Christian Discussion Thread V

[Deuxtete]

I hope that you are not offended by this Constinopolis, because I am very glad that you got involved with religion, but I would have to say that probably about 90% of people who are either atheist or agnostic choose not to believe in God, not because they do not believe in him, but because they are too lazy to. A lot of people become more involved when they get older because they realize the importance of it, and that is a good thing.

I've yet to meet anyone who chose to be an atheist. Indeed, I've yet to meet anyone who could choose whether to believe in a god or not.

Which makes me wonder where your 90% figure comes from, and whether you think you're being objective in your assessment of why. I don't think you are.

Define chose.
My best friend of 22 years chose to become atheist...ahhhh I see. Nevermind I got it.

[Conscentia]

Christianity and hence ones reasons for being being a Christian fall under the topic of the thread.
Atheism is not the topic of the thread.

So does living Christianity...you know the topic of the thread.
Yet no complaints from you about the behavior above mine which I duplicated to the letter.
Thus, painfully predictable hypocrisy, demonstrating the intellectual dishonesty so typical in the atheist pretending to have an interest in discussion with Christians, beyond smug mockery based on semantics and in the tone of a ninth grade debater.
I mean, you lack even the ability to indict a non-christian for being impolite even though less than 4 posts later you're claiming my exact duplication of said behavior is impolite.
Could you try and be slightly less transparent with your bigotted nature.

You want me to tell off the other guy too? That guy didn't respond impolitely to a post I made. You responded directly to me, I therefore responded directly to you. It is not my job to strike down every impolite post across NSG, or even in this thread. I'm not the politeness police. Additionally, "some other dude did it too!" does not justify your behaviour.

I didn't make any mockery based on semantics, and can't control what tone you choose to impose on my writing.
You're seem to be making assumptions about me - otherwise your hostility towards me does not make sense. I would advise you to re-evaluate your assumptions as they're leading you to misinterpret me.

[Ardoki]

I was previously a christian; when I was younger.

What changed?

I guess I grew out of it.

For me it was like with Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. When I was little I believed in them, however once I got older I just stopped believing in them as there was no evidence for their existence and they were obviously fictional stories.

But that is just me.

[Constantinopolis]

I used to be an atheist when I was younger...

Are you willing to share the cause of the change?

It was a gradual process, taking several years. If I had the time and the inclination, I could describe it in detail. But here's a quick summary (which doesn't really do justice to the process, but is good enough):

I came to conclude that life without a purpose is meaningless and not worth living, and the only way that life could have a purpose is if the universe has a purpose, and the only way the universe could have a purpose is if some sort of God exists. Thus, I had to believe in God in order for my life to have meaning. So I decided to believe in (a) God.

It took several more years, and quite a bit of study of various religions, until I settled on the Christian God. And some 10 years after that, I settled on Orthodoxy as the correct form of Christianity.

[The Flutterlands]

Are you willing to share the cause of the change?

It was a gradual process, taking several years. If I had the time and the inclination, I could describe it in detail. But here's a quick summary (which doesn't really do justice to the process, but is good enough):

I came to conclude that life without a purpose is meaningless and not worth living, and the only way that life could have a purpose is if the universe has a purpose, and the only way the universe could have a purpose is if some sort of God exists. Thus, I had to believe in God in order for my life to have meaning. So I decided to believe in (a) God.

It took several more years, and quite a bit of study of various religions, until I settled on the Christian God. And some 10 years after that, I settled on Orthodoxy as the correct form of Christianity.

Even though I've left Christianity, I myself believe strongly in the possibility of a creator. I just don't think he/she's any god/goddess we can truly know of in this life, making all religions equally wrong in their on their own merits. This makes me an agnostic theist and level 4 on Richard Dawkin's scale, stating that I believe the possibility of the existence of a creator to be 50/50.

[The Alexanderians]

It was a gradual process, taking several years. If I had the time and the inclination, I could describe it in detail. But here's a quick summary (which doesn't really do justice to the process, but is good enough):

I came to conclude that life without a purpose is meaningless and not worth living, and the only way that life could have a purpose is if the universe has a purpose, and the only way the universe could have a purpose is if some sort of God exists. Thus, I had to believe in God in order for my life to have meaning. So I decided to believe in (a) God.

It took several more years, and quite a bit of study of various religions, until I settled on the Christian God. And some 10 years after that, I settled on Orthodoxy as the correct form of Christianity.

Even though I've left Christianity, I myself believe strongly in the possibility of a creator. I just don't think he/she's any god/goddess we can truly know of in this life, making all religions equally wrong in their on their own merits.

Are we sharing our religious life stories? Like why we converted from X to B?

[Ardoki]

Are you willing to share the cause of the change?

It was a gradual process, taking several years. If I had the time and the inclination, I could describe it in detail. But here's a quick summary (which doesn't really do justice to the process, but is good enough):

I came to conclude that life without a purpose is meaningless and not worth living, and the only way that life could have a purpose is if the universe has a purpose, and the only way the universe could have a purpose is if some sort of God exists. Thus, I had to believe in God in order for my life to have meaning. So I decided to believe in (a) God.

It took several more years, and quite a bit of study of various religions, until I settled on the Christian God. And some 10 years after that, I settled on Orthodoxy as the correct form of Christianity.

You don't need a deity to have a purpose of meaning of life.

My purpose and meaning of live is to have fun.

[Constantinopolis]

Ultimately, for me, you could say it does not matter if God truly exists or not.

If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns.

But if God exists, then love conquers hate, happiness triumphs over suffering, evil is defeated, death is overthrown, and life reigns.

To paraphrase C.S. Lewis, I would choose to live as if God existed even if I knew He didn't. Either I am on the side of Life Victorious, or I am making a defiant but hopeless last stand against the all-consuming abyss. It does not really matter which it is. I am doing the right thing either way.

[The Alexanderians]

Ultimately, for me, you could say it does not matter if God truly exists or not.

If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns.

But if God exists, then love conquers hate, happiness triumphs over suffering, evil is defeated, death is overthrown, and life reigns.

To paraphrase C.S. Lewis, I would choose to live as if God existed even if I knew He didn't. Either I am on the side of Life Victorious, or I am making a defiant but hopeless last stand against the all-consuming abyss. It does not really matter which it is. I am doing the right thing either way.

So this is what it's like to be on the receiving end of this, now I know why people tell me they need to take a drink when I leave the room.

[Ardoki]

Ultimately, for me, you could say it does not matter if God truly exists or not.

If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns.

But if God exists, then love conquers hate, happiness triumphs over suffering, evil is defeated, death is overthrown, and life reigns.

To paraphrase C.S. Lewis, I would choose to live as if God existed even if I knew He didn't. Either I am on the side of Life Victorious, or I am making a defiant but hopeless last stand against the all-consuming abyss. It does not really matter which it is. I am doing the right thing either way.

Why do you need a god in order to love, or to hate, or to find happiness, etcetera?

I like and dislike based on personal preference, not due to a deity.

[Idzequitch]

Ultimately, for me, you could say it does not matter if God truly exists or not.

If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns.

But if God exists, then love conquers hate, happiness triumphs over suffering, evil is defeated, death is overthrown, and life reigns.

To paraphrase C.S. Lewis, I would choose to live as if God existed even if I knew He didn't. Either I am on the side of Life Victorious, or I am making a defiant but hopeless last stand against the all-consuming abyss. It does not really matter which it is. I am doing the right thing either way.

Why do you need a god in order to love, or to hate, or to find happiness, etcetera?

I like and dislike based on personal preference, not due to a deity.

I don't think that's the point. If there is no God, we can still feel that we lived valiantly, and influenced the world positively, even if it was ultimately meaningless. If everything is ultimately meaningless, there is no real loss here. Meanwhile, if we're right, then we are justified, we can see holiness triumph, and can enjoy the eternal life that we have believed in.

[Coulee Croche]

Ultimately, for me, you could say it does not matter if God truly exists or not.

If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns.

But if God exists, then love conquers hate, happiness triumphs over suffering, evil is defeated, death is overthrown, and life reigns.

To paraphrase C.S. Lewis, I would choose to live as if God existed even if I knew He didn't. Either I am on the side of Life Victorious, or I am making a defiant but hopeless last stand against the all-consuming abyss. It does not really matter which it is. I am doing the right thing either way.

Why do you need a god in order to love, or to hate, or to find happiness, etcetera?

I like and dislike based on personal preference, not due to a deity.

And his personal preference is the deity. He adheres to his philosophy as you to yours. He gave his life meaning according to it as you have yours.

[Ardoki]

Why do you need a god in order to love, or to hate, or to find happiness, etcetera?

I like and dislike based on personal preference, not due to a deity.

And his personal preference is the deity. He adheres to his philosophy as you to yours. He gave his life meaning according to it as you have yours.

But he made a statement: "If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns."

I merely asking why he thinks that way.

[The Hobbesian Metaphysician]

And his personal preference is the deity. He adheres to his philosophy as you to yours. He gave his life meaning according to it as you have yours.

But he made a statement: "If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns."

I merely asking why he thinks that way.

Going on that quote if "good is an illusion" then how can evil have already won if it too would be an illusion?

[Ardoki]

But he made a statement: "If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns."

I merely asking why he thinks that way.

Going on that quote if "good is an illusion" then how can evil have already won if it too would be an illusion?

I guess he would respond by saying the absence of good would mean evil has won by default.

However if good wasn't real (with it being an illusion and all), then logically evil wouldn't be real either. Since the concepts of good and evil are linked. If there was only evil (and no good), such a state would be considered normal or balanced, and thus not evil.

[South East Europe]

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

[Salus Maior]

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

If we only adhered to something based on the moral purity of all its members, nobody would be anything.

Let he who has never sinned cast the first stone, and so forth.

Edit: I saw this on facebook and thought it was funny, so I thought I'd share it here

[Diopolis]

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

I nearly left the church(well, as far as it's possible to leave) over the same issue when I was younger and less mature; however, I suspect that our views on what constitutes the moral failings of the church would be... somewhat at odds.

[Luminesa]

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

If we only adhered to something based on the moral purity of all its members, nobody would be anything.

Let he who has never sinned cast the first stone, and so forth.

Edit: I saw this on facebook and thought it was funny, so I thought I'd share it here

My life. Is made. This is hilarious.

And so true. Modern-day disciples, lol.

[Luminesa]

Ultimately, for me, you could say it does not matter if God truly exists or not.

If God does not exist, then we love in vain, we hate in vain, we find happiness in vain, we suffer in vain, we live in vain, we die in vain. We are dust on the cosmic winds. Humanity is meaningless, Life is meaningless, the Earth itself and its billions of years of history are meaningless. If God does not exist, then good is an illusion, evil has already won, and death reigns.

But if God exists, then love conquers hate, happiness triumphs over suffering, evil is defeated, death is overthrown, and life reigns.

To paraphrase C.S. Lewis, I would choose to live as if God existed even if I knew He didn't. Either I am on the side of Life Victorious, or I am making a defiant but hopeless last stand against the all-consuming abyss. It does not really matter which it is. I am doing the right thing either way.

And there was so much win that day...

[Confederate Ramenia]

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

I nearly left the church(well, as far as it's possible to leave) over the same issue when I was younger and less mature; however, I suspect that our views on what constitutes the moral failings of the church would be... somewhat at odds.

In my opinion you should stay with the Church not despite its failings but because of its failings. The more people leave, the more the Church is weakened, divided, and susceptible to moral failings. Catholics need the church and the Church needs Catholics.

SEE, I saw in your sig that you're influenced by paganism and Buddhism. What ideas do you take from these religions? What pagan religions influence you?

[Efraim-Judah]

I'm a devout Catholic despite the moral failings of some Catholics.

I nearly left the church(well, as far as it's possible to leave) over the same issue when I was younger and less mature; however, I suspect that our views on what constitutes the moral failings of the church would be... somewhat at odds.

In my opinion you should stay with the Church not despite its failings but because of its failings. The more people leave, the more the Church is weakened, divided, and susceptible to moral failings. Catholics need the church and the Church needs Catholics.

SEE, I saw in your sig that you're influenced by paganism and Buddhism. What ideas do you take from these religions? What pagan religions influence you?

The Church should move far far away from Catholicism.

[Confederate Ramenia]

In my opinion you should stay with the Church not despite its failings but because of its failings. The more people leave, the more the Church is weakened, divided, and susceptible to moral failings. Catholics need the church and the Church needs Catholics.

SEE, I saw in your sig that you're influenced by paganism and Buddhism. What ideas do you take from these religions? What pagan religions influence you?

The Church should move far far away from Catholicism.

Why should the Catholic Church stop being Catholic?

[Salus Maior]

The Church should move far far away from Catholicism.

Why should the Catholic Church stop being Catholic?

Because Messianic Judaism.

[The Alexanderians]

In my opinion you should stay with the Church not despite its failings but because of its failings. The more people leave, the more the Church is weakened, divided, and susceptible to moral failings. Catholics need the church and the Church needs Catholics.

SEE, I saw in your sig that you're influenced by paganism and Buddhism. What ideas do you take from these religions? What pagan religions influence you?

The Church should move far far away from Catholicism.

"White should stop being so white"