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Nuclear Weapons: Your Opinion

For discussion and debate about anything. (Not a roleplay related forum; out-of-character commentary only.)

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Do you oppose Nuclear Weapons?

No
182
50%
Yes
136
38%
Other (Please State)
44
12%
 
Total votes : 362

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The Conez Imperium
Minister
 
Posts: 3053
Founded: Nov 23, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby The Conez Imperium » Sat Sep 10, 2016 2:32 am

In my opinion nuclear weapons are immoral as David Lange argued, It is a defense which disturbs far more than it reassures. The weapon simply has its own relentless logic and it is inhuman. It is the logic of escalation, the logic of the arms race. Nuclear weapons make us insecure and to compensate for our insecurity we build and deploy more nuclear weapons. A system of defense serves its purpose if it guarantees the security of those it protects. A system of nuclear defence guarantees only insecurity as the means of defense terrorise as much as the means of attack. The fear they inspire is not a justification for their existence.
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Lydenburg
Senator
 
Posts: 4592
Founded: May 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Lydenburg » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:21 pm

Get rid of the blerrie things. I have no faith whatsoever in the Yanks' ability to wisely manage a nuclear arsenal. Ditto for the Kremlin. To say nothing of a place as horrendously unstable as Pakistan.

And while we're at it, Zuma needs to dump all the crap we've still got left over from our own nuke programme before terrorists get their hands on it and hold the country to ransom.

Ek bly in Australie nou, maar Afrika sal altyd in my hart wees. Maak nie saak wat gebeur nie, ek is trots om te kan sê ek is 'n kind van hierdie ingewikkelde soms wrede kontinent. Mis jou altyd my Suid-Afrika, hier met n seer hart al die pad van Melbourne af!


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Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38385
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Novus America » Sat Sep 10, 2016 12:29 pm

Lydenburg wrote:Get rid of the blerrie things. I have no faith whatsoever in the Yanks' ability to wisely manage a nuclear arsenal. Ditto for the Kremlin. To say nothing of a place as horrendously unstable as Pakistan.

And while we're at it, Zuma needs to dump all the crap we've still got left over from our own nuke programme before terrorists get their hands on it and hold the country to ransom.


Without nuclear weapons the risk of conventional war would greatly increase.
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Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. I support what is good for the country, which means I cannot support either party.

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Lydenburg
Senator
 
Posts: 4592
Founded: May 20, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Lydenburg » Sat Sep 10, 2016 1:38 pm

Novus America wrote:
Lydenburg wrote:Get rid of the blerrie things. I have no faith whatsoever in the Yanks' ability to wisely manage a nuclear arsenal. Ditto for the Kremlin. To say nothing of a place as horrendously unstable as Pakistan.

And while we're at it, Zuma needs to dump all the crap we've still got left over from our own nuke programme before terrorists get their hands on it and hold the country to ransom.


Without nuclear weapons the risk of conventional war would greatly increase.


F.W. de Klerk got rid of our nukes and I would say the risk of conventional war hasn't gotten any higher for us. If anything, it improved relations and eased tensions with our neighbours.

Ek bly in Australie nou, maar Afrika sal altyd in my hart wees. Maak nie saak wat gebeur nie, ek is trots om te kan sê ek is 'n kind van hierdie ingewikkelde soms wrede kontinent. Mis jou altyd my Suid-Afrika, hier met n seer hart al die pad van Melbourne af!


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Imperializt Russia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54873
Founded: Jun 03, 2011
Corporate Police State

Postby Imperializt Russia » Sat Sep 10, 2016 1:43 pm

Lydenburg wrote:
Novus America wrote:
Without nuclear weapons the risk of conventional war would greatly increase.


F.W. de Klerk got rid of our nukes and I would say the risk of conventional war hasn't gotten any higher for us. If anything, it improved relations and eased tensions with our neighbours.

There's an argument that South Africa's (Apartheid-era) nuclear arms weren't to be used against Angola or whoever, but a possible black civil revolt.

But anyway, the nuclear arms in Europe, and the arms held by the people that put them there, have largely prevented another European war.
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Novus America
Post Czar
 
Posts: 38385
Founded: Jun 02, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Novus America » Sat Sep 10, 2016 2:01 pm

Lydenburg wrote:
Novus America wrote:
Without nuclear weapons the risk of conventional war would greatly increase.


F.W. de Klerk got rid of our nukes and I would say the risk of conventional war hasn't gotten any higher for us. If anything, it improved relations and eased tensions with our neighbours.


For you, yes. Because you face no conventional military threats anyways. It is different for different countries. You are better off without them. India is better off with them for example.

Nuclear weapons are not for everyone.
___|_|___ _|__*__|_

Zombie Ike/Teddy Roosevelt 2020.

Novus America represents my vision of an awesome Atompunk near future United States of America expanded to the entire North American continent, Guyana and the Philippines. The population would be around 700 million.
Think something like prewar Fallout, minus the bad stuff.

Politically I am an independent. I support what is good for the country, which means I cannot support either party.

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Indo-Malaysia
Minister
 
Posts: 2592
Founded: Nov 07, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Indo-Malaysia » Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:42 pm

Imperializt Russia wrote:
Lydenburg wrote:
F.W. de Klerk got rid of our nukes and I would say the risk of conventional war hasn't gotten any higher for us. If anything, it improved relations and eased tensions with our neighbours.

There's an argument that South Africa's (Apartheid-era) nuclear arms weren't to be used against Angola or whoever, but a possible black civil revolt.

But anyway, the nuclear arms in Europe, and the arms held by the people that put them there, have largely prevented another European war.

I think the Nuke would get rid of more than just the revolt.
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The Great Devourer of All
Minister
 
Posts: 2940
Founded: Dec 26, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby The Great Devourer of All » Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:44 pm

Horrible examples of the worst aspects of humanity, but strategically necessary.
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Indo-Malaysia
Minister
 
Posts: 2592
Founded: Nov 07, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby Indo-Malaysia » Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:49 pm

The Great Devourer of All wrote:Horrible examples of the worst aspects of humanity, but strategically necessary.

Agreed. They are a necessary evil.
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Tule
Senator
 
Posts: 3886
Founded: Jan 29, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Tule » Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:17 pm

Nuclear weapons have outlived their usefulness.

They made sense when they had a low yield, could be delivered with re-callable bombers and when conventional weapons were inaccurate and necessitated higher troop densities.

With high-yield ballistic missiles that must be launched on warning the risk of an accidental nuclear war has risen drastically.
At the same time, the introduction of precision guided weapons and digital fire control systems has made conventional warfare much less bloody and much more difficult to sustain.
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Ban Pho
Diplomat
 
Posts: 569
Founded: Aug 20, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Ban Pho » Sat Dec 17, 2016 1:35 pm

I guess it wouldn't hurt if Sweden had some...

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Grand Proletaria
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 132
Founded: Dec 13, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Grand Proletaria » Sat Dec 17, 2016 1:38 pm

Well we haven't had a WWIII.
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Pope Joan
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 19500
Founded: Mar 11, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby Pope Joan » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:08 pm

There was a short story, it may have been by Ray Bradbury or perhaps Kurt Vonnegut.

A scientist has devised a weapon which can kill all life on the planet. He is planning to give it to his government.

His friend cannot dissuade him from this plan. He has a handgun. Before he goes, he loads it and puts it in the playpen of his friend's child.

His friend discovers this in time to prevent tragedy. "What kind of fool or devil would put a killing tool into ignorant hands?" he screamed.

He didn't get it, did he.
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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 87633
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:11 pm

Nuclear weapons should be gotten rid of entirely. They are horrible terrible devices that no one should have. The US should get of its nuclear arsenal. If you dont want other countries to have them you cant be hypocritical.

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Imperializt Russia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54873
Founded: Jun 03, 2011
Corporate Police State

Postby Imperializt Russia » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:13 pm

San Lumen wrote:Nuclear weapons should be gotten rid of entirely. They are horrible terrible devices that no one should have. The US should get of its nuclear arsenal. If you dont want other countries to have them you cant be hypocritical.

Now Russia has a large, exceedingly large and literally unparalleled nuclear arsenal.

And precisely no reason to remove it.
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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 87633
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:14 pm

Imperializt Russia wrote:
San Lumen wrote:Nuclear weapons should be gotten rid of entirely. They are horrible terrible devices that no one should have. The US should get of its nuclear arsenal. If you dont want other countries to have them you cant be hypocritical.

Now Russia has a large, exceedingly large and literally unparalleled nuclear arsenal.

And precisely no reason to remove it.

No country should have them

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Internationalist Bastard
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24520
Founded: Aug 09, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:17 pm

Well It's stopped Russia and the US from going to war, and it's kept violence on the quicker end when it comes to Pakistan and India
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San Lumen
Post Kaiser
 
Posts: 87633
Founded: Jul 02, 2009
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby San Lumen » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:19 pm

Internationalist Bastard wrote:Well It's stopped Russia and the US from going to war, and it's kept violence on the quicker end when it comes to Pakistan and India

It still is a horrible weapon no one should have and someone mentally unstable is about to get control of the nuclear arsenal of the United States.

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Internationalist Bastard
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 24520
Founded: Aug 09, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Internationalist Bastard » Sat Dec 17, 2016 2:20 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Well It's stopped Russia and the US from going to war, and it's kept violence on the quicker end when it comes to Pakistan and India

It still is a horrible weapon no one should have and someone mentally unstable is about to get control of the nuclear arsenal of the United States.

Meh, they said the same thing about Reagan.
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I am a girl, damnit
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Dooom35796821595
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9309
Founded: Sep 11, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dooom35796821595 » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:17 pm

San Lumen wrote:
Internationalist Bastard wrote:Well It's stopped Russia and the US from going to war, and it's kept violence on the quicker end when it comes to Pakistan and India

It still is a horrible weapon no one should have and someone mentally unstable is about to get control of the nuclear arsenal of the United States.


You know the president can't arbitrary launch the nuclear deterrent, right? It requires certain scenarios, like Russia launching first, or open war between the US and another nuclear power like Russia or China.

And it's really not that bad, people just think it's worse then it is.
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The East Marches
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13843
Founded: May 14, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby The East Marches » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:18 pm

Dooom35796821595 wrote:
San Lumen wrote:It still is a horrible weapon no one should have and someone mentally unstable is about to get control of the nuclear arsenal of the United States.


You know the president can't arbitrary launch the nuclear deterrent, right? It requires certain scenarios, like Russia launching first, or open war between the US and another nuclear power like Russia or China.

And it's really not that bad, people just think it's worse then it is.


I don't believe we ever said no to a first strike policy.
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Democratic East-Asia
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6068
Founded: Aug 30, 2016
Democratic Socialists

Postby Democratic East-Asia » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:20 pm

Pretty explosions. That's all.
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Dooom35796821595
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 9309
Founded: Sep 11, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Dooom35796821595 » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:25 pm

The East Marches wrote:
Dooom35796821595 wrote:
You know the president can't arbitrary launch the nuclear deterrent, right? It requires certain scenarios, like Russia launching first, or open war between the US and another nuclear power like Russia or China.

And it's really not that bad, people just think it's worse then it is.


I don't believe we ever said no to a first strike policy.


Or open war between the US and another nuclear power like Russia or China. I doubt anyone will let Trump launch nukes over a trade issue with China, or Mexican immigration.
When life gives you lemons, you BURN THEIR HOUSE DOWN!
Anything can be justified if it is cool. If at first you don't succeed, destroy all in your way.
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Greed and Death
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 53383
Founded: Mar 20, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Greed and Death » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:26 pm

You have to nuke something
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Imperializt Russia
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 54873
Founded: Jun 03, 2011
Corporate Police State

Postby Imperializt Russia » Sat Dec 17, 2016 3:26 pm

The East Marches wrote:
Dooom35796821595 wrote:
You know the president can't arbitrary launch the nuclear deterrent, right? It requires certain scenarios, like Russia launching first, or open war between the US and another nuclear power like Russia or China.

And it's really not that bad, people just think it's worse then it is.


I don't believe we ever said no to a first strike policy.

You literally have.
And so has every other properly established nuclear power (the original five).
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