Why Robespierre lost his head! France needed Napoleon?

[Shie]

Arras, France. Robespierre was a radical Jacobin leader and one of the principal figures in the French Revolution. In the latter months of 1793 he came to dominate the Committee of Public Safety, the principal organ of the Revolutionary government during the Reign of Terror, but in 1794 he was overthrown and guillotined.

This is when Napoleon entered France and caused prosperity. Napoleon revitalized the french military and had a brilliant code of law. He gained territory for France and had great values for his time.

Did France need him?

[Blazedtown]

Of course. But I'm only saying that because midgets are hilarious.

[Scomagia]

Of course. But I'm only saying that because midgets are hilarious.

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

[Blazedtown]

Of course. But I'm only saying that because midgets are hilarious.

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

I prefer historical stereotypes to facts.

[Alcase]

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

I prefer historical stereotypes to facts.

Don't we all.

[Oba Shembo]

Yes. Napoleon was the Hitler of France. Well, in that he fixed its economy, not exterminating all the people, but he did turn it around. Not a great metaphor, but he did fix it and turn it into a great power. A bit like Lenin to Russia.

[Benuty]

Robespierre lost his head for being a tyrant who killed thousands in a prolonged excuse of a government which was nothing more than an orgy of violence gone mad. Sure France needed a leader but being authoritarian wasn't necessary at all rather a transition to an actual elective government instead of flip flopping back and forth.

[Islamic republiq of Julundar]

Robespierre lost his head for being a tyrant who killed thousands in a prolonged excuse of a government which was nothing more than an orgy of violence gone mad. Sure France needed a leader but being authoritarian wasn't necessary at all rather a transition to an actual elective government instead of flip flopping back and forth.

Authoritarian Robespierre was elected for a due term. Emperor Napoleon ruled for life.

Robespierre was a Jacobin, Montagnard; the Girondin Monarchists organized a counter Revolution which inevitably led to Military Dictatorship.

Yes. Once the Girondin Monarchists won their counter-Revolution, it was Historically inevitable that a Military strong Man would seize the Power. BUT I disagree that Girondin victory was inevitable.

[Olivaero]

Yes. Napoleon was the Hitler of France. Well, in that he fixed its economy, not exterminating all the people, but he did turn it around. Not a great metaphor, but he did fix it and turn it into a great power. A bit like Lenin to Russia.

He did not "Fix" France. France was a great power long before Napoleon took the reins. It was obviously rivaled at various times by England, Spain and the Holy Roman Empire but it's not as if France was backwards by the standards of the time.

[Nervium]

Robespierre lost his head for being a tyrant who killed thousands in a prolonged excuse of a government which was nothing more than an orgy of violence gone mad. Sure France needed a leader but being authoritarian wasn't necessary at all rather a transition to an actual elective government instead of flip flopping back and forth.

Danton would have been better. *nods*

[Nervium]

Yes. Napoleon was the Hitler of France. Well, in that he fixed its economy, not exterminating all the people, but he did turn it around. Not a great metaphor, but he did fix it and turn it into a great power. A bit like Lenin to Russia.

He did not "Fix" France. France was a great power long before Napoleon took the reins. It was obviously rivaled at various times by England, Spain and the Holy Roman Empire but it's not as if France was backwards by the standards of the time.

People seem to forget France was in an economic crisis before and during the French Revolution
the fact that the clergy and nobility didn't have to pay taxes (sheesh, where have we heard this before, hmm) only prolonged the crisis and planted seed for revolution.

[Margno]

Of course. But I'm only saying that because midgets are hilarious.

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

Let's not forget that 5'7'' is still really short.

[Nervium]

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

Let's not forget that 5'7'' is still really short.

It's about average for late 18th, early 19th century standards.
He was only portrayed as short because of his low background and military rank, that's fuel for cartooning.

[Benuty]

Robespierre lost his head for being a tyrant who killed thousands in a prolonged excuse of a government which was nothing more than an orgy of violence gone mad. Sure France needed a leader but being authoritarian wasn't necessary at all rather a transition to an actual elective government instead of flip flopping back and forth.

Authoritarian Robespierre was elected for a due term. Emperor Napoleon ruled for life.

Robespierre was a Jacobin, Montagnard; the Girondin Monarchists organized a counter Revolution which inevitably led to Military Dictatorship.

Yes. Once the Girondin Monarchists won their counter-Revolution, it was Historically inevitable that a Military strong Man would seize the Power. BUT I disagree that Girondin victory was inevitable.

The Jacobin's do not care for elected governments.

[Geilinor]

Robespierre lost his head for being a tyrant who killed thousands in a prolonged excuse of a government which was nothing more than an orgy of violence gone mad. Sure France needed a leader but being authoritarian wasn't necessary at all rather a transition to an actual elective government instead of flip flopping back and forth.

Emperor Napoleon ruled for life.

No, he ruled for about 10 years.

[Olivaero]

He did not "Fix" France. France was a great power long before Napoleon took the reins. It was obviously rivaled at various times by England, Spain and the Holy Roman Empire but it's not as if France was backwards by the standards of the time.

People seem to forget France was in an economic crisis before and during the French Revolution
the fact that the clergy and nobility didn't have to pay taxes (sheesh, where have we heard this before, hmm) only prolonged the crisis and planted seed for revolution.

And?

[The Grey Wolf]

Of course. But I'm only saying that because midgets are hilarious.

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

That sounds pretty tall.

[Nervium]

People seem to forget France was in an economic crisis before and during the French Revolution
the fact that the clergy and nobility didn't have to pay taxes (sheesh, where have we heard this before, hmm) only prolonged the crisis and planted seed for revolution.

And?

Well, you said it was a great power.
A great power that couldn't pay it's own standing army. The entire structure was crumbling before Napoleon took power. (Or even before the revolution)

[The Fascist American Empire]

I don't care what anybody says, Napoléon Bonaparte was the greatest, wisest, most respected, and all around best leader this planet has ever had. True, he was kind of forced to invade Russia in the winter, but look at all that he accomplished before those English bastards ruined everything!

[Olivaero]

And?

Well, you said it was a great power.
A great power that couldn't pay it's own standing army. The entire structure was crumbling before Napoleon took power. (Or even before the revolution)

You would challenge the assertion that it was a great power?

[Nervium]

I don't care what anybody says, Napoléon Bonaparte was the greatest, wisest, most respected, and all around best leader this planet has ever had. True, he was kind of forced to invade Russia in the winter, but look at all that he accomplished before those English bastards ruined everything!

He killed off opposition members. He limited the freedom of his citizens. He abolished slavery only to reinstate it at a later point and then acts surprised when he can't get back Haiti. He basically operated a police state (although, to be fair, he wasn't the only monarch to do that)

[The Grey Wolf]

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

Let's not forget that 5'7'' is still really short.

"Short" is a relative term.

[Nervium]

Well, you said it was a great power.
A great power that couldn't pay it's own standing army. The entire structure was crumbling before Napoleon took power. (Or even before the revolution)

You would challenge the assertion that it was a great power?

When Napoleon received it, no, it mostly took back it's power.
At the beginning of the revolution, yes.

[The Fascist American Empire]

Napoleon was around 5 feet 7 inches in height.

Let's not forget that 5'7'' is still really short.

Actually, back then it was a little on the tall side. It was however, short for a statesman.

[Olivaero]

You would challenge the assertion that it was a great power?

When Napoleon received it, no, it mostly took back it's power.
At the beginning of the revolution, yes.

At the beginning of the Revolution it had some structural flaws sure but I wouldn't put it out of great power status because of them. However I was mainly taking exception with the assertion that Napoleon was some transformative figure like Lenin however. The legwork of reforming France had already been done by others before he took the reins.