Scorinators (OOC Discussion)

[Costa Aluria]

Incredibly rich given my hosting history on this forum.

Thank you for your hosting history, but that does not mean I am wrong. The question remains as do we want a more accurate portrayal of a real life scoring possibility or not? I think it would be quite foolhardy to say that we do not.

[Osarius]

The question remains as do we want a more accurate portrayal of a real life scoring possibility or not? I think it would be quite foolhardy to say that we do not.

Actually, I personally think a better question is "do we need one?"

[Costa Aluria]

Actually, I personally think a better question is "do we need one?"

I suppose that depends on your definition of "need." If by need you mean that we would like realisticly lifelike and accurate scores, then I would say yes.

[Stvoto Latoli]

Actually, I personally think a better question is "do we need one?"

I suppose that depends on your definition of "need." If by need you mean that we would like realisticly lifelike and accurate scores, then I would say yes.

Lifelike and accurate? Well then why stop at offensive and defensive sliders? Let's have sliders for offensive lines and secondaries. Let's have a toggle button to determine if your stadium is a dome or not. Let's have a setting that lets you decide how lenient/strict referees are.

Do you see my point? Where does it stop? The whole reason we call these things "scorinators" is because they generate scores. That's all. The rest is filled in with roleplay, as this is a roleplaying forum. If you can't be bothered to roleplay a score you think is "inaccurate," and need a computer to fill in the blanks for you, go play Madden.

[Albagaria]

I suppose that depends on your definition of "need." If by need you mean that we would like realisticly lifelike and accurate scores, then I would say yes.

Lifelike and accurate? Well then why stop at offensive and defensive sliders? Let's have sliders for offensive lines and secondaries. Let's have a toggle button to determine if your stadium is a dome or not. Let's have a setting that lets you decide how lenient/strict referees are.

Do you see my point? Where does it stop? The whole reason we call these things "scorinators" is because they generate scores. That's all. The rest is filled in with roleplay, as this is a roleplaying forum. If you can't be bothered to roleplay a score you think is "inaccurate," and need a computer to fill in the blanks for you, go play Madden.

Nah, I think scores restrict my roleplaying potential, It should just decide who wins. Same and do it away with style modifiers, too restrictive, my 4-6-0 formation is really fluid and can be defensive and offensive.

[Costa Aluria]

Do you see my point? Where does it stop? The whole reason we call these things "scorinators" is because they generate scores. That's all. The rest is filled in with roleplay, as this is a roleplaying forum. If you can't be bothered to roleplay a score you think is "inaccurate," and need a computer to fill in the blanks for you, go play Madden.

I'll concede that is a fair point. However, an enhanced slider scorinator doesn't necessarily fill in those blanks either; it just gives more variables to have an accurate result. It stands to reason that a team that calls more running plays than passing plays will subsequently struggle more against a team that defends the run better than the pass, as not only the running plays get defended but as also the team has less experience executing passing plays. The inverse is just as true; a team that defends the run better than the pass will generally fare better against a team with a propensity to run the ball. Now, obviously the law of averages comes into play there as well--that is, a team with a propensity to run the ball more than pass is likely to fare better when running the ball, and teams that defend the run better than the pass are certain to concede more yards per carry to a good running team. But that is where the beauty of the scorinator comes in; a program that can generate this differential using algorithms to give a lifelike effect.

As mentioned this is a roleplay forum, so players should have some amount of creativity in discussing results. But I think such a slider could actually give more RP inspiration rather than less. Consider the above examples--a team that runs the ball well setting up against a team that defends the ball really well. If they are both really good at what they do, one team will ultimately come out ahead nonetheless. Having this accentuated in the scorinator might prompt a player to RP things they otherwise might not have. My thought is that is might just be the spark that a team with a bit of writer's block might need to pull together a fun post. At the very least, such a concession in Xkoranate would not detract from roleplay, and very well might enhance it.

[Liventia]

As mentioned this is a roleplay forum, so players should have some amount of creativity in discussing results. But I think such a slider could actually give more RP inspiration rather than less. Consider the above examples--a team that runs the ball well setting up against a team that defends the ball really well. If they are both really good at what they do, one team will ultimately come out ahead nonetheless. Having this accentuated in the scorinator might prompt a player to RP things they otherwise might not have. My thought is that is might just be the spark that a team with a bit of writer's block might need to pull together a fun post. At the very least, such a concession in Xkoranate would not detract from roleplay, and very well might enhance it.

This wouldn't be shown in the scorinator output anyway. There is nothing stopping participants from currently putting all this information you talk about in their rosters where others can see it and use to RP. The argument that actually inputting this into the scorinator would enhance RP fails when you consider that this information is already available when people make it available.

[Kogvuron]

Looking to make some new track events in xkoranate just for my personal use, was wondering if anyone could run me through how to make a new sports file? I thought there was a way but I seem to always mess it up

[Darmen]

Looking to make some new track events in xkoranate just for my personal use, was wondering if anyone could run me through how to make a new sports file? I thought there was a way but I seem to always mess it up

For track events, simply make a copy of one of the existing events, rename the file (as well as changing the name of the event within the file), and then edit the times and their probabilities to your liking.

[Darmen]

When you're fooling around with xkoranate and this happens:

Rotenboden 2598–0 Rouen RFC
Eau Claire Trailfinders -1–0 Tycos RUFC

Tycos RUFC were credited with the win. Fun times.

For those interested, NSFS formula, max skill at .001, with teams imported from a file having skills higher than .001. Question for CH though, is scoring -1 supposed to happen in xkoronate? It's obviously not possible in RL, but this being NS and all... still, I don't think that's supposed to happen.

[Barunia]

When you're fooling around with xkoranate and this happens:

Rotenboden 2598–0 Rouen RFC
Eau Claire Trailfinders -1–0 Tycos RUFC

Tycos RUFC were credited with the win. Fun times.

For those interested, NSFS formula, max skill at .001, with teams imported from a file having skills higher than .001. Question for CH though, is scoring -1 supposed to happen in xkoronate? It's obviously not possible in RL, but this being NS and all... still, I don't think that's supposed to happen.

What aport was it?

[Affiliated South Califan Sprawls]

Guessing rugby union from RUFC. Presumably a custom made sport could allow negative scoring, like in a really dominant defensive play (even more so than a safety in gridiron, presumably).

[Darmen]

Actually it was football, simply imported my rugby teams since I don't have an import file for my football leagues.

[The Royal Barangay]

From this thread earlier...

when I use the command make in the xkoranate folder in linux, it says:

Code: Select all

make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found.  Stop.

You need to run qmake (the build system for Qt applications) to generate the Makefile. Also note that you’ll need to build it with Qt 4, not 5; if you have both installed, you’ll need to run qmake using the full path to the Qt 4 version, wherever it is on your system. If you don’t have qmake on your system, you need to install the Qt 4 development package from your distribution’s package manager.

This really isn’t a general sports roleplaying question, though, so if you have any further questions, take them to the Scorinators (OOC Discussion) thread.

How do I make a Makefile from the xkoranate folder using qmake? I have already Qt 4 on my system.

[Ndaku]

My computer does not trust a file named "W.S. Resolution" and removed the XKoranate application. Here is a link showing the detailed report: http://www.symantec.com/security_respon ... os=windows

What should I do?

[95X]

My computer does not trust a file named "W.S. Resolution" and removed the XKoranate application…

What should I do?

In brief, your link says that your antivirus is giving you a false-positive. Nothing is wrong with the file; it's the computer equivalent of the clerk at the grocery store miscounting cash and telling you you're a dollar short.

If you downloaded and unzipped the .zip file from the official download page:
http://www.thirdgeek.com/ns/xkoranate/
You should have nothing to worry about. Commerce Heights, who authors xkoranate, is one of the most respected and trusted names in the NS community. If there was something in xkoranate that shouldn't be, the NS Sports community would know about it by now.

[Ndaku]

My computer does not trust a file named "W.S. Resolution" and removed the XKoranate application…

What should I do?

In brief, your link says that your antivirus is giving you a false-positive. Nothing is wrong with the file; it's the computer equivalent of the clerk at the grocery store miscounting cash and telling you you're a dollar short.

If you downloaded and unzipped the .zip file from the official download page:
http://www.thirdgeek.com/ns/xkoranate/
You should have nothing to worry about. Commerce Heights, who authors xkoranate, is one of the most respected and trusted names in the NS community. If there was something in xkoranate that shouldn't be, the NS Sports community would know about it by now.

Ok, I understand.

So when the zip folder is downloaded, I should not extract all files? Er, what did you do when you downloaded your xkoranate?

[Commerce Heights]

The reputation-based system uses "the wisdom of crowds" (Symantec’s tens of millions of end users) connected to cloud-based intelligence to compute a reputation score for an application, and in the process identify malicious software in an entirely new way beyond traditional signatures and behavior-based detection techniques.

Translation: Symantec has never heard of xkoranate, so they have no idea if it might be a virus.

I noticed they have a form to report false positives, so I filled that out just for the hell of it.

[Ndaku]

The reputation-based system uses "the wisdom of crowds" (Symantec’s tens of millions of end users) connected to cloud-based intelligence to compute a reputation score for an application, and in the process identify malicious software in an entirely new way beyond traditional signatures and behavior-based detection techniques.

Translation: Symantec has never heard of xkoranate, so they have no idea if it might be a virus.

I noticed they have a form to report false positives, so I filled that out just for the hell of it.

I see. Thank you for your patience.

One last quick question: once the folder is downloaded, is it best if I extract all files into folder saved onto my computer?

[Barunia]

Ok, weird stuff is happening on my xkoronate.

This is my Matchday 11 for my league

X-League                 Pld    W   D   L    GF   GA   GD   Pts 
 1 Port Newland Destroyers   11    8   1   2    26   11  +15    25
 2 Babbage Town              11    6   2   3    19   14   +5    20
 3 Edwardton Eagles          11    6   2   3    15   12   +3    20
 4 Tildos Ravens             11    6   1   4    25   22   +3    19
 5 West Bay Mariners         11    5   3   3    17   15   +2    18
 6 Trinity Saints            11    5   3   3    13   12   +1    18
 7 Western Orcas             11    4   3   4    11   11    0    15
 8 Newland FC                11    3   5   3    20   17   +3    14
 9 Northern Tridents         11    4   2   5    13   14   −1    14
10 Monte Sol Warriors        11    2   7   2    16   17   −1    13
11 San Baptiste Sea Lions    11    4   1   6    13   16   −3    13
12 Hillside Wanderers        11    3   3   5    15   14   +1    12
13 Southern Bluebirds        11    3   3   5     9   16   −7    12
14 Albatross FC              11    3   2   6     9   14   −5    11
15 Marion Hawks              11    2   3   6     8   17   −9     9
16 Woodvale Wolves           11    1   5   5    22   29   −7     8

This is perfectly fine. Here's what happens when I score MD12...

X-League                 Pld    W   D   L    GF   GA   GD   Pts 
 1 West Bay Mariners         46   23  14   9    94   66  +28    83
 2 Woodvale Wolves           46   21  12  13   100   87  +13    75
 3 Trinity Saints            46   19  15  12    82   64  +18    72
 4 Port Newland Destroyers   46   22   5  19   104   95   +9    71
 5 Northern Tridents         46   19  12  15   105   98   +7    69
 6 Tildos Ravens             46   19  11  16    83   80   +3    68
 7 Newland FC                46   19   9  18    90   84   +6    66
 8 San Baptiste Sea Lions    46   17  11  18    54   56   −2    62
 9 Babbage Town              46   18   7  21    97  110  −13    61
10 Western Orcas             46   14  18  14    46   46    0    60
11 Marion Hawks              46   17   9  20    60   68   −8    60
12 Monte Sol Warriors        46   15  11  20    98  102   −4    56
13 Delmars FC                45   14  13  18    51   61  −10    55
14 Edwardton Eagles          46   12  15  19    74   92  −18    51
15 Porthaven United          45   13  11  21    83   96  −13    50
16 Sheppardton Sharks        45   10  17  18    90  103  −13    47
17 Southern Bluebirds         1    1   0   0     1    0   +1     3
18 Albatross FC               1    0   0   1     0    1   −1     0
19 Hillside Wanderers         1    0   0   1     2    5   −3     0

I scored these games in batches - MD's 1-11 were scored earlier than MD's 12-22. MD's 13-22 build on from MD 12, but are adding their scores into the screwed up table.

From what I can gather, this looks like the final results from last season, with an extra game. The three teams that played 1 game were promoted to this league at the end of that season.

I would resim, but I do not want to lose my MD 11 results. Any suggestions?

[Recuecn]

So I just downloaded xkoronate today and unlike NSFS3, the results seem only to be available 1 matchday at a time. In other words, to in order to get the results for the entire season in one document, for, say, a post in the International Domestic Soccer Newswires, I'd have to copy the results from each match-day individually and paste them all into one document. Even when I export the results, the resulting document contains only one matchday. Is this just me not seeing an obvious solution, or is there actually no work around?

While I'm at it, I'd really like to be able to import style modifiers and not have to type them in manually. I assume this is impossible, but I don't want to give up hope quite yet. The same thing is true of the groups--it's a pain to have to move every team into the correct league myself. Do most people just scorinate different tiers separately?

Thanks in advance!

[95X]

One last quick question: once the folder is downloaded, is it best if I extract all files into folder saved onto my computer?

Yes, xkoranate needs all the files extracted.

So I just downloaded xkoronate today and unlike NSFS3, the results seem only to be available 1 matchday at a time. In other words, to in order to get the results for the entire season in one document, for, say, a post in the International Domestic Soccer Newswires, I'd have to copy the results from each match-day individually and paste them all into one document.

Yes. When I run my top-level league, I have Windows Notepad open and copy everything over. In fact, I do my entire post, bbcode and all, in Notepad, which means I have a local backup for those posts in case something happens with the forums or I'm needing the information offline. This also gives me time to review the results as a final human-level "sanity check." No, it doesn't mean Xi Foureleven wins every week. Even if she'd like to.

While I'm at it, I'd really like to be able to import style modifiers and not have to type them in manually. I assume this is impossible, but I don't want to give up hope quite yet.

A workaround I started is importing them in the "team name" field (assuming you're not using that for something else), since in single-nation domestic leagues this field is unused. Yes, you still need to type the style mod into the correct field, however it's a much less labor-intensive form of data entry as you're just typing what's in the other column.

[Banija]

Ok. This may sound like a dumb question, but I just downloaded NSFS3 and xkoronate. I've been messing around with xkoronate a little, and it seems like you can pretty much only go one match day at a time. Is there a way to do like 5-6 match days all at once?

As for NSFS3. I can find it in my files, but how do I get the program to actually run? It's been driving me insane how to figure that one out

[Yttribia]

Ok. This may sound like a dumb question, but I just downloaded NSFS3 and xkoronate. I've been messing around with xkoronate a little, and it seems like you can pretty much only go one match day at a time. Is there a way to do like 5-6 match days all at once?

As for NSFS3. I can find it in my files, but how do I get the program to actually run? It's been driving me insane how to figure that one out

For the former, you can scroll down to whatever matchday you want to go to (Say MD6), and go straight to that matchday. A prompt will appear asking if you want to score all of those matchdays up to the one you stopped at; hit yes. Do that, and you'll have the first six matchdays generated.

[Stvoto Latoli]

Ok. This may sound like a dumb question, but I just downloaded NSFS3 and xkoronate. I've been messing around with xkoronate a little, and it seems like you can pretty much only go one match day at a time. Is there a way to do like 5-6 match days all at once?

As for NSFS3. I can find it in my files, but how do I get the program to actually run? It's been driving me insane how to figure that one out

For the former, you can scroll down to whatever matchday you want to go to (Say MD6), and go straight to that matchday. A prompt will appear asking if you want to score all of those matchdays up to the one you stopped at; hit yes. Do that, and you'll have the first six matchdays generated.

And for the latter, I do not personally recommend actually using the NSFS3 program. One or two users around here still stick with it, but the NSFS scorination formula is available in xkoranate if you'd like to use it, and there's nothing the NSFS3 application can do that xkoranate can't do better.