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[PASSED] Wetland Protection Protocol

A carefully preserved record of the most notable World Assembly debates.

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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Thu Feb 09, 2017 4:52 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:That's like suing a party for killing the last white rhino: once the defensive mechanism kicks in, it's too late to save the rhino.

PARSONS: The rhino, then, was better off dead. However it is, we think that people have an obligation to destroy the environment anyway. The environment is the primary killer of humans. All parts of the environment should be replaced with something that humans directly control.


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Separatist Peoples wrote:"Clean water is always in general demand. There is no market demand because nature supplies it for free at the moment.

PARSONS: That isn't the case. The reason people built sewers, water purification plants, and other things are because there is a demand for them. While in many nations, these are municipal utilities, they do not necessarily have to be so. And if your city is itself a corporation, then that isn't a problem either. In the United Commonwealth, the government of London, excepting those under the direct administration of Parliament, is run entirely by the corporate body of the City of London.[/quote]
"You've listed two very narrow interests in clean water. It is not just for direct human use. Indirect uses abound, such as water clean enough to be used safely for agriculture and animal husbandry and for maintaining valuable wild animal populations. Wetlands filter and replenish water for underground aquifers, a far more reliable form of water storage than installing great tanks everywhere. They're cheaper than dams and dykes for flood prevention, too.

"Let's not forget the recreational and aesthetic value that wetlands indirectly provide. There is, after all,recreational and aesthetic value in nature, and wetlands are systems that many upland temperate and subtropical habitats rely on, for species diversity, water supply, and about a million other reasons. Depletion of wetlands would harm the aesthetics of other natural areas, which would, in turn, harm ecotourism value, recreational enjoyment of nature, and would, perhaps most tragically, deprive future generations of their beauty."

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United States of Osea
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Postby United States of Osea » Thu Feb 09, 2017 4:58 pm

United States Of Osea will build a habitat similar to that of the wetlands and house a portion of its representative species. US department of state favours the legislation.

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Imperium Anglorum
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Postby Imperium Anglorum » Thu Feb 09, 2017 5:53 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:deprive future generations of their beauty."

PARSONS: They aren't pretty. They are swamps which ought be paved over and replaced with monuments to our glory. Those monuments are pretty, and much improved. Slaughterhouses are prettier than wetlands.

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Wallenburg
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Postby Wallenburg » Thu Feb 09, 2017 7:42 pm

Imperium Anglorum wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:deprive future generations of their beauty."

PARSONS: They aren't pretty. They are swamps which ought be paved over and replaced with monuments to our glory. Those monuments are pretty, and much improved. Slaughterhouses are prettier than wetlands.

"The Martin River Delta in northern Wallenburg is actually rather beautiful, especially in late spring. I've gone fishing there several times. Covering them with rough concrete and garish statements of power would take away from its beauty. Not to mention how needlessly expensive that would be."
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States of Glory WA Office
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Postby States of Glory WA Office » Sat Feb 11, 2017 8:34 pm

Fairburn: Perhaps I haven't drank enough coffee, but what on Earth are mitigation credits and what does Clause 1c require us to do?

Barbera: In addition to Ambassador Fairburn's points, in what way is the problem of wetlands an international issue?
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:49 pm

States of Glory WA Office wrote:Fairburn: Perhaps I haven't drank enough coffee, but what on Earth are mitigation credits and what does Clause 1c require us to do?

Barbera: In addition to Ambassador Fairburn's points, in what way is the problem of wetlands an international issue?


"Mitigation credits are, essentially, a tax on development of wetlands. You have the following options when developing wetlands: Putting them back the way you found it, mitigating for them elsewhere by building new wetlands, or purchasing the credits, which are independently assessed in value based on a number of factors so nations can't just drop the price to $2 per acre. The WA would assess the monetary value of an acre of wetland based on the surrounding area and region, as well as the biological characteristics."

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States of Glory WA Office
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Postby States of Glory WA Office » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:43 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:
States of Glory WA Office wrote:Fairburn: Perhaps I haven't drank enough coffee, but what on Earth are mitigation credits and what does Clause 1c require us to do?

Barbera: In addition to Ambassador Fairburn's points, in what way is the problem of wetlands an international issue?


"Mitigation credits are, essentially, a tax on development of wetlands. You have the following options when developing wetlands: Putting them back the way you found it, mitigating for them elsewhere by building new wetlands, or purchasing the credits, which are independently assessed in value based on a number of factors so nations can't just drop the price to $2 per acre. The WA would assess the monetary value of an acre of wetland based on the surrounding area and region, as well as the biological characteristics."

Fairburn: That does indeed clear things up, but that sounds like a whole lot of excessive micromanagement to me.

Barbera: It actually makes perfect sense. Most countries are not going to be willing to go through the bureaucratic procedure of purchasing mitigation credits, so they would be more likely either to restore wetlands to their previous state or to construct new wetlands.

Harold: Why don't we just saturate cream pies with water and use them as wetlands? Anywho, while I understand that some degree of technical language is required, perhaps the vocabulary ought to be made more accessible?

Fairburn: It's not going to make a difference. Most Ambassadors are going to vote based solely on the title anyway. My obviously superior suggestion would be to come up with a more feelgood title instead.
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The Atlae Isles
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Postby The Atlae Isles » Mon Feb 13, 2017 11:50 am

"By 'development of wetlands,' if you built a sky-bridge above the wetlands, or any form of infrastructure above the wetlands, would it be taxed by the credits? It seems unclear."
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:55 pm

The Atlae Isles wrote:"By 'development of wetlands,' if you built a sky-bridge above the wetlands, or any form of infrastructure above the wetlands, would it be taxed by the credits? It seems unclear."


"Would that impact the wetland? No, the very point of such a construct is to avoid impact. That wouldn't count, provided the bridge didn't cover so much space that blocking sunlight would affect the fauna. That would have to be a mighty large bridge, though."

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States of Glory WA Office
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Postby States of Glory WA Office » Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:59 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:
The Atlae Isles wrote:"By 'development of wetlands,' if you built a sky-bridge above the wetlands, or any form of infrastructure above the wetlands, would it be taxed by the credits? It seems unclear."


"Would that impact the wetland? No, the very point of such a construct is to avoid impact. That wouldn't count, provided the bridge didn't cover so much space that blocking sunlight would affect the fauna. That would have to be a mighty large bridge, though."

Fairburn: Any national leader who endeavours to build such a large bridge must obviously be compensating for something.

Harold: Ooh! Let me guess! Is it a lack of cream pies?

Fairburn: (facepalms)
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Sierra Lyricalia
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Postby Sierra Lyricalia » Mon Feb 13, 2017 6:23 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:
The Atlae Isles wrote:"By 'development of wetlands,' if you built a sky-bridge above the wetlands, or any form of infrastructure above the wetlands, would it be taxed by the credits? It seems unclear."


"Would that impact the wetland? No, the very point of such a construct is to avoid impact. That wouldn't count, provided the bridge didn't cover so much space that blocking sunlight would affect the fauna. That would have to be a mighty large bridge, though."


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"Just what," he declaims, "in the suppurating heck is a 'sky-bridge,' Ambassador? Is it held in place by sky-hooks? There will absolutely be some impact to the wetlands; it's simply a matter of how much. If we're talking about a footbridge, built on simple pilings, very well to your blanket 'no impact' assessed. For a highway bypass, massive concrete and steel supports and noise pollution and re-routing of waterways, that is a whole different kettle of dead fish."

"Just so we are all clear. And for heaven's sake, define your terms next time! 'Sky-bridge!' My great aunt Millie played Sky Bridge on dirigible flights! She wasn't subject to mitigation credits, but your cockamamie megastructure possibly would be. Clarity above all, sir! It makes the world almost tolerable."
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Wed Aug 16, 2017 2:24 pm

OOC: Bump

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States of Glory WA Office
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Postby States of Glory WA Office » Wed Aug 16, 2017 2:46 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:
Defining wetlands as terrestrial habitats whose biological and physical properties are characterized by the regular saturation of water during the growing season, and show evidence of hydrology, hydric soils, and hydrophytic vegetation;

Neville: We're being told that hydrology is the study of geography in regards to water. Wouldn't the presence of hydric soils and hydrophytic plants be enough to qualify a location as a wetland?

Separatist Peoples wrote:
3. Requires member states to utilize at least one of the following mitigation methods:
a. Restoration of a wetland to its pre-construction quality and characteristics;
b. Construction of a new wetland of equal quality in the vicinity to offset impact;
c. Purchase mitigation credits from WHAMMO;

Neville: Shouldn't Clause 3c be 'purchase of mitigation credits'? Also, shouldn't there be a 'the' before 'WHAMMO'?
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Wed Aug 16, 2017 3:25 pm

States of Glory WA Office wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:
Defining wetlands as terrestrial habitats whose biological and physical properties are characterized by the regular saturation of water during the growing season, and show evidence of hydrology, hydric soils, and hydrophytic vegetation;

Neville: We're being told that hydrology is the study of geography in regards to water. Wouldn't the presence of hydric soils and hydrophytic plants be enough to qualify a location as a wetland?


"Not always. Disturbed soils from natural events or the presence of deep aquifers sustaining hydrophytic plants without an actual wetland habitat forming are possibilities."

OOC: This happened to me once with a patch of sycamore, which are sufficiently hydrophytic to indicate proper vegetation, and soils dark enough to meet the hydric requirements. There was no water anywhere near it, and the underbrush was mostly upland. The geology guys proved us right: There was a subsurface flow that sustained the wetter trees without the scrub and herbaceous plants reaching it. It was, for a few years, wet enough for the sycamores to catch root, but then the surface dried out. Not a wetland.

Separatist Peoples wrote:
3. Requires member states to utilize at least one of the following mitigation methods:
a. Restoration of a wetland to its pre-construction quality and characteristics;
b. Construction of a new wetland of equal quality in the vicinity to offset impact;
c. Purchase mitigation credits from WHAMMO;

Neville: Shouldn't Clause 3c be 'purchase of mitigation credits'? Also, shouldn't there be a 'the' before 'WHAMMO'?

"I see there's a bit of a grammatical agreement issue..."

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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:24 pm

"Ok, who still hates this?"

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The Bible Baptist Republic
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Postby The Bible Baptist Republic » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:34 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:"Ok, who still hates this?"



The Bible Baptist Republic supports this resolution but WHAMMO makes me think I'm being sold a cheap plastic kitchen gadget at two AM :)
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:36 pm

The Bible Baptist Republic wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:"Ok, who still hates this?"



The Bible Baptist Republic supports this resolution but WHAMMO makes me think I'm being sold a cheap plastic kitchen gadget at two AM :)

"Perfect. That's what I want to hear."

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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Wed Oct 11, 2017 11:53 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:OOC: Bump

OOC: Ha! Poking campaign for the win once again! :lol:

I'll get you proper feedback a bit later. :)
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The Bible Baptist Republic
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Postby The Bible Baptist Republic » Thu Oct 12, 2017 4:04 am

Separatist Peoples wrote:
The Bible Baptist Republic wrote:

The Bible Baptist Republic supports this resolution but WHAMMO makes me think I'm being sold a cheap plastic kitchen gadget at two AM :)

"Perfect. That's what I want to hear."


Minor point, Mr. Ambassador. On a second reading, I noticed: "6. Obligates member states require projects to include pre-construction environmental" I think you are missing the preposition "to" between "states" and "require".

As a major exporter of agricultural products, The Bible Baptist Republic strongly supports this legislation. We are extremely concerned about wetlands preservation as one of the effects of the destruction of wetlands is the changing of migratory patterns of birds which are a natural form of pest control. The end result being the increased use of toxic pesticides which themselves lead to new ecological problems.
Last edited by The Bible Baptist Republic on Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:35 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:14 am

OOC: Last call. Any errors? I think the substance has been thoroughly covered.

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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:53 am

Separatist Peoples wrote:OOC: Last call. Any errors? I think the substance has been thoroughly covered.

OOC: Is "hydrology" on the list of characteristics just to give you a list of three words starting with "hydr"? Because hydrology is the scientific study of water in its all forms, and even the driest desert would "show evidence of hydrology", whatever that means. It's like saying something showed evidence of biology or chemistry or history.

Also what are "best management practices for research"? Or public demarcation, for that matter (in this case)? Or "wetland feature"?

Is "demands" the best word for clause 5? Why not just "requires"?

Wouldn't "mitigation of impact" (singular instead of plural) be a better wording? Or add a qualifier to the impacts? Also, are you sure you're under the character count?
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:13 pm

Araraukar wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:OOC: Last call. Any errors? I think the substance has been thoroughly covered.

OOC: Is "hydrology" on the list of characteristics just to give you a list of three words starting with "hydr"? Because hydrology is the scientific study of water in its all forms, and even the driest desert would "show evidence of hydrology", whatever that means. It's like saying something showed evidence of biology or chemistry or history.

OOC: Thats the term of art in the industry. You study the hydrological features, such as the presence of water, evidence that it is usually there, or even if there are signs of aquatic creatures like crayfish. It can be as obvious as "hey, theres literally water here" to as subtle as checking the staining on the leaves.
Also what are "best management practices for research"? Or public demarcation, for that matter (in this case)? Or "wetland feature"?

A BMPs are professional procedures that are accepted or prescribed as being correct or most effective. So, BMPs for research are those prescribed as being correct or most effective. Public demarcation was used elsewhere. Its a way of marking wetlands, either physically or on relevant planning maps. Wetland feature can be simplified to Wetland. Thank you for catching that.
Is "demands" the best word for clause 5? Why not just "requires"?

Given the recent kerfluffle about that, I agree.

Wouldn't "mitigation of impact" (singular instead of plural) be a better wording? Or add a qualifier to the impacts? Also, are you sure you're under the character count?

Where?

Also, 3334 characters.
Last edited by Separatist Peoples on Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Araraukar
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Postby Araraukar » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:26 pm

Separatist Peoples wrote:
Wouldn't "mitigation of impact" (singular instead of plural) be a better wording? Or add a qualifier to the impacts?

Where?

OOC: Clause 7.

Also, 3334 characters.

Good. :)

Oh, and aside from trying to find errors/complications as requested, of course supported. ^_^
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Separatist Peoples
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Postby Separatist Peoples » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:31 pm

Araraukar wrote:
Separatist Peoples wrote:Where?

OOC: Clause 7.

Also, 3334 characters.

Good. :)

Oh, and aside from trying to find errors/complications as requested, of course supported. ^_^

OOC: Got it. Much obliged!

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Sanctaria
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Postby Sanctaria » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:33 pm

No obvious issues with this that would cause us to register an objection, Ambassador. We're happy to say we support.
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