[US Election 2016] Democratic Primary Megathread III

[Galloism]

Psst, you can do your part to prevent that by showing up and voting for Hillary.

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Well, it does in the aggregate, unless you don't live in a swing state.

PSST: Texas and Mississippi *might* be swing states this year. Hilariously.

[Gauthier]

Psst, you can do your part to prevent that by showing up and voting for Hillary.

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Yep. You only joined up with Bernie because you thought it was cool. Didn't even fucking bother to understand his vision and what he was planning with it.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Psst, you can do your part to prevent that by showing up and voting for Hillary.

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Probably because your vote matters. These people aren't selected by drawing names out of a hat.

[Ameriganastan]

I'm "sour", cause Trump just won the goddamn presidency.

You want to waste your right to vote, that's your call.

I would appreciate it, however, if you would stop trying to encourage others to do likewise by telling them the election is already lost in fucking July.

Well, I don't know how to sugarcoat it, but that's exactly what it is. It's either waste my vote on Hillary, which wont matter cause she won't win anyway, or just not vote. I'm going with option B.

[The Romulan Republic]

Psst, you can do your part to prevent that by showing up and voting for Hillary.

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Voting is, by nature, a collective enterprise. One vote will seldom win an election, but if enough people say their vote doesn't matter... it matters.

Many great things are achieved by the efforts of millions. To say that something does not matter because you can't do it alone, frankly, stinks of egotism.

[Galloism]

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Probably because your vote matters. These people aren't selected by drawing names out of a hat.

That might arguably be a better system.

[Ameriganastan]

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Yep. You only joined up with Bernie because you thought it was cool. Didn't even fucking bother to understand his vision and what he was planning with it.

I already explained why I was pulling for Bernie. So save it.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

You want to waste your right to vote, that's your call.

I would appreciate it, however, if you would stop trying to encourage others to do likewise by telling them the election is already lost in fucking July.

Well, I don't know how to sugarcoat it, but that's exactly what it is. It's either waste my vote on Hillary, which wont matter cause she won't win anyway, or just not vote. I'm going with option B.

It's insane. You can't even see the contradictions in your own argument. You're willing to bitch about Trump probably winning (which isn't actually that probable), but not willing to do your part to try to make sure that it doesn't happen. Your credibility at this point is nonexistent.

[Gauthier]

Yep. You only joined up with Bernie because you thought it was cool. Didn't even fucking bother to understand his vision and what he was planning with it.

I already explained why I was pulling for Bernie. So save it.

Please. Your whining diatribe indicates you know jack shit about what Sanders sees, and that is a strong indication that you only signed up hoping for cool points.

[The Romulan Republic]

You want to waste your right to vote, that's your call.

I would appreciate it, however, if you would stop trying to encourage others to do likewise by telling them the election is already lost in fucking July.

Well, I don't know how to sugarcoat it, but that's exactly what it is. It's either waste my vote on Hillary, which wont matter cause she won't win anyway, or just not vote. I'm going with option B.

Let us say, for the sake of argument, that you are right. Let us say that God Almighty descended from Heaven today and told us that Trump would win, no matter what.

I would still say go out and vote. Use your God damn right to stand up and say that Trump is not my choice. That I will not sit silently as fascistic buffoon and possible Putin lap dog takes over America. Add your voice to those who said no.

At least then you will be able to say that you stood for something other than apathy.

[The Romulan Republic]

Hell, vote down ballot. Vote for Congress and Governor.

The Presidency is not the be all and end all of politics.

[G-Tech Corporation]

Hell, vote down ballot. Vote for Congress and Governor.

The Presidency is not the be all and end all of politics.

Shush. Stop spreading your filthy Clintonite lies. The downballot must continue to be ignored by all liberals, thus say I, representative of the vast right wing oligarchy.

[Ameriganastan]

Hell, vote down ballot. Vote for Congress and Governor.

The Presidency is not the be all and end all of politics.

Better idea. I'll do none of that, and go play League of Legends. Cause I'm tired of this for today. Toodles.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Yep. You only joined up with Bernie because you thought it was cool. Didn't even fucking bother to understand his vision and what he was planning with it.

I already explained why I was pulling for Bernie. So save it.

Did you miss the part about us all being in this together, and how during the debates, he said that regardless of their differences, Hillary Clinton and him were still one hundred times better than any of the Republicans? Or did you just hear the bits about a rigged system, and think "Yeah! Rigged system! Fight the man!" with no thought the the amount of civic responsibility that it actually takes to work against a rigged system?

[Gauthier]

Hell, vote down ballot. Vote for Congress and Governor.

The Presidency is not the be all and end all of politics.

Better idea. I'll do none of that, and go play League of Legends. Cause I'm tired of this for today. Toodles.

So you just wanted attention when you were never planning to do shit in the first place.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Hell, vote down ballot. Vote for Congress and Governor.

The Presidency is not the be all and end all of politics.

Better idea. I'll do none of that, and go play League of Legends. Cause I'm tired of this for today. Toodles.

Probably for the best. At this point, and considering your judgment skills, I'm not sure that I'd trust you with the responsibility of holding a remote control, much less voting.

[The Romulan Republic]

Better idea. I'll do none of that, and go play League of Legends. Cause I'm tired of this for today. Toodles.

Probably for the best. At this point, and considering your judgment skills, I'm not sure that I'd trust you with the responsibility of holding a remote control, much less voting.

Now that I would not agree with.

Everyone should exercise their right to vote. God knows people have paid a high price for that right. I wouldn't tell even a Trump supporter not to vote.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Probably for the best. At this point, and considering your judgment skills, I'm not sure that I'd trust you with the responsibility of holding a remote control, much less voting.

Now that I would not agree with.

Everyone should exercise their right to vote. God knows people have paid a high price for that right. I wouldn't tell even a Trump supporter not to vote.

I won't block people from voting, but if someone has terrible judgment skills, I'm not necessarily going to encourage them to do so.

[Corrian]

Oh great, more of the worst of the Sanders supporters. Ameriganastan clearly is someone who can't remotely be reasoned with.

[Occupied Deutschland]

Oh, this again. The "Your vote matters" spiel. I get this every time I come in here.

Probably because your vote matters. These people aren't selected by drawing names out of a hat.

They're selected by the national committee drawing one name out of a hat they'd filled with slips of paper with that name written on them.
At least in the case of the DNC. The RNC apparently preferred the 'whatchagot stew' method this go-around and ended up with a big steaming bowl of feces in their hands instead of a hat.

[Senkaku]

Oh great, more of the worst of the Sanders supporters. Ameriganastan clearly is someone who can't remotely be reasoned with.

The stuff that memes are born of hath touched this thread tonight.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

Probably because your vote matters. These people aren't selected by drawing names out of a hat.

They're selected by the national committee drawing one name out of a hat they'd filled with slips of paper with that name written on them.
At least in the case of the DNC. The RNC apparently preferred the 'whatchagot stew' method this go-around and ended up with a big steaming bowl of feces in their hands instead of a hat.

No.

Five people ran for the nomination. Two never got any traction at all, and dropped out early. A third couldn't find a message that worked, and eventually dropped out to endorse Hillary. Bernie put up a good fight, but regardless of bias on the part of the DNC, he lost it fair and square, as both he and his campaign spokesperson have said. This was not collusion, it was not collaboration, it was a democratic process that produced a result that I found to be somewhat disappointing, but still acceptable.

[Occupied Deutschland]

They're selected by the national committee drawing one name out of a hat they'd filled with slips of paper with that name written on them.
At least in the case of the DNC. The RNC apparently preferred the 'whatchagot stew' method this go-around and ended up with a big steaming bowl of feces in their hands instead of a hat.

No.

Five people ran for the nomination. Two never got any traction at all, and dropped out early. A second couldn't find a message that worked, and eventually dropped out to endorse Hillary. Bernie put up a good fight, but regardless of bias on the part of the DNC, he lost it fair and square, as both he and his campaign spokesperson have said. This was not collusion, it was not collaboration, it was a democratic process that produced a result that I found to be somewhat disappointing, but still acceptable.

Collusion and collaboration can exist within an otherwise nominally democratic process.
Would Clinton have won even without superdelegates and friends in high places pulling for her? Probably so. Does this negate the institutional fuckedness that is the superdelegate system and the DNC being biased in her favor? Nope. Because thanks to aforementioned superdelegate system and DNC bias, we won't actually know for sure because what was going on wasn't a 'democratic process', it was a predetermined outcome that experienced some bumpiness because the predetermined candidate proved less popular than expected in comparison to an aging hippie nutbar and that bumpiness was quickly worked against by the DNC in the hopes of limiting any long-term damage to the party from the predetermined nature being demonstrated by aforementioned aging hippie nutbar.

Or, in other words, Exhibit #1,389 of why the American electorate is apathetic and cynical of the political process.

[Yumyumsuppertime]

No.

Five people ran for the nomination. Two never got any traction at all, and dropped out early. A second couldn't find a message that worked, and eventually dropped out to endorse Hillary. Bernie put up a good fight, but regardless of bias on the part of the DNC, he lost it fair and square, as both he and his campaign spokesperson have said. This was not collusion, it was not collaboration, it was a democratic process that produced a result that I found to be somewhat disappointing, but still acceptable.

Collusion and collaboration can exist within an otherwise nominally democratic process.
Would Clinton have won even without superdelegates and friends in high places pulling for her? Probably so. Does this negate the institutional fuckedness that is the superdelegate system and the DNC being biased in her favor? Nope. Because thanks to aforementioned superdelegate system and DNC bias, we won't actually know for sure because what was going on wasn't a 'democratic process', it was a predetermined outcome that experienced some bumpiness because the predetermined candidate proved less popular than expected in comparison to an aging hippie nutbar and that bumpiness was quickly worked against by the DNC in the hopes of limiting any long-term damage to the party from the predetermined nature being demonstrated by aforementioned aging hippie nutbar.

Or, in other words, Exhibit #1,389 of why the American electorate is apathetic and cynical of the political process.

You have legitimate points. I've complained about the superdelegate system more than once, myself. I'm not going to complain about the endorsements that she managed to wrap up before the campaign even started, since that's just good strategy, and would be like bitching about someone exercising and stretching before a real race. Calling it a predetermined outcome is a bit of a stretch: If she did, it's because she knew exactly what she was doing every step of the way, and out-organized and out-campaigned the opposition. Looking ahead in this conversation, though, I have a nasty suspicion that we're going to get bogged down in semantics.

[Geadland]

[quote="Occupied Deutschland";p="29452065"][quote="Yumyumsuppertime";p="29452022"][quote="Occupied Deutschland";p="29451981"]
They're selected by the national committee drawing one name out of a hat they'd filled with slips of paper with that name written on them.
At least in the case of the DNC. The RNC apparently preferred the 'whatchagot stew' method this go-around and ended up with a big steaming bowl of feces in their hands instead of a hat.[/quote]

No.

Five people ran for the nomination. Two never got any traction at all, and dropped out early. A second couldn't find a message that worked, and eventually dropped out to endorse Hillary. Bernie put up a good fight, but regardless of bias on the part of the DNC, he lost it fair and square, as both he and his campaign spokesperson have said. This was not collusion, it was not collaboration, it was a democratic process that produced a result that I found to be somewhat disappointing, but still acceptable.[/quote]
Collusion and collaboration can exist within an otherwise nominally democratic process.
Would Clinton have won even without superdelegates and friends in high places pulling for her? Probably so. Does this negate the institutional fuckedness that is the superdelegate system and the DNC being biased in her favor? Nope. Because thanks to aforementioned superdelegate system and DNC bias, we won't actually know for sure because what was going on wasn't a 'democratic process', it was a predetermined outcome that experienced some bumpiness because the predetermined candidate proved less popular than expected in comparison to an aging hippie nutbar and that bumpiness was quickly worked against by the DNC in the hopes of limiting any long-term damage to the party from the predetermined nature being demonstrated by aforementioned aging hippie nutbar.

Or, in other words, Exhibit #1,389 of why the American electorate is apathetic and cynical of the political process.[/quote]




I think the real cause of the apathy and cynicism is that too many people think that the answer to America's political problems is to send a 'knight on a white horse' into Washington. A person who is radically different from the 'establishment', is untainted by their alleged failings and refuses to cave in on their beliefs. Sounds appealing right? The problem is, they can't agree on what type of person this should be - left, right or centre?

So Congress gets more polarised, less work gets done, promises are undelivered and the electorate are left let down but with nobody obvious to blame. Outsiders trying to rock the establishment keep promising less viable things. Notice how Donald Trump thinks he can slash taxes, balance the budget and make promises that cost masses of money.

The real problem with American politics is too much populism, not too little.