Illegal Immigration in US: Open Borders & citizenship or no?

[Orsailes]

This topic is specifically talking about America, and illegal immigration in America.

Illegal Immigration in America, is something that is either typically suppressed or "left alone". A lot of undocumented immigrants come from Mexico, around ~52% of illegal immigrants come from Mexico, and a overwhelming majority come from the Americas, that much is fact now. However, is it really that much of a good thing to let all these immigrants in? Would it be right to start cracking down on the border much more than we have now? Or should we let them in and have them get a legal shot at conforming to America with at least citizenship? Do we allow these illegal immigrants to work?

So NSG, what is your opinion? My own opinion is that a open border should be established, much like the American-Canadian border, and allow civilians that attempt to cross into America have chances to reform into citizens.

[Transoxthraxia]

nnnnooooooooooooo

[Orsailes]

nnnnooooooooooooo

Expand.

[Republic of Canador]

They're going to come in either way. Might as well let them in so that they at least have some optimism about new life in America.

Immigration is what made us great.

[Orsailes]

They're going to come in either way. Might as well let them in so that they at least have some optimism about new life in America.

Such as job opportunities and citizenship?

[Kelinfort]

They're going to come in either way. Might as well let them in so that they at least have some optimism about new life in America.

Immigration is what made us great.

^

Freedom of Trade and Freedom of Movement FTW.

[Republic of Canador]

They're going to come in either way. Might as well let them in so that they at least have some optimism about new life in America.

Such as job opportunities and citizenship?

Yes. We need to get rid of immigration quotas.

[Sam Hyde]

Close the borders. Deport the illegals. End birthright citizenship. 1924 quotas.

Henry Ford/Charles Lindbergh 2016.

[Republic of Canador]

Close the borders. Deport the illegals. End birthright citizenship. 1924 quotas.

Henry Ford/Charles Lindbergh 2016.

Because closing the border will work great how exactly?

[Sam Hyde]

Close the borders. Deport the illegals. End birthright citizenship. 1924 quotas.

Henry Ford/Charles Lindbergh 2016.

Because closing the border will work great how exactly?

We had closed borders from 1924 to 1965. Arguably the greatest era in American history.

[Republic of Canador]

Because closing the border will work great how exactly?

We had closed borders from 1924 to 1965. Arguably the greatest era in American history.

No, we didn't

[Mushet]

Because closing the border will work great how exactly?

We had closed borders from 1924 to 1965. Arguably the greatest era in American history.

Well it had a great depression, I'm not sure about the rest of it though.

[Sam Hyde]

We had closed borders from 1924 to 1965. Arguably the greatest era in American history.

No, we didn't

Frontier enforcement was extremely difficult in those days, and indeed, our immigration laws were much stricter. We had specific ethnic provisions to make sure this country stayed white, and indeed, we were a 90% white country until 70s.

And yes, this was the intent. The Founding Fathers themselves stated that only free white people of good moral character good be Americans, which is why we didn't only keep out non-whites, but we had strict limits on anarchists and criminals as well, although enforcement was rather lax when the Italians started pouring in.

[Imperial Esplanade]

Right, well there is an issue with Open Borders and Guaranteed Citizenship. Most of the individuals cross the border illegally may be well-intentioned, others are not-so-good-hearted. Do you know what its' like for those in the Americas south of the Rio Grande? It's pretty miserable for those folks, but opening up the borders might actually cause more harm than good. Consider the fact that Mexico is rampant with drug cartels, and most of Central America isn't all that much better, you might be better off just making the immigration process simpler and less pickier, and the screening process quicker and more effective. Reform immigration to make it much, much easier for the good guys while simultaneously cracking down on border-crossing for those with ill-intent.

[Sam Hyde]

We had closed borders from 1924 to 1965. Arguably the greatest era in American history.

Well it had a great depression, I'm not sure about the rest of it though.

A Depression that affected every country though, so it's not like any other parts of the world were comparatively better in the 30s, except Nazi Germany. Baring that, this depression was sandwiched between two eras of massive economic growth and domestic tranquility.

[Empire of Narnia]

Only if it's open borders for the Canada-US border as well.

[Orsailes]

Only if it's open borders for the Canada-US border as well.

Look up the International Boundary.

[Republic of Canador]

No, we didn't

Frontier enforcement was extremely difficult in those days, and indeed, our immigration laws were much stricter. We had specific ethnic provisions to make sure this country stayed white, and indeed, we were a 90% white country until 70s.

And yes, this was the intent. The Founding Fathers themselves stated that only free white people of good moral character good be Americans, which is why we didn't only keep out non-whites, but we had strict limits on anarchists and criminals as well, although enforcement was rather lax when the Italians started pouring in.

Lebanese people, Greeks, Italians, Slavs from the Balkans, and Jews were especially targeted with these restrictions. When turned away at official ports of entry, they found the illegal Mexican crossing to be a convenient alternative. Worries over these immigrants became so acute that when the US Border Patrol was created, in 1924, its priority target wasn’t Mexicans but Europeans.



Along with them came a growing influx of unauthorized Mexican workers. But these immigrants were largely tolerated, with employers in the Southwest informally recruiting large numbers of Mexicans to work in agriculture. Formal, legal entry was complicated, but crossing the border illegally was relatively simple and largely ignored. Strict controls against Mexicans crossing the border were widely perceived as neither viable nor desirable. As a substitute for European and Asian workers, Mexicans were considered an ideal labor force: flexible, compliant, and temporary—a vital source of labor for agriculture and other sectors of the economy.

Not to mention that the U.S. Government specifically brought in Mexican immigrants during the Bracero program of WWII

[Kyrulia]

If the United States had open borders, it would be a nightmare. In fact, if the United States had been enforcing their immigration laws in the first place there wouldn't be a problem.

[Benuty]

Close the borders. Deport the illegals. End birthright citizenship. 1924 quotas.

Henry Ford/Charles Lindbergh 2016.

So you want to reinforce quotas that were proven to be racist?

[The Alexanderians]

This topic is specifically talking about America, and illegal immigration in America.

Illegal Immigration in America, is something that is either typically suppressed or "left alone". A lot of undocumented immigrants come from Mexico, around ~52% of illegal immigrants come from Mexico, and a overwhelming majority come from the Americas, that much is fact now. However, is it really that much of a good thing to let all these immigrants in? Would it be right to start cracking down on the border much more than we have now? Or should we let them in and have them get a legal shot at conforming to America with at least citizenship? Do we allow these illegal immigrants to work?

So NSG, what is your opinion? My own opinion is that a open border should be established, much like the American-Canadian border, and allow civilians that attempt to cross into America have chances to reform into citizens.

You still need your passport card to get into Canada. Illegal immigration isn't something we should be encouraging BUT things should be easier to get in safely and legally. Refugee status should be given out more willingly and legal immigration should be far simpler to achieve.

[Sam Hyde]

Frontier enforcement was extremely difficult in those days, and indeed, our immigration laws were much stricter. We had specific ethnic provisions to make sure this country stayed white, and indeed, we were a 90% white country until 70s.

And yes, this was the intent. The Founding Fathers themselves stated that only free white people of good moral character good be Americans, which is why we didn't only keep out non-whites, but we had strict limits on anarchists and criminals as well, although enforcement was rather lax when the Italians started pouring in.

Lebanese people, Greeks, Italians, Slavs from the Balkans, and Jews were especially targeted with these restrictions. When turned away at official ports of entry, they found the illegal Mexican crossing to be a convenient alternative. Worries over these immigrants became so acute that when the US Border Patrol was created, in 1924, its priority target wasn’t Mexicans but Europeans.

The amount of illegal immigrants then was much smaller than today. Lebanese, Greeks, and Jews never amounted to more than 5% of the population (and I believe that is put together). Meanwhile Hispanics are 30% of America and we have 11 million illegals.

Along with them came a growing influx of unauthorized Mexican workers. But these immigrants were largely tolerated, with employers in the Southwest informally recruiting large numbers of Mexicans to work in agriculture. Formal, legal entry was complicated, but crossing the border illegally was relatively simple and largely ignored. Strict controls against Mexicans crossing the border were widely perceived as neither viable nor desirable. As a substitute for European and Asian workers, Mexicans were considered an ideal labor force: flexible, compliant, and temporary—a vital source of labor for agriculture and other sectors of the economy.

Not to mention that the U.S. Government specifically brought in Mexican immigrants during the Bracero program of WWII

[Sam Hyde]

Close the borders. Deport the illegals. End birthright citizenship. 1924 quotas.

Henry Ford/Charles Lindbergh 2016.

So you want to reinforce quotas that were proven to be racist?

Yes. That's kind of the point.

[Rio Cana]

Right, well there is an issue with Open Borders and Guaranteed Citizenship. Most of the individuals cross the border illegally may be well-intentioned, others are not-so-good-hearted. Do you know what its' like for those in the Americas south of the Rio Grande? It's pretty miserable for those folks, but opening up the borders might actually cause more harm than good. Consider the fact that Mexico is rampant with drug cartels, and most of Central America isn't all that much better, you might be better off just making the immigration process simpler and less pickier, and the screening process quicker and more effective. Reform immigration to make it much, much easier for the good guys while simultaneously cracking down on border-crossing for those with ill-intent.

Are you sure its all misery for those people in Latin America. Take a look at this short video -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbGQZpdv3eg

[Arkinesia]

The existence of the Rio Grande Borderland nullifies any effort at enforcement of immigration laws, which are just artificial controls levied by the state with minimal to no security benefit whatsoever, anyway. I think my opinion on artificial controls against freedom of movement, personal privacy, or freedom of expression is pretty clear, especially when said controls have no demonstrable benefit.

While I'm fully in support of attempting to collect background data for entry and work permits, I think that should be the be-all, end-all of such application processes, and for the love of Christ, they shouldn't cost $900.

Also, for you small-government types out there—we spend $3 billion annually kicking people out of the US. Just some food for thought.