A real progressive tax that favours the poor.

[Vazdaria]

No.
http://www.usnews.com/debate-club/is-a- ... y-the-rich
http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/ ... blogs&_r=0
http://mattbruenig.com/2011/12/17/the-t ... -flat-tax/

Depends on what your definition of fair is. If granting everyone equal access to opportunity is fair, or levelling the playing field for equal outcomes (you canot have both for one destroys the other.

Equality of Person the fairest tax would be something like a flat national sales tax (which a tarriff attached to transactions of individual persons within a naton) , or returning to a general tarrif for all international transactions. If you are taliking about equoalityof outcome (by making the rich and poor equally destitute) a progressive income tax appklied to all labor and rents is best.

A flat tax is the best.

[Skinia]

Depends on what your definition of fair is. If granting everyone equal access to opportunity is fair, or levelling the playing field for equal outcomes (you canot have both for one destroys the other.

Equality of Person the fairest tax would be something like a flat national sales tax (which a tarriff attached to transactions of individual persons within a naton) , or returning to a general tarrif for all international transactions. If you are taliking about equoalityof outcome (by making the rich and poor equally destitute) a progressive income tax appklied to all labor and rents is best.

A flat tax is the best.

Like hell it is.

[Vazdaria]

So yes you are classist.

Am I supposed to feel shame? It's not like I'm demanding this because I'm poor. It's economics, and I would gladly pay that percentage on my income above $250,000. I already pay a higher than average marginal rate.

Well, I mean its just clear that you don't care about treating people equally is all.

[Kelinfort]

No.
http://www.usnews.com/debate-club/is-a- ... y-the-rich
http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/ ... blogs&_r=0
http://mattbruenig.com/2011/12/17/the-t ... -flat-tax/

Depends on what your definition of fair is. If granting everyone equal access to opportunity is fair, or levelling the playing field for equal outcomes (you canot have both for one destroys the other.

Equality of Person the fairest tax would be something like a flat national sales tax (which a tarriff attached to individual persons within a naton) , or returning to a general tarrif for all international transactions. If you are taliking about equoalityof outcome (by making the rich and poor equally destitute) a progressive income tax appklied to all labor and rents is best.

Not biased at all.

A national sales tax would be ruinous on any developed economy. If you solely have a national sales tax, a black market would bloom. And, a general tariff is contrary to free trade, for one, but would also act to reduce consumption. These are not good ideas economically.

[Olivaero]

Depends on what your definition of fair is. If granting everyone equal access to opportunity is fair, or levelling the playing field for equal outcomes (you canot have both for one destroys the other.

Equality of Person the fairest tax would be something like a flat national sales tax (which a tarriff attached to transactions of individual persons within a naton) , or returning to a general tarrif for all international transactions. If you are taliking about equoalityof outcome (by making the rich and poor equally destitute) a progressive income tax appklied to all labor and rents is best.

A flat tax is the best.

If you hate poor people it is.

[Kelinfort]

Am I supposed to feel shame? It's not like I'm demanding this because I'm poor. It's economics, and I would gladly pay that percentage on my income above $250,000. I already pay a higher than average marginal rate.

Well, I mean its just clear that you don't care about treating people equally is all.

Boohoo.

[Vazdaria]

A flat tax is the best.

Like hell it is.

You don't like treating people equally?

[Vazdaria]

A flat tax is the best.

If you hate poor people it is.

You mean treat them like everyone else? Treating the poor like a "special" class that can't help themselves is idiotic.

[Olivaero]

If you hate poor people it is.

You mean treat them like everyone else? Treating the poor like a "special" class that can't help themselves is idiotic.

The rich are the special class in your model not the poor. Unless you think scraping along at the bottom makes you the special class.

[Skinia]

If asking for a fair amount of taxes from those wealthiest (35-40% graduated on $250,000+) then yes, I am classist.

So yes you are classist.

A classist when faced by oppression, yes... just the same way women are sexist in the face of oppression. The same way gays are heterophobic in the face of oppression. The same way blacks are racist in the face of oppression. I.e, nope. We're not classist.

[Skinia]

Like hell it is.

You don't like treating people equally?

I do, you don't by opposing a system in which equal opportunity can be made possible.

[New Macureus]

You do realize that tobacco taxes are extremely regressive, as are gasoline taxes, inherently more disproportionately punitive to the poor than to the rich, right?

[Kelinfort]

You mean treat them like everyone else? Treating the poor like a "special" class that can't help themselves is idiotic.

The rich are the special class in your model not the poor. Unless you think scraping along at the bottom makes you the special class.

You'll pay your taxes the same rate as Steve Forbes and you'll like it!

[Narland]

A flat tax is the best.

Like hell it is.

Nobody will be on the same page and people will be talking past each other until what is meant by fair.

As far as a progressive tax that favors the poor, there isn't one. The poor usually work for richer employers who cannot afford to hire more people when they are taxed beyond the means to sustain their wealth. Both end up the poorer for it. One no longer has a means to produce goods or service, and one no longer has the means to be in the employ of same.

The best single tax that favors the poor depends on the banking system and currency of the nation. Most nations have a state sponsored oligarchical banking structure with a fiat currency, and debt is monetized through credit expansion. The poor are the most disadvantaged under this dual arrangement.

The sales tax is the lightest burden for the poor under this system. The poor spend less therefor are taxed less. Since more income is spent on food, clothing, and shelter per paycheck than that of the wealthy, removing the sales tax from food, clothing and home purchases would benefit the poor even more. Excise taxes on the purchase of luxery items, be it caviar or yachts are also a possiblity.

[Kelinfort]

Like hell it is.

The sales tax is the lightest burden for the poor under this system. The poor spend less therefor are taxed less. Since more income is spent on food, clothing, and shelter per paycheck than that of the wealthy, removing the sales tax from food, clothing and home purchases would benefit the poor even more. Excise taxes on the purchase of luxery items, be it caviar or yachts are also a possiblity.

Sales taxes are uniform, not progressive. That makes them extremely regressive.

[Narland]

The sales tax is the lightest burden for the poor under this system. The poor spend less therefor are taxed less. Since more income is spent on food, clothing, and shelter per paycheck than that of the wealthy, removing the sales tax from food, clothing and home purchases would benefit the poor even more. Excise taxes on the purchase of luxery items, be it caviar or yachts are also a possiblity.

Sales taxes are uniform, not progressive. That makes them extremely regressive.

The question that followed was regarding the lightest burden. The lightest burden would be a sales tax on everything but food, and shelter (for a fiat currency).

A progressive tax that favors the poor, techinically doesn't exist. Progressive taxation rewards poverty, and discourages anyone for leaving. It then progressively punishes you the farther you excape from it by increasing the burden. If one is looking to progress to being eqully poor, this is it. It may be progressive, but it is not progress.

[Vazdaria]

You don't like treating people equally?

I do, you don't by opposing a system in which equal opportunity can be made possible.

Everyone's opportunity is taken away when we tax, (that is the opportunity to spend that money) and when we tax in a progressive fashion, the rich's opportunity is taken away more than the poor. A flat tax remedies this.

[Vazdaria]

So yes you are classist.

A classist when faced by oppression, yes... just the same way women are sexist in the face of oppression. The same way gays are heterophobic in the face of oppression. The same way blacks are racist in the face of oppression. I.e, nope. We're not classist.

You are clearly classist. You don't like treating people the same. Women want equal pay as men, gays want marriage equality, blacks wanted the same civil rights....they all wanted to be treated the same, and so again I state the flat tax treats everyone the same. The progressive tax does not do this.

[Narland]

I do, you don't by opposing a system in which equal opportunity can be made possible.

Everyone's opportunity is taken away when we tax, (that is the opportunity to spend that money) and when we tax in a progressive fashion, the rich's opportunity is taken away more than the poor. A flat tax remedies this.

I think it would be better to say that a flat tax makes it not as painful. I do not support a national flat tax on principle. Free people should not be taxed directly by any means without immediate voluntary consent, either by direct election at the local level only, or by emergency of state. What we do want is a system that helps the engines of the economy raise the poor to the standards of the wealthy over time (like we once had), not tear the means of productivity away from the wealthy bringing the economly down. This hurts the poorest of the poor the worst.

[Laerod]

Like hell it is.

You don't like treating people equally?

You don't either, so get off your high horse.

[Vazdaria]

You don't like treating people equally?

You don't either, so get off your high horse.

In regards to taxation? Yes I do.

[Lalaki]

A progressive tax system should go as far as to bring in enough revenue to fund social welfare, such as public health insurance and day care facilities.

[Skinia]

A classist when faced by oppression, yes... just the same way women are sexist in the face of oppression. The same way gays are heterophobic in the face of oppression. The same way blacks are racist in the face of oppression. I.e, nope. We're not classist.

You are clearly classist. You don't like treating people the same. Women want equal pay as men, gays want marriage equality, blacks wanted the same civil rights....they all wanted to be treated the same, and so again I state the flat tax treats everyone the same. The progressive tax does not do this.

A flat tax doesn't treat everyone the same. Off with the illusions. It has a bigger effect on poorer than richer people.

[Vazdaria]

A progressive tax system should go as far as to bring in enough revenue to fund social welfare, such as public health insurance and day care facilities.

A progressive taxation system is classist.

[Kelinfort]

You don't either, so get off your high horse.

In regards to taxation? Yes I do.

I think he was referring to your other beliefs.