Alternate Vote in Britain

[Norfsex]

Being an American, I really can't how can anyone want to abandon the First Past the Post System.

[Scientific socks]

Normally the first post is more than one line. Care to elaborate

[TheKanadian Federation]

Normally the first post is more than one line. Care to elaborate

And is proof read before posting...

[Beldonia]

Normally the first post is more than one line. Care to elaborate

What he said. This'll get locked if not edited with some detail.

[Sarrowquand]

I'm not sure that AV will change how Britain's political parties operate. Maybe it will though?

I like how the European elections are done and I'd like to see that applied to the national : Maybe there are some good reasons not to have that though, maybe not.

I think that ditching first past the post is only useful if it changes how politicians and political parties operate, maybe that would inject some optimism into the electorate/population.

[Norfsex]

I'm not sure that AV will change how Britain's political parties operate. Maybe it will though?

I like how the European elections are done and I'd like to see that applied to the national : Maybe there are some good reasons not to have that though, maybe not.

I think that ditching first past the post is only useful if it changes how politicians and political parties operate, maybe that would inject some optimism into the electorate/population.

Well, I still think that a Two Party system is infinitely better than a multiple party system that the Alternative Vote System may encourage- it is far better to have to moderate parties that are able to follow through with the promises of their manifesto than to force them to create a coalition with the extreme of their ideology and force them to radicalize against the democratic will of the voters. In addition, I heard it said by several pundits, including Mr Cameron, that it is also unfair in that it allows voters of hopeless fringe parties to have a second vote in comparison with those who have voted for a mainstream party, which is unfair to the voters and undermining our core democratic principle: One man, one vote.

[Forsakia]

I'm not sure that AV will change how Britain's political parties operate. Maybe it will though?

I like how the European elections are done and I'd like to see that applied to the national : Maybe there are some good reasons not to have that though, maybe not.

I think that ditching first past the post is only useful if it changes how politicians and political parties operate, maybe that would inject some optimism into the electorate/population.

Well, I still think that a Two Party system is infinitely better than a multiple party system that the Alternative Vote System may encourage- it is far better to have to moderate parties that are able to follow through with the promises of their manifesto than to force them to create a coalition with the extreme of their ideology and force them to radicalize against the democratic will of the voters. In addition, I heard it said by several pundits, including Mr Cameron, that it is also unfair in that it allows voters of hopeless fringe parties to have a second vote in comparison with those who have voted for a mainstream party, which is unfair to the voters and undermining our core democratic principle: One man, one vote.

So many things wrong here.

AV won't make a major difference to the number of parties. Compare Australia where they've had a form of AV and a two party system for 90 years.

That also takes out the coalition bit and also it's suggested candidates will be more moderate under AV to attract more second preferences from other candidates (that is somewhat disputed).

Those pundits (including Mr Cameron) are wrong, and either being disingenuous or idiots

AV is a what if system. You conditionally indicate where you'd like your vote to go 'if they can win'. So you rank your candidates and then the elimination takes place to work out who can win and what the situation is. And then you all get one vote at the end.

Or you can view it as one vote that transfers from one party to another as the elimination takes place, same deal really, it doesn't remove one man one vote.

Lastly the principle of one man one vote is not really a core principle of British democracy, it was only standardised as such in about 1945.

[St George of England]

In favour of AV. It's interesting to note the Tories, who oppose AV, get 47% of the seats of Parliament despite getting 36% of the vote, same with Labour. How is that fair?

[Rolamec]

I have no idea what this means and in my American ignorance, I'll place a special emphasis on the word "alternative" connect it with "lifestyles" and assume this is about queers. Realizing this is the UK we are talking about, my logic is therefore undeniable.

[Rouge Pioneers]

How come we have to vote on how to vote?

(I can't personally, as I am 14)

[Christmahanikwanzikah]

Being an American, I really can't how can anyone want to abandon the First Past the Post System.

I accidentally verbs.

[The Blood of 999 Goats]

I have no idea what this means and in my American ignorance, I'll place a special emphasis on the word "alternative" connect it with "lifestyles" and assume this is about queers. Realizing this is the UK we are talking about, my logic is therefore undeniable.

I'd vote for you if you came to England

[Whiskey Hill]

I'm not sure that AV will change how Britain's political parties operate. Maybe it will though?

I like how the European elections are done and I'd like to see that applied to the national : Maybe there are some good reasons not to have that though, maybe not.

I think that ditching first past the post is only useful if it changes how politicians and political parties operate, maybe that would inject some optimism into the electorate/population.

Well, I still think that a Two Party system is infinitely better than a multiple party system that the Alternative Vote System may encourage- it is far better to have to moderate parties that are able to follow through with the promises of their manifesto than to force them to create a coalition with the extreme of their ideology and force them to radicalize against the democratic will of the voters. In addition, I heard it said by several pundits, including Mr Cameron, that it is also unfair in that it allows voters of hopeless fringe parties to have a second vote in comparison with those who have voted for a mainstream party, which is unfair to the voters and undermining our core democratic principle: One man, one vote.

First past the post and single member districts also ensure that those "voters of hopeless fringe parties" never get to take part in real democracy, where their voice will be heard in government. Multiple party systems allow them to be heard sometimes, even if it is as minor partners in coalitions. Just because they aren't Democrats or Republicans, or Labour or Conservatives, doesn't mean they shouldn't have a say in the actual governing of the nation once in a while.

[Republicke]

Should follow the Scottish model, I'm not sure why AV is even being talked about tbh.

[Rolamec]

I have no idea what this means and in my American ignorance, I'll place a special emphasis on the word "alternative" connect it with "lifestyles" and assume this is about queers. Realizing this is the UK we are talking about, my logic is therefore undeniable.

I'd vote for you if you came to England

Look out England, London's getting a new PM. But before I become a Brit, I'll have to undergo the British treatment. First, I'll need to start drinking heavily, in order to cause serious damage to my liver. Second, I'll have to avoid the sun at all costs, fortunately enough I did pass a goth at my university, perhaps they could help and tell me how they look so creepy with their pasty complexion. Third, I need to get some crooked, ugly teeth. So bar fights, should do the trick. Fourth, I'll watch as many Sean Connery movies as humanly possible, realizing that yes his accent is Scottish, but I being an American do not realize there is a difference. Finally (and most important of all), I find an unattractive Englishwoman (easy, right? Like picking a needle out of a stack of needles), with crooked teeth, a horrible complexion, and an accent so heavy and thick I'll probably end up murdering her anyhow due to being annoyed shit crazy. Only then, can I become PM.

[Britcan]

I support proportional representation. If 1% of the population supports your policies you should get 1% of the seats.

[Forsakia]

Should follow the Scottish model, I'm not sure why AV is even being talked about tbh.

It's a coalition. The Lib Dems want STV, the Tories want to keep FPTP, this was a compromise deal.

[Forsakia]

Well, I still think that a Two Party system is infinitely better than a multiple party system that the Alternative Vote System may encourage- it is far better to have to moderate parties that are able to follow through with the promises of their manifesto than to force them to create a coalition with the extreme of their ideology and force them to radicalize against the democratic will of the voters. In addition, I heard it said by several pundits, including Mr Cameron, that it is also unfair in that it allows voters of hopeless fringe parties to have a second vote in comparison with those who have voted for a mainstream party, which is unfair to the voters and undermining our core democratic principle: One man, one vote.

First past the post and single member districts also ensure that those "voters of hopeless fringe parties" never get to take part in real democracy, where their voice will be heard in government. Multiple party systems allow them to be heard sometimes, even if it is as minor partners in coalitions. Just because they aren't Democrats or Republicans, or Labour or Conservatives, doesn't mean they shouldn't have a say in the actual governing of the nation once in a while.

Psst, there's a coalition on now.

[Republicke]

I'd vote for you if you came to England

Look out England, London's getting a new PM. But before I become a Brit, I'll have to undergo the British treatment. First, I'll need to start drinking heavily, in order to cause serious damage to my liver. Second, I'll have to avoid the sun at all costs, fortunately enough I did pass a goth at my university, perhaps they could help and tell me how they look so creepy with their pasty complexion. Third, I need to get some crooked, ugly teeth. So bar fights, should do the trick. Fourth, I'll watch as many Sean Connery movies as humanly possible, realizing that yes his accent is Scottish, but I being an American do not realize there is a difference. Finally (and most important of all), I find an unattractive Englishwoman (easy, right? Like picking a needle out of a stack of needles), with crooked teeth, a horrible complexion, and an accent so heavy and thick I'll probably end up murdering her anyhow due to being annoyed shit crazy. Only then, can I become PM.

You missed out the part of gaining citizenship whereby you have to re-enact Zulu. The Queen's just dispatched a cadre of would-be Brits. to Libya, muskets and all. First one to bayonet Gadaffi is declared "Prince of ye Welfare State" and is exempt from Council Tax for life.

[Republicke]

Should follow the Scottish model, I'm not sure why AV is even being talked about tbh.

It's a coalition. The Lib Dems want STV, the Tories want to keep FPTP, this was a compromise deal.

Yeah, but, introducing the Scottish system would take account of that pretty directly, in that it utilizes both FPTP and proportionality.

[The Blood of 999 Goats]

I'd vote for you if you came to England

Look out England, London's getting a new PM. But before I become a Brit, I'll have to undergo the British treatment. First, I'll need to start drinking heavily, in order to cause serious damage to my liver. Second, I'll have to avoid the sun at all costs, fortunately enough I did pass a goth at my university, perhaps they could help and tell me how they look so creepy with their pasty complexion. Third, I need to get some crooked, ugly teeth. So bar fights, should do the trick. Fourth, I'll watch as many Sean Connery movies as humanly possible, realizing that yes his accent is Scottish, but I being an American do not realize there is a difference. Finally (and most important of all), I find an unattractive Englishwoman (easy, right? Like picking a needle out of a stack of needles), with crooked teeth, a horrible complexion, and an accent so heavy and thick I'll probably end up murdering her anyhow due to being annoyed shit crazy. Only then, can I become PM.

To paraphrase the quote in your signature: Being English is easy; It's easier if you're ugly

[Rolamec]

Look out England, London's getting a new PM. But before I become a Brit, I'll have to undergo the British treatment. First, I'll need to start drinking heavily, in order to cause serious damage to my liver. Second, I'll have to avoid the sun at all costs, fortunately enough I did pass a goth at my university, perhaps they could help and tell me how they look so creepy with their pasty complexion. Third, I need to get some crooked, ugly teeth. So bar fights, should do the trick. Fourth, I'll watch as many Sean Connery movies as humanly possible, realizing that yes his accent is Scottish, but I being an American do not realize there is a difference. Finally (and most important of all), I find an unattractive Englishwoman (easy, right? Like picking a needle out of a stack of needles), with crooked teeth, a horrible complexion, and an accent so heavy and thick I'll probably end up murdering her anyhow due to being annoyed shit crazy. Only then, can I become PM.

To paraphrase the quote in your signature: Being English is easy; It's easier if you're ugly

Gordon Brown, Prince Charles, Richard Dawkins- suddenly it all makes senses now.

[The Matthew Islands]

I haven't made my mind up yet, about whether I will vote for it or not, but I don't think it will pass. People are too stupid to be able to work out that you have to number the candidates, when almost half the country can't be bothered to use FPTP.

Plus I also think that there will be a lot of people who will wrongfully vote no to it, in the belief that they are punishing Nick Clegg.

[The Blood of 999 Goats]

To paraphrase the quote in your signature: Being English is easy; It's easier if you're ugly

Gordon Brown, Prince Charles, Richard Dawkins- suddenly it all makes senses now.

Well Mr. Brown is Scottish, but I'll give you the rest

[Rolamec]

Gordon Brown, Prince Charles, Richard Dawkins- suddenly it all makes senses now.

Well Mr. Brown is Scottish, but I'll give you the rest

Again....*cites American ignorance*