Lee Kuan Yew Dies

[Costa Fierro]

Nobody said you aren't, but considering he just died, wouldn't it be better to discuss it without telling others that their opinions are bullshit?

Why? I often think people's views are bullshit. Don't try to tell me where I can and cannot explain to them why.

That isn't true; I haven't seen any program giving people special benefits because of their race.

Did I say special treatment? No.

Uh, the fact that it later became an economic powerhouse in just 40 years after said riots? I don't know?

No. Considering that countries like South Korea and Japan have become economic powerhouses in roughly the same time period after having most of their countries destroyed by war, I don't think that Singapore is "unique".

1) Sure it did, but it was still a 3rd World nation.

Not exactly devoid of anything with which to build an economy on now is it?

2) No *self sustaining* military

Shifting the goalposts.

Eh, let's not take into account the squatters, the terrible state of healthcare, the stinky Singapore River and so on.

Hence why I said "for East Asian standards".

I meant for the period of time following independence.

Fine. Enact laws which prevent discrimination and promote the education of other religions and multiculturalism in schools.

Consider the context, where we have 4 to 5 major ethnic groups and over 10 religions crammed into a tiny island of 714 square km.

Wow. Four or five? Outside of Chinese, Malays and Indians, what are these other "major" ethnic groups? As for "over 10 religions", I can find evidence of six plus a substantial portion of non-religious people.

Considering that where I live, we have four major "racial" groups not counting the different ethnic groups within those racial groups. We also have roughly the same number of religions, including the ones you'd find in Singapore, I'd hardly say that Singapore is "unique" in that respect when it comes to building a state with a multiethnic society.

Clearly you've not read the comics section in the Straits Times.

Fairly tame satire.

Again, consider the context in which such laws were implemented; barely out of merger, riots everywhere, numerous types of people crammed together, etc.

And those days are over. Singapore isn't going to tear itself apart as soon as you get rid of them.

So? You insinuate that protests and demonstrations don't happen because of an absence of free speech; I show otherwise.

It's not really a protest if people get together and celebrate who they are.

Because it sounds like many of the people comparing Singapore to the DPRK and such have never spent any time here.

Except that no one has. Singapore is the same kind of authoritarianism like you'd find in places like Fiji: a country open to foreigners but quietly denying their citizens basic human rights.

That's not what I meant.

So what did you mean by "mass extermination"?

Let me guess… America?

Nope. New Zealand. The country that is freer than the "land of the free and the home of the brave".

[Geilinor]

It's like reading from a PAP pamphlet, or listening to one of their robotic politicians repeating why Singapore is an authoritarian state. What are you protecting these things from? Disparaging political views? Transparency? Homosexuals?

Yes obviously people who hold these views are clearly all PAP shills. How dare we entertain such opinions indeed.

And to entertain your question: political, racial and religious extremism.

The second largest political party in Singapore is hardly "extreme".

[Draakonite]

Except that no one has. Singapore is the same kind of authoritarianism like you'd find in places like Fiji: a country open to foreigners but quietly denying their citizens basic human rights.

Personally i wouldn't count political freedoms as "basic" human rights. Limiting freedom of press, expression and assembly isn't something completely unheard of in "liberal democracies". Of course on a much smaller scale, but still if it has a scale how can you call it basic?

[Imyoji]

Rest in peace, sir.

Honestly if Malaysia had followed Lee's example Malaysia would be oh so much better than it is now. Ish. Sort off.

[Greed and Death]

He was pretty cool

[Atlanticatia]

That's unfortunate. Even though he was occasionally authoritarian, he essentially succeeded in creating one of the richest countries in the world, essentially from nothing.

[Ziegenhain]

A good man with good ideas and good policies died. Pretty sad indeed.

[The Conez Imperium]

Generally positive emotions for the man, it's sad to hear him die. He turned Singapore into an absolutely beautiful country however his authoritarianism leaves a somewhat bitter taste.

[The Greater Aryan Race]

Yes obviously people who hold these views are clearly all PAP shills. How dare we entertain such opinions indeed.

And to entertain your question: political, racial and religious extremism.

The second largest political party in Singapore is hardly "extreme".

Neither was my earlier comment directed towards the Worker's Party. I had in mind Marxist, Fascist, ultranationalist, ethnic and religious supremacist political groups and individuals.

[Seraven]

Rest in peace, sir.

Honestly if Malaysia had followed Lee's example Malaysia would be oh so much better than it is now. Ish. Sort off.

Malaysia is way off the slope now.

Generally positive emotions. He turned Singapore into an absolutely beautiful country however his authoritarianism leaves a somewhat bitter taste.

An authoritarianism rule is needed during the early years of independence.

[Krasny-Volny]

I had no idea he was on his way out. RIP.

I've always admired Mr. Lee and his autobiography was one of the first books I purchased when I was first in Singapore, hard to believe it's been almost twenty years now!! Just like Mandela, incredible to think he's gone.

Did you seriously just compare Mandela and Lee Kuan Yew?

Not in terms of politics or impact, no.

But they both rank somewhere on my list of famous Cold War figures that have died in my lifetime.

[The Conez Imperium]

Generally positive emotions. He turned Singapore into an absolutely beautiful country however his authoritarianism leaves a somewhat bitter taste.

An authoritarianism rule is needed during the early years of independence.

I agree, he had to use some heavy handed tactics to forge Singapore what it is today. However in saying since Singapore is now a top rate country I don't think its necessary to have the remnants of those heavy handed tactics. It's a sticky situation Singapore are in at the moment as this article I think rather accurately describes it...

On this note however, another marvelous contribution of Mr Lee Kuan Yew was his tight stand on corruption. Corruption stops a nation from progressing and this is something that Lee Kuan Yew knew early on so he put in tough laws and a zero tolerance policy for Singapore.

The major downside of his style of leadership is that it has created a legal and political system in Singapore where it is difficult to protect against future corrupt leaders from implementing policies to benefit themselves legally. Those in power will have quite absolute power and this system only worked when the leader is someone like Lee Kuan Yew.

His nation building must be appreciated. Even those who criticise the detention without trial, his heavy handed tactics, strong control of the media and the limits on civil liberties, should accept that these are what allowed him to shape Singapore so efficiently. It would not have been possible for Mr Lee to build Singapore with his teams' policies without the strong power that these problems allowed him to have.

The question now is whether the same system will work in the future now that the arguably incorruptible Lee Kuan Yew is not in the driver's seat. The system he created, while it worked for him and contributed significantly to Singapore's development during tumultuous times, may not work in the modern world.

[Sandhora]

He suppressed freedom of speech and limited the powers of opposition parties... made all the newspapers, radio stations and some tv networks under the control of the his government.. enforce really strict laws and heavy punishments.. a really authoritarian ruler indeed but nevertheless he's still a great leader