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Your stance on gay marriage

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Dusk_Kittens
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Founded: May 18, 2011
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Postby Dusk_Kittens » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:28 pm

Furious Grandmothers wrote:
Chesnova wrote:my stance? against it in the revision of the word "marriage". They can be wedded as a "civil union" but no, they cannot be "married".

Why are you against the revision of the word "marriage"?


What revision?
Her Divine Grace,
the Sovereign Principessa Luna,
Ulata-Druidessâ Teutâs di Genovâs,
Ardua-Druidessâ of Dusk Kittens
The Tribal Confederacy of Dusk_Kittens
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My Political Compass
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"... perché lo universale degli uomini
si pascono così di quel che pare come di quello che è:
anzi, molte volte si muovono
più per le cose che paiono che per quelle che sono."
-- Niccolò Machiavelli,
Discorsi sopra la prima deca di Tito Livio,
Libro Primo, Capitolo 25.
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Chesnova
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Founded: Jul 15, 2011
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Postby Chesnova » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:30 pm

Furious Grandmothers wrote:
Chesnova wrote:my stance? against it in the revision of the word "marriage". They can be wedded as a "civil union" but no, they cannot be "married".

Why are you against the revision of the word "marriage"?


because it is my belief. That word is holy in most religions and being a respectful agnostic to my religious friends, I see good reason why it shouldn't be revised. I have no problem with two people being together but not under "marriage".
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Dusk_Kittens
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Postby Dusk_Kittens » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:33 pm

Chesnova wrote:
Furious Grandmothers wrote:Why are you against the revision of the word "marriage"?


because it is my belief. That word is holy in most religions and being a respectful agnostic to my religious friends, I see good reason why it shouldn't be revised. I have no problem with two people being together but not under "marriage".


But no religion in particular owns the word, and neither does religion in general have any authority to dictate a definition of "Marriage" as "Marriage," nor does any sect, any religion in particular, or religion in general have any authority over "Legal Marriage" whatsoever. "Legal Marriage" is a term referring to a legal status, not a religious one.
Her Divine Grace,
the Sovereign Principessa Luna,
Ulata-Druidessâ Teutâs di Genovâs,
Ardua-Druidessâ of Dusk Kittens
The Tribal Confederacy of Dusk_Kittens
(a Factbook in progress)
~ Stairsneach ~

My Political Compass
Economic Left/Right: -7.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.72
(Left Libertarian)

My C4SS Ratings
58% Economic Leftist
63% Anarchist
79% Anti-Militarist
67% Socio-Cultural Liberal
80% Civil Libertarian

"... perché lo universale degli uomini
si pascono così di quel che pare come di quello che è:
anzi, molte volte si muovono
più per le cose che paiono che per quelle che sono."
-- Niccolò Machiavelli,
Discorsi sopra la prima deca di Tito Livio,
Libro Primo, Capitolo 25.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:33 pm

Chesnova wrote:
Furious Grandmothers wrote:Why are you against the revision of the word "marriage"?


because it is my belief. That word is holy in most religions and being a respectful agnostic to my religious friends, I see good reason why it shouldn't be revised. I have no problem with two people being together but not under "marriage".

According to the Discordian religion, one man and one woman may only be married in exceptional circumstances. To exclude gays from marriage is to offend our beliefs.
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Chesnova
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Founded: Jul 15, 2011
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Postby Chesnova » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:35 pm

Dusk_Kittens wrote:
Chesnova wrote:
because it is my belief. That word is holy in most religions and being a respectful agnostic to my religious friends, I see good reason why it shouldn't be revised. I have no problem with two people being together but not under "marriage".


But no religion in particular owns the word, and neither does religion in general have any authority to dictate a definition of "Marriage" as "Marriage," nor does any sect, any religion in particular, or religion in general have any authority over "Legal Marriage" whatsoever. "Legal Marriage" is a term referring to a legal status, not a religious one.


well I could just say noone can get married... outlaw it all together...
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Dusk_Kittens
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Postby Dusk_Kittens » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:37 pm

Chesnova wrote:
Dusk_Kittens wrote:
But no religion in particular owns the word, and neither does religion in general have any authority to dictate a definition of "Marriage" as "Marriage," nor does any sect, any religion in particular, or religion in general have any authority over "Legal Marriage" whatsoever. "Legal Marriage" is a term referring to a legal status, not a religious one.


well I could just say noone can get married... outlaw it all together...


On what grounds?
Her Divine Grace,
the Sovereign Principessa Luna,
Ulata-Druidessâ Teutâs di Genovâs,
Ardua-Druidessâ of Dusk Kittens
The Tribal Confederacy of Dusk_Kittens
(a Factbook in progress)
~ Stairsneach ~

My Political Compass
Economic Left/Right: -7.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.72
(Left Libertarian)

My C4SS Ratings
58% Economic Leftist
63% Anarchist
79% Anti-Militarist
67% Socio-Cultural Liberal
80% Civil Libertarian

"... perché lo universale degli uomini
si pascono così di quel che pare come di quello che è:
anzi, molte volte si muovono
più per le cose che paiono che per quelle che sono."
-- Niccolò Machiavelli,
Discorsi sopra la prima deca di Tito Livio,
Libro Primo, Capitolo 25.
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Chesnova
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Founded: Jul 15, 2011
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Postby Chesnova » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:39 pm

Dusk_Kittens wrote:
Chesnova wrote:
well I could just say noone can get married... outlaw it all together...


On what grounds?


causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding lol
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Dusk_Kittens
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Founded: May 18, 2011
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Postby Dusk_Kittens » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:40 pm

Chesnova wrote:
Dusk_Kittens wrote:
On what grounds?


causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding lol


I'm sorry, I don't see why the law should protect adults who are generally believed to be generally competent from the consequences of their own free choices.
Last edited by Dusk_Kittens on Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Her Divine Grace,
the Sovereign Principessa Luna,
Ulata-Druidessâ Teutâs di Genovâs,
Ardua-Druidessâ of Dusk Kittens
The Tribal Confederacy of Dusk_Kittens
(a Factbook in progress)
~ Stairsneach ~

My Political Compass
Economic Left/Right: -7.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.72
(Left Libertarian)

My C4SS Ratings
58% Economic Leftist
63% Anarchist
79% Anti-Militarist
67% Socio-Cultural Liberal
80% Civil Libertarian

"... perché lo universale degli uomini
si pascono così di quel che pare come di quello che è:
anzi, molte volte si muovono
più per le cose che paiono che per quelle che sono."
-- Niccolò Machiavelli,
Discorsi sopra la prima deca di Tito Livio,
Libro Primo, Capitolo 25.
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:40 pm

Anyone else getting sick of "lolz, being married is torment" jokes?
He/Him

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we never run from the devil
we never summon the devil
we never hide from from the devil
we never
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Germanic Templars
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Postby Germanic Templars » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:43 pm

My stance on gay marriage....I really do not care, only for the simple fact that, it does not effect me in any shape, way, or form.

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  • Religiously Tolerant
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Furious Grandmothers
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Postby Furious Grandmothers » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:43 pm

Chesnova wrote:
Dusk_Kittens wrote:
On what grounds?


causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding lol

1) Explain relevance of waterboarding in this argument
2) Prove OBJECTIVELY that marriage causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding
3) Prove that this is irrefutable cause for denying marriage to all
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Furious Grandmothers
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Founded: Jan 19, 2010
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Postby Furious Grandmothers » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:44 pm

Germanic Templars wrote:My stance on gay marriage....I really do not care, only for the simple fact that, it does not effect me in any shape, way, or form.

Affect, not effect. Spelling Nazi here, gassing away!
Last edited by Furious Grandmothers on Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Germanic Templars
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Founded: Jul 01, 2011
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Postby Germanic Templars » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:49 pm

Furious Grandmothers wrote:
Germanic Templars wrote:My stance on gay marriage....I really do not care, only for the simple fact that, it does not effect me in any shape, way, or form.

Affect, not effect. Spelling Nazi here, gassing away!


shiiiiiiittt...
puts on gas mask.

  • INTP
  • All American Patriotic Constitutionalist/Classic libertarian (with fiscal conservatism)
  • Religiously Tolerant
  • Roman Catholic
  • Hoplophilic/ammosexual
  • X=3.13, Y=2.41
  • Supports the Blue


I support Capitalism do you? If so, put this in your sig.

XY = Male, XX = Female
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Rascotlandia
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Founded: Apr 04, 2011
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Postby Rascotlandia » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:51 pm

As long as heterosexual couples have right to marry there is no reason to discriminate homosexual couples, although I personally believe that marriage is pointless and that state should have nothing to do with love, because it is a private matter.
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Samuraikoku
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Founded: May 13, 2011
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Postby Samuraikoku » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:51 pm

Chesnova wrote:my stance? against it in the revision of the word "marriage". They can be wedded as a "civil union" but no, they cannot be "married".


And for the gazillionth time, I ask: Where is the equality?
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Samuraikoku
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Postby Samuraikoku » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:52 pm

Ifreann wrote:Anyone else getting sick of "lolz, being married is torment" jokes?


I'm getting more sick of "okay, call it something else" people.
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Chesnova
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Founded: Jul 15, 2011
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Postby Chesnova » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:04 pm

Furious Grandmothers wrote:
Chesnova wrote:
causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding lol

1) Explain relevance of waterboarding in this argument
2) Prove OBJECTIVELY that marriage causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding
3) Prove that this is irrefutable cause for denying marriage to all


honestly, I do not care to prove my points and do not feel like wasting time. I came, I saw, I commented. Simple :p
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Ifreann
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Postby Ifreann » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:06 pm

Chesnova wrote:
Furious Grandmothers wrote:1) Explain relevance of waterboarding in this argument
2) Prove OBJECTIVELY that marriage causes more pain and suffering than waterboarding
3) Prove that this is irrefutable cause for denying marriage to all


honestly, I do not care to prove my points and do not feel like wasting time. I came, I saw, I commented. Simple :p

I trust you understand that this makes you come off as either a child or an unrepentant bigot.
He/Him

beating the devil
we never run from the devil
we never summon the devil
we never hide from from the devil
we never
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Chesnova
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Founded: Jul 15, 2011
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Postby Chesnova » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:08 pm

Ifreann wrote:
Chesnova wrote:
honestly, I do not care to prove my points and do not feel like wasting time. I came, I saw, I commented. Simple :p

I trust you understand that this makes you come off as either a child or an unrepentant bigot.


Nah, I could carry out a good arguement but I don't feel like it...

Truthfully, I don't really care if they legalize it or not. I may not like it but its not my power to control people. If I had the choice to, then i'd turn it down...
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Dusk_Kittens
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Founded: May 18, 2011
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Postby Dusk_Kittens » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:10 pm

Samuraikoku wrote:
Ifreann wrote:Anyone else getting sick of "lolz, being married is torment" jokes?


I'm getting more sick of "okay, call it something else" people.


If this is part of your concern with me in saying that we're talking about "Marriage," "Legal Marriage," and "Religious Marriage" (or whatever the latter might be called), please note, I do not advocate this as any sort of compromise. I advocate it as a matter of precise use of accurate terminology.

"Marriage," whatever it is, does not belong to religion, and it does not belong to law.

There is a legal status conferred when certain legal requirements are met, which is a status of bond/union between two consenting adults, which is called "Marriage," but which is, more accurately, "Legal Marriage." It has nothing to do with religion. It may or may not involve any sort of "wedding" ceremony (religious or otherwise). No sect is required by law to perform any wedding ceremony for anyone on the basis of Legal Marriage. Legal Marriage is a strictly legal matter and is a legal status representing a bond or union between two consenting adults. The said legal status has legal, political, and economic effects for the married couple.

Religion has nothing to say about it, as it is a legal matter, and not a religious one; it does not even affect religion.

Religion, however, does also make use of the term "Marriage" and it would be best if both law and religion get over the word "Marriage" and agree that Legal Marriage and Religious Marriage refer to Marriage in different contexts, and have no effects on one another.
Her Divine Grace,
the Sovereign Principessa Luna,
Ulata-Druidessâ Teutâs di Genovâs,
Ardua-Druidessâ of Dusk Kittens
The Tribal Confederacy of Dusk_Kittens
(a Factbook in progress)
~ Stairsneach ~

My Political Compass
Economic Left/Right: -7.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.72
(Left Libertarian)

My C4SS Ratings
58% Economic Leftist
63% Anarchist
79% Anti-Militarist
67% Socio-Cultural Liberal
80% Civil Libertarian

"... perché lo universale degli uomini
si pascono così di quel che pare come di quello che è:
anzi, molte volte si muovono
più per le cose che paiono che per quelle che sono."
-- Niccolò Machiavelli,
Discorsi sopra la prima deca di Tito Livio,
Libro Primo, Capitolo 25.
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Samuraikoku
Post Czar
 
Posts: 31947
Founded: May 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Samuraikoku » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:10 pm

Chesnova wrote:Nah, I could carry out a good arguement but I don't feel like it...


Then what is the point of commenting?

Chesnova wrote:Truthfully, I don't really care if they legalize it or not. I may not like it but its not my power to control people. If I had the choice to, then i'd turn it down...


It's a good thing you don't, then.
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Samuraikoku
Post Czar
 
Posts: 31947
Founded: May 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Samuraikoku » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:11 pm

Dusk_Kittens wrote:*snip*


Nope, not meant towards you. My disagreement with you stems from the fact that you seem to disregard the law in the concept of marriage, but I know you're pro gay marriage and do not want to call it something else. If I remember correctly, you said you're bisexual.
Last edited by Samuraikoku on Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:13 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Britarvia
Envoy
 
Posts: 278
Founded: Sep 25, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Britarvia » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:16 pm

I strongly oppose Same Sex marriage "marriage".
Last edited by Britarvia on Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Samuraikoku
Post Czar
 
Posts: 31947
Founded: May 13, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Samuraikoku » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:17 pm

Britarvia wrote:I strongly oppose Same Sex marriage "marriage".


And I ask: Where is the equality to gay people?
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The IOAS
Attaché
 
Posts: 79
Founded: Jul 11, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby The IOAS » Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:17 pm

I think the government should just totally butt out of it. Leave it up to the churches to argue its validity. If that's your thing, by all means, go for it. Just don't try and force the churches to change their policy in order to suit your desires. Find one that's cool with it.
Economic Left/Right: -7.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 1.38
"Explain to future generations that it was good for the economy when they can't farm the land, breathe the air, or drink the water."
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