[PASSED]: Liberate Nationalist Union

[New Heathera]

Well I still stand by my decision. That whole combat hatred with kindness thing is a load of bologna. If you want to hear my life story on why I think this way, don't hesitate to ask in telegram.

You're shooting yourself in the foot if you think that starting conflicts with other nations or regions is going to help out with world "peace". Think about it. When the WA intervenes in the affairs of others who are capable of solving their problems on their own, we endanger the safety of many civilians as well as employed military personnel by starting conflict. This is not something that I wish to do.

I'm confused by your standpoint. It sounds like you're telling me we should stay out of it and be isolationist. I didn't decide to have my puppet join the WA to stay out of global affairs.

[Greater Tezdrian]

So OMD is standing up for an allied nation, which leads to....? A Second Montreaux Conference dominating the globe?

He is standing up for their terrible crusade, which is the bad thing here

What terrible crusade. There's no terrible crusade here.

[Cerian Quilor]

You don't understand Liberate Resolutions, do you?

All this will do is strike down the Delegate-Imposed Password.

this will NOT involve troops or any kind, in the sense that you are talking about.

I see, well excuse me, I am a bit new at the WA, but I still believe that every region has a right to password protection for security purposes (If no password is required for entry, then anyone can come in and take over again). I also still believe that this hypocrite must not win. OMD is a terrible nation and must be dealt with diplomatically.

....

The region only has a password because the INVADERS put it up.

You can't expect diplomacy when one region's very name expresses hatred for the ideology of the other side.

You're not a hypocrite. You're just nuts.

[Belmaria]

I see, well excuse me, I am a bit new at the WA, but I still believe that every region has a right to password protection for security purposes (If no password is required for entry, then anyone can come in and take over again). I also still believe that this hypocrite must not win. OMD is a terrible nation and must be dealt with diplomatically.

....

The region only has a password because the INVADERS put it up.

You can't expect diplomacy when one region's very name expresses hatred for the ideology of the other side.

You're not a hypocrite. You're just nuts.

If we disable the password, then nations will move back, and so will raiders. When I say diplomacy I mean peaceful resolution of the problem by the two parties involved. I never said I was a hypocrite, I said OMD was. Plus, this is hypocrisy! OMD has performed raiding and now he is being paid back for what he has done! The system just balanced itself out.

[Belmaria]

He is standing up for their terrible crusade, which is the bad thing here

What terrible crusade. There's no terrible crusade here.

The raiding of other regions.

[Belmaria]

You're shooting yourself in the foot if you think that starting conflicts with other nations or regions is going to help out with world "peace". Think about it. When the WA intervenes in the affairs of others who are capable of solving their problems on their own, we endanger the safety of many civilians as well as employed military personnel by starting conflict. This is not something that I wish to do.

I'm confused by your standpoint. It sounds like you're telling me we should stay out of it and be isolationist. I didn't decide to have my puppet join the WA to stay out of global affairs.

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

[Poni]

I'm confused by your standpoint. It sounds like you're telling me we should stay out of it and be isolationist. I didn't decide to have my puppet join the WA to stay out of global affairs.

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

And yet you support this raid? And yet you have gotten involved in a failure attempt to oppose the liberation of the region? And yet you make yourself sound like you're telling others to stay out of affairs and be isolationist? You're just being hypocritical here, and don't lie about it either.

[Pandemicia]

....

The region only has a password because the INVADERS put it up.

You can't expect diplomacy when one region's very name expresses hatred for the ideology of the other side.

You're not a hypocrite. You're just nuts.

If we disable the password, then nations will move back, and so will raiders. When I say diplomacy I mean peaceful resolution of the problem by the two parties involved. I never said I was a hypocrite, I said OMD was. Plus, this is hypocrisy! OMD has performed raiding and now he is being paid back for what he has done! The system just balanced itself out.

How about you try talking to the antifa invaders currently in control of Nationalist Union? See how long it takes before they start calling you a nazi/fascist or nazi/fascist appeaser. Their agenda isn't one of solving problems through diplomacy, their agenda is one of solving problems through military force. In essence, they are not in the "business" of returning regions that they capture.

[Abisburgo]

how can a libertarian-nearly communist roleplaying nation being catalogued as 'Iron fist Consumerists'?

This should tell you something about the contradictions of international politics...

[Glorious Republic of Glory]

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

And yet you support this raid? And yet you have gotten involved in a failure attempt to oppose the liberation of the region? And yet you make yourself sound like you're telling others to stay out of affairs and be isolationist? You're just being hypocritical here, and don't lie about it either.

I don't think he supports the raid, per se, on NU, just that the system balances itself out. OMD has gotten his.

[Spartan Democratic Union]

A. Freedom of speech is very important
B. There is no proof that all of the nations within this region where OOC Nazi's
C. There is no proof that they where just role playing but in my opinion you can only be guilty when there is proof, not the other way around.
D. Every political view should have a platform, if that political view is dangerous we don't need to ban them. An underground political movement is always more dangerous.

Therefore I vote in favor of this liberation.

[Cromarty]

OMD has gotten his.

A region OMD is not in gets griefed and OMD has 'gotten his'?

I'm curious as to how that qualifies as OMG getting 'his'.

[Parti Ouvrier]

I'm confused by your standpoint. It sounds like you're telling me we should stay out of it and be isolationist. I didn't decide to have my puppet join the WA to stay out of global affairs.

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

And that sounds sensible to me.

And yet you support this raid? And yet you have gotten involved in a failure attempt to oppose the liberation of the region? And yet you make yourself sound like you're telling others to stay out of affairs and be isolationist? You're just being hypocritical here, and don't lie about it either.

Strawman!

[Cerian Quilor]

If we disable the password, then nations will move back, and so will raiders. When I say diplomacy I mean peaceful resolution of the problem by the two parties involved. I never said I was a hypocrite, I said OMD was. Plus, this is hypocrisy! OMD has performed raiding and now he is being paid back for what he has done! The system just balanced itself out.

How about you try talking to the antifa invaders currently in control of Nationalist Union? See how long it takes before they start calling you a nazi/fascist or nazi/fascist appeaser. Their agenda isn't one of solving problems through diplomacy, their agenda is one of solving problems through military force. In essence, they are not in the "business" of returning regions that they capture.

I hate to agree with anyone who would use a Confederate Flag as their own, by he's right, here at least.

[Belmaria]

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

And yet you support this raid? And yet you have gotten involved in a failure attempt to oppose the liberation of the region? And yet you make yourself sound like you're telling others to stay out of affairs and be isolationist? You're just being hypocritical here, and don't lie about it either.

I do not support a raid. I think you are mislead about my opinion on this issue.

[Belmaria]

If we disable the password, then nations will move back, and so will raiders. When I say diplomacy I mean peaceful resolution of the problem by the two parties involved. I never said I was a hypocrite, I said OMD was. Plus, this is hypocrisy! OMD has performed raiding and now he is being paid back for what he has done! The system just balanced itself out.

How about you try talking to the antifa invaders currently in control of Nationalist Union? See how long it takes before they start calling you a nazi/fascist or nazi/fascist appeaser. Their agenda isn't one of solving problems through diplomacy, their agenda is one of solving problems through military force. In essence, they are not in the "business" of returning regions that they capture.

I will try, and we'll see how that goes

[Belmaria]

And yet you support this raid? And yet you have gotten involved in a failure attempt to oppose the liberation of the region? And yet you make yourself sound like you're telling others to stay out of affairs and be isolationist? You're just being hypocritical here, and don't lie about it either.

I don't think he supports the raid, per se, on NU, just that the system balances itself out. OMD has gotten his.

Exactly

[Belmaria]

OMD has gotten his.

A region OMD is not in gets griefed and OMD has 'gotten his'?

I'm curious as to how that qualifies as OMG getting 'his'.

Because NU was a Nazi ally that was taken out by Antifa

[Cromarty]

A region OMD is not in gets griefed and OMD has 'gotten his'?

I'm curious as to how that qualifies as OMG getting 'his'.

Because NU was a Nazi ally that was taken out by Antifa

Tell me, did NU have an embassy with Nazi regions? A treaty? Did NU provide aid to those regions in offensive operations?

Can you prove they did?

[Belmaria]

Because NU was a Nazi ally that was taken out by Antifa

Tell me, did NU have an embassy with Nazi regions? A treaty? Did NU provide aid to those regions in offensive operations?

Can you prove they did?

http://www.nationstates.net/page=region ... list_union
Look through the list and you'll find it

[New Heathera]

I'm confused by your standpoint. It sounds like you're telling me we should stay out of it and be isolationist. I didn't decide to have my puppet join the WA to stay out of global affairs.

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

Isolationism is for non-members. I had my puppet join for the very purpose of getting involved, not sitting back and observing.

[Belmaria]

You must understand that the more you do, the more unintended consequences there are. As a governing body we must not continue to stick our noses in other nations' or regions' business! Let them solve it themselves!

Isolationism is for non-members. I had my puppet join for the very purpose of getting involved, not sitting back and observing.

I am not an Isolationist, I am a Non-Interventionist! There is a difference! I promote embassies and diplomatic resolutions but not disabling passwords, because I believe that goes too far. Perhaps we could develop a new way of liberating, maybe by giving a new password only to nations that were in said region before it was taken over. We need something better than what we have, though.

[Ossitania]

The delegation from Belmaria clearly doesn't understand the issue at hand, there's obviously little scope in arguing with them. Even more, their lack of knowledge on the topic has been pointed out to them, yet they obviously have made no attempt to educate themselves.

I must say I am greatly disappointed by some of the delegations who are opposing this liberation purely because of the (alleged) ideology of (some of) its members (maybe). I wonder just how right-wing you have to be before you lose the right to have your region liberated.

EDIT: Fuck it, I'll give it a swing. Belmaria, this is how it works. The password is removed at the request of natives. They move back in and retake the delegacy, sometimes with the help of a defender organisation (it's doubtful that this is going to happen in this case, as things stand at the moment). With the delegacy secured, they can eject raiders before they get the chance to take over again and, if they wish, propose a repeal of the liberation, which would give them the ability to set a password again, if they so choose. This is not a military intervention, we are just giving the natives an opportunity to retake their homeland. If that's interventionism to you, well, I'm sorry, I don't speak crazy talk.

[Belmaria]

The delegation from Belmaria clearly doesn't understand the issue at hand, there's obviously little scope in arguing with them. Even more, their lack of knowledge on the topic has been pointed out to them, yet they obviously have made no attempt to educate themselves.

I must say I am greatly disappointed by some of the delegations who are opposing this liberation purely because of the (alleged) ideology of (some of) its members (maybe). I wonder just how right-wing you have to be before you lose the right to have your region liberated.

EDIT: Fuck it, I'll give it a swing. Belmaria, this is how it works. The password is removed at the request of natives. They move back in and retake the delegacy, sometimes with the help of a defender organisation (it's doubtful that this is going to happen in this case, as things stand at the moment). With the delegacy secured, they can eject raiders before they get the chance to take over again and, if they wish, propose a repeal of the liberation, which would give them the ability to set a password again, if they so choose. This is not a military intervention, we are just giving the natives an opportunity to retake their homeland. If that's interventionism to you, well, I'm sorry, I don't speak crazy talk.

First I must ask that you try to remain peaceful in your language, as a diplomat in reality would not speak like that. Second, I must say that any intervening through the use of force of any kind is intervention. We are using legal force here, which makes this an act of intervention. And just because what I say isn't politically correct doesn't mean that I'm crazy. You liberals are all the same. Promote diversity and tolerance? You do nothing of the sort! If someone is a mere 1% different than you, you'll attack them for it. If anything, you are the crazy one.

[Drop Your Pants]

First I must ask that you try to remain peaceful in your language, as a diplomat in reality would not speak like that.

This is NS, there's no set rules on how to be a diplomat

You liberals are all the same. Promote diversity and tolerance? You do nothing of the sort! If someone is a mere 1% different than you, you'll attack them for it. If anything, you are the crazy one.

I'll refer you to your first point

Nice to see the gap is slowly growing in favour of For.