Nazi Germany's category in Nationstates

[Thyilea]

National Socialism is Left-Winged.

No it isn't. It's social policies make it very much right winged. Having a welfare state doesn't make you Socialist.

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

[Hellsgrind]

No it isn't. It's social policies make it very much right winged. Having a welfare state doesn't make you Socialist.

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

If you're suggesting that having a Revolutionary Ideology makes you a Socialist, I kindly point you to the Tea Party.

[Thyilea]

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

If you're suggesting that having a Revolutionary Ideology makes you a Socialist, I kindly point you to the Tea Party.

Tea Party wants to re-establish the old order. Very few elements about NS were about the old order, much more were about implementing radical unforeseen change.

[Hellsgrind]

Tea Party wants to re-establish the old order. Very few elements about NS were about the old order, much more were about implementing radical unforeseen change.

What do you mean by the 'old order'? Because it seemed like you were trying to say that because the NS party opposed the previous government, that made them Leftist.

[New Manvir]

No it isn't. It's social policies make it very much right winged. Having a welfare state doesn't make you Socialist.

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

While I can agree with the bold, I believe you are mistaken. The Nazis were against the Weimar government, but sought an empire like the one that Germany lost after WWI. They were against the old order and wanted to revive the old-old order. Nazism has, to me at least, always seemed like radical Conservatism. You can see this in their socially conservative views, their anti-communism and possibly even in their racial policies.

[Hellsgrind]

While I can agree with the bold, I believe you are mistaken. The Nazis were against the Weimar government, but sought an empire like the one that Germany lost after WWI. They were against the old order and wanted to revive the old-old order. Nazism has, to me at least, always seemed like radical Conservatism. You can see this in their socially conservative views, their anti-communism and possibly even in their racial policies.

This much is true. Further bolstered by the fact that a large number of Nazis were also former Militarists, which by theory provokes a Radical Right-wing government by its promotion of Expansionism.

[Hydesland]

Psychotic dictatorship no contest.

[Thyilea]

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

While I can agree with the bold, I believe you are mistaken. The Nazis were against the Weimar government, but sought an empire like the one that Germany lost after WWI. They were against the old order and wanted to revive the old-old order. Nazism has, to me at least, always seemed like radical Conservatism. You can see this in their socially conservative views, their anti-communism and possibly even in their racial policies.

The old German Empire has no racial policies like the Third Reich. Here are the 25 bullets for the NSDAP

(I apologise in advance for the length)


1 We want all Germans to live in a "Greater Germany"

2 We want Germany to be treated the same as other nations, and we want the peace treaties of Versailles and Saint-Germain to be cancelled.

3 We want land and territory (colonies) to feed our people and to settle our surplus population.

4 Only Germans may be citizens of the Germany. Only those of the German races may be members of the nation, their religion does not matter. No Jew may be a citizen>because they are not of a German race

5 Non-citizens may live in Germany, but there will be special laws for foreigners living in Germany<ref>in most countries foreigners cannot own land or houses for example

6 Only citizens can vote for parliament and councils, or vote on laws. Everyone who works for the German government, a state government or even a small village must be a citizen of Germany. We will stop giving people jobs because of the political party they are in, only the best people should get a job.

7 We think that the government's first job is to make sure every citizen has a job and enough to eat. If the government cannot do this, people who are not citizens should be made to leave Germany.

8 No-one who is not of a German-race should be allowed to live in Germany. We want anyone who is not of a German-race who started living in Germany after 1914 to leave the country.

9 All citizens shall have equal rights and duties.

10 Every citizen should have a job. Their work should not be selfish, but help everyone. ''Therefore we say''

11 No one should live off money from rents or other income unless they have worked for that money

12 So many people die or lose their property in a war, it is wrong for other people to make money from the war. Anyone who made money from the war should have all that money taken away.

13 We want all very big corporations to be owned by the government.

14 Big industrial companies should share their profits with the workers.

15 We want old age pensions to be paid.

16 We want

to create a middle class
to split up big department stores, and let small traders rent space inside them
to make State and town governments try to buy from small traders.


17 We want to change the way land is owned. We also want

a law to take over land if the country needs it, without the government having to pay for it;
to abolish ground rent; and
to prohibit land ''speculation'' (buying land just to sell to someone else for more money).

18 Crimes against the common interest must be punished with death.

19 We want the Roman Law system changed for the German common law system.

20 We want to change the system of schools and education, so that every hard-working German can have the chance of higher education.
What is taught should concentrate on practical things
Schools should teach civic affairs, so that children can become good citizens
If poor parent cannot afford to pay the government should pay for education.

21 The State must protect health standards by
protecting mothers and infants
stopping children from working
making a law for compulsory gymnastics and sports, and
supporting sports clubs for young men.

22 We want to get rid of the old army and replace it with a people's army that would look after the ordinary people, not just the rich ''officer-class''

23 We want the law to stop politicians from being anti-German, and newspapers from writing about them. To make a German national press we demand:
that all editors of, and writers in the German language newspapers are members of the nation (''of a German race'');
Foreign newspapers need permission from the government. They must not be printed in the German language;
Non-Germans cannot own or control German newspapers.
any non German who does own or control a newspaper will be made to leave Germany, and the newspaper closed down,
Newspapers which criticise the country or the government are not allowed.
Art, books and which support foreign ideas, should be banned.

24 We want to allow all religions in the State, unless they offend the moral feelings of the German race. The NSDAP is Christian, but does not belong to any denomination. The NSDAP will fight the Jewish self-interest spirit, and believes that our nation will be strongest only if everyone puts the common interest before self-interest.

25 We will
create of a strong central government for the Reich;
give Parliament control over the entire government and its organizations;
form groups based on class and job to carry out the laws in the various German states.






Note the bold. The points above illustrate a movement heading in a new direction with a combination of repealing policies (old or new) that don't work, and implementing (or re-establishing) policies that would. National Socialism is a synthesis of some socialist ideas and cultural values.

[Hellsgrind]

We will stop giving people jobs because of the political party they are in, only the best people should get a job.

This is oddly a traditionally Right-wing ideology, however, your bolded statements would seem to be a traditional example of Leftism were it not for their pretext, that pretext being that,

Only Germans may be citizens of the Germany. Only those of the German races may be members of the nation, their religion does not matter. No Jew may be a citizen>because they are not of a German race

So really, it might seem Leftist because it is providing Welfare to "the people", but only to some. People like foreign immigrants from non-Germanic races, or even natives of non-Germanic races (there was a large Pole population in Germany at the time) were unable to access these benefits, thus negating the Leftist view of these policies.

That said, a racial agenda does not inherently make you a Rightist. But then again, neither does having a basic State welfare programme for the poor. In today's Germany, a similar notion exists among the Right-wing parties, indeed, even the business-friendly FDP (Free Democrat Party) is supportive of a basic welfare institution, and they are one of the most Far-Right parties in Germany.

[Thyilea]

We will stop giving people jobs because of the political party they are in, only the best people should get a job.

This is oddly a traditionally Right-wing ideology, however, your bolded statements would seem to be a traditional example of Leftism were it not for their pretext, that pretext being that,

Only Germans may be citizens of the Germany. Only those of the German races may be members of the nation, their religion does not matter. No Jew may be a citizen>because they are not of a German race

So really, it might seem Leftist because it is providing Welfare to "the people", but only to some. People like foreign immigrants from non-Germanic races, or even natives of non-Germanic races (there was a large Pole population in Germany at the time) were unable to access these benefits, thus negating the Leftist view of these policies.

That said, a racial agenda does not inherently make you a Rightist. But then again, neither does having a basic State welfare programme for the poor. In today's Germany, a similar notion exists among the Right-wing parties, indeed, even the business-friendly FDP (Free Democrat Party) is supportive of a basic welfare institution, and they are one of the most Far-Right parties in Germany.

If a programme does not apply to a foreign population in a country it is automatically right-winged? How does that work? Racialism a conservative does not make.

[New Manvir]

While I can agree with the bold, I believe you are mistaken. The Nazis were against the Weimar government, but sought an empire like the one that Germany lost after WWI. They were against the old order and wanted to revive the old-old order. Nazism has, to me at least, always seemed like radical Conservatism. You can see this in their socially conservative views, their anti-communism and possibly even in their racial policies.

The old German Empire has no racial policies like the Third Reich.

They had a few policies of Germanisation towards Poles and other minorities. I believe it was Bismarck himself who encouraged Jews to become Germanised so as to promote national unity (Panzer mentioned something to this sort). The policies of the German Empire were nowhere near as brutal as that of the Nazis but they did have their own assimilation policies.

Here are the 25 bullets for the NSDAP
(I apologise in advance for the length)

1 We want all Germans to live in a "Greater Germany"

2 We want Germany to be treated the same as other nations, and we want the peace treaties of Versailles and Saint-Germain to be cancelled.

3 We want land and territory (colonies) to feed our people and to settle our surplus population.

4 Only Germans may be citizens of the Germany. Only those of the German races may be members of the nation, their religion does not matter. No Jew may be a citizen>because they are not of a German race

5 Non-citizens may live in Germany, but there will be special laws for foreigners living in Germany<ref>in most countries foreigners cannot own land or houses for example

6 Only citizens can vote for parliament and councils, or vote on laws. Everyone who works for the German government, a state government or even a small village must be a citizen of Germany. We will stop giving people jobs because of the political party they are in, only the best people should get a job.

7 We think that the government's first job is to make sure every citizen has a job and enough to eat. If the government cannot do this, people who are not citizens should be made to leave Germany.

8 No-one who is not of a German-race should be allowed to live in Germany. We want anyone who is not of a German-race who started living in Germany after 1914 to leave the country.

9 All citizens shall have equal rights and duties.

10 Every citizen should have a job. Their work should not be selfish, but help everyone. ''Therefore we say''

11 No one should live off money from rents or other income unless they have worked for that money

12 So many people die or lose their property in a war, it is wrong for other people to make money from the war. Anyone who made money from the war should have all that money taken away.

13 We want all very big corporations to be owned by the government.

14 Big industrial companies should share their profits with the workers.

15 We want old age pensions to be paid.

16 We want

to create a middle class
to split up big department stores, and let small traders rent space inside them
to make State and town governments try to buy from small traders.


17 We want to change the way land is owned. We also want

a law to take over land if the country needs it, without the government having to pay for it;
to abolish ground rent; and
to prohibit land ''speculation'' (buying land just to sell to someone else for more money).

18 Crimes against the common interest must be punished with death.

19 We want the Roman Law system changed for the German common law system.

20 We want to change the system of schools and education, so that every hard-working German can have the chance of higher education.
What is taught should concentrate on practical things
Schools should teach civic affairs, so that children can become good citizens
If poor parent cannot afford to pay the government should pay for education.

21 The State must protect health standards by
protecting mothers and infants
stopping children from working
making a law for compulsory gymnastics and sports, and
supporting sports clubs for young men.

22 We want to get rid of the old army and replace it with a people's army that would look after the ordinary people, not just the rich ''officer-class''

23 We want the law to stop politicians from being anti-German, and newspapers from writing about them. To make a German national press we demand:
that all editors of, and writers in the German language newspapers are members of the nation (''of a German race'');
Foreign newspapers need permission from the government. They must not be printed in the German language;
Non-Germans cannot own or control German newspapers.
any non German who does own or control a newspaper will be made to leave Germany, and the newspaper closed down,
Newspapers which criticise the country or the government are not allowed.
Art, books and which support foreign ideas, should be banned.

24 We want to allow all religions in the State, unless they offend the moral feelings of the German race. The NSDAP is Christian, but does not belong to any denomination. The NSDAP will fight the Jewish self-interest spirit, and believes that our nation will be strongest only if everyone puts the common interest before self-interest.

25 We will
create of a strong central government for the Reich;
give Parliament control over the entire government and its organizations;
form groups based on class and job to carry out the laws in the various German states.

Note the bold. The points above illustrate a movement heading in a new direction with a combination of repealing policies (old or new) that don't work, and implementing (or re-establishing) policies that would. National Socialism is a synthesis of some socialist ideas and cultural values.

While I don't doubt that Fascism takes some ideas from Socialism I feel it's not enough to warrant them being called left-wing. The ultra-nationalism of the Nazis, for example, can most definitely be considered not left-wing.

[New Manvir]

We will stop giving people jobs because of the political party they are in, only the best people should get a job.

This is oddly a traditionally Right-wing ideology, however, your bolded statements would seem to be a traditional example of Leftism were it not for their pretext, that pretext being that,

Only Germans may be citizens of the Germany. Only those of the German races may be members of the nation, their religion does not matter. No Jew may be a citizen>because they are not of a German race

So really, it might seem Leftist because it is providing Welfare to "the people", but only to some. People like foreign immigrants from non-Germanic races, or even natives of non-Germanic races (there was a large Pole population in Germany at the time) were unable to access these benefits, thus negating the Leftist view of these policies.

That said, a racial agenda does not inherently make you a Rightist. But then again, neither does having a basic State welfare programme for the poor. In today's Germany, a similar notion exists among the Right-wing parties, indeed, even the business-friendly FDP (Free Democrat Party) is supportive of a basic welfare institution, and they are one of the most Far-Right parties in Germany.

Also, much of this is correct.

[Hellsgrind]

If a programme does not apply to a foreign population in a country it is automatically right-winged? How does that work? Racialism a conservative does not make.

Traditionally a Right-wing ideology means that you're elevating a certain group over another one, whether that is the Rich over the Poor is irrelevant, because it can be switched around just as well. The ethnic Germans being elevated over the ethnic Jews is just another translation of class-warfare into the racial theatre.

Racialism has nothing to do with it, melding the people into classes and then having the government work off of separating those classes (or by praising one and lowering the other) does.

[Sorvasia]

• Authoritarian Dictatorship
• Father Knows Best State

[Thyilea]

If a programme does not apply to a foreign population in a country it is automatically right-winged? How does that work? Racialism a conservative does not make.

Traditionally a Right-wing ideology means that you're elevating a certain group over another one, whether that is the Rich over the Poor is irrelevant, because it can be switched around just as well. The ethnic Germans being elevated over the ethnic Jews is just another translation of class-warfare into the racial theatre.

Racialism has nothing to do with it, melding the people into classes and then having the government work off of separating those classes (or by praising one and lowering the other) does.

The socialist ideas under the doctrine of National Socialism do not advocate the abolition of either private property or classes, but still encourage a wide variety of ideas considered to belong on the spectrum of the Left. I don't think that National Socialism's ultra-nationalism is enough to warrant it a Right-Winged ideology when it's entire purpose was to completely rid themselves of the old order of Europe and establish a new one. It is possible to have nationalistic ideas and still be considered a socialist.

By economic reasons alone, I think it is fair to at least negate the point that NS was Right-Winged in the traditional sense.

[New Manvir]

Traditionally a Right-wing ideology means that you're elevating a certain group over another one, whether that is the Rich over the Poor is irrelevant, because it can be switched around just as well. The ethnic Germans being elevated over the ethnic Jews is just another translation of class-warfare into the racial theatre.

Racialism has nothing to do with it, melding the people into classes and then having the government work off of separating those classes (or by praising one and lowering the other) does.

The socialist ideas under the doctrine of National Socialism do not advocate the abolition of either private property or classes, but still encourage a wide variety of ideas considered to belong on the spectrum of the Left. I don't think that National Socialism's ultra-nationalism is enough to warrant it a Right-Winged ideology when it's entire purpose was to completely rid themselves of the old order of Europe and establish a new one. It is possible to have nationalistic ideas and still be considered a socialist.

The Nazis wanted to replace the old (or existing) order of Europe (Liberalism) with an even older one (Imperialism). It is possible to have nationalist views and be somewhat socialist, but not to the extent the Nazis carried Nationalism. The National part of NS was clearly more dominant than the Socialist part. I'd even go as far as to say that the Nazis only used Socialism as a tool to garner support among the German working class, before the radicals in the party could be silenced.

By economic reasons alone, I think it is fair to at least negate the point that NS was Right-Winged in the traditional sense.

That's an incredibly narrow view of Right-Wing. Social Conservatism is just as much a part of the right-wing as fiscal conservatism is. Another thing, how can you say their economic policies are enough to label them left-wing, but ultra-nationalism isn't enough to label them right-wing? Double standard, no?

[Thyilea]

The socialist ideas under the doctrine of National Socialism do not advocate the abolition of either private property or classes, but still encourage a wide variety of ideas considered to belong on the spectrum of the Left. I don't think that National Socialism's ultra-nationalism is enough to warrant it a Right-Winged ideology when it's entire purpose was to completely rid themselves of the old order of Europe and establish a new one. It is possible to have nationalistic ideas and still be considered a socialist.

The Nazis wanted to replace the old (or existing) order of Europe (Liberalism) with an even older one (Imperialism). It is possible to have nationalist views and be somewhat socialist, but not to the extent the Nazis carried Nationalism. The National part of NS was clearly more dominant than the Socialist part. I'd even go as far as to say that the Nazis only used Socialism as a tool to garner support among the German working class, before the radicals in the party could be silenced.

By economic reasons alone, I think it is fair to at least negate the point that NS was Right-Winged in the traditional sense.

That's an incredibly narrow view of Right-Wing. Social Conservatism is just as much a part of the right-wing as fiscal conservatism is. Another thing, how can you say their economic policies are enough to label them left-wing, but ultra-nationalism isn't enough to label them right-wing? Double standard, no?

Not really. The ultra-nationalism bit is but one factor of the ideology whilst the various socialist components make up the bulk. The NSDAP did not just "use" socialism as a tool to gain popularity, Goebbels himself was a vehement socialist, and Hitler knew this, yet decided to keep him around. If they had merely been using socialism as a ploy, why did they bother implementing the changes at all? The SA was dealt with due to their perceived thread to Hitler's and Himmler's authority, and had to do more with their many personal quarrels.

As for imperialism, it can be interpreted that imperialism was merely a tool in order to establish the "Greater German Reich" and ultimately finalise one of the decisive goals of National Socialism: complete autarky. The Third Reich did not seek an empire in the traditional sense of the world (to profit, basically) but for lebensraum and all that jazz.

The way I see it: National Socialism incorporated political and economic policies from both ends of the spectrum, but judging from the actual implementations of the aforementioned policies if NS had to be pigeon-holed into a category - it would be more fitting that it be on the Left.

[Cathatis]

Using the old school graph (here: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... calmap.png), I'd say medium economic freedoms and authoritarian political and personal freedoms. I'd say Iron Fist Consumerists.

[Call to power]

Ex-Nation

its amazing I don't get paid to point this stuff out for you guys

[New Manvir]

The Nazis wanted to replace the old (or existing) order of Europe (Liberalism) with an even older one (Imperialism). It is possible to have nationalist views and be somewhat socialist, but not to the extent the Nazis carried Nationalism. The National part of NS was clearly more dominant than the Socialist part. I'd even go as far as to say that the Nazis only used Socialism as a tool to garner support among the German working class, before the radicals in the party could be silenced.



That's an incredibly narrow view of Right-Wing. Social Conservatism is just as much a part of the right-wing as fiscal conservatism is. Another thing, how can you say their economic policies are enough to label them left-wing, but ultra-nationalism isn't enough to label them right-wing? Double standard, no?

Not really. The ultra-nationalism bit is but one factor of the ideology whilst the various socialist components make up the bulk.

Ultra-nationalism was a huge part of Nazi ideology, the holocaust is evidence of that. What Socialist components made up the "bulk" of Nazi ideology?

The NSDAP did not just "use" socialism as a tool to gain popularity, Goebbels himself was a vehement socialist, and Hitler knew this, yet decided to keep him around. If they had merely been using socialism as a ploy, why did they bother implementing the changes at all? The SA was dealt with due to their perceived thread to Hitler's and Himmler's authority, and had to do more with their many personal quarrels.

Goebbels wasn't in charge, Hitler was, and his (Hitler's) views were very much anti-socialist. Goebbels was kept around because he was useful and loyal.

In February 1926, Hitler, having finished working on Mein Kampf, made a sudden return to party affairs and soon disabused the northerners of any illusions about where he stood. He summoned about 60 gauleiters and other activists, including Goebbels, to a meeting at Bamberg, in Streicher’s Gau of Franconia, where he gave a two-hour speech repudiating the political program of the "socialist" wing of the party. For Hitler, the real enemy of the German people was always the Jews, not the capitalists. Goebbels was bitterly disillusioned. "I feel devastated," he wrote. "What sort of Hitler? A reactionary?" He was horrified by Hitler’s characterization of socialism as "a Jewish creation", his declaration that the Soviet Union must be destroyed, and his assertion that private property would not be expropriated by a Nazi government. "I no longer fully believe in Hitler. That’s the terrible thing: my inner support has been taken away."[21]

You aren't incorrect that the purge was mostly to secure power for Hitler, however the ideological divides between the SA and the rest of the Nazi party cannot be denied. The SA purge destroyed most of the left-wing elements of the Nazi party, namely Rohm and Gregor Strasser.

Although some of these conflicts were based on personal rivalries, there were also key socioeconomic conflicts between the SS and SA. SS members generally came from the middle class, while the SA had its base among the unemployed and working class. Politically speaking, the SA were more radical than the SS, with its leaders arguing the Nazi revolution had not ended when Hitler achieved power, but rather needed to implement socialism in Germany (see Strasserism). Furthermore, the defiant and rebellious culture encouraged prior to the seizure of power had to give way to a community organization approach such as canvassing and fundraising, which was resented by the SA as Kleinarbeit, "little work," which had normally been performed by women prior to the seizure of power.[10]

However, Adolf Hitler had his own reasons for wanting Röhm removed. Powerful supporters of Hitler had been complaining about Röhm for some time. The generals were fearful due to knowing Röhm's desire to have the SA, a force of over 3 million men, absorb the much smaller German Army into its ranks under his leadership.[11] Further, reports of a huge cache of weapons in the hands of SA members, gave the army commanders even more concern.[11] Industrialists, who had provided the funds for the Nazi victory, were unhappy with Röhm's socialistic views on the economy and his claims that the real revolution had still to take place. Matters came to a head in June 1934 when President von Hindenburg, who had the complete loyalty of the Army, informed Hitler that if he didn't move to curb the SA then Hindenburg would dissolve the Government and declare martial law.[12]

As for imperialism, it can be interpreted that imperialism was merely a tool in order to establish the "Greater German Reich" and ultimately finalise one of the decisive goals of National Socialism: complete autarky. The Third Reich did not seek an empire in the traditional sense of the world (to profit, basically) but for lebensraum and all that jazz.

Imperialism is still imperialism, it doesn't matter whether you want to have an empire for profit or for land. It's still the conquest and forceful subjugation of other peoples.

The way I see it: National Socialism incorporated political and economic policies from both ends of the spectrum, but judging from the actual implementations of the aforementioned policies if NS had to be pigeon-holed into a category - it would be more fitting that it be on the Left.

Yes, they undoubtedly incorporated some left-wing beliefs but you make the mistake of thinking that economic policy is the be all and end all of an ideology. Just because an ideology doesn't adhere to fully free-market Capitalist economics, doesn't mean they can't be right-wing. I'd say that their far-right social policies outweigh their rather mixed economic policies.

[Hellsgrind]

I'd say that their far-right social policies outweigh their rather mixed economic policies.

This.

[Thyilea]

Ultra-nationalism was a huge part of Nazi ideology, the holocaust is evidence of that. What Socialist components made up the "bulk" of Nazi ideology?

Check out the 25 points. Tight control of private property and enterprise, close relationships with labour unions, environmentalism, along with plenty of other important factors.

Goebbels wasn't in charge, Hitler was, and his (Hitler's) views were very much anti-socialist. Goebbels was kept around because he was useful and loyal.

We are socialists, we are enemies of today’s capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are determined to destroy this system under all conditions.
-Adolf Hitler

In February 1926, Hitler, having finished working on Mein Kampf, made a sudden return to party affairs and soon disabused the northerners of any illusions about where he stood. He summoned about 60 gauleiters and other activists, including Goebbels, to a meeting at Bamberg, in Streicher’s Gau of Franconia, where he gave a two-hour speech repudiating the political program of the "socialist" wing of the party. For Hitler, the real enemy of the German people was always the Jews, not the capitalists. Goebbels was bitterly disillusioned. "I feel devastated," he wrote. "What sort of Hitler? A reactionary?" He was horrified by Hitler’s characterization of socialism as "a Jewish creation", his declaration that the Soviet Union must be destroyed, and his assertion that private property would not be expropriated by a Nazi government. "I no longer fully believe in Hitler. That’s the terrible thing: my inner support has been taken away."[21]

Hitler was referring to what he believed was "Judeo-Bolshevism", and wished to create a Socialistic society free from what he perceived were Jewish influences. Goebbels soon jumped on-board with the theory...check it, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qKNajQbTRA

You aren't incorrect that the purge was mostly to secure power for Hitler, however the ideological divides between the SA and the rest of the Nazi party cannot be denied. The SA purge destroyed most of the left-wing elements of the Nazi party, namely Rohm and Gregor Strasser.

That was just a bonus for Adolf. He did not hesitate when it came to executions, all that really mattered was their loyalty to the reich...not personal political views.

As for imperialism, it can be interpreted that imperialism was merely a tool in order to establish the "Greater German Reich" and ultimately finalise one of the decisive goals of National Socialism: complete autarky. The Third Reich did not seek an empire in the traditional sense of the world (to profit, basically) but for lebensraum and all that jazz.

Imperialism is still imperialism, it doesn't matter whether you want to have an empire for profit or for land. It's still the conquest and forceful subjugation of other peoples.

Absolutely, but it throws a new spin on the "old order" of Europe. Hitler envisioned using tools of the previous establishment in order to create a new one.

The way I see it: National Socialism incorporated political and economic policies from both ends of the spectrum, but judging from the actual implementations of the aforementioned policies if NS had to be pigeon-holed into a category - it would be more fitting that it be on the Left.

Yes, they undoubtedly incorporated some left-wing beliefs but you make the mistake of thinking that economic policy is the be all and end all of an ideology. Just because an ideology doesn't adhere to fully free-market Capitalist economics, doesn't mean they can't be right-wing. I'd say that their far-right social policies outweigh their rather mixed economic policies.

I never thought that economic policy always take predominance over social or political policies, but I do believe that in the case of National Socialism, as dictated by the 25-point programme, it is unmistakably left-winged. Show that programme to any worker in Europe or North America without mentioning Hitler or "Nazism" and they'll say the same thing.

[New Embossia]

Nazi Germany would be a Civil Rights Lovefest

[South Norwega]

No it isn't. It's social policies make it very much right winged. Having a welfare state doesn't make you Socialist.

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

Because the Weimar Republic was so old.

Really now, are you sure?

[Thyilea]

Right-Winged: Old order

Left-Winged: Against the old order

The old order: Weimar Republic in this case. Therefore, NS was Left-Winged

Because the Weimar Republic was so old.

Really now, are you sure?

Not literally "old"