The Multi-Species Union [Alliance, Main Page, OOC]

[Stormwrath]

Oh yeah. Too bad it was cloudy over at our place when the eclipse happened.

[Klemantan-Borneo]

Official Communique of the Carlsvad Defence Force

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Subject: Multi-Species Union Peacekeeping Force

Dear MSU Peacekeeping Liasion Officer,

We would like to inform you that we will be adding 5 Air Force Squadron's which consist of one Long-Range Transport Squadron, two Aircraft Transport Squadron and two Helicopter Aircraft Transport Squadron, in which the total personnel will be 1,500. Also, we will include a company of Military Police which consists of 150 personnel. In total, the extra personnel is 1,550 personnel.

The reason why is to enable logistics in terms of air are established especially if the peacekeeping operations are in remote areas and also to replenish MSU Peacekeeping forces supplies during peacekeeping operations. The Military Police in the other hand is sent over to establish order especially military traffic during peacekeeping operations and to guard peacekeeping force's base of operations.

SIGNED:
DPM
-Field Marshal David Peterson Marks-

[Cerillium]

(Image)
Official Communique of the Carlsvad Defence Force

---

Subject: Multi-Species Union Peacekeeping Force

Dear MSU Peacekeeping Liasion Officer,

We would like to inform you that we will be adding 5 Air Force Squadron's which consist of one Long-Range Transport Squadron, two Aircraft Transport Squadron and two Helicopter Aircraft Transport Squadron, in which the total personnel will be 1,500. Also, we will include a company of Military Police which consists of 150 personnel. In total, the extra personnel is 1,550 personnel.

The reason why is to enable logistics in terms of air are established especially if the peacekeeping operations are in remote areas and also to replenish MSU Peacekeeping forces supplies during peacekeeping operations. The Military Police in the other hand is sent over to establish order especially military traffic during peacekeeping operations and to guard peacekeeping force's base of operations.

SIGNED:
DPM
-Field Marshal David Peterson Marks-

Klem, This is our illustrious and often silly OOC thread. We're not in the process of taking donations just yet (no mission) however you can participate IC using a character over in the Congressional Chambers thread.

[Cerillium]

While I'm thinking about it -

Would you all want an MSU web site? It would be similar to this: http://cerillium.weebly.com/ although not that same style. I have all of next week off work and I'll most likely have very little to do when I'm not helping Swith.

[Klemantan-Borneo]

(Image)
Official Communique of the Carlsvad Defence Force

---

Subject: Multi-Species Union Peacekeeping Force

Dear MSU Peacekeeping Liasion Officer,

We would like to inform you that we will be adding 5 Air Force Squadron's which consist of one Long-Range Transport Squadron, two Aircraft Transport Squadron and two Helicopter Aircraft Transport Squadron, in which the total personnel will be 1,500. Also, we will include a company of Military Police which consists of 150 personnel. In total, the extra personnel is 1,550 personnel.

The reason why is to enable logistics in terms of air are established especially if the peacekeeping operations are in remote areas and also to replenish MSU Peacekeeping forces supplies during peacekeeping operations. The Military Police in the other hand is sent over to establish order especially military traffic during peacekeeping operations and to guard peacekeeping force's base of operations.

SIGNED:
DPM
-Field Marshal David Peterson Marks-

-snip-

Oh gosh, I feel old

[Oaledonia]

Given the nature of NS, It's absurdly silly that we don't have a rapid response force.

[Primordial Luxa]

Given the nature of NS, It's absurdly silly that we don't have a rapid response force.

Ive given the organization 3 DEiMOS's you would be hard pressed to find a faster reaction force of such caliber.
At least in the Ft setting in the other techs we might need something more mobile.

[Oaledonia]

Given the nature of NS, It's absurdly silly that we don't have a rapid response force.

Ive given the organization 3 DEiMOS's you would be hard pressed to find a faster reaction force of such caliber.
At least in the Ft setting in the other techs we might need something more mobile.

You shouldn't be the only one donating. It's an obvious conflict of interest.

[Primordial Luxa]

Ive given the organization 3 DEiMOS's you would be hard pressed to find a faster reaction force of such caliber.
At least in the Ft setting in the other techs we might need something more mobile.

You shouldn't be the only one donating. It's an obvious conflict of interest.

Of course it is, I encourage every other nation to donate squads and units. Its a great way for weaker nations to get more experience from larger nations and for small nations to get a little extra funding for their militiaries.

[Swith Witherward]

It's difficult to have realism with FT by nature of FT being a tech much more advanced than RL tech. However, politics follow the same algorithms. It doesn't matter if it's a group or a city or a state or a nation or an empire. Certain things work a certain way because it's been tried and proven the best way. We can strive for realism even though we are predominantly FT. Realism means that players need to focus a bit on what's realistic and how things are actually done. It allows us to harmonize nations of various tech levels and species for gaming purposes (even if the purpose is war).

VISIT THE CONGRESSIONAL THREAD WHERE THE OUTLINING OF THE MSU PEACEKEEPING MISSION IS TAKING PLACE.

Before posting, please read what Thull said so you get an understanding of what he's looking at, and then contribute your thoughts (not troops) based off that and other helpful posts made by players who also read what Thull spoke.

[Cerillium]

Given the nature of NS, It's absurdly silly that we don't have a rapid response force.

1. What is the purpose of the force?

2. What tech level will it be?

3. Who commands it?

4. Who manages all the logistics for it? Where is it headquartered?

5. Does it go into operation prior to the Congress' vote? If so, who issues that order?


For the record, the MSU does not have 3 DEiMOS. Primordial's nation possesses them and controls them and may elect to use them should a mission require it, but they remain his nation's property and under his command unless it is a joint mission where the other nation is in command (then the equipment remains in his control but he may or may not be ordered to use it). The same goes for any and all resources (troops and equipment) "donated" by other nations. We do not have a standing military. The MSU does not have resources in its inventory.

The UN are peace keepers and peace enforcers. Earth is a small world and most of the major nations are part of the UN or recognize the UN's authority. The MSU is a small drop in a very large bucket, few of our nations are powerful enough to throw their weight around on a cosmic scale (mine certainly can't) and no one recognizes MSU authority. We are not capable of being peace enforcers. Attempting to do so would make us into bullies without a supportive gang. We can only serve as peace keepers until such time that we become a recognized (and supported) agency within the cosmic community.

[Primordial Luxa]

Given the nature of NS, It's absurdly silly that we don't have a rapid response force.

1. What is the purpose of the force?

2. What tech level will it be?

3. Who commands it?

4. Who manages all the logistics for it? Where is it headquartered?

5. Does it go into operation prior to the Congress' vote? If so, who issues that order?

For the record, the MSU does not have 3 DEiMOS. Primordial's nation possesses them and controls them and may elect to use them should a mission require it, but they remain his nation's property and under his command unless it is a joint mission where the other nation is in command (then the equipment remains in his control but he may or may not be ordered to use it). The same goes for any and all resources (troops and equipment) "donated" by other nations. We do not have a standing military. The MSU does not have resources in its inventory.

The UN are peace keepers and peace enforcers. Earth is a small world and most of the major nations are part of the UN or recognize the UN's authority. The MSU is a small drop in a very large bucket, few of our nations are powerful enough to throw their weight around on a cosmic scale (mine certainly can't) and no one recognizes MSU authority. We are not capable of being peace enforcers. Attempting to do so would make us into bullies without a supportive gang. We can only serve as peace keepers until such time that we become a recognized (and supported) agency within the cosmic community.

If the donated forces arent maintained and bound to the MSU then whats the point of donating?
If at the end of the day were all just going to command our own forces then why not just have any willing nation commit to peacekeeping when needed rather than keeping a list of units that dont really mean anything.

Are we treating this like a small organization? I was under the impression that we are the entire galaxies version of UN.
We might be small compared to NS but we have several dozen nations and could treat ourselves as a RP world/galaxy/whatever. If we want to RP with other groups we could always say their from one galaxy over or something.

[Oaledonia]

1. What is the purpose of the force?

Besides what I obviously just said, a quickly mobilized reaction force? Nothing, besides to train our militaries to cooperate.

2. What tech level will it be?

This should be obvious, given that it's an any tech alliance. That being said, it should be every tech so that we're prepared for any threat.

3. Who commands it?

Whoever is elected to based on merits of qualifications.

4. Who manages all the logistics for it? Where is it headquartered?

You're acting like this is anything different from a regular mission oriented peacekeeping force. To be blunt, that's a bad way of thinking. The force would be logistically divided amongst members and would be stationed at various international bases.

5. Does it go into operation prior to the Congress' vote? If so, who issues that order?

Same as the regular peacekeeping force, they're literally the same. The only difference being reaction time, which if we're doing this realistically, could save a few days mobilization.

For the record, the MSU does not have 3 DEiMOS. Primordial's nation possesses them and controls them and may elect to use them should a mission require it, but they remain his nation's property and under his command unless it is a joint mission where the other nation is in command (then the equipment remains in his control but he may or may not be ordered to use it). The same goes for any and all resources (troops and equipment) "donated" by other nations. We do not have a standing military. The MSU does not have resources in its inventory

That's an egregious conflict of interest and I'm ashamed in this alliance (well, actually, only you) for not allowing this to be rectified.
The "standing military" is simply a quick, small reaction force that can be mobilized in a few days as compared to weeks or months. It is fully paid for by member nations, and would still be under their command until elected differently. In the end, the MSU would expend even more resources in training a coherent fighting force out of "mission donations" then a QRF simply due to the enormous time difference.

The UN are peace keepers and peace enforcers. Earth is a small world and most of the major nations are part of the UN or recognize the UN's authority. The MSU is a small drop in a very large bucket, few of our nations are powerful enough to throw their weight around on a cosmic scale (mine certainly can't) and no one recognizes MSU authority. We are not capable of being peace enforcers. Attempting to do so would make us into bullies without a supportive gang. We can only serve as peace keepers until such time that we become a recognized (and supported) agency within the cosmic community.

This is even more the reason to have a reaction force.
Without the authority to protect our ideas, this entire alliance is a bureaucratic waste. This is why I'm not yet a member, so that I'm not fully bound by passed resolutions. But if I ever join as a full member, expect me to challenge you on that. After all, you have the same power here as I do.

[Oaledonia]

If at the end of the day were all just going to command our own forces then why not just have any willing nation commit to peacekeeping when needed rather than keeping a list of units that dont really mean anything.

You are grossly underestimating the amount of time it takes to realistically assemble a working force.

[Cerillium]

If the donated forces arent maintained and bound to the MSU then whats the point of donating?
If at the end of the day were all just going to command our own forces then why not just have any willing nation commit to peacekeeping when needed rather than keeping a list of units that dont really mean anything.

Are we treating this like a small organization? I was under the impression that we are the entire galaxies version of UN.
We might be small compared to NS but we have several dozen nations and could treat ourselves as a RP world/galaxy/whatever. If we want to RP with other groups we could always say their from one galaxy over or something.

We've been saying all along that the MSU isn't going to maintain forces or resources. Forces belong to the member-nation.

Nation X needs bridges built and wells dug after a truce has been called between Nation X and Nation Y. The MSU agrees to send engineers to do the work for the betterment of the war-ravaged people. My Velox Brigade Combat Forces are in close proximity to Nation X. I pledge an engineer company (three engineer mobility platoons and one mobility support platoon) as well as units designed to sustain that company over a duration of time. My officers remain in charge of the operations on site but the orders come down the MSU chain of command. I'm not going to pledge that engineer company without good reason; I need them as part of my normal force. It might be a joint operation if my other units are committed elsewhere but the engineers need further support.

We aren't strong enough as a group to function as the entire galaxy's version of the UN. By that I mean we don't have things ironed out yet, people aren't in agreement over the charter, etc. It's something to strive for.

[Oaledonia]

Nation X needs bridges built and wells dug after a truce has been called between Nation X and Nation Y. The MSU agrees to send engineers to do the work for the betterment of the war-ravaged people. My Velox Brigade Combat Forces are in close proximity to Nation X. I pledge an engineer company (three engineer mobility platoons and one mobility support platoon) as well as units designed to sustain that company over a duration of time. My officers remain in charge of the operations on site but the orders come down the MSU chain of command. I'm not going to pledge that engineer company without good reason; I need them as part of my normal force. It might be a joint operation if my other units are committed elsewhere but the engineers need further support.

Politically, since FT "follows the same algorithms", I would complain wildly about political conflicts of interest. How will your engineering company being in command of the site effect the political climate of nation X? How does that interfere with my nation's interests? Will I be threatened by this? You need at least 3 nations there, and some of them need to be representative of my political interests.

This is the key Capstone Doctrine idea. I thought you researched the UN Peacekeeping? If you did, then you would know why there's always more then one nation.

[Cerillium]

snip

Let's get to the point. The MSU is a handful of a few players. Our setting is borrowed space (2 rooms) on a space station. We are still working to set things up. We still have people unhappy with the charter; they want to make changes. We're about to reveal a new setting but it keeps cycling back to the OOC and "donated troops".

Let's go back to the beginning. Neither of you were here for it. We have several members that can not belong to any alliance that has a standing military or engages in war.

"That's an egregious conflict of interest and I'm ashamed in this alliance (well, actually, only you) for not allowing this to be rectified." Nice flame. You claim to understand Japanese culture and be very knowledgeable of it therefore you must certainly realize that what you've just said is an absolute insult.

Oale, this isn't NS Hetalia. You can't bully your way around here. After that insult, you are no longer worth my attention. I believe Swith is your CIS Rep. You can pass things along through her.

[Primordial Luxa]

If at the end of the day were all just going to command our own forces then why not just have any willing nation commit to peacekeeping when needed rather than keeping a list of units that dont really mean anything.

You are grossly underestimating the amount of time it takes to realistically assemble a working force.

I agree we need a reaction force, thats why im pointing this out. Not advocating for it.

Nation X needs bridges built and wells dug after a truce has been called between Nation X and Nation Y. The MSU agrees to send engineers to do the work for the betterment of the war-ravaged people. My Velox Brigade Combat Forces are in close proximity to Nation X. I pledge an engineer company (three engineer mobility platoons and one mobility support platoon) as well as units designed to sustain that company over a duration of time. My officers remain in charge of the operations on site but the orders come down the MSU chain of command. I'm not going to pledge that engineer company without good reason; I need them as part of my normal force. It might be a joint operation if my other units are committed elsewhere but the engineers need further support.

Politically, since FT "follows the same algorithms", I would complain wildly about political conflicts of interest. How will your engineering company being in command of the site effect the political climate of nation X? How does that interfere with my nation's interests? Will I be threatened by this? You need at least 3 nations there, and some of them need to be representative of my political interests.

This is the key Capstone Doctrine idea. I thought you researched the UN Peacekeeping? If you did, then you would know why there's always more then one nation.

Nail > Head

We might not be as powerful or as organized as the UN but we at least need to write this down for when we are.
We need to cut our as many middle men as possible, if at the end of the day I'm deciding how many troops I deploy and have to be responsible for them then whats the point. While your engineers are waiting for orders and trying to slog through both MSU and your nations bureaucracy mine only has to worry about my own government.

snip

Let's get to the point. The MSU is a handful of a few players. Our setting is borrowed space (2 rooms) on a space station. We are still working to set things up. We still have people unhappy with the charter; they want to make changes. We're about to reveal a new setting but it keeps cycling back to the OOC and "donated troops".

Let's go back to the beginning. Neither of you were here for it. We have several members that can not belong to any alliance that has a standing military or engages in war.

"That's an egregious conflict of interest and I'm ashamed in this alliance (well, actually, only you) for not allowing this to be rectified." Nice flame. You claim to understand Japanese culture and be very knowledgeable of it therefore you must certainly realize that what you've just said is an absolute insult.

Oale, this isn't NS Hetalia. You can't bully your way around here. After that insult, you are no longer worth my attention. I believe Swith is your CIS Rep. You can pass things along through her.

Were not talking about a standing military. Were talking about a few groups of military police or some equivalent that are constantly prepared to give up a foot hold so we can spread food or enforce ceasefires.

[Oaledonia]

You claim to understand Japanese culture and be very knowledgeable of it

And I'm insulting you? I never claimed to be "very knowledgeable" of anything, I said I knew a bit.
Then again, based on the Hetalia comment I can see you've been talking to another "mentor". It wasn't meant to be an insult, simply a dramatic statement of my opinion that you're the only one against this. I'm sorry if you took it as an insult, however you have absolutely NO right to carry a predetermined disposition on my character based on word of mouth.

[Cerillium]

Prim, people aren't donating those things. It's been nothing but combat forces for the most part. We've no, strike that, I asked people if they'd be willing to donate some police forces to keep the current HQ safe just to start with. No response. Nobody seems willing to donate just 10 men.

I've attempted to outline how this will all work but you and Min and Urran are the only ones who have taken the time to respond in the Congress thread. I was looking for some common ground in order to expand on how the chain of command and other things will work. I've delayed posted there in the hope that others would chime in. So far, nothing posted.

[Oaledonia]

Hey Prim, I'm sure you and I could work over the details via TG.

[Tiltjuice]

Prim, people aren't donating those things. It's been nothing but combat forces for the most part. We've no, strike that, I asked people if they'd be willing to donate some police forces to keep the current HQ safe just to start with. No response. Nobody seems willing to donate just 10 men.

I've attempted to outline how this will all work but you and Min and Urran are the only ones who have taken the time to respond in the Congress thread. I was looking for some common ground in order to expand on how the chain of command and other things will work. I've delayed posted there in the hope that others would chime in. So far, nothing posted.

Same question as a while back...are outsiders/observers permitted to contribute?

[Primordial Luxa]

Prim, people aren't donating those things. It's been nothing but combat forces for the most part. We've no, strike that, I asked people if they'd be willing to donate some police forces to keep the current HQ safe just to start with. No response. Nobody seems willing to donate just 10 men.

I've attempted to outline how this will all work but you and Min and Urran are the only ones who have taken the time to respond in the Congress thread. I was looking for some common ground in order to expand on how the chain of command and other things will work. I've delayed posted there in the hope that others would chime in. So far, nothing posted.

Oh I see totally misunderstood some things.
Ignore my above stuff.
I was going to donate some guards in the IC do you want me to do that there later or should I post that stuff in the IC? I was thinking a small group of bound spirits and maybe a Star Vampire or Yithian.
I say just continue without them. They've had plenty of time if theyre not interested in peacekeeping then theres no need to wait for them.

[Cerillium]

Prim, people aren't donating those things. It's been nothing but combat forces for the most part. We've no, strike that, I asked people if they'd be willing to donate some police forces to keep the current HQ safe just to start with. No response. Nobody seems willing to donate just 10 men.

I've attempted to outline how this will all work but you and Min and Urran are the only ones who have taken the time to respond in the Congress thread. I was looking for some common ground in order to expand on how the chain of command and other things will work. I've delayed posted there in the hope that others would chime in. So far, nothing posted.

Same question as a while back...are outsiders/observers permitted to contribute?

Forces: That's a grey area. I'd say "no" at first blush because an observer isn't bound by membership to an alliance.
IC Dialog/Politics: Yes. Observers are permitted to speak before Congress and can weigh in on issues or bring issues to light. They don't have a vote however.

@Prim. Ah. Misunderstandings all around!

Right now I believe the only security or police forces present are those belonging to the congress members or other representatives. We don't have a dedicated police force for the HQ property/interior. Would be nice if we could get a few people to put together something. Perhaps overt and covert mixed?

[Primordial Luxa]

Same question as a while back...are outsiders/observers permitted to contribute?

Forces: That's a grey area. I'd say "no" at first blush because an observer isn't bound by membership to an alliance.
IC Dialog/Politics: Yes. Observers are permitted to speak before Congress and can weigh in on issues or bring issues to light. They don't have a vote however.

@Prim. Ah. Misunderstandings all around!

Right now I believe the only security or police forces present are those belonging to the congress members or other representatives. We don't have a dedicated police force for the HQ property/interior. Would be nice if we could get a few people to put together something. Perhaps overt and covert mixed?

I cant do much as an observer for now but I would be happy to handle the internal protect stuff once I can.