Christian Persecution. Is it ok?

[Treznor]

What, you think Christian mystics aren't genuinely Christian? Shall I point you to the No True Scotsman fallacy? The Holocaust was very much an example of religious persecution, since they went after not only Jews but Gypsies, homosexuals and anyone else not morally/racially pure. Like so many white supremacists, they linked moral purity with racial purity under the big tent of religion. They were Christians, just like the Christians who oppressed the people of India for their own good, the Christians who brought God, guns and disease to South America, the Christians who put pagans to the sword or the torch throughout Europe and so forth.

Persecution is bad. Christians who whine about being persecuted for their faith are just pathetic.

This is utter bullshit, the only religious (and they are extremely tenuous) connection you can put on the ordering of genocide was ancient Germanic and Norse myths that pre-dated Christianity celebrating the strengths and alleged warrior like properties of the Aryan race and their ancient tribes. The person mostly responsible for the Holocaust other than Hitler (and he was arguably MORE responsible), was Himmler, where the only religious connection to his views on the Aryan race (other than the 'survival of the fittest' rhetoric) were based on Meso-Pagan beliefs. Having actually studied the motivation for the holocaust, I don't remember a single thing that Christianity had to do with it - people who engage in historical revisionism in order to try and get a +1 against Christianity are pathetic.

Thank you for attempting to cover the topic with bullshit, but it doesn't change the Christian nature or motivations of the Nazis, whatever else may have been thrown into the mix. They rallied Christian sentiment, cozied up to the Church and pursued their vendetta in the name of God. Trying to shift the blame onto "Meso-Pagan beliefs" doesn't change anything. The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution, and your own historical revisionism doesn't change that.

[Buffett and Colbert]

Yeah that really makes sense. I guess it must be okay to beat up random Mongols given their history.

I see your not arguing the Christian history of persecution but you must have missed the part where I said I was against violence so I will put it in again
“I want the cascade or religious propaganda to end but I do not support violence to do it”
But I am sure it is easier for you to ignore that part.

fuh fuh fuh I have no knowledge of history fuh

Care to enlighten me. When did atheists go about killing people who when non-atheists in large organised numbers? I look forward to the history lesson but if you cant find it I assume this was a statement about as truthful as your assertion I supported violence

He's going to invoke the religious persecution of the Soviet regime, as well as the Communist Revolution, as though they were committed in the name of the most holy Atheism.

Thanks for the warning. I can counter hilter with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Hitler's_religious_views where he was born catholic, spoke possitively of Germans Christian heritage and head voices telling him what to do in war.
I personally believe he was a non dominational Christian that believe he was blessed by God to conquer the world.
As for Stalin I accept the government tried to enforce athiesm there. But they did a greater job at killing themselves than others especially during world war 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_casualties

snip .

Your own source disproves this. Did you read the entire thing? Hitler claimed Christianity was central to Nazism in public to gain the support of church leaders and conservative Germans, many of whom were very religious. Hitler himself despised Christianity as a "symptom of decay, an offshoot of Judaism". As stated in your own source. He was not a Christian of any sort.

That doesn't make Nazism any less a Christian organization, or Hitler ordering genocide any less religiously-motivated.

It really wasn't religiously motivated. It was motivated by ethnicity.

[Buffett and Colbert]

and pursued their vendetta in the name of God the Fürher.

The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution

LolWUT?

[Hydesland]

They rallied Christian sentiment

They rallied socialist workers/sentiment, that doesn't make them a truly workers party. You have to remember that their policy was to explicitly lie to every single class and cultural group in order to rally support, they despised democracy so used fraudulent methods for their own ends.

Trying to shift the blame onto "Meso-Pagan beliefs" doesn't change anything. The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution, and your own historical revisionism doesn't change that.

It was an example of Christian persecution as much as it was 'moustache' persecution, Hitler had a moustache, therefore clearly it was Hitler's moustache that caused him to engage in genocide right? If you label the genocide as 'Christian' persecution, then there is nothing wrong with labelling the USSR as 'atheist persecution'. You've deliberately used retarded usage of the word which is never used in academia, when people use the term '[insert religion here] persecution', they're not describing what some of the members of the state happen to call themselves, but they are talking about the explicit reasons for doing what they do.

[HayBal]

Persecution is wrong regardless of religion, ethnicity, race, etc. Unless the individual murdered somebody, there is no justification for it.

[Puff-Puff-Pass Land]

and pursued their vendetta in the name of God the Fürher.

The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution

LolWUT?

Um... Yeah!
Persecution of the Jews BY Christians!

[Puff-Puff-Pass Land]

Persecution is wrong regardless of religion, ethnicity, race, etc. Unless the individual murdered somebody, there is no justification for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inquisition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquista
A- HEM

[EvilDarkMagicians]

and pursued their vendetta in the name of God the Fürher.

The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution

LolWUT?

Treznor, you taking your anti-religion sentiment too far.

[Treznor]

and pursued their vendetta in the name of God the Fürher.

The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution

LolWUT?

Treznor, you taking your anti-religion sentiment too far.

Wait, what? Does...not...compute....

[Buffett and Colbert]

and pursued their vendetta in the name of God the Fürher.

The Holocaust was another example of Christian persecution

LolWUT?

Um... Yeah!
Persecution of the Jews BY Christians!

Oooooooooooh...

[Tokos]

The Jewish Holocaust, unlike earlier forms of anti-Jewish persecution, was explicitly rallied in racial and national security terms, not in religious terms.

It does not fit with, for example, medieval pogroms.

[New Chalcedon]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

It is not OK to persecute Christians, or any other group, on the basis of their beliefs. But Christianity is not persecuted. Does PC go to far on occasion? Yes - I am minded of a certain case where Nativity decorations were removed from a public place because non-Christians mught get offended (a case of sheer mean-spiritedness: I would have gritted my teeth and borne it rather than being gratuitiously offended - after all, it doesn't hurt me to have their religious symbols on display). This does NOT equate to persecution.

And, in response to someone quite a few pages ago quoting the 'spoiled child' syndrome: absolutely. Since the founding of the Colonies, Christians have had it their way 100% of the time, to the extent of witch burnings, stonings and public vilification of any political figure stupid enough not to pay at least lip-service to their faith. Now Christian leaders are being told that their will is not the law, and they're whining and carrying on like four-year-olds with their favourite lollipops taken off of them.

[Hydesland]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

[Treznor]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

You do know the OP was focusing on claims of persecution against Christians in the West, right?

[New Chalcedon]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

2 of the 3 references provided by the OP, as I noticed, fall into the US. Do pardon me for actually addressing the OP's point, rather than haring off into the screed of my choice. /snark

[Hydesland]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

You do know the OP was focusing on claims of persecution against Christians in the West, right?

But the third link pretty clearly gives non western examples.

[Puff-Puff-Pass Land]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

2 of the 3 references provided by the OP, as I noticed, fall into the US. Do pardon me for actually addressing the OP's point, rather than haring off into the screed of my choice. /snark

You're not excused. Follow proper etiquette next time.

[New Chalcedon]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

2 of the 3 references provided by the OP, as I noticed, fall into the US. Do pardon me for actually addressing the OP's point, rather than haring off into the screed of my choice. /snark

You're not excused. Follow proper etiquette next time.

And what's that? Seeing a topic marginally related to my interest of choice and haring off on that tangency in a 3-page screed? *puff* *puff* *passes back*

[Puff-Puff-Pass Land]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

2 of the 3 references provided by the OP, as I noticed, fall into the US. Do pardon me for actually addressing the OP's point, rather than haring off into the screed of my choice. /snark

You're not excused. Follow proper etiquette next time.

And what's that? Seeing a topic marginally related to my interest of choice and haring off on that tangency in a 3-page screed? *puff* *puff* *passes back*

Exactly! I'm glad you're catching on!

[Farnhamia]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

You do know the OP was focusing on claims of persecution against Christians in the West, right?

That was my impression. Two of his three links were stories of Christians being killed in the US, while the third was a catch-all site covering the whole world. No one here denies that Christians come under attack in countries outside the West, perhaps especially in areas where they are not the dominant or even a large minority religion. That Chrsitians are persecuted in the more developed nations is crap.

[Treznor]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

You do know the OP was focusing on claims of persecution against Christians in the West, right?

But the third link pretty clearly gives non western examples.

One link absolves the OP from hypocrisy? I don't think so.

Most everyone has said something or other to the effect of "persecution bad, mm'kay?" Having said that, we've pointed out how the OP is claiming persecution against Christians where Christians dominate the culture, ignoring persecution by Christians against others and generally playing the victim card. So, no. It's horrible that Christians are being persecuted elsewhere in the world, and it's likewise horrible that Christians are persecuting people. Focusing on Christians as some sort of privileged class earns a beatdown for hypocrisy.

[Kayliea]

Persecution is wrong regardless of religion, ethnicity, race, etc. Unless the individual murdered somebody, there is no justification for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inquisition
A- HEM

add: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquista to that list

[Puff-Puff-Pass Land]

In reference to the OP, a few incidents of violence does not a case for persecution make.

Is Christianity vilified by those in or seeking power? No.
Is Christianity a shameful secret that must be hidden from the public if you wish to be elected to office? No.
Do the police not respond to attacks on Christians? As far as I can tell, they do.
Are Christian churches denied building permits or regularly raided by police on suspicion of "vice"? No.

You know there is a world outside of the west, right?

You do know the OP was focusing on claims of persecution against Christians in the West, right?

But the third link pretty clearly gives non western examples.

One link absolves the OP from hypocrisy? I don't think so.

Most everyone has said something or other to the effect of "persecution bad, mm'kay?" Having said that, we've pointed out how the OP is claiming persecution against Christians where Christians dominate the culture, ignoring persecution by Christians against others and generally playing the victim card. So, no. It's horrible that Christians are being persecuted elsewhere in the world, and it's likewise horrible that Christians are persecuting people. Focusing on Christians as some sort of privileged class earns a beatdown for hypocrisy.

You haven't heard yet? Christians are the only ones in the world who deserve to breathe. All others waste our air.

[Puff-Puff-Pass Land]

Persecution is wrong regardless of religion, ethnicity, race, etc. Unless the individual murdered somebody, there is no justification for it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inquisition
A- HEM

add: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquista to that list

Thank you kindly. If I could direct your attention to my original post...

[Kayliea]

awesome!