Ukraine Megathread: Crimea River Build a Bridge, Get Over It

[Korva]

Lol. Those aren't M4 Carbines. At least, they aren't like anything the US Military uses. They look like the Civilian config.

3 position fire selectors tend to suggest military rifles. They seem to be old stock US issue by the looks.

Here is a rebel from Donetsk carrying one some 10 months ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxvvPlEJ8s0&t=50s

I'm temped to say the Russians supplied it (I am not a denier of Russian involvement), the attachments look pretty expensive and hard to come by, unless he has a lot of cash. And I saw a few of the rebels with them, with similar attachment loadouts, around that time.

3 position fire selector says nothing, you can easily get one for any AR.

The 3rd position being a single raised piece of metal.

Russia could have supplied them, Molot makes an AR clone.

[Geilinor]

Wait, so the RPG-29 is actually more effective when a Russian pulls the trigger?

When a trained Russian uses it, yes. It's not like some magical force that suddenly makes everything go "KABOOM" when a Russian uses it.

Or do you really believe in that?

Yeah that's why all those Gay Enabling Fascist Westerner Banderists won like 4% of the vote right? Because they're carrying on his legacy?

It's simply called, Banderists, and it's not like someone has to be a loud neo-nazi to carry on his beliefs.

4% of the vote is literally nothing, extremists get more of the vote in most European countries.

[Zimnaya Zemlya]

When a trained Russian uses it, yes. It's not like some magical force that suddenly makes everything go "KABOOM" when a Russian uses it.

Or do you really believe in that?

It's simply called, Banderists, and it's not like someone has to be a loud neo-nazi to carry on his beliefs.

4% of the vote is literally nothing, extremists get more of the vote in most European countries.

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

[The balkens]

4% of the vote is literally nothing, extremists get more of the vote in most European countries.

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

*yawn

Another Buzzword, another day.

[Washington Resistance Army]

4% of the vote is literally nothing, extremists get more of the vote in most European countries.

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

Ah yes, hidden agendas!

Did I ever tell you about Obama's reptillian agenda to turn us all into atheist socialist anti-gun nuts who get abortions? He's carrying on the British monarchies legacy!

[The balkens]

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

Ah yes, hidden agendas!

Did I ever tell you about Obama's reptillian agenda to turn us all into atheist socialist anti-gun nuts who get abortions? He's carrying on the British monarchies legacy!

ALL HAIL HIS NON-WHITENESS!!!

[Geilinor]

4% of the vote is literally nothing, extremists get more of the vote in most European countries.

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

Prove that they have those beliefs and admirations.

[Zimnaya Zemlya]

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

Prove that they have those beliefs and admirations.

Go to Kiev, or go on ukrainian forums and ask what people think about Mr. Stephan Bandera. That simple.

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

Ah yes, hidden agendas!

Did I ever tell you about Obama's reptillian agenda to turn us all into atheist socialis

ALL HAIL HIS NON-WHITENESS!!!

t anti-gun nuts who get abortions? He's carrying on the British monarchies legacy!

Hey, you guys comedians now? It seems that way, the way you dodge my arguments with ridiculous side tangents. Why don't you give a legitimate rebuttal you didn't rip out of a conspiracy theorists mind?

[Washington Resistance Army]

Hey, you guys comedians now? It seems that way, the way you dodge my arguments with ridiculous side tangents. Why don't you give a legitimate rebuttal you didn't rip out of a conspiracy theorists mind?

I'm not dodging your arguments, I'm simply responding to stupidity with more stupidity because I already know you'll never accept anything we say no matter how much evidence we have.

The fact you actually believe the ebul banderists control the government even though you've been shown to be wrong says enough as to why no one will ever take you seriously. Like UMN said, you aren't helping the pro-Russia side win any arguments by spouting off stupid conspiracy theory bullshit.

[Bratislavskaya]

3 position fire selectors tend to suggest military rifles. They seem to be old stock US issue by the looks.

I'm temped to say the Russians supplied it (I am not a denier of Russian involvement), the attachments look pretty expensive and hard to come by, unless he has a lot of cash. And I saw a few of the rebels with them, with similar attachment loadouts, around that time.

3 position fire selector says nothing, you can easily get one for any AR.

The 3rd position being a single raised piece of metal.

Russia could have supplied them, Molot makes an AR clone.

As I said: "tend to suggest military rifles". It's more likely than not that they are military grade.

Because instead of buying something useful, they would buy 100 Molot M4 clones, put a third position on the fire select, cover them in dust, and place them in a cache in Donetsk airport, just to show the media. I doubt it. Anyway, the M4s were one example. They also found 155mm shells that had been fired at them, and Ukraine doesn't have any 155mm guns in its inventory, and they must have come from somewhere. I'd link the video, but I can't from my phone (which I have now transitioned to).

[United Marxist Nations]

Corrected.

Except you left out that the Soviet Union are the ones who turned those cities to ashes. You also left out that none of the former USSR-aligned States could actually afford to maintain the cities built under USSR guidance, without USSR help. So, yeah... the USSR fucked over Eastern Europe, whether you want to admit it or not. Poland has only now started to bounce back from the shithole the Soviets left behind.

Ukraine, sadly, never bounced back from getting anally worked-over by the fall of the USSR.

How was the USSR the ones that turned them to ashes? The Nazis invaded and held the cities, destroying most of them in the process. Most of the ones that weren't destroyed by the Nazis were only destroyed in removing the Nazis.

[Estruia]

Except you left out that the Soviet Union are the ones who turned those cities to ashes

No, it's still there if you look.

You also left out that none of the former USSR-aligned States could actually afford to maintain the cities built under USSR guidance, without USSR help.

No, many of the Eastern nations were actually supported by Western loans. And not only that but East Germany had an economy stronger than that of the USSR.

So, yeah... the USSR fucked over Eastern Europe, whether you want to admit it or not.

Most Eastern Europeans would disagree (I didn't have enough words for these).

Ukraine, sadly, never bounced back from getting anally worked-over by the fall of the USSR.

It didn't "bounce back", it went downhill. Ukraine wasn't too bad as part of the USSR. After it got worse.

You think you're helping your argument, but you aren't. They were still fucked over by the USSR, when it failed as a State. It built up those countries beyond where they could independently maintain, then disappeared as an entity. Hence why I said the USSR fucked over Eastern Europe.

Also, if you reread what I said, I said Ukraine never bounced back. However, I feel like rereading what I said wouldn't fit into your narrative, so don't worry about it. <3

[United Marxist Nations]

Prove that they have those beliefs and admirations.

Go to Kiev, or go on ukrainian forums and ask what people think about Mr. Stephan Bandera. That simple.

Ah yes, hidden agendas!

Did I ever tell you about Obama's reptillian agenda to turn us all into atheist socialist anti-gun nuts who get abortions? He's carrying on the British monarchies legacy!

Hey, you guys comedians now? It seems that way, the way you dodge my arguments with ridiculous side tangents. Why don't you give a legitimate rebuttal you didn't rip out of a conspiracy theorists mind?

IIRC, only some 33% like Right Sektor (the Banderites), I will go get poll to get exact number.

[Zimnaya Zemlya]

Hey, you guys comedians now? It seems that way, the way you dodge my arguments with ridiculous side tangents. Why don't you give a legitimate rebuttal you didn't rip out of a conspiracy theorists mind?

I'm not dodging your arguments, I'm simply responding to stupidity with more stupidity because I already know you'll never accept anything we say no matter how much evidence we have.

The fact you actually believe the ebul banderists control the government even though you've been shown to be wrong says enough as to why no one will ever take you seriously. Like UMN said, you aren't helping the pro-Russia side win any arguments by spouting off stupid conspiracy theory bullshit.

Riiiight, and spouting bullshit in response is okay. "OMG DID YOU GUYS KNOW MERKEL IS A FISH WOMAN LOOKING TO HARVEST OUR BRAINS FUR OUR ALIEN OVERLORDS?????!!?!?"

Alright, show me some evidence that supports Poroshenko not being a Banderite, and hating or despising Bandera. Because right now, Poroshenko is doing what Bandera strived to do, remove Russians and their supporters from Ukraine. Show me what the Ukrainian populace thinks of Bandera. I've seen it and heard first-hand.

[United Marxist Nations]

Go to Kiev, or go on ukrainian forums and ask what people think about Mr. Stephan Bandera. That simple.



Hey, you guys comedians now? It seems that way, the way you dodge my arguments with ridiculous side tangents. Why don't you give a legitimate rebuttal you didn't rip out of a conspiracy theorists mind?

IIRC, only some 33% like Right Sektor (the Banderites), I will go get poll to get exact number.

The survey also asked respondents about the “Right Sector,” a nationalist organization that played a major role in the Maidan protests and whose presence has sparked worries about anti-Semitism and racism in Ukraine. Barely two-in-ten Ukrainians (19%) say supporters of the Right Sector are having a good influence on the country, compared with almost two-thirds (65%) who say the organization is having a negative impact. Overall, few in the country’s west (34%) or east (7%) give the Right Sector positive evaluations, although Ukrainians in the far west are somewhat more likely to describe the Right Sector as having a good influence (42%).

When asked their attitude toward different ethnic groups, overwhelming majorities in Ukraine say they have a favorable opinion of ethnic Ukrainians (96%), Jews (87%), Russians (84%) and Tatars (84%). With regard to ethnic Ukrainians, favorable attitudes are highly uniform across the territory of the country. Views toward ethnic Russians, however, are more positive in the country’s east (93% favorable) than either the far west or center west (60% and 81% favorable, respectively).3 Meanwhile, there are smaller differences by language, with Russian-only speakers more favorable toward ethnic Russians (94%) than either bilingual (85%) or Ukrainian-only speakers (73%).

Nonetheless, concern about ethnic conflict within Ukraine’s borders has spiked in 2014. Overall, 73% of Ukrainians say ethnic conflict is a big problem in their country, including 40% who say it is a very big problem. In 2009, just 37% said such conflict was a big problem, including only 15% who thought it was a very big concern. Western Ukrainians (77% big problem) and those in the east (74%) are nearly equally worried about ethnic conflict in Ukraine. Among eastern Ukraine, Russian-only speakers and other language speakers, alike, express concern.

http://www.pewglobal.org/2014/05/08/cha ... -conflict/

[The balkens]

I'm not dodging your arguments, I'm simply responding to stupidity with more stupidity because I already know you'll never accept anything we say no matter how much evidence we have.

The fact you actually believe the ebul banderists control the government even though you've been shown to be wrong says enough as to why no one will ever take you seriously. Like UMN said, you aren't helping the pro-Russia side win any arguments by spouting off stupid conspiracy theory bullshit.

Riiiight, and spouting bullshit in response is okay. "OMG DID YOU GUYS KNOW MERKEL IS A FISH WOMAN LOOKING TO HARVEST OUR BRAINS FUR OUR ALIEN OVERLORDS?????!!?!?"

Alright, show me some evidence that supports Poroshenko not being a Banderite, and hating or despising Bandera. Because right now, Poroshenko is doing what Bandera strived to do, remove Russians and their supporters from Ukraine. Show me what the Ukrainian populace thinks of Bandera. I've seen it and heard first-hand.

political Minorities tend to be the loudest of all.

[Malgrave]

Two words: hidden agenda.

You act like someone HAS to be from a certain party to have certain beliefs or admirations.

*yawn

Another Buzzword, another day.

I have Hidden Agenda installed on my computer at the moment. It is a fairly decent game (and free) so perhaps someone is just suggesting a form of entertainment.

[United Marxist Nations]

No, it's still there if you look.

No, many of the Eastern nations were actually supported by Western loans. And not only that but East Germany had an economy stronger than that of the USSR.

Most Eastern Europeans would disagree (I didn't have enough words for these).

It didn't "bounce back", it went downhill. Ukraine wasn't too bad as part of the USSR. After it got worse.

You think you're helping your argument, but you aren't. They were still fucked over by the USSR, when it failed as a State. It built up those countries beyond where they could independently maintain, then disappeared as an entity. Hence why I said the USSR fucked over Eastern Europe.

Also, if you reread what I said, I said Ukraine never bounced back. However, I feel like rereading what I said wouldn't fit into your narrative, so don't worry about it. <3

In all fairness, the USSR didn't just unilaterally say "Fuck you guys, I'm going home!", its various republics saw the coup happen, then freaked out and ran away in terror. It almost stuck together.

[Bratislavskaya]

IIRC, only some 33% like Right Sektor (the Banderites), I will go get poll to get exact number.

Really? That's actually quite a lot. If all of them voted for them they could easily get into government. That is literally a third of the nation that likes Neo-Nazis.

Edit: Never mind the full stats are different. Still, 34% in the west of Ukraine is quite high.

[The balkens]

You think you're helping your argument, but you aren't. They were still fucked over by the USSR, when it failed as a State. It built up those countries beyond where they could independently maintain, then disappeared as an entity. Hence why I said the USSR fucked over Eastern Europe.

Also, if you reread what I said, I said Ukraine never bounced back. However, I feel like rereading what I said wouldn't fit into your narrative, so don't worry about it. <3

In all fairness, the USSR didn't just unilaterally say "Fuck you guys, I'm going home!", its various republics saw the coup happen, then freaked out and ran away in terror. It almost stuck together.

And we are still dealing with the consequences.

[United Marxist Nations]

IIRC, only some 33% like Right Sektor (the Banderites), I will go get poll to get exact number.

Really? That's actually quite a lot. If all of them voted for them they could easily get into government. That is literally a third of the nation that likes Neo-Nazis.

It's not a matter of whether you like someone that determines who you vote for, it is a matter of who you like most. Though, I agree, it is worrying.

[The balkens]

IIRC, only some 33% like Right Sektor (the Banderites), I will go get poll to get exact number.

Really? That's actually quite a lot. If all of them voted for them they could easily get into government. That is literally a third of the nation that likes Neo-Nazis.

Its still a minority that the ukes could ignore (Or blame them) for the time being. let Democracy run its course and see what happens.

[Korva]

3 position fire selector says nothing, you can easily get one for any AR.

The 3rd position being a single raised piece of metal.

Russia could have supplied them, Molot makes an AR clone.

As I said: "tend to suggest military rifles". It's more likely than not that they are military grade.

Because instead of buying something useful, they would buy 100 Molot M4 clones, put a third position on the fire select, cover them in dust, and place them in a cache in Donetsk airport, just to show the media. I doubt it. Anyway, the M4s were one example. They also found 155mm shells that had been fired at them, and Ukraine doesn't have any 155mm guns in its inventory, and they must have come from somewhere. I'd link the video, but I can't from my phone (which I have now transitioned to).

You somehow used reverso logic there.

The rebels didn't buy M4s from Molot/Norinco/ATG/etc then cover them with dirt then bring in a camera.

Ukrainian volunteer battalions purchased AR's that were then captured when the airport was taken.

If these weapons were in fact from Western stocks then one would imagine that the rebels would be keen to show off and identify serial numbers. Instead they emerge in a few videos and are never mentioned again.

Literally the two things that Ukraine has no shortage of are small arms and artillery, they are the two least needed items.

[United Marxist Nations]

In all fairness, the USSR didn't just unilaterally say "Fuck you guys, I'm going home!", its various republics saw the coup happen, then freaked out and ran away in terror. It almost stuck together.

And we are still dealing with the consequences.

Well, Germany left Comecon of its own impetus, more than a year before the USSR's fall.

[The balkens]

And we are still dealing with the consequences.

Well, Germany left Comecon of its own impetus, more than a year before the USSR's fall.

Shit happens when you tear down a wall, eh?