:.Separatist Peoples wrote:
"You pay money based on the environmental value of the wetland for impacts that are unavoidable. That money goes back to WAMMO to fund it. This serves as an economic incentive to use less invasive methods while also funding conservation efforts."
"So,..is it a tax?...or a fine?
My only issue that it's not very clear how this is supposed to operate. Do we basically buy the rights to fill in a bayou?"
Lolz and Civfive wrote:In a thick country accent, the ambassador speaks: "I don't need sum govahment body tellin' mah nation 'ow to control its envahroment".
by Aclion » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:55 am
by Separatist Peoples » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:58 am
Aclion wrote:To be clear, WHAMMO is not an international police force, despite the enforce clause, correct?
by Separatist Peoples » Sun Nov 05, 2017 12:43 pm
Ransium wrote:Big money... no whammies... STOP!
Anyway, surprising no one, we have voted for. Long live mangroves!
by Tarsonis » Sun Nov 05, 2017 4:09 pm
Separatist Peoples wrote:Zakuvia wrote:"After deliberation in the Senate, I am announcing that the Empire will not support the WHAMMO legislation. While we understand the gesture of environmentalism, and in full recognition that this will put us on the side of those forces profiteering from the planet's destruction, we cannot in good faith support half-measures. No amount of tokens, credits, transferable or otherwise, will restore lost wetlands ruined by industrial encroachment and pollution. All the 'best practices' in the world mean nothing if all it takes to circumvent them is a meaningless 'sin tax'. Though this vote is largely ceremonial, considering the overwhelming support it already has, even within the DSA, the Empire must stand firm in its convictions."
- Legate Alrig Durmer
"A full ban on wetland damage will actually cripple industry, ambassador."Tarsonis wrote:.
"So,..is it a tax?...or a fine?
My only issue that it's not very clear how this is supposed to operate. Do we basically buy the rights to fill in a bayou?"
"Sure. Lets call it a fine. I suppose its a bit more like purchasing a permit."Lolz and Civfive wrote:In a thick country accent, the ambassador speaks: "I don't need sum govahment body tellin' mah nation 'ow to control its envahroment".
"The WA is like a post-scarcity society: 'Need' isn't a concern at all!"
by Hill City Dome » Sun Nov 05, 2017 6:54 pm
You probably remember me as Free South Califas, ASCS (cant even remember what that stood for now), and several others. I'm ancom now (was demsoc then syndicalist as FSC).
Loose, mostly informal confederation of a sprawling network of Zones with and without governments. Regional politics range from fascism all the way left to left-wing nihilism, with most of the official government working out of the Diplomatic Zone in WAGA Compliance
by Shwe Tu Colony » Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:37 pm
by Essu Beti » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:40 pm
National News Radio: A large-scale infrastructure project will soon be underway. During this time, for safety reasons, the island will be closed to tourists and foreign news agents. We do expect a minor loss in revenue due to this, but this will be greatly offset by both the long and short-term benefits of the infrastructure project. If your job is negatively impacted by the island closure, please send a letter or verbal message via courier to the Council so that we can add you to the list of beneficiaries of foreign aid.
by The Candy Of Bottles » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:01 pm
Essu Beti wrote:"Against, because this proposal is literally impossible for my nation to follow." says Iksana. "We're one giant swamp. There is no way we can become a self-sufficient nation without some development of that swamp, there's no non-swamp land to construct replacement wetlands on, whether in the vicinity or otherwise, and mitigation credits? We're dependent on WA aid just to not all starve to death, do you really think we can afford mitigation credits?"
by Essu Beti » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:19 pm
National News Radio: A large-scale infrastructure project will soon be underway. During this time, for safety reasons, the island will be closed to tourists and foreign news agents. We do expect a minor loss in revenue due to this, but this will be greatly offset by both the long and short-term benefits of the infrastructure project. If your job is negatively impacted by the island closure, please send a letter or verbal message via courier to the Council so that we can add you to the list of beneficiaries of foreign aid.
by Tinfect » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:28 pm
Essu Beti wrote:((OOC: Man, a Dwarf Fortress nation would be interesting to play. Heck, even just one with Dwarven physics...))
Imperium Central News Network: EMERGENCY ALERT: ALL CITIZENS ARE TO PROCEED TO EVACUATION SITES IMMEDIATELY | EMERGENCY ALERT: ALL FURTHER SUBSPACE SIGNALS AND SYSTEMS ARE TO BE DISABLED IMMEDIATELY | EMERGENCY ALERT: THE FOLLOWING SYSTEMS ARE ACCESS PROHIBITED BY STANDARD/BLACKOUT [Error: Format Unrecognized] | Indomitable Bastard #283
by Separatist Peoples » Mon Nov 06, 2017 4:30 am
Essu Beti wrote:"Against, because this proposal is literally impossible for my nation to follow." says Iksana. "We're one giant swamp. There is no way we can become a self-sufficient nation without some development of that swamp, there's no non-swamp land to construct replacement wetlands on, whether in the vicinity or otherwise, and mitigation credits? We're dependent on WA aid just to not all starve to death, do you really think we can afford mitigation credits?"
by Eldrahar » Mon Nov 06, 2017 5:44 am
by Sierra Lyricalia » Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:38 am
by Sweet Baby Jones » Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:44 am
by Separatist Peoples » Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:45 am
Eldrahar wrote:Still, very greatly opposed to this proposal. Just more bureaucracy! And more taxes! We need less government and more freedom!
All these regulations are getting dreadfully restrictive!
The World Assembly has just become more socialistic lately, and it is getting very depressing.
It's basically a slap in the face of the more conservative and freedom loving nations, and a big hello to the commies who just love controlling others and getting more power. No thanks.
Another thing this proposal doesn't take into account is the level of advancement of the different nations. Many aren't advanced enough to be able to comply with this issue and still maintain a decent economy and society.
They would have to go into debt to be able to do so, or become reliant on other nations.
This greatly harms their potential for growth and their nations freedom. It also refuses to take into account the differences in environments for the varying nations. Some nations have far more wetland than others. This means that these nations will be impacted very unfairly and thus will suffer the most from this proposal. It will prevent them from expanding and growing. While nations with very little to no wetland will be rather unaffected by this proposal.
Only those nations that will be significantly impacted by this bill should really get a say.
Not those who just wish to force some self-righteous proposal down their throats and tell them they will do so or be fined for it.
by Essu Beti » Mon Nov 06, 2017 7:24 am
Separatist Peoples wrote:"Sweet, so when you resign to prevent the death of your society, dibs on your office!"
National News Radio: A large-scale infrastructure project will soon be underway. During this time, for safety reasons, the island will be closed to tourists and foreign news agents. We do expect a minor loss in revenue due to this, but this will be greatly offset by both the long and short-term benefits of the infrastructure project. If your job is negatively impacted by the island closure, please send a letter or verbal message via courier to the Council so that we can add you to the list of beneficiaries of foreign aid.
by Eldrahar » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:22 am
by Shwe Tu Colony » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:31 am
The Candy Of Bottles wrote:Essu Beti wrote:"Against, because this proposal is literally impossible for my nation to follow." says Iksana. "We're one giant swamp. There is no way we can become a self-sufficient nation without some development of that swamp, there's no non-swamp land to construct replacement wetlands on, whether in the vicinity or otherwise, and mitigation credits? We're dependent on WA aid just to not all starve to death, do you really think we can afford mitigation credits?"
Tislam simply rolls his eyes at this. "Have you tried putting things underground?" A quick toss supplies Iksana with a set of plans to penetrate the inevitable aquifer with. "Stilts might help too."
by Imperium Anglorum » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:28 am
Essu Beti wrote:Also if we ever resign, when we become self-sufficient, I'm auctioning that sucker off. It's a real prize of an office."
by Essu Beti » Mon Nov 06, 2017 9:53 am
Imperium Anglorum wrote:You can't auction off something that isn't yours.
National News Radio: A large-scale infrastructure project will soon be underway. During this time, for safety reasons, the island will be closed to tourists and foreign news agents. We do expect a minor loss in revenue due to this, but this will be greatly offset by both the long and short-term benefits of the infrastructure project. If your job is negatively impacted by the island closure, please send a letter or verbal message via courier to the Council so that we can add you to the list of beneficiaries of foreign aid.
by Separatist Peoples » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:11 am
Eldrahar wrote:Seperatist People, given it is your proposal, I don't expect you to be logical about it all. You'd defend it to your last breath.
No matter how horrible of an idea it is. Which it is. My problem is with the whole damned proposal. Not just part of it.
It is a big mess of rules, regulations, restrictions, and just adds more bureaucracy and taxes.
Especially for those who don't wish to comply.
Well, my nation will ignore this nonsense like everything else we disagree with.
And no amount of sanctions will make a difference.
Besides, trying to force us will simply harm the environment you claim to wish to protect, so good luck there.
by Tarsonis » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:14 am
by Eldrahar » Mon Nov 06, 2017 10:23 am
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