Is it time to deploy the National Guard at the S. Border?

[Estrain (Ancient)]

1. Them being here is a civil offense, not a criminal one.
2. “As a general rule, it is not a crime for a movable alien to remain in the United States.” - Justice Robert Kennedy.
3. They performed one criminal act, according to a silly system of law that doesn't acknowledge the history of the United States and the obvious benefits of immigration, by crossing the border.
4. It's inhumane and dehumanizing. It's strips them of their humanity, and makes them some sort of "other."

1. But crossing the border is.
2. Okay...Your point?
3. I don't care if you like it or not. Its the law.
4. I think its a good description.

I agree with you on that. Crossing the border is an illegal act. But that does NOT make them illegal. They aren't "illegal immigrants" that's factually incorrect. But clearly, you will continue to use that dehumanizing language and there's nothing I can do.
That quote is from the Supreme Court when they gave out the majority on SB 1070.

[Organized States]

Customs and Border Protection has been flying UNARMED, surveillance drones over the border for years. If the National Guard was to give 8 or 9 more to add to the CBP's 2, you could patrol half the border with ISR and FLIR Capability.

Fair enough, I was wrong about that. I still wouldn't like a lot of drones flying over the border. It would be an invasion of privacy, and it could be a slippery slope leading to weaponized drones.

I think there's currently an Executive Order about the DOD operating armed drones over US Soil, which they area' allowed to. Hellfire missiles are very expensive too, they are running almost 500,000 dollars a pop now, I don't think that the US Government would want to use those on Low Level Human Smugglers when they can bust them for 80,000 dollars instead through conventional means.

[Infected Mushroom]

1. But crossing the border is.
2. Okay...Your point?
3. I don't care if you like it or not. Its the law.
4. I think its a good description.

I agree with you on that. Crossing the border is an illegal act. But that does NOT make them illegal. They aren't "illegal immigrants" that's factually incorrect. But clearly, you will continue to use that dehumanizing language and there's nothing I can do.
That quote is from the Supreme Court when they gave out the majority on SB 1070.

i thought an illegal immigrant was someone who broke a law relating to immigration regulation when entering the country.

how's it dehumanizing? They broke a law... hence the illegal part.

[Murkwood]

1. But crossing the border is.
2. Okay...Your point?
3. I don't care if you like it or not. Its the law.
4. I think its a good description.

I agree with you on that. Crossing the border is an illegal act. But that does NOT make them illegal. They aren't "illegal immigrants" that's factually incorrect. But clearly, you will continue to use that dehumanizing language and there's nothing I can do.
That quote is from the Supreme Court when they gave out the majority on SB 1070.

If you find it offensive, report me to Moderation.

[Estrain (Ancient)]

Fair enough, I was wrong about that. I still wouldn't like a lot of drones flying over the border. It would be an invasion of privacy, and it could be a slippery slope leading to weaponized drones.

Surveillance of Illegals = Invasion of Privacy.

Logic.

Right! Because as citizens of the world, as people, they have rights. They have rights, according to international law and according the United Nations. You're logic is dehumanizing and oppressive.

[Norstal]

What are you going to do, line up the units shoulder to shoulder from the Gulf to the Pacific? If you want to spend money on this, beef up the Border Guard. Deploying weekend warriors who will just be pissed off at having to leave their jobs and families to stand around in the friggin' desert doing nothing is not going to improve anything.

do the National Guard have access to US military satellites?

It can help with surveillance on the ground and help with reducing man-hours for the troops if they get tired.

I expect these high tech tools should be very useful for detecting illegal crossings. You can then send the appropriate response force on a case by case basis...

The border guards have that too...

And probably much better at it.

[Farnhamia]

Fair enough, I was wrong about that. I still wouldn't like a lot of drones flying over the border. It would be an invasion of privacy, and it could be a slippery slope leading to weaponized drones.

Surveillance of Illegals = Invasion of Privacy.

Logic.

True. All persons within the jurisdiction of the United States, whether citizens or not, are entitled to equal protection under the law as provided by the 14th Amendment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yick_Wo_v. ... _the_Court

[Estrain (Ancient)]

I agree with you on that. Crossing the border is an illegal act. But that does NOT make them illegal. They aren't "illegal immigrants" that's factually incorrect. But clearly, you will continue to use that dehumanizing language and there's nothing I can do.
That quote is from the Supreme Court when they gave out the majority on SB 1070.

i thought an illegal immigrant was someone who broke a law relating to immigration regulation when entering the country.

how's it dehumanizing? They broke a law... hence the illegal part.

It's dehumanizing, because humans can't be illegal!!! To refer to them as "illegal" makes them an "other," i.e. not human, i.e. dehumanized.

[Murkwood]

Surveillance of Illegals = Invasion of Privacy.

Logic.

Right! Because as citizens of the world, as people, they have rights. They have rights, according to international law and according the United Nations. You're logic is dehumanizing and oppressive.

There is no real thing as international law. No one cares what the UN has to say.

[Infected Mushroom]

do the National Guard have access to US military satellites?

It can help with surveillance on the ground and help with reducing man-hours for the troops if they get tired.

I expect these high tech tools should be very useful for detecting illegal crossings. You can then send the appropriate response force on a case by case basis...

The border guards have that too...

And probably much better at it.

Good. Then they can work together and combine capabilities to enforce the US border laws; I like where this is going.

I'm sure the National Guard, coming from a more military perspective, can bring a fresh perspective to the problem while the traditional border agencies can teach the National Guard a lot too. Together they will be unstoppable.

[Estrain (Ancient)]

Surveillance of Illegals = Invasion of Privacy.

Logic.

True. All persons within the jurisdiction of the United States, whether citizens or not, are entitled to equal protection under the law as provided by the 14th Amendment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yick_Wo_v. ... _the_Court

Thank you!

[Organized States]

do the National Guard have access to US military satellites?

It can help with surveillance on the ground and help with reducing man-hours for the troops if they get tired.

I expect these high tech tools should be very useful for detecting illegal crossings. You can then send the appropriate response force on a case by case basis...

The border guards have that too...

And probably much better at it.

They don't have the manpower to continue tracking them after they have been picked up by air assets unless they are in a fixed position most of the time, though.

[Murkwood]

Surveillance of Illegals = Invasion of Privacy.

Logic.

True. All persons within the jurisdiction of the United States, whether citizens or not, are entitled to equal protection under the law as provided by the 14th Amendment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yick_Wo_v. ... _the_Court

Okay? Its not an invasion of privacy to have surveillance drones.

[Infected Mushroom]

i thought an illegal immigrant was someone who broke a law relating to immigration regulation when entering the country.

how's it dehumanizing? They broke a law... hence the illegal part.

It's dehumanizing, because humans can't be illegal!!! To refer to them as "illegal" makes them an "other," i.e. not human, i.e. dehumanized.

then what would you call them?

''immigrants who broke the law''? People on the news used the term ''illegal immigrants'' all the time and get no flak for it. I thought the term was mainstream and neutral...

[Farnhamia]

True. All persons within the jurisdiction of the United States, whether citizens or not, are entitled to equal protection under the law as provided by the 14th Amendment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yick_Wo_v. ... _the_Court

Okay? Its not an invasion of privacy to have surveillance drones.

I doubt that's be adjudicated in any court yet.

[Murkwood]

It's dehumanizing, because humans can't be illegal!!! To refer to them as "illegal" makes them an "other," i.e. not human, i.e. dehumanized.

then what would you call them?

''immigrants who broke the law''? People on the news used the term ''illegal immigrants'' all the time and get no flak for it. I thought the term was mainstream and neutral...

Not according to the SJWs.

[Organized States]

True. All persons within the jurisdiction of the United States, whether citizens or not, are entitled to equal protection under the law as provided by the 14th Amendment. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yick_Wo_v. ... _the_Court

Okay? Its not an invasion of privacy to have surveillance drones.

I believe you aren't technically invading their privacy. You are just looking at them.

[Estrain (Ancient)]

It's dehumanizing, because humans can't be illegal!!! To refer to them as "illegal" makes them an "other," i.e. not human, i.e. dehumanized.

then what would you call them?

''immigrants who broke the law''? People on the news used the term ''illegal immigrants'' all the time and get no flak for it. I thought the term was mainstream and neutral...

It's definitely mainstream, but it's hardly neutral. They are undocumented immigrants. People on the news say a lot of things they should get flak for. If you talked to an actual undocumented immigrant or people who represent them or fight for their rights, they will tell you the same thing I'm saying right now.

[Infected Mushroom]

then what would you call them?

''immigrants who broke the law''? People on the news used the term ''illegal immigrants'' all the time and get no flak for it. I thought the term was mainstream and neutral...

Not according to the SJWs.

what's SJW?

[Norstal]

The border guards have that too...

And probably much better at it.

They don't have the manpower to continue tracking them after they have been picked up by air assets unless they are in a fixed position most of the time.

How so?

[Murkwood]

Okay? Its not an invasion of privacy to have surveillance drones.

I believe you aren't technically invading their privacy. You are just looking at them.

Its like saying Traffic Cams are an invasion of privacy.

[Estrain (Ancient)]

then what would you call them?

''immigrants who broke the law''? People on the news used the term ''illegal immigrants'' all the time and get no flak for it. I thought the term was mainstream and neutral...

Not according to the SJWs.

Again, not an insult. *oh no* I actually care about people's feelings and don't think they should be oppressed. Ouch.

[Estrain (Ancient)]

I believe you aren't technically invading their privacy. You are just looking at them.

Its like saying Traffic Cams are an invasion of privacy.

And some people believe that and argue that point. It's actually a common belief, I've found.

[Murkwood]

Not according to the SJWs.

what's SJW?

Social Justice Warriors. They are extreme far-left radfems and their ilk.

[Farnhamia]

It's dehumanizing, because humans can't be illegal!!! To refer to them as "illegal" makes them an "other," i.e. not human, i.e. dehumanized.

then what would you call them?

''immigrants who broke the law''? People on the news used the term ''illegal immigrants'' all the time and get no flak for it. I thought the term was mainstream and neutral...

It isn't really neutral but it is mainstream.

Estrain, can we grind our teeth and accept that people are going to use the term "illegal immigrants" and not make the term the topic?