Should the CIA be disbanded?

[Ostroeuropa]

Prompted by:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline ... ion-tapes/

When graphic photographs of American soldiers abusing detainees at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq surfaced in 2004, they sparked international outrage — and prompted new scrutiny of how the U.S. treats its prisoners.

Even though Abu Ghraib itself wasn’t a CIA-run facility, the agency was worried about the scandal’s ramifications.

That’s because the CIA was in possession of something that was potentially more explosive than the detainee abuse photos: hundreds of hours of videotaped “enhanced interrogations” of two Al Qaeda suspects in CIA detention, that included the use of techniques widely described as torture.

As FRONTLINE details in tonight’s new documentary, Secrets, Politics and Torture, those tapes would never see the light of day. Their destruction was ordered by Jose Rodriguez, then the CIA’s top operations officer.

“I was told, if those videotapes had ever been seen, the reaction around the world would not have been survivable,” Jane Mayer of The New Yorker tells FRONTLINE.

Go inside the CIA’s decision to destroy the tapes — and learn why CIA attorney John Rizzo was so surprised by that choice — in this advance excerpt from tonight’s new FRONTLINE film: ...

Etc, etc.

Coupled with the CIA's dubious history, and it's questionable accomplishments (Can... can anyone think of one that isn't horrifying?)
Has the time come to disband the CIA and form a new intelligence agency from the ground up?

I think that, yeh, probably. The culture and conventions of the CIA seem pretty fucked to be honest.
The tendency to violate the rights of people and to act in secrecy even from their own government makes me think that the CIA should be disbanded in order to safeguard the security of the citizens of the US, as well as it's national defenses, and to ease tensions abroad.
I'm skeptical that with such an entrenched culture of complicity in rights violations that a reform would do enough, and forming a wholly new agency would allow the US to found one in line with modern threats and modern values without baggage from the past.

[Napkiraly]

It probably should be, however it probably wont be.

[Robert Magoo]

Yes, it should be disbanded. There's a need for military intelligence, but that already exists anyway, with or without the CIA.

Should do away with the NSA too while we're at it.

[Jamzmania]

Do you plan to replace the CIA with a new intelligence agency? If so, what would make them different from what we have now? You seem to erroneously believe that the CIA has accomplished nothing else important but torture people, which is ridiculous.

[The Nazi New Order of Wolfenstein]

Ja, es macht Amerika schwach!

[New Frenco Empire]

Maybe reform it to not be so fucked up (or, at least, a bit more subtle in it's affairs).

Disbanded? Nah.

[Napkiraly]

Yes, it should be disbanded. There's a need for military intelligence, but that already exists anyway, with or without the CIA.

Should do away with the NSA too while we're at it.

The CIA does more than military intelligence.

And severely hamper the USA's SIGNIT and cyberdefence capabilities?

[Krasny-Volny]

Every nation needs an intelligence agency, not only to collect intelligence for the state but also to engage in counter-intelligence as necessary to preempt foreign espionage.

If we bin the CIA it'll simply have to be replaced by a similar institution.

[Napkiraly]

Do you plan to replace the CIA with a new intelligence agency? If so, what would make them different from what we have now? You seem to erroneously believe that the CIA has accomplished nothing else important but torture people, which is ridiculous.

I believe it'd be more keep the ones who are less tainted and not in favour of the old way, enforce a certain code of conduct and culture, and greater oversight. Of course that could be done just through reforms and a renaming.

[Robert Magoo]

Yes, it should be disbanded. There's a need for military intelligence, but that already exists anyway, with or without the CIA.

Should do away with the NSA too while we're at it.

The CIA does more than military intelligence.

That's part of the problem.

And severely hamper the USA's SIGNIT and cyberdefence capabilities?

Some of that could easily be brought under military agencies, and the rest, that isn't directly defense related, is unnecessary at best.

[Ostroeuropa]

Do you plan to replace the CIA with a new intelligence agency? If so, what would make them different from what we have now? You seem to erroneously believe that the CIA has accomplished nothing else important but torture people, which is ridiculous.

I believe it'd be more keep the ones who are less tainted and in favour of the old way, enforce a certain code of conduct and culture, and greater oversight. Of course that could be done just through reforms and a renaming.

Pretty much this.
I think the rot may run too deep for reform to be possible though.

[New Frenco Empire]

Do you plan to replace the CIA with a new intelligence agency? If so, what would make them different from what we have now? You seem to erroneously believe that the CIA has accomplished nothing else important but torture people, which is ridiculous.

I believe it'd be more keep the ones who are less tainted and in favour of the old way, enforce a certain code of conduct and culture, and greater oversight. Of course that could be done just through reforms and a renaming.

That's fine, but why rename it? "CIA" gets the point across just fine.

[Camelza]

It should be reformed into a less human-rights-breaching agency, but not disbanded. The US needs an intelligence service in order to function properly in the international stage.

[Jamzmania]

I believe it'd be more keep the ones who are less tainted and in favour of the old way, enforce a certain code of conduct and culture, and greater oversight. Of course that could be done just through reforms and a renaming.

Pretty much this.
I think the rot may run too deep for reform to be possible though.

Then the obvious solution is to disband the CIA, form a new agency, and... probably hire all the same people.

[Robert Magoo]

It should be reformed into a less human-rights-breaching agency, but not disbanded. The US needs an intelligence service in order to function properly in the international stage.

Which it has. The CIA is FAR from the ONLY intelligence agency in the US.

[Jamzmania]

It should be reformed into a less human-rights-breaching agency, but not disbanded. The US needs an intelligence service in order to function properly in the international stage.

Which it has. The CIA is FAR from the ONLY intelligence agency in the US.

It is a very important and central one though.

[Robert Magoo]

Which it has. The CIA is FAR from the ONLY intelligence agency in the US.

It is a very important and central one though.

Is it, though?

It's only existed since 1947. The US got along just fine for 150 years before that without it. The only legitimate need for such an agency (whose very existence is just dying to be abused and turned on the people) is for military intelligence, which existed before that, and will still exist if the CIA is ever disbanded.

JFK knew this. I'm not going to act like a conspiracy nut and claim that the CIA was behind his assassination, but they definitely didn't get along...

[Ostroeuropa]

It is a very important and central one though.

Is it, though?

It's only existed since 1947. The US got along just fine for 150 years before that without it. The only legitimate need for such an agency (whose very existence is just dying to be abused and turned on the people) is for military intelligence, which existed before that, and will still exist if the CIA is ever disbanded.

Do you think domestic terrorism could be handled by military intelligence, or the FBI or something?

[Dooom35796821595]

Yes, you should dismantle the CIA and reorganise it into a better agency. How about the Office of Strategic Services?

[Robert Magoo]

Is it, though?

It's only existed since 1947. The US got along just fine for 150 years before that without it. The only legitimate need for such an agency (whose very existence is just dying to be abused and turned on the people) is for military intelligence, which existed before that, and will still exist if the CIA is ever disbanded.

Do you think domestic terrorism could be handled by military intelligence, or the FBI or something?

Domestic terrorism IS handled by the FBI, and the DHS, etc.

It's not like the US government is a sleek, efficient organization.

[Ostroeuropa]

Do you think domestic terrorism could be handled by military intelligence, or the FBI or something?

Domestic terrorism IS handled by the FBI, and the DHS, etc.

It's not like the US government is a sleek, efficient organization.

*Shrug*
You've convinced me.

[Napkiraly]

It is a very important and central one though.

Is it, though?

It's only existed since 1947. The US got along just fine for 150 years before that without it.

That's because most countries didn't have dedicated, properly organized intelligence agencies until relatively recently. MI6 was only established in 1909 as an example. And before the OSS (which is essentially the CIA's predecessor), it was collected on an ad hoc and not very central manner by the US. Which really wouldn't work very well nowadays.

[Ostroeuropa]

Is it, though?

It's only existed since 1947. The US got along just fine for 150 years before that without it.

That's because most countries didn't have dedicated, properly organized intelligence agencies until relatively recently. MI6 was only established in 1909 as an example. And before the OSS (which is essentially the CIA's predecessor), it was collected on an ad hoc and not very central manner by the US. Which really wouldn't work very well nowadays.

What does the CIA actually do that couldn't be covered by other agencies?

[Camelza]

Which it has. The CIA is FAR from the ONLY intelligence agency in the US.

It is a very important and central one though.

Exactly, outright disbanding the CIA would be a tremendous wound for the US.

[Russels Orbiting Teapot]

We need to send everyone who signed off on torture, and every officer who engaged in it, to prison. Politicians, CIA officials, military officers, everyone.

For once we really do need a witch hunt.