Is War A Valid Option To Deal With Putin?

[Murkwood]

No. First off Putin hasn't done anything to the west. He's annexed Crimea, and as far as expanding goes thats about it. Now, if he invades another nation afflicted with the west, then maybe. But you better figure out what to do about the nuke problem, because nuclear war is not fun.

MAD guarantees no nation will ever fire a nuke, with the exception of Iran.

[Murkwood]

*Mao Tse-Tung or Mao Zedong, your spelling is oddly phallic.

And his thinking is naive too. History repeats itself, Adolf Hitler thought he had the strongest army in the world, Napoleon too.

The Mongols did it, and it was winter too.

[Republic of Coldwater]

No. First off Putin hasn't done anything to the west. He's annexed Crimea, and as far as expanding goes thats about it. Now, if he invades another nation afflicted with the west, then maybe. But you better figure out what to do about the nuke problem, because nuclear war is not fun.

MAD guarantees no nation will ever fire a nuke, with the exception of Iran.

So Iran would want to potentially destroy their own nation, their own people and their own government?

[Murkwood]

MAD guarantees no nation will ever fire a nuke, with the exception of Iran.

So Iran would want to potentially destroy their own nation, their own people and their own government?

It's not likely, but still a possibility.

[Serrian]

Something people are forgetting is that not all Russians are bad.

Even assuming all nuclear weapons in the world inexplicably failed and it would only be a "regular" war, an invasion of Russia would bring catastrophic casualties to Russian civilians, especially considering they have a history of not surrendering so easily. Do they deserve that? And before you say "they voted for him", have you never regretted making a decision even when you had no possible way of knowing the outcome?

Russians are people too, and I detest that most of the reasons for not invading Russia so far has been the idea of a loss of European and American citizens. Tell me, NSG, if you had a chance to destroy Russia and kill everyone inside at no risk to the rest of the world, would you do it?

[Republic of Coldwater]

So Iran would want to potentially destroy their own nation, their own people and their own government?

It's not likely, but still a possibility.

They evidently don't, as if they do have a nuke or anything like that, they would've destroyed many US Naval Units in the Mediterranean.

[Lyttenburg]

And his thinking is naive too. History repeats itself, Adolf Hitler thought he had the strongest army in the world, Napoleon too.

The Mongols did it, and it was winter too.

Actually, this is not true. The winter prevented Mongols from attacking northern parts of Rus (Pskov, Novgorod). They still campaigned mainly in spring-summer period.

[Lyttenburg]

Something people are forgetting is that not all Russians are bad.

Even assuming all nuclear weapons in the world inexplicably failed and it would only be a "regular" war, an invasion of Russia would bring catastrophic casualties to Russian civilians, especially considering they have a history of not surrendering so easily. Do they deserve that? And before you say "they voted for him", have you never regretted making a decision even when you had no possible way of knowing the outcome?

Russians are people too, and I detest that most of the reasons for not invading Russia so far has been the idea of a loss of European and American citizens. Tell me, NSG, if you had a chance to destroy Russia and kill everyone inside at no risk to the rest of the world, would you do it?

Seeing that NSG discussions about Russia attracts mainly unapologetic Russophobes (both closeted and the ones that came out), I guess their collective answer would be "Yeah! 'Murica, fuck yeah!"

[Indira]

Something people are forgetting is that not all Russians are bad.

Even assuming all nuclear weapons in the world inexplicably failed and it would only be a "regular" war, an invasion of Russia would bring catastrophic casualties to Russian civilians, especially considering they have a history of not surrendering so easily. Do they deserve that? And before you say "they voted for him", have you never regretted making a decision even when you had no possible way of knowing the outcome?

Russians are people too, and I detest that most of the reasons for not invading Russia so far has been the idea of a loss of European and American citizens. Tell me, NSG, if you had a chance to destroy Russia and kill everyone inside at no risk to the rest of the world, would you do it?

No. But IF it came to war (unlikely, but for the sake of argument) then said Russians would be the ones fighting it. The same could be said for the Germans in WW2. Not all Germans were bad, but the fact of the matter is that war effected them just the same. So no, we wouldn't. We just put our own citizens first.

[Korva]

Something people are forgetting is that not all Russians are bad.

Even assuming all nuclear weapons in the world inexplicably failed and it would only be a "regular" war, an invasion of Russia would bring catastrophic casualties to Russian civilians, especially considering they have a history of not surrendering so easily. Do they deserve that? And before you say "they voted for him", have you never regretted making a decision even when you had no possible way of knowing the outcome?

Russians are people too, and I detest that most of the reasons for not invading Russia so far has been the idea of a loss of European and American citizens. Tell me, NSG, if you had a chance to destroy Russia and kill everyone inside at no risk to the rest of the world, would you do it?

Despite how it may seem to some, Putin is not a dictator. He really is acting on the will of the people. And so in the words of Curtis LeMay:

"There are no innocent civilians. It is their government and you are fighting a people, you are not trying to fight an armed force anymore. So it doesn't bother me so much to be killing the so-called innocent bystanders."

[Caltarania]

I'd rather not die of nuclear radiation, tyvm.

[Myrensis]

Despite how it may seem to some, Putin is not a dictator. He really is acting on the will of the people. And so in the words of Curtis LeMay:

It is somewhat amusing. I mean, the history of Putin's rise and his popularity in Russia aren't even that mystifying. People like to call him a Dictator just because, in spite of the mountains of evidence to the contrary, we like to cling to the delusion that real democracy will always lead to freedom and happiness and rainbow puppies for all.

[The Sotoan Union]

It's basically just rewarding aggression. Instead of doing anything to stop a very powerful nation from expanding its influence into less powerful nations, we pay them for doing so. If a child is throwing a tantrum, you don't buy them a toy to get them to stop. That just encourages more tantrums. When did appeasement ever get any nation to stop being aggressive?

Economic sanctions prevent bloodbath and have an impact. It's currently working.

Again, "bloodbath" is the key word. Especially in the nuclear age which people seem to forget that we're in. Ganging up on a weakened Iraq, for example, is not the same thing as squaring off against another major nuclear power in an actual war. I actually support the sanctions on Putin's Russia; I draw the line at the US going to war for the Crimea or another disputed chunk of Eastern Europe. Borders shift all the time, and at times it's better that they shift with a pen than with the sword.

Appeasement would be a horrible way to go about that though. The sanctions are a better idea.

[Saarth]

Something people are forgetting is that not all Russians are bad.

Even assuming all nuclear weapons in the world inexplicably failed and it would only be a "regular" war, an invasion of Russia would bring catastrophic casualties to Russian civilians, especially considering they have a history of not surrendering so easily. Do they deserve that? And before you say "they voted for him", have you never regretted making a decision even when you had no possible way of knowing the outcome?

Russians are people too, and I detest that most of the reasons for not invading Russia so far has been the idea of a loss of European and American citizens. Tell me, NSG, if you had a chance to destroy Russia and kill everyone inside at no risk to the rest of the world, would you do it?

That's true. Putin was elected democratically, and most of what he has done is good. Even in crimea, most Crimeans supported the annexation. Now this doesn't mean he was right to, but there are far worse people out there. Has America never done any wrong? Or Europe? Of course they have. They've split up entire continents between themselves and oppressed th natives
Now this isn't to say "Americans are evil!", but my point is that Putin is far from the first person to annex land of a foreign nation.

[Herskerstad]

If Putin starts it or invades NATO territory, then yes.

[Serrian]

Something people are forgetting is that not all Russians are bad.

Even assuming all nuclear weapons in the world inexplicably failed and it would only be a "regular" war, an invasion of Russia would bring catastrophic casualties to Russian civilians, especially considering they have a history of not surrendering so easily. Do they deserve that? And before you say "they voted for him", have you never regretted making a decision even when you had no possible way of knowing the outcome?

Russians are people too, and I detest that most of the reasons for not invading Russia so far has been the idea of a loss of European and American citizens. Tell me, NSG, if you had a chance to destroy Russia and kill everyone inside at no risk to the rest of the world, would you do it?

Despite how it may seem to some, Putin is not a dictator. He really is acting on the will of the people. And so in the words of Curtis LeMay:

"There are no innocent civilians. It is their government and you are fighting a people, you are not trying to fight an armed force anymore. So it doesn't bother me so much to be killing the so-called innocent bystanders."

He is acting on the will of the people, but not all of the people. What you are effectively saying is:

"Joe's brother voted for Putin, so if we invade Russia, both Joe and Joe's brother need to suffer because they were Putin's citizens."

No. Not even Joe's brother should be punished, because he didn't necessarily know that Putin would attack Ukraine.

[Kelinfort]

No. TBH, he really hasn't been that aggressive in his efforts, not to mention, Russia is not a power to war with.

I would be more willing to sympathise with Putin if he wasn't socially conservative.

[Rothschild]

I repeat. NO. NO. NO.

A war against Russia just to topple its head of state is not going to be like Iraq, the Kossacks have been modernising their military slowly but surely and have some quality aircraft, plus a weapon that has the sun's light, heat and power. If sanctions are placed against Moscow, the Kremlin will just turn off the gas and oil supply, that is if any sanctions get off the deck. If the UN Security Council wants to condemn Russia, Russia and maybe China will veto. A question I will ask is this: WHAT IF NATO is antagonizing the Kossacks?

[Lyttenburg]

I repeat. NO. NO. NO.

A war against Russia just to topple its head of state is not going to be like Iraq, the Kossacks have been modernising their military slowly but surely and have some quality aircraft, plus a weapon that has the sun's light, heat and power. If sanctions are placed against Moscow, the Kremlin will just turn off the gas and oil supply, that is if any sanctions get off the deck. If the UN Security Council wants to condemn Russia, Russia and maybe China will veto. A question I will ask is this: WHAT IF NATO is antagonizing the Kossacks?

Who do you call "Kossacks"? Russians? According to you, what - all of them are "Kossaks"?

Should we start calling all Americans "Rednecks" now? And all Jews - "Rothschilds"?

[Edward Scissorhands]

Vladimir Putin is an admirable politician, he doesn't take shit from the Western bullies and wishes to steer away from the US dollar in regards to oil. Which is amazing.

If you take up arms against him, I will help defend him.

[Myrensis]

Vladimir Putin is an admirable politician, he doesn't take shit from the Western bullies and wishes to steer away from the US dollar in regards to oil. Which is amazing.

If you take up arms against him, I will help defend him.

Pfft, how are you going to fire a gun with those scissor fingers?

[Bolnoa]

War isn't the answer.

[Northeskia]

If only Putin would abandon his religion & his aggressive expansionism, we wouldn't have these anti-gay issues and terrorist-funding.

[Korva]

Despite how it may seem to some, Putin is not a dictator. He really is acting on the will of the people. And so in the words of Curtis LeMay:

"There are no innocent civilians. It is their government and you are fighting a people, you are not trying to fight an armed force anymore. So it doesn't bother me so much to be killing the so-called innocent bystanders."

He is acting on the will of the people, but not all of the people. What you are effectively saying is:

"Joe's brother voted for Putin, so if we invade Russia, both Joe and Joe's brother need to suffer because they were Putin's citizens."

No. Not even Joe's brother should be punished, because he didn't necessarily know that Putin would attack Ukraine.

That is not at all what I said.
Joe and the majority of his brothers supported and continue to support Putin. It is no great tragedy if either Joe or his brothers, even those that do not like Putin, become casualties of a war started by Putin.
I said nothing about punishment or the West invading Russia.

[Lyttenburg]

If only Putin would abandon his religion

What you have against the Orthodox Christianity?

& his aggressive expansionism

"Aggressive expansionism"? Really? If he was really expansionists he would invade the Ukraine properly months ago and annex all of the Eastern Ukraine.

What are you suggesting now? For him to ignore the will of Crimean people, give back Creimea to the Ukraine (as it is some sack of potatos) and say "Me bad"?

we wouldn't have these anti-gay issues

Do you seriously think that all of the recent anti-gay legislation in Russia was only due to Putin's "EVIL" will and are not supported by the populace?

and terrorist-funding.

WAT?

Also, should I remind you which country kick-started Al-Qaeda back in 80s?