*Implying that a there is such a thing as a non missile spam destroyer*
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by Krazeria » Sat Apr 12, 2014 8:44 pm
RP stats
Population: 954,000,000 Military: 1,304,900 GDP: 7.9 trillion Tech Level: Modern Tech
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 8:46 pm
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by Krazeria » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:01 pm
RP stats
Population: 954,000,000 Military: 1,304,900 GDP: 7.9 trillion Tech Level: Modern Tech
by Dragomere » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:02 pm
Krazeria wrote:Serious question: would nuclear powered destroyers and other similarly sized vessels work?
by Svendborg- » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:03 pm
Krazeria wrote:Serious question: would nuclear powered destroyers and other similarly sized vessels work?
by The Akasha Colony » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:03 pm
Krazeria wrote:Serious question: would nuclear powered destroyers and other similarly sized vessels work?
by Rich and Corporations » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:18 pm
Lyras wrote:Triplebaconation wrote:If Taiwan (???) ever buys any F-35s, I'll post in NS Military Realism Consultation Thread #999 from the nursing home and publicly proclaim that the Longsword is a well thought out and practical design.
I saw this, and see it a bit, but just thought that I'd draw collective attention to something.
I just sunk 5,000 Stevidian ships. Because I had a Longsword in my fleet. I could see, and target, the Stevidian 5th Fleet, due to the Longsword's OTH radar. A piece of equipment that I could otherwise not utilise, due to the size of the over-the-horizon radar. Its a capability I can't replicate with anything smaller. Which is, of course, why I make such large ships.
I lost nothing, save the cruise missiles I fired to sink that fleet. 5,000 ships sunk, and over two million personnel lost, if I calculate correctly. 0 Lyran losses.
This is why Longswords exist.
Just thought I'd put that out there.
Corporate Confederacy DEFENSE ALERT LEVEL PEACE ▓ Factbook [url=iiwiki.com/wiki/Corporate_Confederacy]Wiki Article[/url] | Neptonia |
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:22 pm
Rich and Corporations wrote:Lyras wrote:
I saw this, and see it a bit, but just thought that I'd draw collective attention to something.
I just sunk 5,000 Stevidian ships. Because I had a Longsword in my fleet. I could see, and target, the Stevidian 5th Fleet, due to the Longsword's OTH radar. A piece of equipment that I could otherwise not utilise, due to the size of the over-the-horizon radar. Its a capability I can't replicate with anything smaller. Which is, of course, why I make such large ships.
I lost nothing, save the cruise missiles I fired to sink that fleet. 5,000 ships sunk, and over two million personnel lost, if I calculate correctly. 0 Lyran losses.
This is why Longswords exist.
Just thought I'd put that out there.
The longsword uses a bistatic radar.
Smaller bistatic radars exist, and one could swarm a bunch of ships to conduct radar in unison.
Or use an AWACs.
or use a hypersonic cruisemissile with literally one tonne of explosives and a incendiary shaped charge.
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by San-Silvacian » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:24 pm
Lyras wrote:
It seems the collective inability to grasp the idea of OTHER PLATFORMS firing the missiles knows no bounds.
I'm not pointing this comment at anyone in particular. 'tis simply an observation. Longswords spot fleets. Other force elements generally fire the missiles. Sure, Longswords CAN, but doctrinally are normally carrying other weapons, and generally they are intended for fleet- and self-defence.
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:26 pm
San-Silvacian wrote:Lyras wrote:
It seems the collective inability to grasp the idea of OTHER PLATFORMS firing the missiles knows no bounds.
I'm not pointing this comment at anyone in particular. 'tis simply an observation. Longswords spot fleets. Other force elements generally fire the missiles. Sure, Longswords CAN, but doctrinally are normally carrying other weapons, and generally they are intended for fleet- and self-defence.
Fill every single tube with ESSM, RM-161, RIM-174.
Win NS though making the enemy run out of missiles.
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by San-Silvacian » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:31 pm
by Rich and Corporations » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:35 pm
Lyras wrote:Rich and Corporations wrote:The longsword uses a bistatic radar.
Smaller bistatic radars exist, and one could swarm a bunch of ships to conduct radar in unison.
Or use an AWACs.
or use a hypersonic cruisemissile with literally one tonne of explosives and a incendiary shaped charge.
If you have to put a radar close to the enemy, the radar can be hit. Thus, using multiple small radars to put a whole bunch of overlapping circles of radar coverage to the same area, while cheaper, means you will have critically incomplete coverage.
AEWACs has inferior range to a large-scale OTH radar. This is not news. But a reasonable compromise at smaller scales.
Hypersonic (at least in sprint) cruise missiles are win. This used, in conjunction with OTH radar, is what wins wars, imho.
Corporate Confederacy DEFENSE ALERT LEVEL PEACE ▓ Factbook [url=iiwiki.com/wiki/Corporate_Confederacy]Wiki Article[/url] | Neptonia |
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:35 pm
San-Silvacian wrote:Lyras wrote:
While entertaining, the use of attendant escorts and arsenal ships for missile volume is the norm. Although the mental image is amusing.
This is NS. Norm is bad.
Longsword carriers tens of thousands of ESSMs, RIM-161/174s while rest of fleet carry AShMs and ESSMs for self-defense.
Enemy fleet runs out of missiles, conduct ASW and kill enemy submarines.
Kill enemy fleet with airplanes w/ Exocet and AShMs.
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:36 pm
Rich and Corporations wrote:Lyras wrote:
If you have to put a radar close to the enemy, the radar can be hit. Thus, using multiple small radars to put a whole bunch of overlapping circles of radar coverage to the same area, while cheaper, means you will have critically incomplete coverage.
AEWACs has inferior range to a large-scale OTH radar. This is not news. But a reasonable compromise at smaller scales.
Hypersonic (at least in sprint) cruise missiles are win. This used, in conjunction with OTH radar, is what wins wars, imho.
fortunately it won't be hard to detect the location of a longsword
infact, if someone maintain a bombardment of anti-radiation missiles, the longsword will be forced to turn off it's radar many many times.
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by Rich and Corporations » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:41 pm
Lyras wrote:San-Silvacian wrote:
This is NS. Norm is bad.
Longsword carriers tens of thousands of ESSMs, RIM-161/174s while rest of fleet carry AShMs and ESSMs for self-defense.
Enemy fleet runs out of missiles, conduct ASW and kill enemy submarines.
Kill enemy fleet with airplanes w/ Exocet and AShMs.
Possible... but aircraft carrying Exocets have to get within 200km to fire upon the enemy fleet, which is within the range of enemy combat air patrol. Lyran fleet or ground forces carrying Hellions can stand-off at 3,000km. That's a plus.
Corporate Confederacy DEFENSE ALERT LEVEL PEACE ▓ Factbook [url=iiwiki.com/wiki/Corporate_Confederacy]Wiki Article[/url] | Neptonia |
by Inyourfaceistan » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:43 pm
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:45 pm
Rich and Corporations wrote:Lyras wrote:
Possible... but aircraft carrying Exocets have to get within 200km to fire upon the enemy fleet, which is within the range of enemy combat air patrol. Lyran fleet or ground forces carrying Hellions can stand-off at 3,000km. That's a plus.
really, you don't expect your enemy to do what you did and ''design'' missiles?
I could create a scaled up version of a BrahMos with a ramjet engine. the BrahMos could be controlled by a radio-relay drone sending a focused frequency hopping signal to the missile. The BrahMos will also be small enough to not be detected by JORN radar, but it could still be detected by smaller OTH radars.
Inyourfaceistan wrote:Still worth a polite ignore cannon from any player who doesn't want to RP in a thread with kilometer-long warships housing OTH radar...
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by Rich and Corporations » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:46 pm
Inyourfaceistan wrote:Still worth a polite ignore cannon from any player who doesn't want to RP in a thread with kilometer-long warships housing OTH radar...
Corporate Confederacy DEFENSE ALERT LEVEL PEACE ▓ Factbook [url=iiwiki.com/wiki/Corporate_Confederacy]Wiki Article[/url] | Neptonia |
by Inyourfaceistan » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:51 pm
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 9:52 pm
Inyourfaceistan wrote:Would it be possible to stick a passive radar seeker on a tomahawk missile?
(Not something I plan to emulate, just a hypothetical question)
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by Hurtful Thoughts » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:01 pm
Rich and Corporations wrote:Lyras wrote:
I saw this, and see it a bit, but just thought that I'd draw collective attention to something.
I just sunk 5,000 Stevidian ships. Because I had a Longsword in my fleet. I could see, and target, the Stevidian 5th Fleet, due to the Longsword's OTH radar. A piece of equipment that I could otherwise not utilise, due to the size of the over-the-horizon radar. Its a capability I can't replicate with anything smaller. Which is, of course, why I make such large ships.
I lost nothing, save the cruise missiles I fired to sink that fleet. 5,000 ships sunk, and over two million personnel lost, if I calculate correctly. 0 Lyran losses.
This is why Longswords exist.
Just thought I'd put that out there.
The longsword uses a bistatic radar.
Smaller bistatic radars exist, and one could swarm a bunch of ships to conduct radar in unison.
Or use an AWACs.
or use a hypersonic cruisemissile with literally one tonne of explosives and a incendiary shaped charge.
Mokostana wrote:See, Hurty cared not if the mission succeeded or not, as long as it was spectacular trainwreck. Sometimes that was the host Nation firing a SCUD into a hospital to destroy a foreign infection and accidentally sparking a rebellion... or accidentally starting the Mokan Drug War
Blackhelm Confederacy wrote:If there was only a "like" button for NS posts....
by Lyras » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:05 pm
Mokastana: Then Lyras happened.
Allanea: Wanting to avoid fighting Lyras' fuck-huge military is also a reasonable IC consideration
TPF: Who is stupid enough to attack a Lyran convoy?
Sumer: Honestly, I'd rather face Doom's military with Doom having a 3-1 advantage over me, than take a 1-1 fight with a well-supplied Lyran tank unit.
Kinsgard: RL Lyras is like a real life video game character.
Ieperithem: Eighty four. Eighty four percent of their terrifyingly massive GDP goes directly into their military. And they actually know how to manage it. It's safe to say there isn't a single nation that could feasibly stand against them if they wanted it to die.
Yikes. Just... Yikes.
by Rich and Corporations » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:07 pm
Lyras wrote:Rich and Corporations wrote:really, you don't expect your enemy to do what you did and ''design'' missiles?
I could create a scaled up version of a BrahMos with a ramjet engine. the BrahMos could be controlled by a radio-relay drone sending a focused frequency hopping signal to the missile. The BrahMos will also be small enough to not be detected by JORN radar, but it could still be detected by smaller OTH radars.
Designing missiles is the same as designing anything on NS, subject to peer review, and critique for viability. Anything I've ever used has gone through that process. BrahMos range comes nowhere near the 7,000km of detection envelope that the firing platform would have to cross, and would itself also be detectable from 1000km+ by the suite of other radars and detection systems that a Longsword fields.
Hellions are modest changes to the Tomahawk, for the record. Mainly software upgrades, and mild (mild!) engine tinkering. A bit less mild in the Hellion 2, but still at almost-identical-to-Tomahawk ranges.
by San-Silvacian » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:12 pm
by Hurtful Thoughts » Sat Apr 12, 2014 10:22 pm
Lyras wrote:AWACs calling in orbital weapons requires:
1. AWACs not being shot down, which is tough, as their own radar is less ranged than the heavy SAMs that are available to bring them down, and are very vulnerable to weapons that a SDGN carries, let alone the escorts. Which of course are being assisted in THEIR targeting by the SDGN.
2. Orbital weapons. Which are themselves hideously expensive, and can be shot down by the ASATs that such a ship also carries. And can be remarkably inaccurate, and able to be engaged by kinetic ABM weapons, at least conceptually.
3. Airfields in range that haven't been struck. Which can be tough itself, if the SDGN-user is being cautious/thorough.
Mokostana wrote:See, Hurty cared not if the mission succeeded or not, as long as it was spectacular trainwreck. Sometimes that was the host Nation firing a SCUD into a hospital to destroy a foreign infection and accidentally sparking a rebellion... or accidentally starting the Mokan Drug War
Blackhelm Confederacy wrote:If there was only a "like" button for NS posts....
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