Your Nations Warships, MKII

[Allentyr]

http://i.imgur.com/bjMRiv3.png

Anything too wrong with this design? I won't clutter with a stat block, but it's meant to replace most of my supercarriers because I'm slashing the carrier fleet to become more defense-oriented.

Yes, I know there's a severe lack of anti-ship weapons since there's only four 57mm guns (two on each side).

not hugely, there does seem to be some odd scling issues going on with some of the radars and the dows and doors on the bridge are gigantic for some reason.

I don't really see the point in the 57mm guns since you have CIWS and any anti-shipping work would be done by your aircraft. You could be better repalcing them with some SHORAD SAMs like sea sparrow or even just RAM launchers.

Oh yeah just noticed I didn't fix the bridge, thanks for that.

Also wouldn't it better to have some guns just in case enemy ships get too close to be capable of launching aircraft? Like, it'd be very unlikely unless the entire fleet was already being annihilated, but you know. Just in case. At least SOMETHING to shoot at enemy ships with.

[Gig em Aggies]

First, fix your scaling. It's way off, which makes any attempt at evaluation impossible. For instance, on the first one, your planes are too tall to fit into the hangar doors you have toward the rear of the ship. The windows are also almost as tall as your planes, and you seem to be lacking, um, engines. There are also a lot of lines that seem to go nowhere that need to be cleaned up, but there may be an image scaling problem that makes them get dropped. If you can find an image host that doesn't confine it to a webpage view (direct link is ideal), that'd be much better.

The second one would probably push itself under the waves if it tried to go anywhere. The bow just doesn't work.

IIRC its supposed to be a Ulstein X-bow design, which do work.

Its also quite a nasty mdoficiation of Thiel's waverider class from shipbucket.


Gig em Aggies: You may not be aware of this but the folks at shipbucket understandably get very upset when you take thier stuff and don't retain or ignore thier crediting standards.
I know you day you didn't draw these but I would be very pissied if you took some of my work and made the minimal changes you have done before claiming them as your nations' product. I'm not sure if Thiel is active on NS or what his nation might be if he is but you are definitely in mod actionable plagarism territory here if he is and he chooses to make an issue of it.

On the Gans reveille, if you can't see the fact the hull it no where near tall/deep enough or that a single thin "deck" with no real support, that honestly makes the famously under strength and spindly new Southern general helipad look rhobust and well designed, simply won't support 1, let alone multiple heavy helicopters, then the best advice is to simply go away and spend a lot more time looking at actual carriers. Trying multideck operations can be forgiven as many people think they are being new and original with the concept without realising that its been tried several tiems IRL and in all cases it was a horrible failure that was quickly abandonded.

Thinking I don't want trouble I did find the artist so now it should be okay.

On design of double flight deck how can I design or modify a ship for it to actually work?

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

IIRC its supposed to be a Ulstein X-bow design, which do work.

Its also quite a nasty mdoficiation of Thiel's waverider class from shipbucket.


Gig em Aggies: You may not be aware of this but the folks at shipbucket understandably get very upset when you take thier stuff and don't retain or ignore thier crediting standards.
I know you day you didn't draw these but I would be very pissied if you took some of my work and made the minimal changes you have done before claiming them as your nations' product. I'm not sure if Thiel is active on NS or what his nation might be if he is but you are definitely in mod actionable plagarism territory here if he is and he chooses to make an issue of it.

On the Gans reveille, if you can't see the fact the hull it no where near tall/deep enough or that a single thin "deck" with no real support, that honestly makes the famously under strength and spindly new Southern general helipad look rhobust and well designed, simply won't support 1, let alone multiple heavy helicopters, then the best advice is to simply go away and spend a lot more time looking at actual carriers. Trying multideck operations can be forgiven as many people think they are being new and original with the concept without realising that its been tried several tiems IRL and in all cases it was a horrible failure that was quickly abandonded.

Thinking I don't want trouble I did find the artist so now it should be okay.

On design of double flight deck how can I design or modify a ship for it to actually work?

Double flight decks was tried in the 30's, even triple superimposed decks. They discovered that it firstly encroached on vital hangar space, secondly limited the takeoff distance and thus impacted the maximum takeoff weight of aircraft you could throw off your flight deck, thirdly launching from the hangar required as many as six catapults to match the ability of four or less catapults on the main flight deck and nobody was willing to trade anti-air firepower, storm resistance and hangar space to launch planes from the hangar.

[Empire of Gibraltar]

GSS Gibraltar:
It is based a lot on French Destroyers, a lot from the Suffren Class and Horizon Class.

6,975 Tonnes: Full Weaponry
5,230 Tonnes: No Weaponry

172 M Long
12.5 M Wide
5.5 M High

1x Nuclear Fission Reactor
90 MeV, equivalent to 120,000 horsepower.

43 Knots (49 MPH, 79 KM/H)


Phalanx CIWS
Patriot Missile System

6x Exocet Ship-Ship Missile
56x Rapier SAM
1x 40MM Cannon

The Gibraltar has been in service since 1995, and is the most advanced class in their arsenal. It also serves as a flagship.

[The Akasha Colony]

On design of double flight deck how can I design or modify a ship for it to actually work?

You can't. That's why they aren't used.

[New Oyashima]

On design of double flight deck how can I design or modify a ship for it to actually work?

You can't. That's why they aren't used.

We have a negative nacy here :c

[Crookfur]

not hugely, there does seem to be some odd scling issues going on with some of the radars and the dows and doors on the bridge are gigantic for some reason.

I don't really see the point in the 57mm guns since you have CIWS and any anti-shipping work would be done by your aircraft. You could be better repalcing them with some SHORAD SAMs like sea sparrow or even just RAM launchers.

Oh yeah just noticed I didn't fix the bridge, thanks for that.

Also wouldn't it better to have some guns just in case enemy ships get too close to be capable of launching aircraft? Like, it'd be very unlikely unless the entire fleet was already being annihilated, but you know. Just in case. At least SOMETHING to shoot at enemy ships with.

If the enemy is within gun range then the carrier is already buggered. Other than your CIWS all the guns you really need are a couple of light 20-30mm cannon on pintle or light turret mounts to ward off boghammers.

[Crookfur]

IIRC its supposed to be a Ulstein X-bow design, which do work.

Its also quite a nasty mdoficiation of Thiel's waverider class from shipbucket.


Gig em Aggies: You may not be aware of this but the folks at shipbucket understandably get very upset when you take thier stuff and don't retain or ignore thier crediting standards.
I know you day you didn't draw these but I would be very pissied if you took some of my work and made the minimal changes you have done before claiming them as your nations' product. I'm not sure if Thiel is active on NS or what his nation might be if he is but you are definitely in mod actionable plagarism territory here if he is and he chooses to make an issue of it.

On the Gans reveille, if you can't see the fact the hull it no where near tall/deep enough or that a single thin "deck" with no real support, that honestly makes the famously under strength and spindly new Southern general helipad look rhobust and well designed, simply won't support 1, let alone multiple heavy helicopters, then the best advice is to simply go away and spend a lot more time looking at actual carriers. Trying multideck operations can be forgiven as many people think they are being new and original with the concept without realising that its been tried several tiems IRL and in all cases it was a horrible failure that was quickly abandonded.

Thinking I don't want trouble I did find the artist so now it should be okay.

On design of double flight deck how can I design or modify a ship for it to actually work?

No idea. As has been said it's been tried and binned. Pretty much all carriers have the same single operations/flight deck with a hanger deck underneath it design (although with lots of variety within that concept) becuase nothing else works anywhere near as well.

[Girten Isle]

First ship design, help me out with any obvious flaws please. Year is 1930s equivalent.

GIS Candid-class Cruiser

Sorry for teeny-tiny size, it's at 1px:1m scale

Stats

:General:
Length: 170m
Beam: 25m
Height: 33.8m
Draft: 11.2m
Displacement: 3750
Speed: 30kn
Complement: ~400

:Armament:
2x300mm double-gun
2x200mm double-gun
13x28mm quad-gun

Will edit/add info as needed.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

It's a 30 knot pre-dreadnought in 1920 weighing nothing. I think the issues should be self-evident.

[Girten Isle]

Soo... too light and fast and guns are too big? I'm not familiar with ships, please bear with me if my numbers seem magical. Also it's mid to late '30s, after edit.

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

They tried putting a single big gun on a very light 4,700 ton hull. It heeled over as soon as the ship brought the gun to the side.
You need at least 12,000 tons to support four 12 inchers, and a speed of 30 knots. I suggest you start by looking at the Deutschland-class pocket battleships.

[Girten Isle]

Gotcha. If I, say, increased displacement to ~14,500 tonnes, and reduced speed to ~22kn, would that be more reasonable?

[The Solar Cooperative Union]

Are starships allowed in this fine thread?

[Connori Pilgrims]

Are starships allowed in this fine thread?

Technically yes, read the first post of this thread its there.

[Girten Isle]

I decided to size down the guns since I wasn't looking for a battleship-strength ship here. And of course tripled the displacement. Thinking about adding torpedoes as well, although they would probably replace the 100mm's on the sides. Any other tweaks I could do, or missing info that would be nice?

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

I decided to size down the guns since I wasn't looking for a battleship-strength ship here. And of course tripled the displacement. Thinking about adding torpedoes as well, although they would probably replace the 100mm's on the sides. Any other tweaks I could do, or missing info that would be nice?

The big question I have yet to ask is "What role do you envision this ship performing?" Deutschland-class pocket battleships were geared towards commerce raiding, which means heavy guns to sink anything lesser than it and power to get away from anything superior to it. Japanese cruisers, often in the same weight-class sported extensive torpedo batteries to give them an edge in long-range night fighting, to even the odds out for the eventual Decisive Battle their admirality envisioned. What role will your vessel assume?

[Girten Isle]

The best answer that I have for that very important question is " I'm not sure." I don't have any adversaries yet, so I don't have a specific threat in mind. I will, however, say that I envisioned this particular craft to play some sort of commercial/carrier escort role, potentially against ships the same size as or smaller than her.

[Girten Isle]

GIS Candid
Current pic and stats:

Candid-class Cruiser

Length: 170m
Beam: 25m
Height: 33.8m
Draft: 11.2m
Displacement: 11,000 tonnes
Speed: 30kn
Compliment: 500 enlisted
30 officers

2x200mm double-gun
2x100mm double-gun
13x28mm quad-gun

2px:1m scale

I doubled the resolution for greater detail and easier viewing. Will probably keep scaling it up and improving as I go. I'll probably get around to doing a top view sometime as well.

[Husseinarti]

GIS Candid
Current pic and stats:
(Image)
Candid-class Cruiser

Length: 170m
Beam: 25m
Height: 33.8m
Draft: 11.2m
Displacement: 11,000 tonnes
Speed: 30kn
Compliment: 500 enlisted
30 officers

2x200mm double-gun
2x100mm double-gun
13x28mm quad-gun

2px:1m scale

I doubled the resolution for greater detail and easier viewing. Will probably keep scaling it up and improving as I go. I'll probably get around to doing a top view sometime as well.

this is really cool.

I've give it some more 100mm dual-purpose guns though.

Also I'd add some more details. But that would require a bigger scale.

[The Soodean Imperium]

GIS Candid
Current pic and stats:
(Image)
Candid-class Cruiser

Length: 170m
Beam: 25m
Height: 33.8m
Draft: 11.2m
Displacement: 11,000 tonnes
Speed: 30kn
Compliment: 500 enlisted
30 officers

2x200mm double-gun
2x100mm double-gun
13x28mm quad-gun

2px:1m scale

I doubled the resolution for greater detail and easier viewing. Will probably keep scaling it up and improving as I go. I'll probably get around to doing a top view sometime as well.

Actually, it looks like you may have taken ABH's comments a little too far; as it stands now, it's very over-weight and very under-gunned. Holding length constant, you can probably cut draft down to ~6.5 meters and beam down to ~20 for a displacement of closer to 11,000 tonnes with a typical heavy cruiser block coefficient of somewhere around 0.5. Armament for a heavy cruiser that size would be 8-10 200mm guns, with 4-8 100-130mm dual-purpose guns in turrets along the sides; torpedoes are optional.

For more information, I'd suggest looking at some real-life heavy cruisers, like the IJN's Mogami-class and the USN's Northampton-class, to get a better sense of what kind of armament and what kind of overall layout would be common for a cruiser in that era.

[Girten Isle]

this is really cool.

I've give it some more 100mm dual-purpose guns though.

Also I'd add some more details. But that would require a bigger scale.

Thanks. And I do plan on greatly increasing the scale, making it this big simply made it easy for me to get a preliminary drawing down, and also took like five minutes.

Actually, it looks like you may have taken ABH's comments a little too far; as it stands now, it's very over-weight and very under-gunned. Holding length constant, you can probably cut draft down to ~6.5 meters and beam down to ~20 for a displacement of closer to 11,000 tonnes with a typical heavy cruiser block coefficient of somewhere around 0.5. Armament for a heavy cruiser that size would be 8-10 200mm guns, with 4-8 100-130mm dual-purpose guns in turrets along the sides; torpedoes are optional.

For more information, I'd suggest looking at some real-life heavy cruisers, like the IJN's Mogami-class and the USN's Northampton-class, to get a better sense of what kind of armament and what kind of overall layout would be common for a cruiser in that era.

Thanks for the advice. I really appreciate any help I can get with regards to ships because I have very little actual knowledge of them. And expect a lot of jockeying around with stats, I'll probably go from low to high and back a lot until I get them how I like.

[Girten Isle]

:Total superstructure/guns overhaul:


Candid-class Cruiser

Length: 170m
Beam: 21m
Height: 39m
Draft: 7m
Displacement: 11,000 tonnes
Speed: 30kn
Compliment: 500 enlisted
30 officers

8x200mm double-gun
8x100mm double-gun
12x28mm quad-gun

2px:1m scale

[The Soodean Imperium]

And now that we're on a past-tech theme, I might as well pull out the 1911 Dreadnought design I was working on before GREs happened.



Here's the wiki entry and statblock if anyone's interested.

[Girten Isle]

Last time shoving this in everyone's faces. Because I'm happy with it, finally. Until I feel the urge to up the resolution, which will happen very soon.

Candid-class Heavy Cruiser

Length: 170m
Beam: 21m
Height: 33.8m
Draft: 7m
Displacement: 11,000t
Speed: 30kn
Compliment: 500 enlisted
30 officers

8x203mm double-gun
8x102mm double-gun
2x530mm triple-torpedo
10x25mm quad-gun

2px:1m scale

And wow. I feel very inadequate now. XP