NationStates' Transgender Thread II

[The Serbian Empire]

So in news that is not doing my paranoia any favours, it turns out most UK health care professionals have no clue how to deal with transgender patients.

*sigh*

That's also true in the US. They don't exactly teach this in medical school.

[Philjia]

So in news that is not doing my paranoia any favours, it turns out most UK health care professionals have no clue how to deal with transgender patients.

*sigh*

That's also true in the US. They don't exactly teach this in medical school.

Since it's not a widespread issue and is left to specialists, it's unlikely to be included in mandatory study. GPs should technically have basic knowledge of all aspects of medicine, but since their job in practice is to dispense medication for common problems and conduct routine check ups, so they are unlikely to be clued in.

[Nature-Spirits]

That's also true in the US. They don't exactly teach this in medical school.

Since it's not a widespread issue and is left to specialists, it's unlikely to be included in mandatory study. GPs should technically have basic knowledge of all aspects of medicine, but since their job in practice is to dispense medication for common problems and conduct routine check ups, so they are unlikely to be clued in.

I still feel like all GPs should have to attend a few lectures in medical school on dealing with certain minorities. How to approach Muslims who practise hijab, sexuality for LGBT+ people, basic care for trans people, etc. I really think that just a lecture or two would make a difference, and it's not like there's a paucity of people who do speak on those topics.

[The Serbian Empire]

That's also true in the US. They don't exactly teach this in medical school.

Since it's not a widespread issue and is left to specialists, it's unlikely to be included in mandatory study. GPs should technically have basic knowledge of all aspects of medicine, but since their job in practice is to dispense medication for common problems and conduct routine check ups, so they are unlikely to be clued in.

It also makes it a much harder life when most have no idea what to do about it and that they attribute broken limbs to being trans.

[Nature-Spirits]

Holy shit.

I'm going through my workplace's Code of Business Conduct. Discrimination based on gender identity and expression is listed as prohibited (alongside all the other usual suspects). This doesn't particularly surprise me.

But then it does a very brief Trans 101.

Cool.

Still not ready to be out at work yet, but hey, at least I know I'm protected.

[Philjia]

Holy shit.

I'm going through my workplace's Code of Business Conduct. Discrimination based on gender identity and expression is listed as prohibited (alongside all the other usual suspects). This doesn't particularly surprise me.

But then it does a very brief Trans 101.

Cool.

Still not ready to be out at work yet, but hey, at least I know I'm protected.

How big a business is it? Local, statewide, nationwide?

[Socialist Tera]

Not sure how long I can hide that I am trans to my parents. I am hiding getting lasers as going to the library.

[Pope Joan]

Holy shit.

I'm going through my workplace's Code of Business Conduct. Discrimination based on gender identity and expression is listed as prohibited (alongside all the other usual suspects). This doesn't particularly surprise me.

But then it does a very brief Trans 101.

Cool.

Still not ready to be out at work yet, but hey, at least I know I'm protected.

As many in minority ethnic communities realize, it is one thing to have rights and another to have them honored by those in power.

But if you are mistreated, at least you know you can fight back.

Good luck to you.

[Unpredictable Galaxy]

Okay, so, I just need some clarification. Why is it necessary to use proper pronouns further than he/she in the transgender community? I don't mean this as an attack or to be offensive, I am just ignorant and have no connections to any transgender people in the real world. PLEASE INFORM ME!!!

[Philjia]

Okay, so, I just need some clarification. Why is it necessary to use proper pronouns further than he/she in the transgender community? I don't mean this as an attack or to be offensive, I am just ignorant and have no connections to any transgender people in the real world. PLEASE INFORM ME!!!

Not everyone's a man or woman. Some are somewhere between, or neither.

[Socialist Tera]

Okay, so, I just need some clarification. Why is it necessary to use proper pronouns further than he/she in the transgender community? I don't mean this as an attack or to be offensive, I am just ignorant and have no connections to any transgender people in the real world. PLEASE INFORM ME!!!

Not everyone's a man or woman. Some are somewhere between, or neither.

Can you link me a scientific journal on that please? I don't mean to sound like a huge troll.

[Unpredictable Galaxy]

Okay, so, I just need some clarification. Why is it necessary to use proper pronouns further than he/she in the transgender community? I don't mean this as an attack or to be offensive, I am just ignorant and have no connections to any transgender people in the real world. PLEASE INFORM ME!!!

Not everyone's a man or woman. Some are somewhere between, or neither.

Okay, thanks. I find that personally difficult to grasp my head around (I've always assumed the main conflict was defining themselves between man/woman), but I appreciate the quick explanation. How can you not see yourself as a man/woman based on sex (not sexuality)?

[Nature-Spirits]

Holy shit.

I'm going through my workplace's Code of Business Conduct. Discrimination based on gender identity and expression is listed as prohibited (alongside all the other usual suspects). This doesn't particularly surprise me.

But then it does a very brief Trans 101.

Cool.

Still not ready to be out at work yet, but hey, at least I know I'm protected.

How big a business is it? Local, statewide, nationwide?

It's one of Canada's biggest department stores.

Not sure how long I can hide that I am trans to my parents. I am hiding getting lasers as going to the library.

That's a tough situation to navigate. I'm sure you'll find a way to make it work.

As many in minority ethnic communities realize, it is one thing to have rights and another to have them honored by those in power.

But if you are mistreated, at least you know you can fight back.

Good luck to you.

Oh believe me, I know that all too well. But yes, it is good to be officially protected so that I can fight back if it ever comes to that.

Not everyone's a man or woman. Some are somewhere between, or neither.

Can you link me a scientific journal on that please? I don't mean to sound like a huge troll.

Well, truth be told, there hasn't been a whole lot of research into non-binary people. There just isn't enough interest in mainstream academics. There is this, though, as well as all the studies indicating that the gender of brains is really complex and not so easily polarised. It seems plausible to me that, given binary transgender people have been shown to have brains more similar to their gender than to their assigned sex, non-binary people are neurologically intersex to some degree.

Not everyone's a man or woman. Some are somewhere between, or neither.

Okay, thanks. I find that personally difficult to grasp my head around (I've always assumed the main conflict was defining themselves between man/woman), but I appreciate the quick explanation. How can you not see yourself as a man/woman based on sex (not sexuality)?

Let's turn this question on its head: How can you see yourself as any gender at all? Is there some specific thing or feeling that makes someone see themself as a man or as a woman? Can we really pin any definitive trait down, aside from simple self-identification?

Gender's not simple. It's messy, it's difficult to define, and no one really knows why anyone has a gender at all. The only metric we can reliably use to determine someone's gender is their self-identification, because there's nothing tangible that can prove it.

[Unpredictable Galaxy]

Okay, thanks. I find that personally difficult to grasp my head around (I've always assumed the main conflict was defining themselves between man/woman), but I appreciate the quick explanation. How can you not see yourself as a man/woman based on sex (not sexuality)?

Let's turn this question on its head: How can you see yourself as any gender at all? Is there some specific thing or feeling that makes someone see themself as a man or as a woman? Can we really pin any definitive trait down, aside from simple self-identification?

Gender's not simple. It's messy, it's difficult to define, and no one really knows why anyone has a gender at all. The only metric we can reliably use to determine someone's gender is their self-identification, because there's nothing tangible that can prove it.

But shouldn't someone be able to say "I am a man/woman" in basic terms? You can be asexual but still identify as a man/woman; that's where I'm confused. How can you be neither?

[Nature-Spirits]

Let's turn this question on its head: How can you see yourself as any gender at all? Is there some specific thing or feeling that makes someone see themself as a man or as a woman? Can we really pin any definitive trait down, aside from simple self-identification?

Gender's not simple. It's messy, it's difficult to define, and no one really knows why anyone has a gender at all. The only metric we can reliably use to determine someone's gender is their self-identification, because there's nothing tangible that can prove it.

But shouldn't someone be able to say "I am a man/woman" in basic terms? You can be asexual but still identify as a man/woman; that's where I'm confused. How can you be neither?

Because why would everyone fit neatly into one of two categories? I can't wrap my head around binary gender, personally. I don't know why I'm non-binary; I just know that I don't feel comfortable living entirely as a man or as a woman.

And asexuality has nothing to do with non-binary gender. (Or are you referring to intersex people? Either way, little connection.)

[Unpredictable Galaxy]

But shouldn't someone be able to say "I am a man/woman" in basic terms? You can be asexual but still identify as a man/woman; that's where I'm confused. How can you be neither?

Because why would everyone fit neatly into one of two categories? I can't wrap my head around binary gender, personally. I don't know why I'm non-binary; I just know that I don't feel comfortable living entirely as a man or as a woman.

And asexuality has nothing to do with non-binary gender. (Or are you referring to intersex people? Either way, little connection.)

Okay, I think it's just something I need to grow accustomed to rather than pressing to explain the impossible. I hope you didn't see me as ridiculing this whole thing, I was just pressing because I genuinely had no clue about these things. I am in full support of transgender rights, I just had to iron out my ignorance.

Thanks for clearing it up for me in a nice way; I understand a little better than previously before.

[Noraika]

Okay, thanks. I find that personally difficult to grasp my head around (I've always assumed the main conflict was defining themselves between man/woman), but I appreciate the quick explanation. How can you not see yourself as a man/woman based on sex (not sexuality)?

The current recognized definitions of gender identity are as follows:

"Gender Identity is defined as a person's deeply felt, inherent sense of being a girl, woman, or female; a boy, a man, or male; a blend of male or female; or an alternative gender"..."For TGNC* people, gender identity differs from sex assigned at birth to varying degress, and may be experienced and expressed outside of the gender binary." (p.834)

"Research over the last two decades has demonstrated the existence of a wide spectrum of gender identity and gender expression, which includes people who identify as either man or woman, neither man nor woman, a blend of man and woman, or a unique gender identity."..."A nonbinary understanding of gender is fundamental to the provision of affirmative care for TGNC people."..."By understanding the spectrum of gender identityies and gender expressions that exist, and that a person's gender identity may not be in full alignment with sex assigned at birth, psychologists can increase their capacity to assist TGNC people, their families, and their communities. Respecting and supporting TGNC people in authentically articularting their gender identity and gender expression, as well as their lived experience, can improve TGNC people's health, well-being, and quality of life." (p.835)

- Guidelines for Psychological Practice With Transgender and Gender Nonconforming People, American Psychological Association

It is difficult to describe the how of the matter because gender is extremely complex, but what I can tell you is that you have to see gender identity as something of a spectrum, and that different people lie in various places between male and female. To be honest, the differences between male and female are small enough that there being identities which fall between them is not at all surprising. Individuals in these areas do experience their identities just like how everyone else does, but they have one that is neither male or female, goes between male and female, is both male and female, is neither male nor female, et cetera. Despite this concept, the way these gender identities are experienced is the same as any other.

One small correction I'd make is that 'transgender' is not something that means opposite sex only. Instead how it works is that it is simply defined as a difference in the identification or experienced gender identity of the person, and it not being aligned to the sex they were assigned at birth. It is not limited to both extremities of the spectrum, and a non-binary person can likewise be diagnosed with Gender Dysphoria, and be able to receive treatment should they desire it.

[The Serbian Empire]

This next week will be laden with practicing. A good couple drives should inspire confidence that I might see HRT soon enough once I start working again. Sucks when you end up returning home without a license to drive.

[Vassenor]

So I got tape that doesn't snap under load now. It does make getting everything in and held down a bit of a challenge though.

[Neutraligon]

Let's turn this question on its head: How can you see yourself as any gender at all? Is there some specific thing or feeling that makes someone see themself as a man or as a woman? Can we really pin any definitive trait down, aside from simple self-identification?

Gender's not simple. It's messy, it's difficult to define, and no one really knows why anyone has a gender at all. The only metric we can reliably use to determine someone's gender is their self-identification, because there's nothing tangible that can prove it.

But shouldn't someone be able to say "I am a man/woman" in basic terms? You can be asexual but still identify as a man/woman; that's where I'm confused. How can you be neither?

I think I can explain. No one is saying that they are not male/female. What they are saying is that their gender identity is not man/woman. I for instance am agender, meaning I am neither man nor woman, nor any other gender. The reason I claim this is because I cannot feel dysphoria. When I was asked the question what it would feel like to wake up in a body of the opposite sex, I didn't think it would feel weird, I wouldn't feel had the wrong body, I was mainly just interested in how and why that would happen. That is one example of the neither.

I don't think of gender as just one singular spectrum, man to woman. There is also a spectrum of gendered to nongendered as well as the "craziness" that is the non-binary genders.

[Aphryss]

I just got back from my appointment with the endocrinologist. She's willing to prescribe blockers (Cyproterone acetate as opposed to spironolactone due to concerns about low blood pressure) pretty much immediately, but wants a letter from my psychologist first; she wants to wait a couple months after that before prescribing estrogen. She also had me sign the consent forms and took blood for baseline testing.

All in all, she seemed very competent and good at her job, and I'm happy enough with the results even if it means I probably won't start on estrogen until January.

[The Serbian Empire]

I just got back from my appointment with the endocrinologist. She's willing to prescribe blockers (Cyproterone acetate as opposed to spironolactone due to concerns about low blood pressure) pretty much immediately, but wants a letter from my psychologist first; she wants to wait a couple months after that before prescribing estrogen. She also had me sign the consent forms and took blood for baseline testing.

All in all, she seemed very competent and good at her job, and I'm happy enough with the results even if it means I probably won't start on estrogen until January.

While for me, they'd almost certainly use Spiro unless terrible side effects occur. BP is too high.

[Noraika]

So I officially love the Jesuits in my area.

The priest I went to had known me before I started to transition, so of course I was terrified to talk to him, but he was completely supportive of me, and is working with me to ensure that, even if my parents completely reject me, I have options open to me to be able to ensure I can continue my transition. He even was like "yeah, you seem so much happier even just looking at you, compared with last year" when I told him that transitioning was a positive thing for me, and working to maximize the chances my parents will be accepting.

Here's hoping for the next few months!

[Nature-Spirits]

So I officially love the Jesuits in my area.

The priest I went to had known me before I started to transition, so of course I was terrified to talk to him, but he was completely supportive of me, and is working with me to ensure that, even if my parents completely reject me, I have options open to me to be able to ensure I can continue my transition. He even was like "yeah, you seem so much happier even just looking at you, compared with last year" when I told him that transitioning was a positive thing for me, and working to maximize the chances my parents will be accepting.

Here's hoping for the next few months!

That's great! I hope he has some success with your family.

[Philjia]

So I officially love the Jesuits in my area.

The priest I went to had known me before I started to transition, so of course I was terrified to talk to him, but he was completely supportive of me, and is working with me to ensure that, even if my parents completely reject me, I have options open to me to be able to ensure I can continue my transition. He even was like "yeah, you seem so much happier even just looking at you, compared with last year" when I told him that transitioning was a positive thing for me, and working to maximize the chances my parents will be accepting.

Here's hoping for the next few months!

Ah, so he's actually read and understood Mark 12:30 to 12:31.