5 Most Powerful Empires

[Avenio]

Ive been readin this thread and what about the German Empire during WW1? They came to power and became extremely powerful in a much shorter time then the British and were kickin ass against the French, British, and Russia. Only until America came did they feel that they couldn't win. And dont even start with the joke of the help from Austria-Hungary, or the Ottoman Empire. Their militaries couldnt do shit. Also, the Germans in WW2. Hitler was fuckin crazy and his Nazi stuff was fucked up but you have to commend their military prowess. They completely rolled over France and the other nations and only lost because Britain, Russia, and the United States were against them. They inflicted far more casualties on the Russians then the Russians ever inflicted on them and they were basically alone again because Italy and Bulgaria had horrible militaries also. Once again, I am not advocating Naziism, that shit was fucked up but you have to admire the mobilization and military genius of the German people in both instances.

I think the definition of the term "empire" used here is that of a long-lasting, successful (In both bureacratic and militaristic terms) state that maintained themselves (Or attempted to) over a long period of time. Though both German states were extremely successful militarily, they did not last, and they would have likely succumbed to the same interregional and nationalistic fracturing that Austria-Hungary and the Ottoman Empire fell prey to.

[Fortareata]

I think they meant the Byzantine Empire. It was pretty powerful in its zenith, but experienced a long and complicated history of decline, semi-resurgence, more decline, more resurgence, more decline, and ultimate downfall. At least it lasted for more than a thousand years. And it had Greek Fire. I must add that it had Greek Fire.

Well, the Byzantines did control much of the trade between the Orient and Europe, but I wouldn't call them a great empire. Most of their conquests were during the reign of one or two Emperors (Justinian and Basil II), and much of the Emperors succeeding them allowed the Empire to stagnate, and their conquests didn't last long.

True, true. The reign of Justinian was the "zenith" part of the empire's history, while the reigns of Basil II and the Komnenians were the two "resurgence" parts. The other emperors were more concerned about court intrigues than about keeping their empire in one piece.

[The Parkus Empire]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Greece
Before the conquest of the Roman Empire, Greece was a potency. Before Rome, Greece was the center of the Ancient World. Maybe labeling it an 'empire' is slightly wrong, but you can't deny that it was huge in its time.

Renaissance Italy was huge, too, but it still does not belong in this thread.

[Dontgonearthere]

No love for the Ottomans?

They did own the Mediterranean at one point. I guess people only really remember them from the late 19th century.

But c'mon, they gave us mehter music. What else do you want?

[Risottia]

Post you're list below

You mean "your" list.


Anyway:
as for sheer military power,
Soviet Union (WW2 to Cold War)
USA (Cold War)
British Empire (1600 to WW2)
French Empire (Napoleon to WW1)
Third Reich

as for cultural influence,
Roman Empire
France
Britain
Spain
Baghdad Caliphate

as for economy
EU (today... well, not quite an empire)
USA (today)
China (today)
British Empire (colonial age)
Spanish Empire (late renaissance to colonial age)

[Albrante]

Reading through yall, very few have mentioned Portugal and Spain's respective empires. Both of which were quite powerful.

[Zandan]

1. British Empire
2. British Empire
3. British Empire
4. British Empire
5. America

The world speaks OUR language!

Just felt like pointing out that it wasn't Britain's language to begin with. It was the Saxons' language, who settled in present day England from mainland Europe. Then the Romans took over England. Saxons were regarded as barbarians, so technically, the world speaks a barbarian language. I do wonder, however, how the language survived when the Saxons were wiped out....

[Albrante]

1. British Empire
2. British Empire
3. British Empire
4. British Empire
5. America

The world speaks OUR language!

Just felt like pointing out that it wasn't Britain's language to begin with. It was the Saxons' language, who settled in present day England from mainland Europe. Then the Romans took over England. Saxons were regarded as barbarians, so technically, the world speaks a barbarian language. I do wonder, however, how the language survived when the Saxons were wiped out....

Yall know why it was called "barbarian". According to the romans the only thing thay could make out when the savages spoke was the word bar. Bar,bar,bar,bar,bar. So know a third of the world says bar.

[Roten]

How is it that the nation on the bottom kicks the crap out of the nation on the top?

they had a lot of help?

Particularly Russia. Giving them credit for winning the Napoleonic Wars would be like giving America credit for winning WWII in Europe.

Hang on...that does seem to be about right...especially since the US won the Pacific pretty much by itself, and did most of the heavy lifting after D-Day until after V-day, but I see your point.

Just felt like pointing out that it wasn't Britain's language to begin with. It was the Saxons' language, who settled in present day England from mainland Europe. Then the Romans took over England. Saxons were regarded as barbarians, so technically, the world speaks a barbarian language. I do wonder, however, how the language survived when the Saxons were wiped out....

You've got your history backwards, my friend. The Celts defeated and conquered the original Britons. The Romans defeated the Celto-brits (who had assimilated). The Saxons defeated and conquered the Romano-brits, who had assimilated. The Normans defeated and conquered the Saxons, and then were assimilated. There hasn't been a successful invasion of the isle since.

[Tahar Joblis]

You've got your history backwards, my friend. The Celts defeated and conquered the original Britons. The Romans defeated the Celto-brits (who had assimilated). The Saxons defeated and conquered the Romano-brits, who had assimilated. The Normans defeated and conquered the Saxons, and then were assimilated. There hasn't been a successful invasion of the isle since.

You missed at least one! Between the Saxons and the Normans, the Vikings conquered most of the isle. Did a better job than the Romans in terms of total territory on the isles, I suspect.

[Coffin-Breathe]

the Vaticane...rules over a billion of people worldwide (theocracy)
Windows...most PC-users rely to, worldwide (capitalistic multicultural trust)
the empire of Alexander the Great...invaded nearly the whole world known at his time successfully in one man´s lifetime (monarchy)
China or India ...will outrun the rest economically in a few years (commercial-capitalistic olegarchy)
the 3rd Reich...although losing a devastating war and being destroyed and annihilated, has lots of ideological citizens till today (dictatorship)

the US of A could qualify too, for successfully infecting the world with junk products like Coke or McD in the Fifties and Sixties - but I´m restricted to only five, so I had to go with the former...

[Roten]

You've got your history backwards, my friend. The Celts defeated and conquered the original Britons. The Romans defeated the Celto-brits (who had assimilated). The Saxons defeated and conquered the Romano-brits, who had assimilated. The Normans defeated and conquered the Saxons, and then were assimilated. There hasn't been a successful invasion of the isle since.

You missed at least one! Between the Saxons and the Normans, the Vikings conquered most of the isle. Did a better job than the Romans in terms of total territory on the isles, I suspect.

You're right, alas, I did forget that one, but my point stands. And the Danes did not conquer more land than the Romans, and they held it for less time, too.

[Coffin-Breathe]

1. British Empire
2. British Empire
3. British Empire
4. British Empire
5. America

The world speaks OUR language!

I wouldn´t call less than a billion people exactly "the world"...as there are more native speakers in Mandarin or Urdu than "tought" ones in English.
It was a simple agreement between many "western" countries to make English the common international language, `cause it´s a comparative easy language to learn. How about Arabic, the language of the Koran, which every muslim has to be able to read...or at least understand, or Latin, which is the language the most scientific (and other, including catholic ecclestical) terms are based on...

[Risottia]

1. British Empire
2. British Empire
3. British Empire
4. British Empire
5. America

The world speaks OUR language!

Just felt like pointing out that it wasn't Britain's language to begin with. It was the Saxons' language, who settled in present day England from mainland Europe. Then the Romans took over England. Saxons were regarded as barbarians, so technically, the world speaks a barbarian language. I do wonder, however, how the language survived when the Saxons were wiped out....

Actually when the Romans conquered Britain, Britain was inhabited by Briton Kelts, not by Saxons. Saxons (from, guess what, Saxony) moved into Britain AFTER the Angles (hence "England"), who settled in Britain AFTER the Roman Britannia collapsed.

[Dontgonearthere]

1. British Empire
2. British Empire
3. British Empire
4. British Empire
5. America

The world speaks OUR language!

I wouldn´t call less than a billion people exactly "the world"...as there are more native speakers in Mandarin or Urdu than "tought" ones in English.
It was a simple agreement between many "western" countries to make English the common international language, `cause it´s a comparative easy language to learn. How about Arabic, the language of the Koran, which every muslim has to be able to read...or at least understand, or Latin, which is the language the most scientific (and other, including catholic ecclestical) terms are based on...

I think he's referring to the fact that English is pretty much the generally accepted 'international language', rather like Latin or French in previous eras. For example, most commercial airplane pilots speak English, handy on international flights when you've got, say, an Uzbek pilot coming in for a landing in Rio.

However, I believe this is more a result of the influence of the United States, not the United Kingdom. British cultural influence, to my knowledge, outside of the US, Canada and Australia, was fairly limited once their empire collapsed. And even then most British people would probably argue against cultural similarities between themselves and those horrible barbarians across the pond

Really, though, the British Empire's scope was FAR less than many people imagine it was. The peak of its power was only really reached in the late 19th century and only lasted until about WWII. It did not, as many imagine, begin with the defeat of the Spanish Armada. The Spanish Empire actually peaked around 1820 and collapsed without much direct help from the British. Even into the Napoleonic Wars, the British avoided direct confrontation with the French when possible, employing economic power instead, which was probably a good thing for them if the performance of British officers in Spain is anything to go by.

The conquest of India, it should be pointed out, was mostly carried out by locals for the BEIC. The British supplied money, and local princes fought for them. The actual BRITISH presence accounted for hardly anything, and on those occasions when the British fought directly, on their own, against the Marathi states, they got their butts kicked. Although they did apparently take the ideas about rockets to heart

The Crimean War...well, popular imagination has turned it into a one-sided smackdown of the Russians by the British, but it should be pointed out that not only did the French send FAR more troops, but the Allies lost as many men as the Russians and, really, where did they plan to go after taking Sevestopol? Kiev? That would have been something to see. I doubt the Ottomans would have maintained interest past taking out the Russian ports, anyway. The Allies really only avoided a horribly bloody campaign by a stroke of luck with the death of Nicholas I.

After that, though, the British did start to flex their military muscles, although mostly in the direction of rather small states that couldn't fight back. And then they didn't win all the time. Afghanistan, anybody? A loss, a tie, and a somewhat Pyrrhic win. China was something of an easy win, but the last quarter of the 19th century was basically 'everybody gang up on China' time anyway.

After that it's really just the British fighting off revolts and beating up tiny states (disregarding WWI/II, since they weren't really colonial wars, and mostly only served to highlight British military incompetence on land.)

tl;dr: The British Empire is a duck.

[United Russian State]

1. Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
2. Russian Empire
3. Russia Federation
4. Tsardom of Russia
5. Rome

[Lackadaisical2]

1. Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
2. Russian Empire
3. Russia Federation
4. Tsardom of Russia
5. Rome

really?

I can see sense in including up to 2 Russian states, but 4/5?

For example, I'd say the US pretty clearly beats the Russian Federation at the moment.

[The Violet Goddess]

His name is 'United Russian State'...

Also, proven troll is troll.

[Old Tyrannia]

1. British Empire- Biggest in history
2. Roman Empire- A massive and very powerfull empire, that has lasting influence on Europe
3. Incan Empire- Despite not having the wheel, horses or writing, they built an empire to rival that of Rome
4. Egyptian Empire- Longest lasting nation in history, believe it or not once the world's greatest superpower
5. Akkadian Empire- The earliest nation that could be described as an 'empire'.
US doesn't count, it's a federation, rather than an Empire.

[Doitzel]

1. British Empire
2. Roman Empire
3. First French Empire
4. United States of America
5. Ottoman Empire

Honourary mentions: Umayyad Caliphate, Kingdom of Macedon, Byzantine Empire, USSR.

[Tahar Joblis]

However, I believe this is more a result of the influence of the United States, not the United Kingdom. British cultural influence, to my knowledge, outside of the US, Canada and Australia, was fairly limited once their empire collapsed. And even then most British people would probably argue against cultural similarities between themselves and those horrible barbarians across the pond

Er. I would dispute that point. The British influence lingers in the political systems and cultures of a vast number of former colonies. Hence we have "cricket diplomacy," for example.

Britain has not been a major culture exporter in the entertainment world, but the BBC is still one of the most widely disseminated news sources, globally.

I think you can contrast the current cultural influence of Americans vs British by the prevalence of British vs American dialects in foreign speakers. The two are mutually comprehensible dialects, so both serve the purpose of a lingua franca equally well.

A number of former colonies still use English extensively within the country because their national borders include multiple languages, and taking English is a neutral solution. As a result, 55 nations list English as an official language; almost all of them are former possessions of the British.

Conversely, most former possessions of the British Empire have English as one of their official languages.

I'm also going to disagree with you on Spain. I'm going to agree with the conventional view that when the Habsburgs got wrecked by the 30 Years' War, that was the beginning of Spain's decline. They tied up far too much in military adventures in Europe in the Reformation/Counter-Reformation squabbles in Germany, and they got a big fat bloody nose out of it. France and Sweden came out on the top in that mess, as much as anyone did.

[Lackadaisical2]

His name is 'United Russian State'...

Also, proven troll is troll.

I'm not one to jump to the "troll" conclusion just because someone disagrees with me. IN this case, he may well be trolling, yes. If so, hes done a poor job, since hes not getting a rise out of me, yet

[Angleter]

In order of power (in relation to their time):

1. British Empire (1880-1930)- most territory, power everywhere, introduced the world's most-spoken language (incl. second lang.)
2. Russian Empire (19th Century and Cold War Era)- third-most territory, strong sphere of influence
3. Mongol Empire (13th Century)- second-most territory
4. Portuguese Empire (17th Century)- influential on all continents
5. Islamic Khalifat (8th Century)- large territory, introduced a belief system that has expanded ever since

[The Anglo-Saxon Empire]

1. British Empire 1900 A.D. (Controlled 1/4 of the world, largest navy, largest population, wealthiest, probably most feared nation of the time)

2. Nazi Germany late 1941A.D. (was at that point winning in North Africa, on the verge of crushing the USSR, largest army on earth, most advanced land force, second best airforce, was only defeated of an alliance of the next 3 strongest nations on earth (UK, US, and USSR))

3. Mongol Empire late 1300s A.D. (Controlled most of Asia, most advanced, and wealthiest empire of the time, merciless armies, most feared nation of the time)

4. Roman Empire under Trajan (controlled all of Western Europe, greatest power in Europe, very professional armies, no real threats)

5. Persian Empire under Xerxes (controlled most of the middle east, most powerful nation in the world, very wealthy)

Honorable mentions

United States (although is the wealthiest nation on earth, and has the largest navy, can still be defeated by several groups of nations)

Spanish Empire early 1500s A.D. (powerful and wealthy empire, but constantly harrassed by privateers)

Napoleonic France before the Invasion of Russia (Although he had a large and powerful army, Napoleon couldn't hope to defeat Britain, and was unable to force a treaty with the UK)

USSR (was a powerful and large nation, but was not the only superpower at the time, and could not be considered great if they had to repeatidly bow to American pressure)

[Dontgonearthere]

However, I believe this is more a result of the influence of the United States, not the United Kingdom. British cultural influence, to my knowledge, outside of the US, Canada and Australia, was fairly limited once their empire collapsed. And even then most British people would probably argue against cultural similarities between themselves and those horrible barbarians across the pond

Er. I would dispute that point. The British influence lingers in the political systems and cultures of a vast number of former colonies. Hence we have "cricket diplomacy," for example.

Britain has not been a major culture exporter in the entertainment world, but the BBC is still one of the most widely disseminated news sources, globally.

I think you can contrast the current cultural influence of Americans vs British by the prevalence of British vs American dialects in foreign speakers. The two are mutually comprehensible dialects, so both serve the purpose of a lingua franca equally well.

A number of former colonies still use English extensively within the country because their national borders include multiple languages, and taking English is a neutral solution. As a result, 55 nations list English as an official language; almost all of them are former possessions of the British.

Conversely, most former possessions of the British Empire have English as one of their official languages.

The question is whether this is a leftover of British rule, or a result of US influence on the world after the British Empire fell, although some combination of both seems likely.

I'm also going to disagree with you on Spain. I'm going to agree with the conventional view that when the Habsburgs got wrecked by the 30 Years' War, that was the beginning of Spain's decline. They tied up far too much in military adventures in Europe in the Reformation/Counter-Reformation squabbles in Germany, and they got a big fat bloody nose out of it. France and Sweden came out on the top in that mess, as much as anyone did.

I should clarify that I was talking about territorial height, the Spanish Empire was certainly pretty much done by the late 17th century, but they still hung on for a while.


On the note of hanging around for a while, I note that nobody's mentioned Venice. They had a nice little empire in the Mediterranean and were around for 1,100 years. No love for the Italians, eh?