Canadian parliament on lockdown.

[The balkens]

So I was right, the perpetrator was a Muslim and a child of an immigrant. There is no other to be a terrorist.

Did you just say that all terrorists are muslims?



Also, I know it's a serious situation, but damn this image looks like it's from James Bond or something.

i'd be more impressed if he killed him with that giant golden thing.

[Bottany Bay Colony]

Or Irish.

[Kouralia]

Did you just say that all terrorists are muslims?



Also, I know it's a serious situation, but damn this image looks like it's from James Bond or something.

I am speaking of today, not some of events from 30+ years. I was right yet there were poster who claimed to "not jump on conclusions".

>30+ years ago

[Dewhurst-Narculis]

So I was right, the perpetrator was a Muslim and a child of an immigrant. There is no other to be a terrorist.

Did you just say that all terrorists are muslims?



Also, I know it's a serious situation, but damn this image looks like it's from James Bond or something.

"GET TO THE SCHOOL CROSSING!"

yeah bit of a contrast there

[Alyakia]

The man on Monday was not the child of an immigrant nor were the members of the FLQ.

Wasn't he also a recent convert? Not that it makes much difference? Also what country was he from if his parents are immigrants. I mean so far all I've heard is that he was a recently converted white guy.

oh and he had an extensive criminal record. but obviously it's the recent muslim part that's important, lol.

Did you just say that all terrorists are muslims?



Also, I know it's a serious situation, but damn this image looks like it's from James Bond or something.

I am speaking of today, not some of events from 30+ years. I was right yet there were poster who claimed to "not jump on conclusions".

and? you did. that you happened to be right does not clear you jumping to conclusions. you could have just as easily been wrong like the people that jumped all over beivik claiming he was totally a muslim. just like you were wrong about the guy that was born in canada to a canadian mother being an immigrant, which you then changed to child of an immigrant in at attempt to be less wrong, but still ended up wrong. almost like you... jumped to conclusions, lol.

[Avenio]

Neither was Zehaf-Bibeau;



He was an average Canadian growing up whose mother happened to have married a Libyan businessman for a time. That same article also notes that he seems to have struggled with mental illness in his early 20's, perhaps precipitating his conversion to radical Islam.

Erm, I said "child of an immigrant". If his father is an immigrant, that still makes him the child of an immigrant. Not that his father being Libyan had anything to do with him going on his rampage.

No, but he way I interpreted that article he's the child of Susan Bibeau from a previous relationship and that Bibeau married Zehaf while he was growing up. Hence the hyphenated name.

[Phoenixfox]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

If 5% of Muslims want to attack non-Muslims and force Sharia on them, should we tolerate them because it's unfair to 95% of them? What if 40% want you dead? Do you still say since the majority aren't trying to kill you, we need to put up with them? Or are you one of those who goes all the way, and even if 99% of them want you dead, we still accommodate them because the one guy shouldn't be discriminated against?

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

[Napkiraly]

Erm, I said "child of an immigrant". If his father is an immigrant, that still makes him the child of an immigrant. Not that his father being Libyan had anything to do with him going on his rampage.

No, but he way I interpreted that article he's the child of Susan Bibeau from a previous relationship and that Bibeau married Zehaf while he was growing up. Hence the hyphenated name.

Ohhh my bad sorry. Missed that part.

[Napkiraly]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

If 5% of Muslims want to attack non-Muslims and force Sharia on them, should we tolerate them because it's unfair to 95% of them?

How about we just condemn the 5% yeah without resorting to hating or discriminating against the remaining 95%? Well shit that was easy.

[Napkiraly]

Did you just say that all terrorists are muslims?



Also, I know it's a serious situation, but damn this image looks like it's from James Bond or something.

I am speaking of today, not some of events from 30+ years. I was right yet there were poster who claimed to "not jump on conclusions".

The Troubles officially ended in the late 90's. Violence still pops up. ETA has only recently laid down their arms. Tamil Tigers were only defeated a few years ago. FARC in Colombia is still around as is the Shining Path in Peru. Naxalists in India. AUC only stopped its activities in Colombia in 2006. You were saying there bruv?

[Avenio]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

That's the wrong question to ask. Although it's hard to extrapolate from a sample size of 2, the fact that both of the attackers were mentally unstable prior to converting and committing their attacks, and that when they interacted with the broader Muslim community they sent up red flags is important. It's pretty likely, in fact, that members of the mosques they attended tipped off CSIS and/or the RCMP in the first place. We know that the Muslim Canadian community issued fatwas against terrorism years ago and that they were very quick to condemn the two attackers and offer condolences to the victims.

Seeing as the Muslim community isn't the problem, the question we should be asking is what our mental health community can and should be doing to support these people and keep them from travelling down these paths.

[Northwest Slobovia]

I am speaking of today, not some of events from 30+ years. I was right yet there were poster who claimed to "not jump on conclusions".

The Troubles officially ended in the late 90's. Violence still pops up. ETA has only recently laid down their arms. Tamil Tigers were only defeated a few years ago. FARC in Colombia is still around as is the Shining Path in Peru. Naxalists in India. AUC only stopped its activities in Colombia in 2006. You were saying there bruv?

Don't forget the militia and "soverign citizen" types in the US. One of them ambushed police officers near here about a month ago, and is still being chased down. His "real" name is clearly abu Eric al-Freini. /nods

Of course, to the extent we know the motives of any of these guys. Yesterday's shooter is kinda dead, and Frein is still hiding in the woods.

[Quevola]

Absoloutly terrible what happened in Ottowa. My heart goes out to all of those killed.

[Vamtrl]

[Phoenixfox]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

If 5% of Muslims want to attack non-Muslims and force Sharia on them, should we tolerate them because it's unfair to 95% of them?

How about we just condemn the 5% yeah without resorting to hating or discriminating against the remaining 95%? Well shit that was easy.

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

[Napkiraly]

How about we just condemn the 5% yeah without resorting to hating or discriminating against the remaining 95%? Well shit that was easy.

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

Of course the baddies don't go around shouting "We're the baddies" unless it's in a place like Syria. That's why we have the police and CSIS to investigate who are the baddies and a good way of knowing who the baddies are is to go to the non-baddie Muslims, not be dicks, and ask them to help us out - which they have. Then we can catch the baddies without being dickheads to those who do not share their beliefs. Well shit, that was also easy.

[Atlanticatia]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

If 5% of Muslims want to attack non-Muslims and force Sharia on them, should we tolerate them because it's unfair to 95% of them? What if 40% want you dead? Do you still say since the majority aren't trying to kill you, we need to put up with them? Or are you one of those who goes all the way, and even if 99% of them want you dead, we still accommodate them because the one guy shouldn't be discriminated against?

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

so, by your logic, we should stop tolerating Christians because of Christian terrorist groups like the KKK or hate groups like the Westboro Baptist church?

[Napkiraly]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

If 5% of Muslims want to attack non-Muslims and force Sharia on them, should we tolerate them because it's unfair to 95% of them? What if 40% want you dead? Do you still say since the majority aren't trying to kill you, we need to put up with them? Or are you one of those who goes all the way, and even if 99% of them want you dead, we still accommodate them because the one guy shouldn't be discriminated against?

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

so, by your logic, we should stop tolerating Christians because of Christian terrorist groups like the KKK or hate groups like the Westboro Baptist church?

$10 says they'll be applied to a different standard. Why? Because, just because.

[Phoenixfox]

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

Of course the baddies don't go around shouting "We're the baddies" unless it's in a place like Syria. That's why we have the police and CSIS to investigate who are the baddies and a good way of knowing who the baddies are is to go to the non-baddie Muslims, not be dicks, and ask them to help us out - which they have. Then we can catch the baddies without being dickheads to those who do not share their beliefs. Well shit, that was also easy.

Then why don't the "good" muslims do more to denounce violent measures and terrorism? Why don't mosques get rid of imams with extremist leanings, or report extremist members to police? We all know they silently approve of it when these things happen. The extremists have the tacit approval of the rest of the Muslim community, who smirk in private then shake their heads in public to save face so that we'll continue to accommodate them. Don't forget there were celebrations in the streets of middle eastern cities after 9/11. If you believe the moderate muslims are really on our side, then they have fooled you - that's what they want you to think.

[Phoenixfox]

I understand that not all moslems are evil.

But what % of a group of people have to hate you for them to be blacklisted.

If 5% of Muslims want to attack non-Muslims and force Sharia on them, should we tolerate them because it's unfair to 95% of them? What if 40% want you dead? Do you still say since the majority aren't trying to kill you, we need to put up with them? Or are you one of those who goes all the way, and even if 99% of them want you dead, we still accommodate them because the one guy shouldn't be discriminated against?

Be realistic - the good and bad Muslims don't go around wearing white hats and black hats - you get all of them and as a group they are hundreds of time more likely to commit acts of violence in the name of religion than any other group.

so, by your logic, we should stop tolerating Christians because of Christian terrorist groups like the KKK or hate groups like the Westboro Baptist church?

KKK is a racial hate group, some of whom happen to be Christian, not a religious body. The Westboro church, though a little bit of a nuisance at times, doesn't hurt anybody.

[Avenio]

Then why don't the "good" muslims do more to denounce violent measures and terrorism?

Fatwas released jointly by all of the major Canadian imams denouncing all violence in the name of Islam as evil isn't enough?

Why don't mosques get rid of imams with extremist leanings, or report extremist members to police? We all know they silently approve of it when these things happen.

They already do. Again, for all we know, fellow congregants were the ones who tipped CSIS off to the extremism of the two attackers in the first place.

[Napkiraly]

Of course the baddies don't go around shouting "We're the baddies" unless it's in a place like Syria. That's why we have the police and CSIS to investigate who are the baddies and a good way of knowing who the baddies are is to go to the non-baddie Muslims, not be dicks, and ask them to help us out - which they have. Then we can catch the baddies without being dickheads to those who do not share their beliefs. Well shit, that was also easy.

Then why don't the "good" muslims do more to denounce violent measures and terrorism? Why don't mosques get rid of imams with extremist leanings, or report extremist members to police? We all know they silently approve of it when these things happen. The extremists have the tacit approval of the rest of the Muslim community, who smirk in private then shake their heads in public to save face so that we'll continue to accommodate them. Don't forget there were celebrations in the streets of middle eastern cities after 9/11. If you believe the moderate muslims are really on our side, then they have fooled you - that's what they want you to think.

http://www.masjidtoronto.com/2014/10/muslim-association-ofcanada-condemns-violence-in-ottawa-and-montreal/

Also something something about the Muslim community helping the authorities say who were the radicals to put on that list and how their contribution was paramount.

Oh and sauce for that they all secretly support such actions.

[Fanosolia]

so, by your logic, we should stop tolerating Christians because of Christian terrorist groups like the KKK or hate groups like the Westboro Baptist church?

KKK is a racial hate group, some of whom happen to be Christian, not a religious body. The Westboro church, though a little bit of a nuisance at times, doesn't hurt anybody.

*cough* denial! *cough cough*

Also by you logic in a previous post, that would mean moderate christians would be against homosexuality.

[Atlanticatia]

so, by your logic, we should stop tolerating Christians because of Christian terrorist groups like the KKK or hate groups like the Westboro Baptist church?

KKK is a racial hate group, some of whom happen to be Christian, not a religious body. The Westboro church, though a little bit of a nuisance at times, doesn't hurt anybody.

the original Klan's ideology was Christian terrorism and white supremacy - and Christian terrorism still remains as a part of it today. It was/is a terrorist organization.

And I mean, why don't we consider religiously motivated attacks on abortion providers and abortionists as terrorism? It's the same thing.

For example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Army_of_God_(United_States)

Also, from Wikipedia:
".. since 1977 in the United States and Canada, there have been 17 attempted murders, 383 death threats, 153 incidents of assault or battery, and 3 kidnappings committed against abortion providers. .. Property crimes committed against abortion providers have included 41 bombings, 173 arsons, 91 attempted bombings or arsons, 619 bomb threats, 1630 incidents of trespassing, 1264 incidents of vandalism, and 100 attacks with butyric acid ("stink bombs"). The New York Times also cites over one hundred clinic bombings and incidents of arson, over three hundred invasions, and over four hundred incidents of vandalism between 1978 and 1993."

[Napkiraly]

so, by your logic, we should stop tolerating Christians because of Christian terrorist groups like the KKK or hate groups like the Westboro Baptist church?

KKK is a racial hate group, some of whom happen to be Christian, not a religious body. The Westboro church, though a little bit of a nuisance at times, doesn't hurt anybody.

Mhmmm something something about the KKK not being fan of Catholics, Jews, and other religious folk due to them being rather hell bent on thinking Protestantism being the bestest thing ever.