The General Car Thread.

[Petrolheadia]

Imagine it is 1954. You own a taxi depot in Brooklyn. You have to buy a bunch of new cars to replace the retired '49 Studebakers as taxis, so low cost, good reliability and high MPGs are important. You have a few fullsize choices in the sub-$2000 market. These choices are:
- Ford Customline 225 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1800
- Chevrolet 150 235 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1680
- Plymouth Plaza 230 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1700
- Studebaker Champion 170 ci I6 - $1800
Or maybe let's cut fuel cost by getting compacts?
Willys Aero 226 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1750

Which one would you choose? I'd go with the Plymouth.

[Petrolheadia]

Well, here is a case for carmakers having some unique features (BMW's RWD, Citroen's hydropneumatic suspension, etc.) disappear.

My dad recently told me that if he delayed car buying until about a year later, he would have seriously considered the 2nd gen Citroen C5.

The C5 was a part of the lineage of Citroen's midsizers (ID19, GS, Xantia, C5). These cars were known for having unique styling and standard hydropneumatic suspension. However, the 2008 C5 broke up with that tradition. It looked like its German rivals and the hydropneumatic suspension was optional.

But that was why my dad considered it. He said that he wanted one because it did finally look like the German midsizers and you could finally have one without hydropneumatic suspension (and also probably due to the generous dicounts Citroen used to give back then).

And seems like most of the new model's buyers shared his train of thought, with 80% of 2nd generation C5 being sold with traditional suspension.

So, removing characteristic features: it might make the 1-2% of enthusiasts riled up, but attract many buyers due to a lower cost, complexity or the car not having a certain drawback.

[Elwher]

Imagine it is 1954. You own a taxi depot in Brooklyn. You have to buy a bunch of new cars to replace the retired '49 Studebakers as taxis, so low cost, good reliability and high MPGs are important. You have a few fullsize choices in the sub-$2000 market. These choices are:
- Ford Customline 225 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1800
- Chevrolet 150 235 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1680
- Plymouth Plaza 230 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1700
- Studebaker Champion 170 ci I6 - $1800
Or maybe let's cut fuel cost by getting compacts?
Willys Aero 226 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1750

Which one would you choose? I'd go with the Plymouth.

While slightly over the $2000 budget at $2387.24 (which includes the Federal Excise Tax of $217.02), I would have gone for the Checker A5, as their reputation for reliability and long life would win me over.

Also, I believe that in 1954 New York City still required a minimum of 5 passenger capicity behind the driver, so I suspect that none of those choices would have been legal.

[The Two Jerseys]

Imagine it is 1954. You own a taxi depot in Brooklyn. You have to buy a bunch of new cars to replace the retired '49 Studebakers as taxis, so low cost, good reliability and high MPGs are important. You have a few fullsize choices in the sub-$2000 market. These choices are:
- Ford Customline 225 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1800
- Chevrolet 150 235 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1680
- Plymouth Plaza 230 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1700
- Studebaker Champion 170 ci I6 - $1800
Or maybe let's cut fuel cost by getting compacts?
Willys Aero 226 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1750

Which one would you choose? I'd go with the Plymouth.

While slightly over the $2000 budget at $2387.24 (which includes the Federal Excise Tax of $217.02), I would have gone for the Checker A5, as their reputation for reliability and long life would win me over.

Also, I believe that in 1954 New York City still required a minimum of 5 passenger capicity behind the driver, so I suspect that none of those choices would have been legal.

1954 was actually the year that NYC removed the 5-passenger requirement.

They also implemented a maximum wheelbase of 127", so the Checker might not be compliant.

[Petrolheadia]

Imagine it is 1954. You own a taxi depot in Brooklyn. You have to buy a bunch of new cars to replace the retired '49 Studebakers as taxis, so low cost, good reliability and high MPGs are important. You have a few fullsize choices in the sub-$2000 market. These choices are:
- Ford Customline 225 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1800
- Chevrolet 150 235 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1680
- Plymouth Plaza 230 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1700
- Studebaker Champion 170 ci I6 - $1800
Or maybe let's cut fuel cost by getting compacts?
Willys Aero 226 ci I6 4-door sedan - $1750

Which one would you choose? I'd go with the Plymouth.

While slightly over the $2000 budget at $2387.24 (which includes the Federal Excise Tax of $217.02), I would have gone for the Checker A5, as their reputation for reliability and long life would win me over.

Also, I believe that in 1954 New York City still required a minimum of 5 passenger capicity behind the driver, so I suspect that none of those choices would have been legal.

But let's say you can spend only $2000, no exceptions, this is maximum budget. And 1954 was exactly the year when the 5-passenger requirement was removed.

[Ethel mermania]

While slightly over the $2000 budget at $2387.24 (which includes the Federal Excise Tax of $217.02), I would have gone for the Checker A5, as their reputation for reliability and long life would win me over.

Also, I believe that in 1954 New York City still required a minimum of 5 passenger capicity behind the driver, so I suspect that none of those choices would have been legal.

But let's say you can spend only $2000, no exceptions, this is maximum budget. And 1954 was exactly the year when the 5-passenger requirement was removed.

For nyc the only answer is checker.

[Petrolheadia]

But let's say you can spend only $2000, no exceptions, this is maximum budget. And 1954 was exactly the year when the 5-passenger requirement was removed.

For nyc the only answer is checker.

Not really...

[Ethel mermania]

For nyc the only answer is checker.

Not really...

yes other cabs existed, but the quintessential nyc cab is the checker, specifically the marathon, but that was not made till 1960 or so

[Petrolheadia]

Not really...

yes other cabs existed, but the quintessential nyc cab is the checker, specifically the marathon, but that was not made till 1960 or so

So what? It was the quintessengial, but it wasn't the only.

The quintessential 50s American car is the '57 Chevy Bel Air, but it wasn't the only one.

[Ethel mermania]

yes other cabs existed, but the quintessential nyc cab is the checker, specifically the marathon, but that was not made till 1960 or so

So what? It was the quintessengial, but it wasn't the only.

The quintessential 50s American car is the '57 Chevy Bel Air, but it wasn't the only one.

Except we are discussing nyc cabs. Not all cars from the 50's.

[Petrolheadia]

So what? It was the quintessengial, but it wasn't the only.

The quintessential 50s American car is the '57 Chevy Bel Air, but it wasn't the only one.

Except we are discussing nyc cabs. Not all cars from the 50's.

I'm just ahowing another example of the quintessential not being the only.

[Petrolheadia]

Imagine you live in the San Fernando Valley with your wife. She is a fun/performance car enthusiast and you want to buy her one for $4000 for the 20th wedding anniversary. You've found some on Craigslist:
- 1993 Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo convertible
- 1992 Jaguar XJS V12 convertible,
- 1988 Porsche 944 hatchback,
- 1990 Toyota Supra coupe,
- 2003 Infiniti M45,
- 1999 Mitsubishi 3000GT coupe,
- 1993 Lexus SC400,
- Mazda RX-8,
- Modified 2000 Mazda Miata,
- 1996 BMW M3 coupe,
- 2001 Audi S4 sedan,
- 1st generation Audi S6 sedan,
- 2003 Mercedes SLK230,
- 1974 Mercedes SL450 hardtop,
- 1st generation Mercedes CLK55 AMG coupe,
- 2000 Ford Mustang GT convertible,
- 2002 Ford Crown Vic ex-cop car,
- 1995 Pontiac Trans Am coupe,
- 1996 Chevy Camaro Z28 coupe,
- 1994 Chevy Impala SS,
- 1990 Chevy Corvette roadster,
- 1997 Jaguar XJR,
- 1973 MG MGB roadster,
- 1974 Triumph Spitfire,
- 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT,
- Widebody 1985 Toyota MR2

Which one would you buy? I'd choose the Vette.

[Auzkhia]

Imagine you live in the San Fernando Valley with your wife. She is a fun/performance car enthusiast and you want to buy her one for $4000 for the 20th wedding anniversary. You've found some on Craigslist:
- 1993 Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo convertible
- 1992 Jaguar XJS V12 convertible,
- 1988 Porsche 944 hatchback,
- 1990 Toyota Supra coupe,
- 2003 Infiniti M45,
- 1999 Mitsubishi 3000GT coupe,
- 1993 Lexus SC400,
- Mazda RX-8,
- Modified 2000 Mazda Miata,
- 1996 BMW M3 coupe,
- 2001 Audi S4 sedan,
- 1st generation Audi S6 sedan,
- 2003 Mercedes SLK230,
- 1974 Mercedes SL450 hardtop,
- 1st generation Mercedes CLK55 AMG coupe,
- 2000 Ford Mustang GT convertible,
- 2002 Ford Crown Vic ex-cop car,
- 1995 Pontiac Trans Am coupe,
- 1996 Chevy Camaro Z28 coupe,
- 1994 Chevy Impala SS,
- 1990 Chevy Corvette roadster,
- 1997 Jaguar XJR,
- 1973 MG MGB roadster,
- 1974 Triumph Spitfire,
- 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT,
- Widebody 1985 Toyota MR2

Which one would you buy? I'd choose the Vette.

Clichéd answer: the NB Miata because it's always the answer.
Real Answer: Whatever she wants.
But, personally, I'd go for the CLK55 AMG.

[Elwher]

Imagine you live in the San Fernando Valley with your wife. She is a fun/performance car enthusiast and you want to buy her one for $4000 for the 20th wedding anniversary. You've found some on Craigslist:
- 1993 Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo convertible
- 1992 Jaguar XJS V12 convertible,
- 1988 Porsche 944 hatchback,
- 1990 Toyota Supra coupe,
- 2003 Infiniti M45,
- 1999 Mitsubishi 3000GT coupe,
- 1993 Lexus SC400,
- Mazda RX-8,
- Modified 2000 Mazda Miata,
- 1996 BMW M3 coupe,
- 2001 Audi S4 sedan,
- 1st generation Audi S6 sedan,
- 2003 Mercedes SLK230,
- 1974 Mercedes SL450 hardtop,
- 1st generation Mercedes CLK55 AMG coupe,
- 2000 Ford Mustang GT convertible,
- 2002 Ford Crown Vic ex-cop car,
- 1995 Pontiac Trans Am coupe,
- 1996 Chevy Camaro Z28 coupe,
- 1994 Chevy Impala SS,
- 1990 Chevy Corvette roadster,
- 1997 Jaguar XJR,
- 1973 MG MGB roadster,
- 1974 Triumph Spitfire,
- 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT,
- Widebody 1985 Toyota MR2

Which one would you buy? I'd choose the Vette.

Despite the Lucas electrics, I'd go for the MGB. It is unusual enough to attract attention and a great fun car to drive (presuming she knows how to drive a standard, otr is willing to learn).

[Licana]

- 1988 Porsche 944 hatchback,

>cylinders: 6

wat

[Patridam]

- 1988 Porsche 944 hatchback,

>cylinders: 6

wat

probably because 2 of them do not work anymore in a 944 at this price.

[Petrolheadia]

>cylinders: 6

wat

probably because 2 of them do not work anymore in a 944 at this price.

Yeah, they are so broken, they aren't even there.

[Petrolheadia]

Imagine you live in the San Fernando Valley with your wife. She is a fun/performance car enthusiast and you want to buy her one for $4000 for the 20th wedding anniversary. You've found some on Craigslist:
- 1993 Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo convertible
- 1992 Jaguar XJS V12 convertible,
- 1988 Porsche 944 hatchback,
- 1990 Toyota Supra coupe,
- 2003 Infiniti M45,
- 1999 Mitsubishi 3000GT coupe,
- 1993 Lexus SC400,
- Mazda RX-8,
- Modified 2000 Mazda Miata,
- 1996 BMW M3 coupe,
- 2001 Audi S4 sedan,
- 1st generation Audi S6 sedan,
- 2003 Mercedes SLK230,
- 1974 Mercedes SL450 hardtop,
- 1st generation Mercedes CLK55 AMG coupe,
- 2000 Ford Mustang GT convertible,
- 2002 Ford Crown Vic ex-cop car,
- 1995 Pontiac Trans Am coupe,
- 1996 Chevy Camaro Z28 coupe,
- 1994 Chevy Impala SS,
- 1990 Chevy Corvette roadster,
- 1997 Jaguar XJR,
- 1973 MG MGB roadster,
- 1974 Triumph Spitfire,
- 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT,
- Widebody 1985 Toyota MR2

Which one would you buy? I'd choose the Vette.

Despite the Lucas electrics, I'd go for the MGB. It is unusual enough to attract attention and a great fun car to drive (presuming she knows how to drive a standard, otr is willing to learn).

The MGB is actually too slow to be fun and its supposedly good handling stems from the fact that it is just too slow to give you any roadholding troubles.

If you think a small roadster is the best idea, the Miata would be better, as it is fast enough to be fun and it actually has good handling, not only handling good for its speed.

[Petrolheadia]

I've just decided to compare vehicles from VW, Acura and Buick, 3 midrange brands, to see if VWs are really that expensive as they say.

I decided to start with well-equipped compact sedans. They all had to be on a similar specification level. If they did not have any of these features standard, they got spec'd up to the right level. So, here is what we have:
- VW Jetta GLI - 210 HP, $29,815 - http://www.vw.com/models/jetta/trims/20 ... automatic/
- Acura ILX 2.4 - 210 HP, $29,990 - http://www.acura.com/build-price/ilx
- Buick Verano - $25,400, but only 180 HP - http://www.buick.com/sedans/verano-smal ... ?sidebar=1

Now, it's time to go to midsizers. Here, we are picking black and 250+ HP, with all cars having similar specification.
- VW Passat V6 SE - $30,115, 280 HP, 6-speed - http://www.vw.com/models/passat/trims/2 ... or/n3p-zw/
- Acura TLX - $43,540, 290 HP, 9-speed - http://www.acura.com/build-price/tlx
- Buick Regal GS - $37,695 256 HP, 6-speed - http://www.buick.com/previous-year/rega ... ?sidebar=1

Now, let's go to ca. 300 HP 4x4 midsize crossovers. Here, we have to omit Buick, as they have no car for the competition here, and substitute it with Lincoln. As above, all of them have similar specifications.
- VW Touareg Wolfsburg - $53,705, 290 HP, 8-speed - https://www.vw.com/models/touareg/trims ... or/n1p-to/
- Acura MDX - $54,400, 290 HP, 9-speed - http://www.acura.com/build-price/mdx
- Lincoln MKX - $51,200, 303 HP, 6-speed - http://t.bp3.lincoln.com/2016-Lincoln-M ... urs/Config[|Lincoln|MKX Base|2016|1|1.|102A.J8L..RR...~YZKAA.65T.99R.NON BLACK LABEL.]

Time for AWD manual performance compacts. Here, I have to substitute Acura for Subaru and Buick for Ford. Once again, similar specs.
- VW Golf R - $40,195, 300 HP, 6-speed - https://www.vw.com/models/golf-r/trims/ ... pe/manual/
- Subaru WRX STi - $39,995 (but probably no ACC or automatic parking), 310 HP, 6-speed - http://www.subaru.com/build-your-own/20 ... V/6MT.html
- Ford Focus RS - $40,255, 350 HP, 6-speed - http://shop.ford.com/build/focus/#/conf ... CUS-RS.%5D

So, in contrary to what Patridam once said, VW is not much more expensive than the competitors. It is either on par or much cheaper.

[Arkinesia]

I was surfing on the Internet and found out that apparently 5 out of 6 Chrysler 300 buyers are black.

Interesting, huh?

Not at all surprising. I don't know why exactly the 300 came to be known as a “black man's” car (much like I'm not sure how the Hyundai Accent and the XV20 Toyota Camry similarly are known), but it absolutely is the case.

Imagine you live in the San Fernando Valley with your wife. She is a fun/performance car enthusiast and you want to buy her one for $4000 for the 20th wedding anniversary. You've found some on Craigslist:
Which one would you buy? I'd choose the Vette.

It'd be the Vette or the '03 SLK for me. Both are pretty reliable, not horribly expensive to maintain.

[The New Falkland Islands]

I was surfing on the Internet and found out that apparently 5 out of 6 Chrysler 300 buyers are black.

Interesting, huh?

Not at all surprising. I don't know why exactly the 300 came to be known as a “black man's” car (much like I'm not sure how the Hyundai Accent and the XV20 Toyota Camry similarly are known), but it absolutely is the case.

Imagine you live in the San Fernando Valley with your wife. She is a fun/performance car enthusiast and you want to buy her one for $4000 for the 20th wedding anniversary. You've found some on Craigslist:
Which one would you buy? I'd choose the Vette.

It'd be the Vette or the '03 SLK for me. Both are pretty reliable, not horribly expensive to maintain.

It's like a Ford F250 driver... only the opposite. Also I would take the 300ZX.

[Auzkhia]

>cylinders: 6

wat

probably because 2 of them do not work anymore in a 944 at this price.

Umm, the V8 Porsche is the 928, if that is what you're were thinking of.

probably because 2 of them do not work anymore in a 944 at this price.

Yeah, they are so broken, they aren't even there.

Because the 944 actually, only has 4 cylinders. They gave it a selection I4's, one of them could have a turbo.

[Petrolheadia]

probably because 2 of them do not work anymore in a 944 at this price.

Umm, the V8 Porsche is the 928, if that is what you're were thinking of.

Yeah, they are so broken, they aren't even there.

Because the 944 actually, only has 4 cylinders. They gave it a selection I4's, one of them could have a turbo.

Our resident car historian just confused 2 wholly differnet cars.

I wonder what would he behave like if I confused the Cimarron and DeVille.

[Elwher]

Despite the Lucas electrics, I'd go for the MGB. It is unusual enough to attract attention and a great fun car to drive (presuming she knows how to drive a standard, otr is willing to learn).

The MGB is actually too slow to be fun and its supposedly good handling stems from the fact that it is just too slow to give you any roadholding troubles.

If you think a small roadster is the best idea, the Miata would be better, as it is fast enough to be fun and it actually has good handling, not only handling good for its speed.

0-60 in 9 seconds is not too slow for fun, in my opinion, and until the engine/drivetrain change in 1974 the top speed was over 100; which is fast enough to get into lots of trouble. The MGB is also more unusual in California these days than the Miata, giving it a greater cool factor as well as allowing entry into the classic sports car crowd.

[Petrolheadia]

The MGB is actually too slow to be fun and its supposedly good handling stems from the fact that it is just too slow to give you any roadholding troubles.

If you think a small roadster is the best idea, the Miata would be better, as it is fast enough to be fun and it actually has good handling, not only handling good for its speed.

0-60 in 9 seconds is not too slow for fun, in my opinion, and until the engine/drivetrain change in 1974 the top speed was over 100; which is fast enough to get into lots of trouble. The MGB is also more unusual in California these days than the Miata, giving it a greater cool factor as well as allowing entry into the classic sports car crowd.

So what if it's rarer? It is rarer for a reason - it it worse.

The Miata has better handling, build quality, is faster, more spacious, reliable, less rust-prone... better in everything.