A view of conservatives, from a conservative

[Nazi Flower Power]

Its just, in a 21st century world, where women's rights is a huge political topic, we also take up for a culture that endorses the beating of women that are raped.

What the fuck does this have to do with your previous sentence? Why is this not in a separate paragraph if you're moving on to a new topic.

So, do we accept what's behind to move forward?

What does this even mean?

This is just one version of how we move forward but bring what's behind us with it and call it a future.

What?


Well, look at it. Most times conservatives are called old world, or that we don't move forward, any number of things that would tie us to a old mindset of thinking. At the same time Islam is considered conservative, and practice a lot of things that we wouldn't see as alright under human right laws and what not, but they are still accepted as a part of it. So, do their human rights violations and actions, and ways of life stop anyone from accepting them into the 21st century world? In a very liberal, progressive world, that has a goal of taking a select old world system with them? Its interesting because they way they do things is the opposite of what progressives would see as progress would accept as being modern. Now, if I said this about a Christian, then we can outlaw, and say bad thing, and do what ever; if it was Islam, we just need to progress them and bring them into the 21st century. Also, anyone against this now has a mental issue called Islamaphobic.

So, that's what I meant by that.

Islam does not get any special consideration or protection that Christianity doesn't. Liberals do not support the human rights abuses committed by Islamic extremists.

[The Marshmallow people of tgs]

Why is it that when an organization that someone supports does something wrong they immediately declare that it was a minority or a "few". You all belong to the same group. Conservatives are Conservatives, Christians are Christians. It doesn't matter in what little ways you differ. The right wing is responsible for the actions it's supporters take, just as the left wing is.

To me it seems like y'all are quick to disassociate yourselves with that person or group.

[Fralinia]

This OP essentially consists of bashing liberals under the pretense of describing conservatives, and I'm not having it. Yes, I, as a liberal atheist, disagree with conservative Christians. No, I don't hate them or think they're stupid. But when they come in blazing with harshly critical attitudes towards my political views that are largely based in falsities and misrepresentations of who I am and how I think, I do find them very silly and also rather wrong, just like they would find me very silly if I did the same thing to them.

[Diopolis]

I wanted to talk on a few thing as a Christian and conservative, that currently are things I see going on daily.

1st off, separation of church and state is used and abused by both sides. In political talks, I hear a lot of more left leaning people say instead of doing dumb things like protesting over abortion and what not, why wont Christians solve world issues, like hunger and what not. Well, for the record, some do, but they are hated because they are religious, Christian, in nature, which then makes them old world and un effective, so they want to provide a result that the world demands but wont let them give, so in a sense how can they do anything? Now, even as a conservative, I don't want faith being the whole base of politics. Faith should be a choice, not forced. Its just, even atheists, have a faith. they have a faith there is no god, as we have a faith God leads us through out life. So, we all have a faith in one way or another, ours just became the realization that there is more out there then just us. So, what does that have to do with church and state? Why would a Texas mayor order pastors give over sermons if this old world system had no power? If this church was fake and could do nothing, why would people demand separation of church and state, which leads to my second point.

2nd. Most Christians and conservatives are not scared, and do not have a phobia of Islam. One thing I notice, because we don't accept something, people equate it with a fear, but then when other people don't accept something, its a civil right? Well, I wont lie, there are some people that miss represent Christians and conservatives. Its just, in a 21st century world, where women's rights is a huge political topic, we also take up for a culture that endorses the beating of women that are raped. So, do we accept what's behind to move forward? This is just one version of how we move forward but bring what's behind us with it and call it a future. Its not that I or any other conservative is scared of a Islamic person, its just we cant over look the bad things that are happening, the same as I can say with some people that call themselves "Christians" but have a hard time actually showing the love and compassion Christ commanded. Yet, does the love and compassion demand that you over look things that are wrong, things that are dangerous, things that cause issues? Nope, but you should reprimand in love of another person, and not in hate, and that's the things so many have failed at.

3rd and my final thing. This one will get me in a lot of trouble with the more liberal side of politics. Civil rights didn't come from man, because if they did, nothing would be civil. If we legislate morality, you push people to do the opposite, but do you over look un moral actions, nope. Through out history, what was defined as civil was ever changing, is that what we would want in our nations, in our cities? To have a ever changing format of what's right and wrong, what acceptable, to only have freedom and justice if your on the side of the political party that won the most recently election. A example of this is the recent Indiana bill, using religious freedom, discrimination occurs, and that's what religion should not be used for. My question is, do we become so secular and so accepting, that we block out groups and views that can do good, but because of the name we don't allow them to do anything? We allowed Islam into the 21st century with out changing a lot, all I ask is that Christians be allowed the same with out chaining their faith to meet the current political views. Because, in the end, what good is faith if every other person determines it, except a unchanging standard that is the headline for what you believe in. That's why for me, Christianity and conservative ideas, will never be split. Its true, their are liberal Christians, and some liberal ideas work fine, make a good economy, make a good place to live in. Yet, its the idea of non-chaining standards, morals that help some one live a good life, and the belief that by doing this, we make things better in the hope for a brighter future. And for me, that should actually be conservatism.

I know the more liberal side will hate everything I wrote her probably, but hey, I want a honest discussion, a honest view, pull apart what I said, if its the truth, it should stand firm. So, my question is, the things I wrote down, should that be real conservatism, should it be accepted, in a 21st century world should Christianity play a part? Lets have a honest discussion, and lets try to keep it civil with out a lot of cursing and what not.

As a christian conservative, let me tell you how you're wrong.
1. Yes, religions have some worldly power. I'll let other people argue about whether it's too much or too little. No, separation of church and state doesn't mean "The church should adopt liberal positions on everything, not just economic issues", because there's another term for that: episcopalianism Liberal Christianity. Now, it sometimes gets used that way, but that's an incorrect use of the term. Separation of church and state just means that the church doesn't control the state, and the state doesn't control the church.
2. I rather admire Islam for their devotion and strict moral code, actually. Stop talking out of your ass about no conservatives being scared of Islam, when they produce racist videos about how they're outbreeding Christians.
3. Your argument here doesn't even make sense. Civil rights do come from man; you're thinking about natural rights, which not everyone even recognizes as existing.

[Nazi Flower Power]

I would like to remind everyone here claiming or saying ''what atheists believe'' is false because we don't have a organized code on our views. We're all individual people having our own reasons for being a atheist. In my view, that's one of the reasons I became a atheist. I truly feel that this allows me to be me. Call me a hipster or a rebel, but I do not like the idea of submitting myself to a orthodox institution to be myself.

note me using the word feel rather then believe.

^This.

Some atheists actually do belong to organized religions, like versions of Buddhism that don't have deities or Jewish groups that are just in it to preserve their culture and hold the community together. I once met a rabbi who didn't believe in God. But then other people don't have a religion at all.

[The New Sea Territory]

Its just, even atheists, have a faith. they have a faith there is no god

It would be nice if conservatives could go even a paragraph without lying about and insulting their enemies.

They wouldn't be conservative at that point. Not being allowed to make shit up about opponents is a clear example of PC Fascists contributing to the moral degradation of Murica. If conservatives don't defend their right to strawman, then what rights do they have!?

[Godular]

It would be nice if conservatives could go even a paragraph without lying about and insulting their enemies.

They wouldn't be conservative at that point. Not being allowed to make shit up about opponents is a clear example of PC Fascists contributing to the moral degradation of Murica. If conservatives don't defend their right to strawman, then what rights do they have!?

Guns4jheezhus!!!1!

And alsp... discirminize against them homogays 4jheezhus.

Or something... I dunno.

[Dragonir]

If this was the 1970s i wouldn't have been a conservative but i was raised in a Catholic home and my parents taught me right from wrong so on social issues i am a conservative

[Sociobiology]

I wanted to talk on a few thing as a Christian and conservative, that currently are things I see going on daily.

1st off, separation of church and state is used and abused by both sides. In political talks, I hear a lot of more left leaning people say instead of doing dumb things like protesting over abortion and what not, why wont Christians solve world issues, like hunger and what not. Well, for the record, some do, but they are hated because they are religious, Christian, in nature, which then makes them old world and un effective, so they want to provide a result that the world demands but wont let them give, so in a sense how can they do anything?

dislike=/= prevent you from doing things.
And people tend to dislike the apparatus of religion more than religion itself.

Now, even as a conservative, I don't want faith being the whole base of politics. Faith should be a choice, not forced. Its just, even atheists, have a faith. they have a faith there is no god,

which does not require faith, faith means belief regardless of evidence.
we have a thread on this.

So, what does that have to do with church and state? Why would a Texas mayor order pastors give over sermons if this old world system had no power? If this church was fake and could do nothing, why would people demand separation of church and state,

because belief in fake things still results in real behavior. see your point 2

3rd and my final thing. This one will get me in a lot of trouble with the more liberal side of politics. Civil rights didn't come from man,

of course they do, all rights come from their enforcement, if nobody acts as though you have a right you don't have that right.

because if they did, nothing would be civil.

why?

If we legislate morality, you push people to do the opposite, but do you over look un moral actions, nope

.
actually yes because different cultures define moral differently.

Through out history, what was defined as civil was ever changing,

which demonstrates it is a human construct

is that what we would want in our nations, in our cities? To have a ever changing format of what's right and wrong, what acceptable,

yes, otherwise our morals would never progress, it would still be OK to own slaves, women would still be property, and we would still treat mental illness with beatings.

to only have freedom and justice if your on the side of the political party that won the most recently election.

no, which is why we have formalized rights and a constitution.

A example of this is the recent Indiana bill

, which was a step back to old morals not a move to new ones.

My question is, do we become so secular and so accepting, that we block out groups and views that can do good, but because of the name we don't allow them to do anything?

you have not shown one would follow from the other.

We allowed Islam into the 21st century with out changing a lot,

no we really don't, we make all religions live up to our current societies rules and morals, it is only once those are met we allow flexibility, Some Christians like some Muslims are just often confused about what modern morals are.

Because, in the end, what good is faith if every other person determines it, except a unchanging standard that is the headline for what you believe in.

exactly, what good is faith?

The major divide between conservatives and progressives is whether you value tradition for its own sake.

That's why for me, Christianity and conservative ideas, will never be split. Its true, their are liberal Christians, and some liberal ideas work fine, make a good economy, make a good place to live in. Yet, its the idea of non-chaining standards, morals that help some one live a good life,

or not, this isn't really a claim with any evidence.
non-changing standards are the very thing liberals find as problematic.
Change isn't always good but it is better than the alternative. No society survives through stagnation.