Should LGBT adoption be allowed?

[Thermodolia]

Wow.. That describes my father in a nutshell. That's scary.

I've seen parents who were like that, and I'll never understand why they think it's a good idea.

Well for my father it was what he grew up with.

[The Rich Port]

Psychology often speaks in generalities for a reason.

Not everybody fits perfectly, but a lot of people do.

Psychology isn't an exact science, but that's because it's specialization isn't exact either.

But what you said about authoritarian parents is my father exactly, and I'm pretty sure he was abuvise as well. Which is a major reason on why I'm scared to be a parent because I'm worried that I'll be like him.

Don't be.

You realize he was abusive. That's a start.

If you have children, just remember to stay vigilant.

And listen to your wife/husband if they ask you to tone it down.

Be strict, but fair. Listen to your children, but if they're wrong, you put your foot down. And at the end of the day, don't forget to tell them you love them, or be afraid to show when they've hurt you, angered you, or anything, because you'll always love them, even when they cause such emotions in you.

Also, no corporeal punishment.

My mother learned the hard way it's not the right thing to teach kids, to respond to bad things with automatic violence.

Especially when they're taller and physically stronger than you.

And don't be afraid to ask for help. Read books, go to a psychologist or therapist if you find yourself stressed to the point you're at your wit's end, maybe even splurge for family therapy if you think it's needed.

Peace is difficult to maintain, but nowhere near as messy and difficult to clean up as war.

[Thermodolia]

But what you said about authoritarian parents is my father exactly, and I'm pretty sure he was abuvise as well. Which is a major reason on why I'm scared to be a parent because I'm worried that I'll be like him.

Don't be.

You realize he was abusive. That's a start.

If you have children, just remember to stay vigilant.

And listen to your wife/husband if they ask you to tone it down.

Be strict, but fair. Listen to your children, but if they're wrong, you put your foot down. And at the end of the day, don't forget to tell them you love them, or be afraid to show when they've hurt you, angered you, or anything, because you'll always love them, even when they cause such emotions in you.

Also, no corporeal punishment.

My mother learned the hard way it's not the right thing to teach kids, to respond to bad things with automatic violence.

Especially when they're taller and physically stronger than you.

And don't be afraid to ask for help. Read books, go to a psychologist or therapist if you find yourself stressed to the point you're at your wit's end, maybe even splurge for family therapy if you think it's needed.

Peace is difficult to maintain, but nowhere near as messy and difficult to clean up as war.

Thanks. I don't think I could ever bring myself to hit my future kids, I don't know how my father and people like him did it.

[The Rich Port]

Don't be.

You realize he was abusive. That's a start.

If you have children, just remember to stay vigilant.

And listen to your wife/husband if they ask you to tone it down.

Be strict, but fair. Listen to your children, but if they're wrong, you put your foot down. And at the end of the day, don't forget to tell them you love them, or be afraid to show when they've hurt you, angered you, or anything, because you'll always love them, even when they cause such emotions in you.

Also, no corporeal punishment.

My mother learned the hard way it's not the right thing to teach kids, to respond to bad things with automatic violence.

Especially when they're taller and physically stronger than you.

And don't be afraid to ask for help. Read books, go to a psychologist or therapist if you find yourself stressed to the point you're at your wit's end, maybe even splurge for family therapy if you think it's needed.

Peace is difficult to maintain, but nowhere near as messy and difficult to clean up as war.

Thanks. I don't think I could ever bring myself to hit my future kids, I don't know how my father and people like him did it.

My parents admitted to me that they did it out of anger rather than a desire to discipline me. That's what corporeal punishment is usually for. Stress relief. Same as any violence, really.

I give credit to my father though... The few times he hit me he realized were for the wrong reasons. I've gotten very close to him recently. He dislikes seeing me sad. I think it reminds him of his own childhood with his mother. Though I still wish he hadn't wasted his life making money and throwing it away and using me and my sister as an excuse for working for that money. He's quite the prima-donna, dressing in expensive clothes all the time and buying new phones and computers. But I recently realized he's quite reasonable...

Compared to my mother, who is incredibly adamant about having her way, regardless of whether it's ridiculous or not. I used to pity her for having to put up with my father's antics and living in a world that discouraged her from having ambition... But she takes out her frustrations on me, and occasionally my sister, when she lets her. Always has.

... I don't like that. Not one bit.

My psychologist tells me I'm strong for putting up with it. She may have a point, but I certainly don't feel strong. In fact, I fear she's turned me into an asshole. I try to be patient with her, but it's like asking me to ignore a hurricane as the wind tears my face off.

A fat, unconfident, snobby dullard who is scared of doing anything for himself for fear of failure. I often feel I should stay this way. To spite her.

[Pulau Singapura]

Of course, there is zero problem with that. Don't let the old GOP folks fool you.

[Pope Joan]

The standard is "the best interests of the children". All we have to do is remove the presumption that those interests are best served by a hetero couple, and leave the rest of the standards the same ( emotional stability, records check, etc) and we should be fine.

[San Lumen]

The standard is "the best interests of the children". All we have to do is remove the presumption that those interests are best served by a hetero couple, and leave the rest of the standards the same ( emotional stability, records check, etc) and we should be fine.

Exactly and there is no evidence of any detriment to the child being raised by a same sex couple

[Renewed Dissonance]

I have heard that kids that have LGBT parents are slightly happier, but I haven't done research on that claim.

http://www.bu.edu/today/2013/gay-parent ... ight-ones/

"The lesbian mothers’ reports of their children “indicated that they had high levels of social, school/academic, and total competence and fewer social problems, rule-breaking, and aggressive and externalizing behavior compared with their age-matched counterparts,” Siegel and Perrin write."

http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/h ... -1.1365963

"...children of gay couples scored "significantly better" when it came to general health as well as family cohesion, meaning the families got along better with one another."

Here's some more, just because:

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=365783&p=27376156#p27376156

From the relatively little that I've read, parents sexuality basically makes no difference. Family life factors regardless of sexuality are far more important. I'd be interested in research concerning whether
same-sex families are significantly different along those factors. I would hypothesize that same-sex couples more liberal/tolerant -> more familial trust -> stronger relationships.

[Zottistan]

http://www.bu.edu/today/2013/gay-parent ... ight-ones/

"The lesbian mothers’ reports of their children “indicated that they had high levels of social, school/academic, and total competence and fewer social problems, rule-breaking, and aggressive and externalizing behavior compared with their age-matched counterparts,” Siegel and Perrin write."

http://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/h ... -1.1365963

"...children of gay couples scored "significantly better" when it came to general health as well as family cohesion, meaning the families got along better with one another."

Here's some more, just because:

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=365783&p=27376156#p27376156

From the relatively little that I've read, parents sexuality basically makes no difference. Family life factors regardless of sexuality are far more important. I'd be interested in research concerning whether
same-sex families are significantly different along those factors. I would hypothesize that same-sex couples more liberal/tolerant -> more familial trust -> stronger relationships.

I've read that it's been shown that a child's development is primarily decided by genetics and peers, and that provided parents aren't abusive or negligent they make little difference.

EDIT: I think it was Freakonomics. Can't remember.

[Opplandia]

I dont see any reason why LGBT-people shouldnt be allowed to adopt children. They can be as good or bad parents as heterosexuals, so no need to debate if 'good-or-bad-idea'. So, a clear Yes to the question in the threads title.

[The Rich Port]

I dont see any reason why LGBT-people shouldnt be allowed to adopt children. They can be as good or bad parents as heterosexuals, so no need to debate if 'good-or-bad-idea'. So, a clear Yes to the question in the threads title.

But people don't accept homosexuals!

WE CAN'T LET CHILDREN BE ABUSED BY... GIVING THEM TO LOVING HOMOSEXUAL PARENTS.

BECAUSE THEN THE WORLD IS GOING TO BE A DICK TO THEM.

Ah, but seriously, the fucking world needs to fucking get over itself, then.

Jesus fucking Christ...

[Hindia Belanda]

I dont see any reason why LGBT-people shouldnt be allowed to adopt children. They can be as good or bad parents as heterosexuals, so no need to debate if 'good-or-bad-idea'. So, a clear Yes to the question in the threads title.

What opplandia said

[San Lumen]

I dont see any reason why LGBT-people shouldnt be allowed to adopt children. They can be as good or bad parents as heterosexuals, so no need to debate if 'good-or-bad-idea'. So, a clear Yes to the question in the threads title.

But people don't accept homosexuals!

WE CAN'T LET CHILDREN BE ABUSED BY... GIVING THEM TO LOVING HOMOSEXUAL PARENTS.

BECAUSE THEN THE WORLD IS GOING TO BE A DICK TO THEM.

Ah, but seriously, the fucking world needs to fucking get over itself, then.

Jesus fucking Christ...

anyone that would do that is a terrible person who needs to mind their own business. Who cares if their parents are gay as long as they love them!?

[Calimera II]

I would say yes. However, I am not totally convinced it is the best choice. What creates richness is diversity. Children mature seeing their father and mother like this. Their identity matures being confronted with the love their father and mother have, confronted with this difference. It provides stability. So, I think the ideal situation would be for a child to have a mother and a father instead of two fathers or mothers or gender-fluid parents etc. Nevertheless, I must point out that I agree with almost all of you that same-sex couples can be great, loving and open-minded parents.

[San Lumen]

I would say yes. However, I am not totally convinced it is the best choice. What creates richness is diversity. Children mature seeing their father and mother like this. Their identity matures being confronted with the love their father and mother have, confronted with this difference. It provides stability. So, I think the ideal situation would be for a child to have a mother and a father instead of two fathers or mothers or gender-fluid parents etc. Nevertheless, I must point out that I agree with almost all of you that same-sex couples can be great, loving and open-minded parents.

however as i have said many times studies have shown there is no determent to the child whatsoever. I see what your saying though.

[Renewed Dissonance]

I would say yes. However, I am not totally convinced it is the best choice. What creates richness is diversity. Children mature seeing their father and mother like this. Their identity matures being confronted with the love their father and mother have, confronted with this difference. It provides stability. So, I think the ideal situation would be for a child to have a mother and a father instead of two fathers or mothers or gender-fluid parents etc. Nevertheless, I must point out that I agree with almost all of you that same-sex couples can be great, loving and open-minded parents.

It's not that they can be, so much as they are. The former implies that same-sex couples are obligated to reach some sort of predetermined "natural" standard.

Which all the research says they meet and/or exceed anyway. Probably because the hetero-"standard" isn't any such thing.

[The Rich Port]

Don't be.

You realize he was abusive. That's a start.

If you have children, just remember to stay vigilant.

And listen to your wife/husband if they ask you to tone it down.

Be strict, but fair. Listen to your children, but if they're wrong, you put your foot down. And at the end of the day, don't forget to tell them you love them, or be afraid to show when they've hurt you, angered you, or anything, because you'll always love them, even when they cause such emotions in you.

Also, no corporeal punishment.

My mother learned the hard way it's not the right thing to teach kids, to respond to bad things with automatic violence.

Especially when they're taller and physically stronger than you.

And don't be afraid to ask for help. Read books, go to a psychologist or therapist if you find yourself stressed to the point you're at your wit's end, maybe even splurge for family therapy if you think it's needed.

Peace is difficult to maintain, but nowhere near as messy and difficult to clean up as war.

Thanks. I don't think I could ever bring myself to hit my future kids, I don't know how my father and people like him did it.

Frankly, a lot of people do it because they don't know what else to do.

Parenting isn't something that's really taught, especially to boys. Girls at least get creepy monster dolls to play mother to.

The only thing most people seem to base their parenting on is on how their own parents raised them, regardless of whether they think it was effective or not. For whatever reason, I find parenting classes are really unpopular, even though they often help immensely. Maybe take a few, they'll probably help you decide. That's my experience, anyway.

That's surprisingly a common thing I hear from people: "I wouldn't be a good parent."

You don't know that until you tried, and even then, local governments, especially in the South, have a very liberal interpretation of what "good parenting" means, a reflection of themselves. So, if you're THAT worried, you can come down here and go nuts. Christian Scientists, anti-vaccination, the Atkins diet, corporeal punishment, right-wing family militias, survivalists... All very popular down here. It will amaze you how much people say thy love their children yet find reasons to do nothing in their benefit and/or put them deliberately in needless danger. If they have few problems (well, to be fair, I find they usually do... But, you know, my honest opinion and all...), someone who is educated and understanding of adults usually does pretty good with children.

The most common kind of abuse is neglect which, sadly, not many people recognize as such until it's too late. This can range from a child never really talking to their parents a lot because they work most of the time, which some children take in stride, to not being fed properly, varying from just irresponsible calorie intake to outright starvation or lethal malnutrition. Some parents can't control it, some can and simply don't care. Other kinds include leaving children locked in cars, home alone, handling things they shouldn't (like power tools and motor vehicles), and general lack of supervision. You don't have to stalk your child constantly, but at the very least maintaining a good level of attention to them reduces childhood injuries, costs due to accidents, and resentment due to what children perceive as ignorance on their mom or dad's part. If you suspect your child is severely injured (usually when their screams of pain won't stop no matter what you do in a single day), immediately take them to a doctor as soon as you can. In fact, regular doctor visits do wonders more than emergency ones, and they're usually cheaper.

The second most common one is emotional abuse. Different from physical abuse, which even spankers disagree with, emotional abuse is more subtle, characterized by passive-aggressiveness, and yet possibly even more damaging. Sure, spanking hurts and leaves marks and teaches problem solving through violence... But I would have rather been spanked if it meant I'd take less abuse from my mother nowadays. This ranges from ignoring your children's thoughts in favor of your own (often manifesting as "Respect your elders, they know more than you always" and "Don't question me. I'm your parent.") to deriding them (making fun of them, scaring them for your own amusement, asking them "what, are you stupid?" when they make an honest mistake) to harassing them (threatening them with violence beyond corporeal punishment, like "I'll kill you" or "I'll kill your friend" or "I'll shut a car door on your fingers" or "I'll spank you so hard you'll bleed", burdening them with excessive chores you yourself couldn't do, the old "washing the mouth out with soap" when you yourself may very well have taught them the habit of cursing by example, being childishly bothersome to them) to sabotaging them (taking action to prevent them from doing something that's fairly reasonable, like getting a driver's license, converting religion, getting a job the parent disagrees with, studying something the parent disagrees with, humiliating them in public or private maliciously, trying to split up the child from a partner when the child does not want to wait for marriage to be in a relationship or even have sex and there's no good reason otherwise).

Emotional abuse is especially damaging because of it's often passive-aggressive nature. Children and teenagers especially appreciate directness, integrity and honesty, especially when they're taught to be as such by their parents or guardians. The fastest way to loose your child's respect is to be a hypocrite. For example, if you were a partier yourself, DON'T do like my parents and tell me about all the fun they had at parties and... Then expect me not to want to be a partier. My father had the right idea. "Don't be like me. I was an irresponsible, spoiled rich kid. Your mom and I traded vomit one time when we tried making out. Is that how you want to think about your wife? 'I know what her vomit tastes like'."

A point I should re-iterate: that also means being emotionally honest. If you're angry with your kid, allow yourself to feel angry. Tell them you're angry, and why. When you punish them, tell them why you're punishing them, why it's wrong. Rather than focusing on punishment, try to give your children reasons to do good rather than bad. Reward them when they show consistent, good behavior, and take away the reward if they fall off the wagon and won't get back on. You may notice it's a lot like training a dog... To be fair, we're also mammals. Of course... rolled up newspapers will probably just confuse your kid.

Ah, but seriously, if you feel you must use corporeal punishment, remember that the threat of it is much more powerful than the action. You can only hit your kid so much until they get used to a certain threshold of pain to the point they don't fear it anymore. Do it often enough, you'll find yourself beating the crap out of your kid with a fucking Cat o' nine tails like you're holding the fucking Spanish Inquisition in your house and still asking yourself "why won't he/she listen?"

[Alvecia]

Regarding kids, IIRC the more recent studies done indicate that lesbian couples are the "best" at raising kids. Can't be bothered looking for the studies I can recall.
The different isn't, of course, large enough to warrant removing all kids from every other parental unit and giving them all to lesbians to look after but I thought it was an interesting point.

[Imperium Sidhicum]

I'll answer in one word. The lot of you can make an educated guess what that word is.

[Alvecia]

I'll answer in one word. The lot of you can make an educated guess what that word is.

If you're allowing us to answer for you then your answer is now "Yes", regardless of your actual feelings on the matter.

[Philjia]

Yes, of course they should. If any couple or single person can adequately care for a child they should be allowed to adopt.

[Imperium Sidhicum]

I'll answer in one word. The lot of you can make an educated guess what that word is.

If you're allowing us to answer for you then your answer is now "Yes", regardless of your actual feelings on the matter.

Lol, didn't quite see that coming...

[Alvecia]

If you're allowing us to answer for you then your answer is now "Yes", regardless of your actual feelings on the matter.

Lol, didn't quite see that coming...

Hey, you offered your opinion, and I decided I'd take it

[Imperium Sidhicum]

Lol, didn't quite see that coming...

Hey, you offered your opinion, and I decided I'd take it

Well, considering how I invited you and others to make a guess, I suppose a "Yes" is as good as any other answer.