The General Car Thread.

[The Two Jerseys]

Is something like the Ford Focus RS American or German?

It's made in Germany and was developed by the Ford European Division based in Köln.

But if that's true, then the Honda Accord (USDM) is American because since 1982 it is made in Ohio, and Toyota Camry is made Kentucky, so American or Japanese?

Depends.

RS is designed in Europe and built in Europe, so European.

USDM Accord is designed for the US where it is built, so American.

There's not as much difference between USDM Camrys and other Camrys and the Camry is mostly designed in Japan, so Japanese.

I have to agree. Ford is an American company and Holden is a GM division, but nobody would consider a ute to be an American car (steering wheel location notwithstanding).

[Auzkhia]

Is something like the Ford Focus RS American or German?

It's made in Germany and was developed by the Ford European Division based in Köln.

But if that's true, then the Honda Accord (USDM) is American because since 1982 it is made in Ohio, and Toyota Camry is made Kentucky, so American or Japanese?

Depends.

RS is designed in Europe and built in Europe, so European.

USDM Accord is designed for the US where it is built, so American.

There's not as much difference between USDM Camrys and other Camrys and the Camry is mostly designed in Japan, so Japanese.

I can say my car is German because it was assembled in Bremen, and it was made under a German based marque. I think final point of assembly should be more of a factor when defining car nationality. But, people usually go by the brand's origin.

[The Two Jerseys]

Depends.

RS is designed in Europe and built in Europe, so European.

USDM Accord is designed for the US where it is built, so American.

There's not as much difference between USDM Camrys and other Camrys and the Camry is mostly designed in Japan, so Japanese.

I can say my car is German because it was assembled in Bremen, and it was made under a German based marque. I think final point of assembly should be more of a factor when defining car nationality. But, people usually go by the brand's origin.

But how would that work when you have the same car assembled in different countries? The Model T and Beetle were assembled all over the place, but I wouldn't consider them anything but American and German cars respectively.

[Auzkhia]

I can say my car is German because it was assembled in Bremen, and it was made under a German based marque. I think final point of assembly should be more of a factor when defining car nationality. But, people usually go by the brand's origin.

But how would that work when you have the same car assembled in different countries? The Model T and Beetle were assembled all over the place, but I wouldn't consider them anything but American and German cars respectively.

It's not the end all, but, brand origin shouldn't solely define "car nationality", but it is something to consider.

[Patridam]

I just go with where the company is headquartered honestly. While that's getting messier and messier with multinational corporations and "world cars", people's stereotypes and predetermined opinions are still set that any car that says Ford/GM/Chrysler is American, VW/BMW/Merc is German, or Toyota/Honda/Nissan is Japanese. At least those stereotypes of origin seem to be how Petrolheadia (and any other automotive weeaboo or teutophile) decides what cars to hate and what cars to love.

When I look at buying a car the parts content/location of assembly also matters, but that still doesn't make a Camry an American car.

[Petrolheadia]

Is something like the Ford Focus RS American or German?

It's made in Germany and was developed by the Ford European Division based in Köln.

But if that's true, then the Honda Accord (USDM) is American because since 1982 it is made in Ohio, and Toyota Camry is made Kentucky, so American or Japanese?

The Ford is a joint German-British design (car designed in Germany, spiced up in Britain) and the Honda is Japanese (designed in Japan).

[Petrolheadia]

I just go with where the company is headquartered honestly. While that's getting messier and messier with multinational corporations and "world cars", people's stereotypes and predetermined opinions are still set that any car that says Ford/GM/Chrysler is American, VW/BMW/Merc is German, or Toyota/Honda/Nissan is Japanese. At least those stereotypes of origin seem to be how Petrolheadia (and any other automotive weeaboo or teutophile) decides what cars to hate and what cars to love.

When I look at buying a car the parts content/location of assembly also matters, but that still doesn't make a Camry an American car.

'Cause you are completely unbiased.
/end sarcasm

[Belantica]

Imagine you are a teenage girl, living in 1983 London. It's time for your first car. However, many different costs leave you only able to own a car with an engine below 1000 cc. The options are:
- 1977 Datsun 100A manual 2-door sedan,
- 1978 Daihatsu Charade 1.0 4-speed manual 5-door hatchback,
- 1978 VW Polo 0.9 3-door hatchback,
- 1979 Peugeot 104 954 cc 5-door hatchback,
- 1979 Renault 6 854 cc,
- 1979 Fiat 127 0.9 3-door hatchback,
- 1978 Ford Fiesta 957 cc,
- 1979 Chrysler Sunbeam 0.9,
- 1980 Mini 1000 2-door sedan,
- 1980 Reliant Kitten 2-door saloon.

Which one would you choose? I'd get the Datsun.

I'd go with the Datsun as well.

[Auzkhia]

I just go with where the company is headquartered honestly. While that's getting messier and messier with multinational corporations and "world cars", people's stereotypes and predetermined opinions are still set that any car that says Ford/GM/Chrysler is American, VW/BMW/Merc is German, or Toyota/Honda/Nissan is Japanese. At least those stereotypes of origin seem to be how Petrolheadia (and any other automotive weeaboo or teutophile) decides what cars to hate and what cars to love.

When I look at buying a car the parts content/location of assembly also matters, but that still doesn't make a Camry an American car.

But What about rebadged variants? Is the Buick Regal German because it's a based on the Opel Insignia? (or British if you look at the Vauxhall)

Is something like the Ford Focus RS American or German?

It's made in Germany and was developed by the Ford European Division based in Köln.

But if that's true, then the Honda Accord (USDM) is American because since 1982 it is made in Ohio, and Toyota Camry is made Kentucky, so American or Japanese?

The Ford is a joint German-British design (car designed in Germany, spiced up in Britain) and the Honda is Japanese (designed in Japan).

Honda Accord: Made in Ohio, USA by a Japanese multinational corporation. But that's a bit like saying iPhone: Designed in California, made in China. oh wait, the iphone is etched with that statement.

[Petrolheadia]

I just go with where the company is headquartered honestly. While that's getting messier and messier with multinational corporations and "world cars", people's stereotypes and predetermined opinions are still set that any car that says Ford/GM/Chrysler is American, VW/BMW/Merc is German, or Toyota/Honda/Nissan is Japanese. At least those stereotypes of origin seem to be how Petrolheadia (and any other automotive weeaboo or teutophile) decides what cars to hate and what cars to love.

When I look at buying a car the parts content/location of assembly also matters, but that still doesn't make a Camry an American car.

But What about rebadged variants? Is the Buick Regal German because it's a based on the Opel Insignia? (or British if you look at the Vauxhall)

The Ford is a joint German-British design (car designed in Germany, spiced up in Britain) and the Honda is Japanese (designed in Japan).

Honda Accord: Made in Ohio, USA by a Japanese multinational corporation. But that's a bit like saying iPhone: Designed in California, made in China. oh wait, the iphone is etched with that statement.

Then starts the craziness. The Prius was designed in California on accord of a Japanese company, so it's part-Japanese, part-American. The Hyundai i30 was designed in Germany by a Korean company, so it's part-Korean, part-German.

And the Vauxhalls are basically German, apart from the VXR8, which is basically Australian.

[Belantica]

I just go with where the company is headquartered honestly. While that's getting messier and messier with multinational corporations and "world cars", people's stereotypes and predetermined opinions are still set that any car that says Ford/GM/Chrysler is American, VW/BMW/Merc is German, or Toyota/Honda/Nissan is Japanese. At least those stereotypes of origin seem to be how Petrolheadia (and any other automotive weeaboo or teutophile) decides what cars to hate and what cars to love.

When I look at buying a car the parts content/location of assembly also matters, but that still doesn't make a Camry an American car.

But What about rebadged variants? Is the Buick Regal German because it's a based on the Opel Insignia? (or British if you look at the Vauxhall)

The Ford is a joint German-British design (car designed in Germany, spiced up in Britain) and the Honda is Japanese (designed in Japan).

Honda Accord: Made in Ohio, USA by a Japanese multinational corporation. But that's a bit like saying iPhone: Designed in California, made in China. oh wait, the iphone is etched with that statement.

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

[Auzkhia]

But What about rebadged variants? Is the Buick Regal German because it's a based on the Opel Insignia? (or British if you look at the Vauxhall)

Honda Accord: Made in Ohio, USA by a Japanese multinational corporation. But that's a bit like saying iPhone: Designed in California, made in China. oh wait, the iphone is etched with that statement.

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

Even so, many Murican "imports from Detroit" are made in Canada, or at least have parts from Canada, or even Mexico. Even Honda is on there too.

World cars are definitely a thing now, especially at Ford, even the Mustang is in the European and Aus/NZ markets.

[Petrolheadia]

But What about rebadged variants? Is the Buick Regal German because it's a based on the Opel Insignia? (or British if you look at the Vauxhall)

Honda Accord: Made in Ohio, USA by a Japanese multinational corporation. But that's a bit like saying iPhone: Designed in California, made in China. oh wait, the iphone is etched with that statement.

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

Chrysler cars are still American, many being designed in America, built using American research and constructed in America.

The exception is Chrysler Europe and other regional parts. The Chryslers: Delta and Ypsilon are Italian,,the 70s EDM Chryslers are actually French/British, the Chrysler Lancer was Japanese and the AUDM Chrysler Valiant was Australian.

[Petrolheadia]

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

Even so, many Murican "imports from Detroit" are made in Canada, or at least have parts from Canada, or even Mexico. Even Honda is on there too.

World cars are definitely a thing now, especially at Ford, even the Mustang is in the European and Aus/NZ markets.

Yeah, I laughed when I noticed that the only non-American made car in the top 10 cars bought in Cash for Clunkers was the Chevy Silverado, hecho en Mexico.

[Auzkhia]

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

Chrysler cars are still American, being designed in America, built using American research and constructed in America.

The exception is Chrysler Europe and other regional parts. The Chryslers: Delta and Ypsilon are Italian,,the 70s EDM Chryslers are actually French/British, the Chrysler Lancer was Japanese and the AUDM Chrysler Valiant was Australian.

And the Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger and Challenger are a 90's Mercedes Benz E-class underneath, so there's some German parts, which are made in Canada.

Hell, the Jeep Wrangler uses the 5G-tronic automatic transmission. The Crossfire was the R170. The Jeep Grand Cherokee shared some underpinnings with the ML.

[Petrolheadia]

Chrysler cars are still American, being designed in America, built using American research and constructed in America.

The exception is Chrysler Europe and other regional parts. The Chryslers: Delta and Ypsilon are Italian,,the 70s EDM Chryslers are actually French/British, the Chrysler Lancer was Japanese and the AUDM Chrysler Valiant was Australian.

And the Chrysler 300 and Dodge Charger and Challenger are a 90's Mercedes Benz E-class underneath, so there's some German parts, which are made in Canada.

Hell, the Jeep Wrangler uses the 5G-tronic automatic transmission. The Crossfire was the R170. The Jeep Grand Cherokee shared some underpinnings with the ML.

That is part sharing. What matters is where the bits are drawn as a whole.

And, knowing how these Mercedes bits are built, I am now 100% sure I want none of these Jeeps or Chryslers.

[Belantica]

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

Even so, many Murican "imports from Detroit" are made in Canada, or at least have parts from Canada, or even Mexico. Even Honda is on there too.

World cars are definitely a thing now, especially at Ford, even the Mustang is in the European and Aus/NZ markets.

And that's a big thing, the Mustang, which was almost exclusively for the American market, went global so that other people are able to have them. And they also replaced the Econoline/E-Series with the Transit van. However, Americans won't be able to get the Ranger since Ford knows that they have no problem selling F-150s in the US.

I mean these days, everything is going global, especially with GM and Ford right now. Chrysler is still trying to hang on by being "American", but everyone else is building vehicles that are the same in America as they are in Europe, Africa, Asia, and Australia. And it's what happening with other companies as well, the rise of the global car.

Chrysler cars are still American, being designed in America, built using American research and constructed in America.

The exception is Chrysler Europe and other regional parts. The Chryslers: Delta and Ypsilon are Italian,,the 70s EDM Chryslers are actually French/British, the Chrysler Lancer was Japanese and the AUDM Chrysler Valiant was Australian.

Now Chrysler still has a lot of American designed vehicles, but their smaller cars share a platform or chassis with their FIAT couterparts, which is something similar in idea to the K platform back in the 80's.

[Petrolheadia]

Imagine you are a teenage girl, living in 1983 London. It's time for your first car. However, many different costs leave you only able to own a car with an engine below 1000 cc. The options are:
- 1977 Datsun 100A manual 2-door sedan,
- 1978 Daihatsu Charade 1.0 4-speed manual 5-door hatchback,
- 1978 VW Polo 0.9 3-door hatchback,
- 1979 Peugeot 104 954 cc 5-door hatchback,
- 1979 Renault 6 854 cc,
- 1979 Fiat 127 0.9 3-door hatchback,
- 1978 Ford Fiesta 957 cc,
- 1979 Chrysler Sunbeam 0.9,
- 1980 Mini 1000 2-door sedan,
- 1980 Reliant Kitten 2-door saloon.

Which one would you choose? I'd get the Datsun.

Probably the Polo, though I'd have to get a Derby sedan instead of a Polo. That'd be the closest thing to an actual car (as opposed to a golf cart with windows) on this list.

The Derby wasn't available with the 0.9. It only had the 1.1 and 1.3, both too big for that buyer.

[Patridam]

The Derby wasn't available with the 0.9. It only had the 1.1 and 1.3, both too big for that buyer.

First sentence on Wikipedia: "In Europe, the Derby was available with 0.9-litre (895 cc), 1.1-litre (1,093 cc) and 1.3-litre (1,272 cc) four-cylinder engines, with 40, 50 and 60 bhp respectively. " It would be a Derby 900 L, specifically.

[Petrolheadia]

The Derby wasn't available with the 0.9. It only had the 1.1 and 1.3, both too big for that buyer.

First sentence on Wikipedia: "In Europe, the Derby was available with 0.9-litre (895 cc), 1.1-litre (1,093 cc) and 1.3-litre (1,272 cc) four-cylinder engines, with 40, 50 and 60 bhp respectively. " It would be a Derby 900 L, specifically.

Oh, yeah. Sorry for the mistake.

[Licana]

The Derby wasn't available with the 0.9. It only had the 1.1 and 1.3, both too big for that buyer.

First sentence on Wikipedia: "In Europe, the Derby was available with 0.9-litre (895 cc)

Things like this make me infinitely glad that I wasn't born in 70s Europe.

[Petrolheadia]

First sentence on Wikipedia: "In Europe, the Derby was available with 0.9-litre (895 cc)

Things like this make me infinitely glad that I wasn't born in 70s Europe.

Nah, at least in the West it was close to the bottom of the new car food chain. A typical car was a 1.6 midsize sedan (Ford Cortina/Taunus, Vauxhall Cavalier/Opel Ascona).

[Patridam]

Things like this make me infinitely glad that I wasn't born in 70s Europe.

Nah, at least in the West it was close to the bottom of the new car food chain. A typical car was a 1.6 midsize sedan (Ford Cortina/Taunus, Vauxhall Cavalier/Opel Ascona).

The late 70's was a bad time for cars all around, really, but at least in the USA our "bottom of the food chain" shitboxes (e.g. Chevy Chevette and Dodge Omni) had 1.6 liter engines (and for that matter were a good bit larger than a Polo or Derby). Meanwhile our midsize cars had 3.3 (smallest 6 available in the Granada/Monarch) to 5.9 (biggest V8 available in the Aspen/Volare) liter engines.

[Petrolheadia]

Nah, at least in the West it was close to the bottom of the new car food chain. A typical car was a 1.6 midsize sedan (Ford Cortina/Taunus, Vauxhall Cavalier/Opel Ascona).

The late 70's was a bad time for cars all around, really, but at least in the USA our "bottom of the food chain" shitboxes (e.g. Chevy Chevette and Dodge Omni) had 1.6 liter engines (and for that matter were a good bit larger than a Polo or Derby). Meanwhile our midsize cars had 3.3 (smallest 6 available in the Granada/Monarch) to 5.9 (biggest V8 available in the Aspen/Volare) liter engines.

And AFAIK,,the middle of the American "food chain" was a fullsize car with a V8 around 300-350ci.

[Patridam]

The late 70's was a bad time for cars all around, really, but at least in the USA our "bottom of the food chain" shitboxes (e.g. Chevy Chevette and Dodge Omni) had 1.6 liter engines (and for that matter were a good bit larger than a Polo or Derby). Meanwhile our midsize cars had 3.3 (smallest 6 available in the Granada/Monarch) to 5.9 (biggest V8 available in the Aspen/Volare) liter engines.

And AFAIK,,the middle of the American "food chain" was a fullsize car with a V8 around 300-350ci.

Not exactly. From 1974 to 1976 and then again in 79 through 84, the Oldsmobile Cutlass (a midsize car) was the most popular car in America. Only in 77 and 78 were full size cars the most popular (the Chevrolet Impala/Caprice in both years).