Infantry Discussion Thread 6: True Korea Edition

[Imperializt Russia]

Samoz, did you have some question or something about a Soviet Motor rifle squad? I feel asleep typing this and don't remember

All of my work with my forces is based upon FM-100-2-3 (US), which is not the most reliable of models, I'm told
It's from where I get my breakdown of the Soviet rifle platoon - three sections of seven fighting men, a BMP each and two commanders for the platoon. FM-100-2-3 was written at a time when the BMP-1 was still the dominant vehicle in the Soviet and WarPac inventory, and the structure may have changed entirely.

Id just like to note that the RPG-7s Thermobaric warhead has more explosive yield than the m/48s

But can it blow up squad a kilometer and a half away?

I doubt many other shoulder fired weapons can compare to this. That aren't guided missiles.

1500m seems entirely superfluous. Were one to issue the RPG-7 with a "fire control system", one could probably eke out competitive capabilities.

1500 metres is not a range for the small arms of the rifle squad, this is either to be taken up by armour or artillery, or a local mortar.

Different role.

I'd argue that the RPG-7 is closer in role to the AT4 then it is to the Charlie G though. At least in terms of distribution.

I'd disagree. FM-100-2-3 suggests the Soviets handed out almost as many RPG-7s as they did RPKs, which they seemed to issue to everyone not an infantryman who worked in a forwards unit. Its distribution seems to suggest it was a general purpose heavy grenadier weapon with a secondary AT role, and the varied warheads available seems to support that.

I never have to ask for the IDTs opinion. But now I am

Would you rather a multi-purpose assault weapon more in the vein of the Carl Gustav (Grg m/48), or the RPG-7?

I'm at an actual loss for choice. I like the RPG-7 and m/48 almost equally; having used the RPG-7(V2), I am inherently biased to it, but I have absolute confidence in its ability, and its pretty well-established its a very effective weapon; probably the most effective really.
To the same note, I love the Carl Gustav; its general use, its effectiveness and its design have always interested me and, having fired one a few times, I take some interest in it in that regard. Its clearly good enough, being one of (the, really) longest serving anti-fortification/tank weapons in the world of the particular type.

Follow up question:

Can the RPG-7 fire nuclear projectiles?

At its most theoretically abstract, yes.

[Imperializt Russia]

Isn't 33cm a lot?
The Doberman is a long rifle and that's like 34cm LoP.

I swear you told me 33cm was the standard, centuries ago.

Quite possibly. Because the Doberman is 40-41cm LoP, that's why.

[Crookfur]

Is there all that much to discuss? I guess a pike's length depends on the time period, how big you want your shields to be if you have them at all, and how flexible the pikemen need to be. Obviously there's no one best length.

Well, obviously 24ft long pike is too long, and we have a record of pikes of a similar length or longer being held by the front rank of enemy infantry and other troops going in under the pikes to attack.

Regarding shields, there is no pike length incompatible with them.

What we need to consider is just how more manoeuvrable a pike block equipped with 16ft pikes is compared to one armed with 25ft pikes. From Arrian we can deduce that the longer pikes were still quite manoeuvrable, since Alexander once turned his phalanx around when the enemy was within bow shot (anywhere between 80 and 200 metres) and coming on at a rapid pace. On the other hand, no one has yet come up with a satisfactory explanation as to how the Macedonian pikes were managed on the march, so perhaps the shorter pikes might be better rounded.

From my breif afternoon's worth of drill with 12 and 14ft pikes wouldn't 25ft pikes be awefully springy and an abolute pain in the arse to keep under any kind of control (unless they are very thick)?

[Fordorsia]

Is there all that much to discuss? I guess a pike's length depends on the time period, how big you want your shields to be if you have them at all, and how flexible the pikemen need to be. Obviously there's no one best length.

Well, obviously 24ft long pike is too long, and we have a record of pikes of a similar length or longer being held by the front rank of enemy infantry and other troops going in under the pikes to attack.

Regarding shields, there is no pike length incompatible with them.

What we need to consider is just how more manoeuvrable a pike block equipped with 16ft pikes is compared to one armed with 25ft pikes. From Arrian we can deduce that the longer pikes were still quite manoeuvrable, since Alexander once turned his phalanx around when the enemy was within bow shot (anywhere between 80 and 200 metres) and coming on at a rapid pace. On the other hand, no one has yet come up with a satisfactory explanation as to how the Macedonian pikes were managed on the march, so perhaps the shorter pikes might be better rounded.

I wouldn't say incompatible, but the shields of pikemen were relatively small compared to those of others. Having large shields would make it harder to control a pike, especially one as long as those of Macedonia.

You also need to consider that Alexander's army was likely the best pike army to ever exist. It's not really fair to use them as an example of how easy it is to move phalanxes.

And Crook is right. At that length, the pike is no longer an opportunist weapon. You're no longer picking out vunrable spots in the enemy formation because you would likely be unable to hit it, unlike with shorter pikes and spears. You might be beating the enemy in reach, but it will be far easier for them to move through your pikes.

[Nirvash Type TheEND]

It also depends on whether you're 8 guys deep in a phalanx formation or using a circular Scottish formation. I would think the Scottish model would call for slightly shorter pikes since you have to be able to pick up and move the entire formation.

[Fordorsia]

It also depends on whether you're 8 guys deep in a phalanx formation or using a circular Scottish formation. I would think the Scottish model would call for slightly shorter pikes since you have to be able to pick up and move the entire formation.

A circular schiltron is a static defense. They drive stakes into the ground around them and stay there. You couldn't just pick them up them quickly move somewhere else, and if you left the stakes and moved, you'd be forced to form a wall. A regular phalanx would be far more maneuverable simply because it's a mobile formation.

[Nirvash Type TheEND]

o

Damn you history channel. : ' (

[Fordorsia]

[Nirvash Type TheEND]

Oh no, not autoeroticism! Now everyone knows my fetish!

[Sevvania]

*laments inability to art LMG*
Was browsing DeviantArt and found this picture by someone called Werdandi. Figured it looked fairly *Sevvania*, so I'm thinking about attempting to recreate the MG.

Looks like it might need some modification, like a feed tray and maybe a Bergmann MG 15nA-style stock. Anything else?

[Vancon]

*laments inability to art LMG*
Was browsing DeviantArt and found this picture by someone called Werdandi. Figured it looked fairly *Sevvania*, so I'm thinking about attempting to recreate the MG.
(Image)
Looks like it might need some modification, like a feed tray or something. Anything else?

Well, the grip looks, uh, nifty.

[Tekeristan]

Would you guys suggest using the 7.62×39mm or the 5.56 round?

[Laywenrania]

Would you guys suggest using the 7.62×39mm or the 5.56 round?

5,45x39mm

[Sevvania]

*laments inability to art LMG*
Was browsing DeviantArt and found this picture by someone called Werdandi. Figured it looked fairly *Sevvania*, so I'm thinking about attempting to recreate the MG.
(Image)
Looks like it might need some modification, like a feed tray or something. Anything else?

Well, the grip looks, uh, nifty.

The phallic grip and the fact that the image snippet is at groin-level is pure coincidence.

The pistol grip will probably be one of the things I change, though.

[Imperializt Russia]

*laments inability to art LMG*
Was browsing DeviantArt and found this picture by someone called Werdandi. Figured it looked fairly *Sevvania*, so I'm thinking about attempting to recreate the MG.
(Image)
Looks like it might need some modification, like a feed tray and maybe a Bergmann MG 15nA-style stock. Anything else?

For what it's worth, here's a hi-res model of the weapon itself:
http://freelancer89.deviantart.com/art/ ... n-38341308
(linked in the artist's description).

It seems to be a high-power rifle, hence the lack of obvious feed mechanism, action and possibly peculiar grip.

[Nirvash Type TheEND]

Would you guys suggest using the 7.62×39mm or the 5.56 round?

5,45x39mm

7.62x45. Ball's in your court.

[Fordorsia]

*laments inability to art LMG*
Was browsing DeviantArt and found this picture by someone called Werdandi. Figured it looked fairly *Sevvania*, so I'm thinking about attempting to recreate the MG.
(Image)
Looks like it might need some modification, like a feed tray or something. Anything else?

Well, the grip looks, uh, nifty.

It's for hooking shields

[Laywenrania]

5,45x39mm

7.62x45. Ball's in your court.

6x49mm

[Sevvania]

*laments inability to art LMG*
Was browsing DeviantArt and found this picture by someone called Werdandi. Figured it looked fairly *Sevvania*, so I'm thinking about attempting to recreate the MG.
(Image)
Looks like it might need some modification, like a feed tray and maybe a Bergmann MG 15nA-style stock. Anything else?

For what it's worth, here's a hi-res model of the weapon itself:
http://freelancer89.deviantart.com/art/ ... n-38341308
(linked in the artist's description).

It seems to be a high-power rifle, hence the lack of obvious feed mechanism, action and possibly peculiar grip.

How did I miss that link *faves*

I originally thought that it was some sort of rifle, but I figured it was close enough to tubular LMGs like the MG15 that the basic design could be adapted to that purpose.

[Nirvash Type TheEND]

7.62x45. Ball's in your court.

6x49mm

6.5 Federov.

[Laywenrania]

6.5 Federov.

7,62x54

[Nirvash Type TheEND]

6.5 Federov.

7,62x54

That's hardly an intermediate. : ' (

[Laywenrania]

7,62x54

That's hardly an intermediate. : ' (

But it's glorious

[Vancon]

203mm for all your handheld weaponry.

[Immoren]

Would you guys suggest using the 7.62×39mm or the 5.56 round?

Would you guys suggest using the 7.62×39mm or the 5.56 round?

5,45x39mm

5,45x39mm

7.62x45. Ball's in your court.

7.62x45. Ball's in your court.

6x49mm

6x49mm

6.5 Federov.

6.5 Federov.

7,62x54

203mm for all your handheld weaponry.

Use eight sided die to pick one of these.