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is america losing its status as a superpower?

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Othelos
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Founded: Feb 05, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Othelos » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:00 pm

Arumdaum wrote:
The Sotoan Union wrote:America is still a superpower, and it will still be throughout this century. No other country comes close.

The Chinese economy will overtake America's by the end of this decade. China's military rise will follow the acquisition of great economic power. By 2050, China will be much stronger than the United States.

And on the decline because there will be way too many old people.

The US is way better balanced demographically.
Last edited by Othelos on Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Arumdaum
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Postby Arumdaum » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:01 pm

Othelos wrote:
Arumdaum wrote:The Chinese economy will overtake America's by the end of this decade. China's military rise will follow the acquisition of great economic power. By 2050, China will be much stronger than the United States.

And on the decline because there will be way too many old people.

China's been continuously liberalizing its policies on the amount of children you can have.

China will also eventually be seeing some more immigration into the country. Robots will help, although it's difficult to tell what kind of an impact they'll have.
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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:05 pm

Arumdaum wrote:
Othelos wrote:And on the decline because there will be way too many old people.

China's been continuously liberalizing its policies on the amount of children you can have.


Barely. It's not enough to keep up. And most people don't even want two kids or more to make up for it.

Arumdaum wrote:China will also eventually be seeing some more immigration into the country.


Immigration will be down worldwide as people have fewer children and nations modernize.

Arumdaum wrote:Robots will help, although it's difficult to tell what kind of an impact they'll have.


That's true.
Last edited by Othelos on Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Arumdaum
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Postby Arumdaum » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:07 pm

i
Last edited by Arumdaum on Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Arumdaum
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Postby Arumdaum » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:08 pm

Othelos wrote:
Arumdaum wrote:China's been continuously liberalizing its policies on the amount of children you can have.


Barely. It's not enough to keep up. And most people want less than two kids, which is below replacement.

Regardless, there will be improvements.

Arumdaum wrote:China will also eventually be seeing some more immigration into the country.


Immigration will be down worldwide as people have fewer children and nations modernize.

China will obtain a larger portion of that share. China will also not be losing people due to emigration as the gap between China and the rest of the world closes.

Overall, China will have a greater net migration rate.
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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:14 pm

Arumdaum wrote:
Othelos wrote:
Barely. It's not enough to keep up. And most people want less than two kids, which is below replacement.

Regardless, there will be improvements.


We'll see. Birthrates are down globally, so I doubt it's going to suddenly go over replacement level in China. Even the US is below replacement, and has been for a while.

Arumdaum wrote:
Othelos wrote:
Immigration will be down worldwide as people have fewer children and nations modernize.

China will obtain a larger portion of that share. China will also not be losing people due to emigration as the gap between China and the rest of the world closes.

Overall, China will have a greater net migration rate.


That could be so.

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Baader-Meinhof Gruppe
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Postby Baader-Meinhof Gruppe » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:17 pm

America is still a superpower, but yes it is declining. Not so much as Russia but it is declining. There need to be some vast changes to make America powerful again. One of which is the fact that mere military might doesn't mean you can run the show, diplomacy is also quite important.

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Arumdaum
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Postby Arumdaum » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:17 pm

Othelos wrote:
Arumdaum wrote:Regardless, there will be improvements.


We'll see. Birthrates are down globally, so I doubt it's going to suddenly go over replacement level in China. Even the US is below replacement, and has been for a while.

When did I ever say that it'd suddenly be above replacement level?

I said that as laws regarding the amount of children you have are liberalized, more people will be having kids, and China's birth rate will go up from what it currently is.

Arumdaum wrote:China will obtain a larger portion of that share. China will also not be losing people due to emigration as the gap between China and the rest of the world closes.

Overall, China will have a greater net migration rate.


That could be so.

When a country becomes wealthy, powerful, and developed, less people leaving and having more people want to come to your country is sort of inevitable...
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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:26 pm

Arumdaum wrote:
Othelos wrote:
We'll see. Birthrates are down globally, so I doubt it's going to suddenly go over replacement level in China. Even the US is below replacement, and has been for a while.

When did I ever say that it'd suddenly be above replacement level?

I said that as laws regarding the amount of children you have are liberalized, more people will be having kids, and China's birth rate will go up from what it currently is.


True, yeah. Sorry, haha I misinterpreted what you meant.

Arumdaum wrote:
Othelos wrote:
That could be so.

When a country becomes wealthy, powerful, and developed, less people leaving and having more people want to come to your country is sort of inevitable...


Well yeah, if everything goes smoothly.

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Othelos
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Postby Othelos » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:27 pm

Baader-Meinhof Gruppe wrote:America is still a superpower, but yes it is declining. Not so much as Russia but it is declining. There need to be some vast changes to make America powerful again. One of which is the fact that mere military might doesn't mean you can run the show, diplomacy is also quite important.

America isn't declining. It only seems that way because other nations are modernizing.

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Marcurix
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Postby Marcurix » Thu Apr 17, 2014 10:07 pm

Keyboard Warriors wrote:
Blazedtown wrote:
He is right about most of NATO being freeloaders. Out of 28 member states, only 5 meet the required 2% of GDP defense spending. America, Great Britain, France, Turkey and Greece.

It doesn't matter though, because that 2% recommendation was created during the Cold War and currently NATO has no serious threats at all to respond to.


The situation in Ukraine shows how quickly that can change. The less than 2% budget that some European countries have pursued has been an irritant to the USA for some time, they view such moves as possible only because the US is underpinning said countries
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Cailfornia
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can the world take the loss of american hegomony

Postby Cailfornia » Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:48 pm

The thing is, when American begins to decline so will the world's economy as a whole. The fact that we are the world reserve currency and the largest market of consumers. Can the world economy take the lost of this? More so, will the world self destruct? Regions of the world where America doesn't have a military presence has a tendency to be UN stable. Can the world take the third largest country and largest economy being behind a nation like China. More so, can China retain supremacy after they take the center stage in the world economy. Or will it's people finally fight for the freedom they've craved for three generations? An event like the loss of America hegemony, will be history and have impact like the fall of Rome.

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The Serbian Empire
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Postby The Serbian Empire » Fri Apr 18, 2014 7:52 pm

Any nuclear power is a superpower in my book as they control the terms of who is willing to invade them. The US is certainly a nuclear power so yes.
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The Sotoan Union
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Postby The Sotoan Union » Fri Apr 18, 2014 10:12 pm

Arumdaum wrote:
Othelos wrote:
We'll see. Birthrates are down globally, so I doubt it's going to suddenly go over replacement level in China. Even the US is below replacement, and has been for a while.

When did I ever say that it'd suddenly be above replacement level?

I said that as laws regarding the amount of children you have are liberalized, more people will be having kids, and China's birth rate will go up from what it currently is.


That could be so.

When a country becomes wealthy, powerful, and developed, less people leaving and having more people want to come to your country is sort of inevitable...

China's little bubble economy isn't sustainable to the point of being able to rise to overtake the US without the US. They depend on us, their entire rise depends on us. Furthermore they have no reason to try some hegemonic takeover. Why not just keep trading with the US. Why not keep growing their economy as it is. Why do our ridiculous post cold war world police thing.

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Vicious Debaters
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Postby Vicious Debaters » Fri Apr 18, 2014 11:48 pm

Cailfornia wrote:In recent days it seems like our economy is slower then the rest of the world and our political and military prowess has decline. Is America still a superpower?


Aye, me lad. America is still a superpower. Arrr! I sail the seas in search of cheeseburgers.

We're challenged of course, but I see no indication that we're losing influence. The dollars still the standard medium of exchange in the world, we still have a military that is ludicrously well-funded, and we still have enough nukes to destroy the galaxy.

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New Colorado Republic
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Postby New Colorado Republic » Sat Apr 19, 2014 1:30 am

I think as our economy improves, and we get more money from legalizing and taxing weed, we should bump up our military spending.

Maybe I sound ridiculous to you humanitarians...or whatever you all are, but America is my country and I want it to be powerful.

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Divair2
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Postby Divair2 » Sat Apr 19, 2014 4:49 am

The Serbian Empire wrote:Any nuclear power is a superpower in my book as they control the terms of who is willing to invade them. The US is certainly a nuclear power so yes.

That's not the definition of a superpower. Nobody dares to invade Switzerland. Is it a superpower?

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Postby Tagmatium » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:26 am

Divair2 wrote:
The Serbian Empire wrote:Any nuclear power is a superpower in my book as they control the terms of who is willing to invade them. The US is certainly a nuclear power so yes.

That's not the definition of a superpower. Nobody dares to invade Switzerland. Is it a superpower?

I doubt anyone's going to invade Andorra, either.

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Keyboard Warriors
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Postby Keyboard Warriors » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:30 am

Marcurix wrote:
Keyboard Warriors wrote:It doesn't matter though, because that 2% recommendation was created during the Cold War and currently NATO has no serious threats at all to respond to.


The situation in Ukraine shows how quickly that can change. The less than 2% budget that some European countries have pursued has been an irritant to the USA for some time, they view such moves as possible only because the US is underpinning said countries

No it doesn't. NATO and more specifically, the EU, is more than capable of repelling any would-be Russian invasion on their current budgets. With or without the US, the remainder or Europe is perfectly safe from a Russian invasion and Russia knows they wouldn't be able to win.
Yes.

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Vazdania
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Postby Vazdania » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:32 am

Cailfornia wrote:In recent days it seems like our economy is slower then the rest of the world and our political and military prowess has decline. Is America still a superpower?

of course. We have bacon.
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Trelso
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Postby Trelso » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:33 am

Vazdania wrote:
Cailfornia wrote:In recent days it seems like our economy is slower then the rest of the world and our political and military prowess has decline. Is America still a superpower?

of course. We have bacon.


But Danish bacon is the best, does this mean that Denmark is the greatest superpower?

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Vazdania
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Postby Vazdania » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:34 am

Trelso wrote:
Vazdania wrote:of course. We have bacon.


But Danish bacon is the best, does this mean that Denmark is the greatest superpower?

:eyebrow: Did you really just ask me that? *Slaps you* BITCH PLEASE. Canadian Bacon.
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Auxatia
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Postby Auxatia » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:36 am

Perhaps not losing, but declining in some influence. The U.S. will still continue to be a dominant superpower for the foreseeable future. Somehow, their economy is ALWAYS able to bounce back. I mean, come on. So many people invest in America, even in economic trouble. Why? Because it's America! It's built on a system of capitalism that makes its economy the best it can be given any circumstances, and they ALWAYS bounce back!
Last edited by Auxatia on Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:37 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Ostroeuropa » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:47 am

Auxatia wrote:Perhaps not losing, but declining in some influence. The U.S. will still continue to be a dominant superpower for the foreseeable future. Somehow, their economy is ALWAYS able to bounce back. I mean, come on. So many people invest in America, even in economic trouble. Why? Because it's America! It's built on a system of capitalism that makes its economy the best it can be given any circumstances, and they ALWAYS bounce back!


It's historically been built on a system of capitalism and social democracy.
Not this completely lunatic neoliberal system of capitalism with low regulations, low taxes, and low welfare. That is a very, very new social experiment that seems to be backfiring immensely.
The America of the past when it was powerful was a nation of med/high taxes, med/high regulation, and mid/high welfare and government investment.
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Auxatia
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Postby Auxatia » Sat Apr 19, 2014 5:49 am

Government should have a minimal role in determining what to do with what you earn, and how you go about it. Apart from if said practice brings harm to anyone. Then, regulation should play a part.

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