Malaysian Airliner crashes in Ukraine

[Roski]

But what are the unarmed policemen going to do if attacked? Its not like a Leopard tank column (closest NATO country with sick tanks) is nearby? They gonna wag their fingers at them?

I'd assume, run away and hide, until the Special Forces and Air Support can arrive.

I'd at least give them sidearms.

[Kahlenberg]

I heard the idea is not to send in armed men at this point in order not to provoke escalation of the conflict in the area. I guess Australia keeps some special forces or airborne units stand-by and in proximity to the crash site as well in case the unarmed policemen of either country are attacked.

But what are the unarmed policemen going to do if attacked? Its not like a Leopard tank column (closest NATO country with sick tanks) is nearby? They gonna wag their fingers at them?

If they are attacked, they won't stand a chance. However, it seems an unlikely scenario to me. Attacking unarmed men that are carrying out a resolution adopted by the UN Security Council including Russia will lead to such a strong condemnation that it would be practically suicide for the rebels and their cause. Also, I think it would unleash such a jolt of anger in at least Dutch public opinion that the government will be forced to send the special forces and air force in at once.

[Roski]

But what are the unarmed policemen going to do if attacked? Its not like a Leopard tank column (closest NATO country with sick tanks) is nearby? They gonna wag their fingers at them?

If they are attacked, they won't stand a chance. However, it seems an unlikely scenario to me. Attacking unarmed men that are carrying out a resolution adopted by the UN Security Council including Russia will lead to such a strong condemnation that it would be practically suicide for the rebels and their cause. Also, I think it would unleash such a jolt of anger in at least Dutch public opinion that the government will be forced to send the special forces and air force in at once.

I don't think the rebels cared? They bragged about shooting down the airliner. Do not put it past them.

[Organized States]

I'd assume, run away and hide, until the Special Forces and Air Support can arrive.

I'd at least give them sidearms.

You'd hope that they'd be armed.

[Kahlenberg]

I'd assume, run away and hide, until the Special Forces and Air Support can arrive.

I'd at least give them sidearms.

What are you going to do with those against an AK? Nothing at all, and it will only provoke the rebels to use the AKs. I can't see them killing unarmed men - in the worst case scenario they might capture them, but killing.. I don't think it's likely.

[Kahlenberg]

If they are attacked, they won't stand a chance. However, it seems an unlikely scenario to me. Attacking unarmed men that are carrying out a resolution adopted by the UN Security Council including Russia will lead to such a strong condemnation that it would be practically suicide for the rebels and their cause. Also, I think it would unleash such a jolt of anger in at least Dutch public opinion that the government will be forced to send the special forces and air force in at once.

I don't think the rebels cared? They bragged about shooting down the airliner. Do not put it past them.

I haven't seen footage of any rebel bragging about downing the airliner.

[Organized States]

I'd at least give them sidearms.

What are you going to do with those against an AK? Nothing at all, and it will only provoke the rebels to use the AKs. I can't see them killing unarmed men - in the worst case scenario they might capture them, but killing.. I don't think it's likely.

Some of these guys have been known for being rather trigger happy, but I agree, these rebels would commit suicide if they fired on those officers.

[Allanea]

They've taken OSCE officers hostage/prisoner before, what's different this time?

[Kahlenberg]

They've taken OSCE officers hostage/prisoner before, what's different this time?

These agents are carrying out a UN Security Council Resolution that Putin backed in public. Also capturing Dutch or Australian nationals while the public opinion is already murderous in both countries will lead to an inevitable military intervention.

[Oaledonia]

(closest NATO country with sick tanks)

Poland.

[Kahlenberg]

Hmm, apparently Dutch special forces have been withdrawn from their mission in Mali, on top of the two airborne brigades that were already on stand-by. The Dutch government will make a decision about whether or not they will be sent to Ukraine tomorrow.

[Greater Beggnig]

I heard the idea is not to send in armed men at this point in order not to provoke escalation of the conflict in the area. I guess Australia keeps some special forces or airborne units stand-by and in proximity to the crash site as well in case the unarmed policemen of either country are attacked.

Australia ain't fucking around here. We'll have Army guys guarding our AFP. If some dumb rebels want to shoot at us, we're shooting the fuck back. So protip for the rebels here: don't fucking start shooting at us.

Even if we don't protect the AFP officers with the Army, we'll send them in if the slightest hostility breaks out. Australia's not taking shit on this one...

[Greater Beggnig]

(closest NATO country with sick tanks)

Poland.

http://i.imgur.com/smJnMoT.png

[Imperializt Russia]

Poland.

http://i.imgur.com/smJnMoT.png

Choo-choo motherfuckers, I'm an angry Polack.

[Limborg]

Fun fact though, all flights now avoid Ukriane, and they haven't gotten more expensive at all, at least not over here.

And I am sure you have the source for that, and you aren't just speaking out of your ass, as you have been the whole time?

As i have been? Please explain that crap of yours. Also, get yourself google or so. It doesn't need any source, its quiet Obvious.

[Limborg]

Are a few bucks worth the loss of a plane and the loss of so many lives? I don't think so.



1.Then why do all airliners fly those routes now?
2.Source.

1. Trying to avoid being sued for endangering passengers (only a few however, most are going over Syria now).
2. Math. Calculate fuel costs (including the total fuel cost) on top of permits to fly over the new countries, paying employees, and taxes.

1. Source.
2. Nope, tickets didn't got more expesive, at least not 100$ (what you claim). Prices are pretty much the same, so again you're talking crap.

[Limborg]

I'd assume, run away and hide, until the Special Forces and Air Support can arrive.

I'd at least give them sidearms.

And putting lives at risk with that? You seem to forget that its a warzone. If some militia doesn't like it then those people are screwed. Untill a UN mission gets accepted its very unlikely and very risky to bring in armed people without the approval from the DPR

[Organized States]

1. Trying to avoid being sued for endangering passengers (only a few however, most are going over Syria now).
2. Math. Calculate fuel costs (including the total fuel cost) on top of permits to fly over the new countries, paying employees, and taxes.

1. Source.
2. Nope, tickets didn't got more expesive, at least not 100$ (what you claim). Prices are pretty much the same, so again you're talking crap.

1. You shouldn't need one, it's pretty freaken obvious.
2. Except some if not most airlines airlines keep their ticket prices at a semi-set rate depending on the season. Wow, no math either.

[Limborg]

1. Source.
2. Nope, tickets didn't got more expesive, at least not 100$ (what you claim). Prices are pretty much the same, so again you're talking crap.

1. You shouldn't need one, it's pretty freaken obvious.
2. Except some if not most airlines airlines keep their ticket prices at a semi-set rate depending on the season. Wow, no math either.

1. Nope sorry, source.
2. So you admit that you where talking crap?

[Organized States]

1. You shouldn't need one, it's pretty freaken obvious.
2. Except some if not most airlines airlines keep their ticket prices at a semi-set rate depending on the season. Wow, no math either.

1. Nope sorry, source.
2. So you admit that you where talking crap?

1. Still, it's freaking obvious, so why should I give you one when it's painfully obvious? It's pretty easy to tell quite of the airlines are trying to avoid a negligence lawsuit if another one of their damn planes gets blown from the sky, even if MH-17 was diverted because of traffic, they are attempting to avoid another one of these.
EDIT: Here have a source:
http://www.firstpost.com/world/mh17-tra ... 25271.html
http://fortune.com/2014/07/23/what-will ... fter-mh17/
http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malay ... on-lawyers
2. So, you can't even attempt to refute my points by even doing the simple math?
Also, why the hell would Malaysian even consider raising the cost of their tickets when they are desperately attempting to attract costumers after these two tragedies?

[Allanea]

Passenger planes avoiding flying over Ukraine

[Organized States]

Passenger planes avoiding flying over Ukraine

I like those maps, very informative. Nice find on that one.

[Limborg]

1. Nope sorry, source.
2. So you admit that you where talking crap?

1. Still, it's freaking obvious, so why should I give you one when it's painfully obvious? It's pretty easy to tell quite of the airlines are trying to avoid a negligence lawsuit if another one of their damn planes gets blown from the sky, even if MH-17 was diverted because of traffic, they are attempting to avoid another one of these.
EDIT: Here have a source:
http://www.firstpost.com/world/mh17-tra ... 25271.html
http://fortune.com/2014/07/23/what-will ... fter-mh17/
http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malay ... on-lawyers
2. So, you can't even attempt to refute my points by even doing the simple math?
Also, why the hell would Malaysian even consider raising the cost of their tickets when they are desperately attempting to attract costumers after these two tragedies?

1. Still doesn't say that they all fly over Syria now.
2. nvm, i thought you where the one that claimed that tickets would get more expensive, but it appeared to be someone else.

[Registug]

limborg I don't even think it's worth arguing with you over this if you won't use any of your own logic.

[Organized States]

1. Still, it's freaking obvious, so why should I give you one when it's painfully obvious? It's pretty easy to tell quite of the airlines are trying to avoid a negligence lawsuit if another one of their damn planes gets blown from the sky, even if MH-17 was diverted because of traffic, they are attempting to avoid another one of these.
EDIT: Here have a source:
http://www.firstpost.com/world/mh17-tra ... 25271.html
http://fortune.com/2014/07/23/what-will ... fter-mh17/
http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malay ... on-lawyers
2. So, you can't even attempt to refute my points by even doing the simple math?
Also, why the hell would Malaysian even consider raising the cost of their tickets when they are desperately attempting to attract costumers after these two tragedies?

1. Still doesn't say that they all fly over Syria
2. nvm, i thought you where the one that claimed that tickets would get more expensive, but it appeared to be someone else.

1. Here you go, Not all of them fly over Syria, but more than a few do.
http://mashable.com/2014/07/18/ukraine- ... ict-zones/
http://www.skynews.com.au/news/world/as ... -over.html
http://stream.wsj.com/story/latest-head ... -2-582258/