Nationstates Olympic Games Discussion Thread

[Liventia]

Probably sometime around the start of 2017. Typically, there's just 1 Winter Olympics and 1 Summer Olympics per RL year.

Why there no more olympics?

Youth Olympics / Paralympics / Special Olympics

The Summer Paralympics were held before the Summer Olympics this year. There are no Youth or Special Olympics on NS, and in any case the NS Olympic Council (specifically, in reality, its President) would have to give its approval for the 'Olympics' name to be used.

As to why there aren't more? BURNOUT. Both for the people taking part/RPing and potential hosts. It's a lot of work.

[Drawkland]

Heh, I would be 7th on the list if all my nations' medals were added up

One time where putting all your eggs in one basket is a good thing

[CoraSpia]

Why there no more olympics?

Youth Olympics / Paralympics / Special Olympics

The Summer Paralympics were held before the Summer Olympics this year. There are no Youth or Special Olympics on NS, and in any case the NS Olympic Council (specifically, in reality, its President) would have to give its approval for the 'Olympics' name to be used.

As to why there aren't more? BURNOUT. Both for the people taking part/RPing and potential hosts. It's a lot of work.

Why would the Olympics council have to give their permission? I thought in general, anyone could claim rl things in NS.

[Vilita and Turori]

The Summer Paralympics were held before the Summer Olympics this year. There are no Youth or Special Olympics on NS, and in any case the NS Olympic Council (specifically, in reality, its President) would have to give its approval for the 'Olympics' name to be used.

As to why there aren't more? BURNOUT. Both for the people taking part/RPing and potential hosts. It's a lot of work.

Why would the Olympics council have to give their permission? I thought in general, anyone could claim rl things in NS.

You can claim things that haven't already been established.

[Liventia]

Why would the Olympics council have to give their permission? I thought in general, anyone could claim rl things in NS.

You can claim things that haven't already been established.

Something like that, which I'm sure Archregimancy can clarify in better detail than I could ever explain.

[Gregoryisgodistan]

Is the NS Olympic Council as protective about people using the term Olympics as the RL IOC? I could see Youth Olympics or Paralympics causing a problem if done without the Council's permission since IRL that's an Olympic event, but IRL the Special Olympics aren't associated with the IOC and simply have an agreement to use the trademark so I'm not sure that would be as much of an issue. And something like Science Olympics certainly shouldn't be an issue if someone were to propose it (Though I don't know if this is the right sub subforum) even though it would be IRL, which is why it's called the Science Olympiad even though that's not what Olympiad means.

[Tobiasia]

Is the NS Olympic Council as protective about people using the term Olympics as the RL IOC? I could see Youth Olympics or Paralympics causing a problem if done without the Council's permission since IRL that's an Olympic event, but IRL the Special Olympics aren't associated with the IOC and simply have an agreement to use the trademark so I'm not sure that would be as much of an issue. And something like Science Olympics certainly shouldn't be an issue if someone were to propose it (Though I don't know if this is the right sub subforum) even though it would be IRL, which is why it's called the Science Olympiad even though that's not what Olympiad means.

The science Olympics was hosted by Irian Barat i beleive

[Liventia]

Is the NS Olympic Council as protective about people using the term Olympics as the RL IOC? I could see Youth Olympics or Paralympics causing a problem if done without the Council's permission since IRL that's an Olympic event, but IRL the Special Olympics aren't associated with the IOC and simply have an agreement to use the trademark

The Youth Olympics would certainly be an issue, for me. The Paralympics has nothing to do with the IOC IRL – it's run by the IPC. Likewise on NS it's got nothing to do with the Olympics. I certainly take your point about the Special Olympics; I think on NS it would depend on how anyone who runs such an event uses the name (e.g. whether they try to claim a link to the NSOC).

[Kelssek]

As I understand the mod ruling in force, you cannot "start" an NS Sports event that's already in existence without some kind of approval from that event's community. This is not just for the Olympics, the same applies to someone starting up "World Cup" or "Cup of Harmony" international football tournaments, for instance. Although there is nothing to stop you starting up an international football tournament or multi-sports event in a different format under a different name, or hosting a regional Olympics on these forums.

[Amuaplye]

Are there people who wants to join the Nation Games 2016? Please let me know whe need more nations! Ore maybe wants to host the next edition of the Nation Games?

I'll join. Link?

[Todd McCloud]

All-Time NS Olympics Medal Table

That took a rather long time, but it's completed to the best of my knowledge.

All numbers are lifted from the final medal counts of all Olympics except for the 3rd Winter Olympics, which was never completed. If there are any inconsistencies or spelling errors, etc, please let me know and I'll get on correcting them.

Thank you for that. Very cool. Just FYI, Astyrian Unified Team and Astyrian Olympics Delegation are the same thing and can probably be combined.

Combined the two teams - if they're one in the same I don't see a reason not to combine them.

[Todd McCloud]

All-Time NS Olympics Medal Table

That took a rather long time, but it's completed to the best of my knowledge.

All numbers are lifted from the final medal counts of all Olympics except for the 3rd Winter Olympics, which was never completed. If there are any inconsistencies or spelling errors, etc, please let me know and I'll get on correcting them.

Liverpool Eng's 4/7/7 should be included in Liventia's total; Liventia is the direct successor nation. The Combined Team should be designated Combined Team (Ad’ihan, Liventia, Tyoduura) or Combined Team (ALT) where possible to distinguish from other combined teams. A footnote would be useful to point out the Liventia Olympic Association officially claims the 12/6/8 from the Independent Athletes of Liventia, despite the NSOC recognising the IAL as a separate historical delegation.

Liverpool Eng combined with Liventia
Combined team is now called Combined Team (Ad’ihan, Liventia, Tyoduura)
I included a footnote to the IA of Liventia, but kept the medal counts separate. Is this correct?

[The Archregimancy]

The Summer Paralympics were held before the Summer Olympics this year. There are no Youth or Special Olympics on NS, and in any case the NS Olympic Council (specifically, in reality, its President) would have to give its approval for the 'Olympics' name to be used.

As to why there aren't more? BURNOUT. Both for the people taking part/RPing and potential hosts. It's a lot of work.

Why would the Olympics council have to give their permission? I thought in general, anyone could claim rl things in NS.

It's against established forum precedent to claim to be the NS equivalent of a RL event where an established NS event already exists. So there can only ever be one NS Olympics and NS World Cup. This can be enforced by the moderation team.

However, there are exceptions and grey areas.

The main exception is that region-specific equivalent tournaments are permitted. So, for example, it would be perfectly legitimate for Esportiva to hold an 'Esportiva Olympics' without asking for permission because it would be clear that this is for Esportiva only, and isn't a competitor to the NS Olympics. In that sense, the problem isn't the term 'Olympics', but rather whether an event replicating the RL Olympics is narrowly restricted to specific participants or is open to everyone.

The status of a hypothetical Youth or Special Olympics is a grey area. If these haven't been held before, and the NSOC has no constitutional or precedent-based claim on either, then I'm not sure that requiring permission from the NSOC - or president thereof - would be enforceable by moderation. The NSOC could attempt to bring any such event under its remit, but this one may be more a matter of protocol than of hard and fast rules as things currently stand (noting that I haven't checked the relevant constitutional documents before typing this).

[Liventia]

The status of a hypothetical Youth or Special Olympics is a grey area. If these haven't been held before, and the NSOC has no constitutional or precedent-based claim on either, then I'm not sure that formal permission from the NSOC - or president thereof - would be formally required. The NSOC could attempt to bring any such event under its remit, but I'm not convinced that this specific example is enforceable by moderation - though it may well be enforceable by the weight of forum culture. Summed up, depending on the NSOC rules, this one may be more a matter of protocol than of hard and fast rules as things currently stand (noting that I haven't checked the relevant constitutional documents before typing this).

What is the status of this prior ruling?

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1067&p=7868365&hilit=youth+olympics#p7868365

[The Archregimancy]

The status of a hypothetical Youth or Special Olympics is a grey area. If these haven't been held before, and the NSOC has no constitutional or precedent-based claim on either, then I'm not sure that formal permission from the NSOC - or president thereof - would be formally required. The NSOC could attempt to bring any such event under its remit, but I'm not convinced that this specific example is enforceable by moderation - though it may well be enforceable by the weight of forum culture. Summed up, depending on the NSOC rules, this one may be more a matter of protocol than of hard and fast rules as things currently stand (noting that I haven't checked the relevant constitutional documents before typing this).

What is the status of this prior ruling?

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic ... s#p7868365

Thanks for reminding us of that. Here's the actual full original 2011 ruling, for reference:

OFFICIAL MODERATOR RULING:

Euskirribakondara is free to run an event called the NS Youth Games where 'youth' (as variously defined by each nation) participate in multi-event winter games where the event list is similar to that of the Olympic Games. I wish him every success in this ambitious venture.

However, in keeping with established moderator protocol regarding the relationship between new and existing events where potential for confusion exists between the two, Euskirribakondara must take action to disassociate the new NS Youth Games from the established NS Olympic Games, as the NS Olympic Committee in no way endorses, or is associated with, the NS Youth Games.

I note that there's been absolutely no discussion of these new Youth Games in the official NationStates Olympics Discussion Thread, despite Euskirribakondara stating that this new competition is in response to the NS Olympics, will draw upon existing national Olympic Committees, and will use the same three letter national codings as used by existing national Olympic Committees.


Euskirribakondara should take the following specific steps:

1) Edit this paragraph (in each thread in which it appears):

This event is born as a response to the Olympic Games, which since 2006 AD represent the biggest sporting competition of the multiverse, gathering together the highest amount of nations possible to create a haven for understanding, competition and fair play. The Youth Games will gather the young athletes from all over the world to show the importance of sport and well being.

So that it no longer mentions the Olympic Games, or in any way implies a link to the established NS Olympic Games.

2) Edit this post: http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic ... 7#p7855417
So that it removes any mention of 'Olympism', 'Olympic Spirit', 'Youth Olympic Movement', or any other phrasing which implies a connection with the existing NS Olympic Games.

3) Edit the 'official charter' (http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?p=7855533#p7855533) so as to remove references to Youth Olympic movement, and most specifically to remove any mention of 'National Olympic Committees' that might imply endorsement by, or association with, the existing NS Olympic movement.

4) Remove this post entirely: http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic ... 7#p7855787
As there is no association between the Olympic Games and the Youth Games, then the official national codes used in the existing NS Olympic Games are irrelevant to the new Youth Games.


Note that the "Youth Games Administrating Committee (YOGAC)" title is perfectly acceptable, and I would urge Euskirribakondara to work with that.


Summed up, a new international sporting event for youth is perfectly acceptable. A national 'Euskirribakondara Olympic Games' would have been perfectly acceptable (as would a regional Olympics for a specific region). A new international sporting event for youth that attempts to connect itself to an established NS sporting competition without the consent or endorsement of that existing competition, and which uses language which strongly implies a connection by extensively duplicating naming terminology, is not acceptable.

I thank everyone for their time and consideration.

This ruling helps demonstrate why the question of 'Youth Olympics' is a grey area. Note that part of the problem here was that Euskirribakondara unilaterally stated that (quoting myself) 'this new competition is in response to the NS Olympics, will draw upon existing national Olympic Committees, and will use the same [trigrammes] as used by existing national Olympic Committees.'

His transgression wasn't therefore solely in using the term 'Olympics', but in directly and explicitly linking his own event to the existing NS Olympics without asking for permission: 'A new international sporting event for youth that attempts to connect itself to an established NS sporting competition without the consent or endorsement of that existing competition, and which uses language which strongly implies a connection by extensively duplicating naming terminology, is not acceptable.

So it wasn't just the use of the word 'Olympic' that was at issue here. What we haven't tested - the remaining grey area - is what happens if someone holds a 'Youth Olympics' that directly and explicitly disclaims any link to the NS Olympics run by the NSOC.

Note that in my elaboration in this very thread of the formal ruling, as linked to by Liventia, I offered some potential discussion points about how to deal with this type of situation, but I'm not sure that either myself or the NSOC ever reached a resolution on those discussion points. If this is a point of concern, it might be useful to revive that discussion.

[Frestovenia]

I have Nation Games created for people to do participate for fun! (For all the people here that wants to make an Olympics just do it!)

[Frestovenia]

As I understand the mod ruling in force, you cannot "start" an NS Sports event that's already in existence without some kind of approval from that event's community. This is not just for the Olympics, the same applies to someone starting up "World Cup" or "Cup of Harmony" international football tournaments, for instance. Although there is nothing to stop you starting up an international football tournament or multi-sports event in a different format under a different name, or hosting a regional Olympics on these forums.

Yes thats good for me to know! Nation Games can continue!!

[The Sarian]

Whilst the event can continue, constantly spamming about it in another event's discussion thread probably shouldn't.

[Schutzenphalia and West Ruhntuhnkuhnland]

Whatever you call it, can you stop posting about it in this thread, which is meant to be for the Olympics only?

[Frestovenia]

Why am spamming? this thread is about the NS olympics oke. But why I don't can talk about other funny events.

[The Licentian Isles]

Why am spamming? this thread is about the NS olympics oke. But why I don't can talk about other funny events.

It's not considered good etiquette to advertise your event in other people's threads. You have your own thread for that.

[Frestovenia]

Why am spamming? this thread is about the NS olympics oke. But why I don't can talk about other funny events.

It's not considered good etiquette to advertise your event in other people's threads. You have your own thread for that.

'Advertise' That are your words.

[The Licentian Isles]

It's not considered good etiquette to advertise your event in other people's threads. You have your own thread for that.

'Advertise' That are your words.

I have Nation Games created for people to do participate for fun! (For all the people here that wants to make an Olympics just do it!)

If this isn't advertising, I'm not sure I know what is.

Since you're fairly new around here, I would advise that this thread would be a pretty good start as to how the NS Sports subforum works. My main advice to you would be not to start a tournament of your own instantly; compete in a few tournaments run by other people, get an idea for how it works, and then start small, certainly not by hosting a multi-sport event of the size of the one you have created, which is a hard task for even the most experienced forum members.

[Britonisea]

It's not considered good etiquette to advertise your event in other people's threads. You have your own thread for that.

'Advertise' That are your words.

Google says...

advertise

ˈadvətʌɪz (pronouncation)

verb

describe or draw attention to (a product, service, or event) in a public medium in order to promote sales or attendance.

I have Nation Games created for people to do participate for fun! (For all the people here that wants to make an Olympics just do it!)

Advertising by promoting your National Games, you want to increase your attendance at the event.

You've been asked to stop, just stop it. The way I see it is that this is the official NationStates Olympic Games, not your Nations Games.

[The Archregimancy]

I have Nation Games created for people to do participate for fun! (For all the people here that wants to make an Olympics just do it!)

Please cease and desist from promoting your 'Nation Games' event here, or you'll be handed with a formal warning for spamming this thread.